From: eskrima-digest-owner@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com To: eskrima-digest@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com Subject: Inayan_Eskrima/FMA-Digest V6 #19 Reply-To: eskrima@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com Errors-To: eskrima-digest-owner@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com Precedence: Inayan_Eskrima/FMA-Digest Fri, 15 Jan 1999 Vol 06 : Num 019 In this issue: eskrima: sparring in Phoenix eskrima: RE: About Katch As Katch Can eskrima: The Beginner's Essentials eskrima: Re: Karl Gotch eskrima: Catch as Catch Can eskrima: Re: Inayan_Eskrima/FMA-Digest V6 #18 eskrima: re: catch wrestling eskrima: Stickman Re: eskrima: Stickman eskrima: Lou Thesz & Gotch eskrima: sticks and hackers eskrima: HTML eskrima: . .......................................................................... Eskrima-Digest, serving the Internet since June 1994. ~1000 members strong! Copyright 1994-99: Ray Terry, Inayan System of Eskrima, Martial Arts Resource To send e-mail to this list use eskrima@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com To unsubscribe, send "unsubscribe eskrima-digest" (no quotes) in the body of an e-mail (top line, left justified) addressed to majordomo@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com Replying to this message will NOT unsubscribe you. See the Filipino Martial Arts (FMA) FAQ and online search the last two years worth of digest issues at http://www.MartialArtsResource.com Mabuhay ang eskrima! Ray Terry, PO Box 110841, Campbell, CA 95011 FMA@MartialArtsResource.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Ussery, Raymond" Date: Fri, 15 Jan 1999 16:06:19 -0700 Subject: eskrima: sparring in Phoenix I am looking for Kali instructors and/or students in Phoenix, AZ. Please contact me about sparring or just comparing notes. - -Raymond raymond@ronin.org ------------------------------ From: "Lankford, James" Date: Fri, 15 Jan 1999 18:24:52 -0500 Subject: eskrima: RE: About Katch As Katch Can On another discussion group someone asked a catchwrestler named Tony Cecchine about his bio. here's a liitle of what he said - ----->> I don't train with Lou. He lives in Va. and I'm in Chicago. He is like family to me and has helped me in many, many ways (both as a wrestler and as a human being. He is ABSOLUTELY the REAL DEAL). It was Lou Thesz who publicly stated that I was considered the fourth living Hooker. To me, that is akin to winning an Olympic Gold Medal and is without a doubt, the highlight of my life. I've learned wrestling from a lot of different guys throughout my life (and I will continue to do so till I draw my last breath). Just recently, Dough Blubaugh (the 1960 Olympic Gold Medalist at 160.5 lbs) showed me some interesting stuff. Mark Schultz (1984 Olympic Gold Medalist at 180.5 lbs)and I are good friends and we exchange information regularly. He really likes Hooking and is intertested in learning as much as he can. To those who know the history of Catch Wrestling, the name John Pesek is legendary. I met him in 1978 and he had a profound influence on me, especially in regards to learning specific hooks (especially the double wrist lock) from every conceivable position. Karl Gotch convinced me that you can never be in good enough condition, ... This country was and is loaded with EXTREMELY talented people that history has/will not remember. I just feel blessed that I was able to say that I was in some of their company and can consider them my friends.... Whatever I say and do negatively, please let that be a reflection of me and not anyone I have mentioned. Those great men have been an inspiration to me and I would not want their reputations tarnished in any way by something inappropriate that I may say or do. http://members.tripod.com/~catchwrestling <<--- You'll notice that none of this info is on his web page. He was answering a specific question. So I hope no one thinks he's bragging or dropping names. ------------------------------ From: Date: Fri, 15 Jan 1999 18:22:34 EST Subject: eskrima: The Beginner's Essentials I what you consider a novice in the world of FMA. I was wondering if there were any essential materials a person studying FMA should have. whether its training equipment, books, videos other than a pair of sticks. Thanks Gar ------------------------------ From: Date: Fri, 15 Jan 1999 18:35:15 EST Subject: eskrima: Re: Karl Gotch Here's a little info with an interesting interview. http://dummyweb.albany.net/~hit/puroresu/hallfame/gotch/ Regards, Travis Kilap@aol.com ------------------------------ From: Date: Fri, 15 Jan 1999 16:04:10 -0800 Subject: eskrima: Catch as Catch Can I seem to recall a scene from the movie Paper Moon wherein Ryan O'Neil challenges a hill-billy (Randy Quade?) to 'wrassle' in order to allow the trading of automobiles so that he and his daughter can escape the long arm of the law. One of them asks the other what kind of rules will be observed, and the other says "Catch as Catch Can?", which they both agree to. O'Neil proceeds to beat the daylights out of the hill-billy (or Hill-William, to be more politically correct). Ever since then I always understood the term to mean 'no holds barred', or 'anything goes'. Live and learn, I guess. Guro Kirk Righter IESA ------------------------------ From: "Carl Fung" Date: Fri, 15 Jan 1999 16:20:39 -0800 Subject: eskrima: Re: Inayan_Eskrima/FMA-Digest V6 #18 >IS THERE ANYONE OUT THERE WHO REALLY, REALLY POSSSESS THE TRUE >FUNCTIONAL TECHNIQUE OF CATACH AS CATCH CAN? > >If anyone has any information on this I am interested. I am looking >for someone who really knows the real art, someone who learned from >someone who learned from one of the great Hookers of early 1900's. > >Guro Allen Sachetti Allen, Check with Guy Chase in San Francisico. If you cannot find him easily there you may check with the Villibrille guys in SF/HI and or the Inosanto Academy for a current number. What he learned from Gotch may or not be real "catch as catch can". I hear that as part of or a key componant of Gotch Submission Wrestling but the way I hear the story from Guy is that Gotch says the art is from everywhere and not true American...after all what Americans had was from Indians and Europe. I the Gotch training method part of the calestenics are India Indian and even persian with the use of the heavy persian war club. One of the really cool things I get from BJJ vs. Gotch is that BJJ works to position before submission. Gotch says there is a submission for every position. Gotch is way cool but you have to have a big hard drive in your head to remember it all. carl ------------------------------ From: Theobald the Good Gorilla Date: Fri, 15 Jan 1999 17:14:47 -0800 Subject: eskrima: re: catch wrestling There's only one guy I know of who actively teaches old-school catch wrestling, including the art of hooking, and that's Tony Cecchine, e-mail catchhookr@aol.com. He learned from 20's era super strongman & hooker Stan Radwan, and is pretty much the only really talented hooker who makes his knowledge public -- Karl Gotch is pretty reclusive, teaching only to a few people, and maybe not even that anymore. There are supposedly one or two other active hookers in New England, but like Gotch they aren't teaching anything to the open public. As for Tony, he's a very good teacher, frighteningly strong, and from what myself and others have tried on him, almost unchokeable. He is rough, holding those old-school values of making someone earn a bit of the knowledge through pain, but he's a good guy and well worth contacting. If anyone here does e-mail him, tell him Ken from San Diego says hi! ------------------------------ From: Earl Michael Baylon Date: Fri, 15 Jan 1999 17:23:58 -0800 (PST) Subject: eskrima: Stickman Greetings everyone on the list. Hey, I was browsing through Jeff "Stickman" Finder's webpage and I was interested in some of the sticks he's selling, but the email address on the website isn't going through. Does anyone know how I can get ahold of Mr. Finder? Oh, and on a different note...I was wondering if anyone had any ideas for some good solo training techniques. What kind of things to some people out there do? Bag drills won't help since I'm in a dorm and I can't bring my punching bag here. Any suggestions anyone? Thanks in advance. Earl ebaylon@uci.edu ------------------------------ From: Date: Fri, 15 Jan 1999 17:44:21 -0800 (PST) Subject: Re: eskrima: Stickman > he's selling, but the email address on the website isn't going through. > Does anyone know how I can get ahold of Mr. Finder? I don't know about getting hold of Mr. Finder, he might like it too much... :) Try stickman@autobahn.org Ray Terry raymail@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com ------------------------------ From: Date: Fri, 15 Jan 1999 18:17:00 -0800 (PST) Subject: eskrima: Lou Thesz & Gotch Regarding Frank Gotch, I seem to recall seeing an interview with Lou Thesz where he seemed to downplay the contribution of Gotch to the development of early 20th century catch-as-catch-can. As I recall it was along the line that Gotch's rep was far larger than his wrestling ability ever warranted. Am I dreaming that? Anyone else see that interview w/Thesz? Ray Terry raymail@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com ------------------------------ From: Jeffrey Finder Date: 15 Jan 99 19:53:38 -0800 Subject: eskrima: sticks and hackers This is a multi-part message in MIME format. - --X-X-X-X-X-X--NeoPlanet-MIME-TEXTandHTML--X-X-X-X-X-X-X2995812-X-X Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" >>some oldtimers preferred the damage done by hardwood ... >The stick techniques prepare you for the translation to the blade.... >Villabrille preferred the garrote--the bahi war club--to edged weapons. Edged weapons would cut, but the garrote would shatter the bone, which always seemed to never heal properly. I don't quite get your point. Seems like your last statement agrees with what I said, that some old-timers preferred the effect of wood to steel. The point was also made in a recent E-D by someone else that some styles do NOT necessarily go to the blade. Even in Serrada, I have seen folks optimize their technique for the stick, which can hit from any part of the circumference. If you don't carry a blade, this maybe even makes sense. On another note, my ISP got hacked recently, so: 1) I have a hard time getting email sent, though I believe I'm receiving most of what is sent to me. 2) I say most, because it seems that I have missed a couple of recent E-D issues. If anyone has been trying to reach me (I do get mail about sticks, etc), be patient and try again if I don't answer within a day or so. Jeff "Stickman" Finder stickman@autobahn.org ------------------------------ From: Date: Fri, 15 Jan 1999 20:10:05 -0800 (PST) Subject: eskrima: HTML Please, no HTML. Thanks. Ray Terry raymail@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com ------------------------------ From: Date: Fri, 15 Jan 1999 20:13:05 -0800 (PST) Subject: eskrima: . ------------------------------ End of Inayan_Eskrima/FMA-Digest V6 #19 *************************************** To unsubscribe from this digest, eskrima-digest, send the command: unsubscribe eskrima-digest -or- unsubscribe eskrima-digest your.old@address in the BODY of email (top line, left justified) addressed to majordomo@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com. Old digest issues are available via ftp://ftp.martialartsresource.com, directory pub/eskrima/digests. All digest files have the suffix '.txt' Copyright 1994-99: Ray Terry, Inayan System of Eskrima, Martial Arts Resource Standard disclaimers apply.