From: eskrima-digest-owner@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com To: eskrima-digest@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com Subject: Inayan_Eskrima/FMA-Digest V6 #106 Reply-To: eskrima@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com Errors-To: eskrima-digest-owner@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com Precedence: Inayan_Eskrima/FMA-Digest Fri, 12 March 1999 Vol 06 : Num 106 In this issue: eskrima: enjoying rape?!! eskrima: ED V6 #104 Cryin' in my Heineken eskrima: Re: Right of self defense, mugger repellant, etc. eskrima: looking for fights eskrima: a new California law! eskrima: Silat Seminar, Portland Oregon, March 20 & 21 eskrima: Tool Dip 'n Sticks Re: eskrima: Tool Dip 'n Sticks eskrima: Self Defense part two eskrima: Just stuff in genral eskrima: Re: Inayan_Eskrima/FMA-Digest V6 #105 eskrima: "Garimot" Largo Mano eskrima: epi/nori [none] eskrima: Wekaf tournaments eskrima: The big fight eskrima: smoke -n- mirrors eskrima: . .......................................................................... Eskrima-Digest, serving the Internet since June 1994. 1050 members strong! Copyright 1994-99: Ray Terry, Inayan System of Eskrima, Martial Arts Resource Replying to this message will NOT unsubscribe you. To unsubscribe, send "unsubscribe eskrima-digest" (no quotes) in the body of an e-mail (top line, left justified) addressed to majordomo@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com To send e-mail to this list use eskrima@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com See the Filipino Martial Arts (FMA) FAQ and online search the last two years worth of digest issues at http://www.MartialArtsResource.com Mabuhay ang eskrima! Ray Terry, PO Box 110841, Campbell, CA 95011 FMA@MartialArtsResource.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Date: Thu, 11 Mar 1999 11:13:02 -0800 Subject: eskrima: enjoying rape?!! >Man, I couldn't believe my ears a few months ago when a so-called >martial arts instructor said "If a woman is being raped, she should just >lay back and enjoy it." Aside from the beating the woman takes, consider the potential for the rapist to kill his victim! This is terrorism, pure and simple. What part of it is for her enjoyment? Whatever else E-D members might think of feminism, this kind of pre-feminist attitude is crap. Jeff "Stickman" Finder stickman@autobahn.org ------------------------------ From: Henry Martinez Date: Thu, 11 Mar 1999 11:26:00 -0800 Subject: eskrima: ED V6 #104 Cryin' in my Heineken With some minor snippage, MD wrote > From: "Marc Denny" > Date: Wed, 10 Mar 1999 16:28:03 -0800 > Subject: eskrima: The Right of Self Defense > Can we, this Digest, come up with a cogent, pithy statement of principles > in this regard? To start with, I suggest...I would also posit ...I would > also posit...That's for starters. Your thoughts people?WoofCraftyDog > What? Now you want this digest, which, as an assembly of people gathered for a common purpose, is a government of sorts, to start making more rules for us to follow..."a pithy statement of principles" is just the thin edge of the sword, and will eventually become "general guidelines of behavior", then "voluntary" rules, then...well, it's just to horrible to ponder! For those who doubt this, just look at how this digest has steadily become the Marc Denny Non-FMA Soapbox. HM H. T. Jon Martinez Tammarau Kempo-Jutsu 801 1/2 East 22nd Street Merced CA 95340 (209) 722-4828 (209) 381-6640 ------------------------------ From: "Todd D. Ellner" Date: Thu, 11 Mar 1999 11:15:09 -0800 Subject: eskrima: Re: Right of self defense, mugger repellant, etc. o Someone asked "Isn't the government supposed to protect you?" The simple answer is "No." Cops have a duty to investigate crimes, uphold the peace, and enforce the law. They are under absolutely no obligation whatsoever to protect any individual citizen unless there is some sort of personal services contract between them. This has been upheld in several court cases though not, AFAIK, by the Supremes. o Marc, I think it was, reported advice about just speaking to the mugger in a firm, calm voice to stop the attack. I'll have to disagree with him on this one. It really DOES work. You just have to use the right tone of voice to show him that you are confident, calm, and feel positively about the situation. Myself, I prefer 230 grain Federal Jacketed Hollow Point Punctuation Marks with the subtley nuanced body language of a Vaquero Grande *-) [ob FMA: Think Espada y Daga for technique] ------------------------------ From: Date: Thu, 11 Mar 1999 14:21:31 EST Subject: eskrima: looking for fights Hello, My name is Kevin Rosier. I am 6'4" and 275lbs. I am the 6X World Superheavyweight Champion (fighting for my 7th on pay-per-view on May 14th against Mike Labree). Please contact me if you have ANYONE to fight me. If you are not promoting a show or do not have anyone to fight me please pass my name along to your fellow promoters. BOXING 7-5 6KOs Thank You 1998-UFO (Universal Fighting-Arts Organization)- wrestling in Japan for Antonio Inoki 1998-Extreme Fight Challenge (no holds barred) 1997-WFF (World Fighting Federation) Professional boxing event 1996-IFC (International Fighting Council) No holds barred event 1994-WKKC (World Karate and Kickboxing Council) World Superheavyweight Champion 1993- First choice contender in the first ever UFC (Ultimate Fighting Championship) a no holds barred event 1990-WKA (World Karate Association) World Superheavyweight Champion (above the waist) 1990-ISKA (International Sport Karate Association) North American Superheavyweight Champion 3X WKA (World Kickboxing Association) World Superheavyweight Champion 1989-All Japan World Champion 1987-United States Kung-Fu Karate National No-Rules Tournament Champion (similar to the movie Blood Sport) MY professional record for Kickboxing is---Leg kicks--16-2 with 16 ko's above the waist--20-4 with 20 ko's My professional boxing record is 7-5 with 6 ko's ------------------------------ From: Date: Thu, 11 Mar 1999 11:24:34 -0800 Subject: eskrima: a new California law! Ol' Dirty Bastard's got more than body armor between himself and the world. Now he's got jail bars. After a preliminary hearing Wednesday, the often-foul-of-the-law Wu Tang Clan rapper was dropped in the clink on charges he violated a new California state law that bans violent felons from strapping on body armor. ODB pleaded innocent. Bail was set at $115,000. The music star's latest troubles began last month when Los Angeles police picked him up in Hollywood on a so-called minor traffic violation (he was parked in a no-parking zone). During the arrest, officers said they discovered crafty ol' ODB (real name: Russell Jones) was wearing a bulletproof vest. To authorities that was a no-no, if not because it was the erstwhile Big Baby Jesus' fifth arrest since last July, then because the rapper was convicted of second-degree assault in New York in 1993. All these run-ins with the law apparently have drained the man dry. In court Wednesday, ODB was assigned a public defender (one Mearl Lottman) when the chart-topper claimed he couldn't afford an attorney. Lottman went to work, explaining that because of his client's fame "he's at risk of his life"--a risk that is mitigated by body armor. Plus, Lottman said, "he has been in gun battles." No dice. The judge sided with Deputy District Attorney Mary Ganahl who argued that the new-fangled felons-can't-wear-bulletproof-stuff law must be upheld. "The danger is to the community," Ganahl said. Jeff "Stickman" Finder stickman@autobahn.org ------------------------------ From: "Todd D. Ellner" Date: Thu, 11 Mar 1999 11:40:04 -0800 Subject: eskrima: Silat Seminar, Portland Oregon, March 20 & 21 As was mentioned in January and February the Stark Street Academy of Kung Fu will be hosting a Pencak Silat seminar by Steve Plinck and Cass Magda. Topics covered will depend on the experience of the attendees, but will certainly include trapping, stand-up grappling, ground fighting, entering and throwing, striking, djurus, and footwork. Guru Plinck is one of less than half a dozen students to receive the complete Serak system from Pendekar Paul de Thouars. He has taught widely and produced a very well-received Silat video from Paladin Press. Guru Magda is a long-time student of Guro Inosanto, a JKD Instructor, respected Eskrimador, and experienced Silat player. The seminar will be 10AM-6PM Saturday and Sunday March 20-21. Cost is $70 for one day, $100 for both with large group discounts available. Please bring a cup, mouthpiece, and your school's uniform if any. For more information contact the Stark Street Academy of Kung Fu at (503)254-1478 or Todd Ellner at (503)493-4431/tellner@cs.pdx.edu ------------------------------ From: "David W. Fulton" Date: Thu, 11 Mar 1999 14:44:10 -0500 Subject: eskrima: Tool Dip 'n Sticks The "Stick Man" wrote: > Ah, yes, Tool Dip. I used to use this on my old fiberglass sticks (talk >about real bone breakers! I learned of this stuff from Tom Meadows). I >made some real cool handles on 3/4" rod (thin but VERY heavy, a most >dangerous combination). BTW, I quit making these around '91 because too >many beginners thought they were cool, but couldn't handle it safely when >training with partners. I sold them with the disclaimer "NOT FOR >BEGINNERS". This should give some relative perspective on the plastics, Just out of curiosity, has anyone tried using tool dip on rattan sticks? If so, what were the results? TIA. Dave dwf@computerpackages.com ------------------------------ From: Date: Thu, 11 Mar 1999 12:05:15 -0800 (PST) Subject: Re: eskrima: Tool Dip 'n Sticks > Just out of curiosity, has anyone tried using tool dip on rattan sticks? If > so, what were the results? Yes! I love it. Ray Terry raymail@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com ------------------------------ From: "Marc Denny" Date: Thu, 11 Mar 1999 12:40:34 -0800 Subject: eskrima: Self Defense part two A Howl of Greeting to All: Thanks to Mik for the info on the Citizens' Self-Defense Act of 1999 (Introduced in the House). Does anyone know how I could get in touch with Congressman Bartlett? Drew wrote: > > As for helmet/seat-belt laws, these are for generating revenue, not > increasing public safety or as, is generally claimed, reducing > insurance costs by limiting the severity/number of injuries sustained. I would suggest that whatever the given "good idea" is behind nannying people is irrelevant. The issue is who gets to decide- the State or the individual? > How does this relate to FMA?? If it comes down to it, do what those > in the Phillipines did and take the arts underground for as long as is > necessary. > > Drew Good point, but lets see if we can keep it from getting to that , , , Animal wrote: > Those that want to force everyone into submission to verbal weapons aren't > necessarily in the government, but they support a government who behaves in > such a manner. It's not so much the government we need to focus on, Yes and no. Yes the change begins with the man in the mirror. As for the latter point, we have only to look at the recently shot down FDIC "Know your Customer" proposed regs to see that Government can be a most serious problem. >Face it, despite some serious notable > exceptions, the average human being really has a better control over violence > than alarmists give him credit. How can I say this? Consider what it would be > like if for a week, every gun and knife in this country was used. It isn't > until you realize what it could be like that we can realize how much self- > control people really have. Good and essential point by Animal here. Lurking underneath the words of those who would neuter we the people, is the very undemocratic belief that anarchy and mayhem results when the people are armed. Certainly the counter position can be taken too far too as well. Wherein lies the balance? I believe the people should be armed, but confess visceral unease with certain technologies. Can we articulate a principled position in this regard? Rick wrote: > Out of a sense of > righteousness, frustration, and self preservation "Interest Groups" > have taken single issues to new heights (lows?). Groups such as PETA > have deemed it necessary to justify physical and non physical violence > as allowable to protect non human species. Doctors are portrayed on > "Wanted Posters" as murderers.A common denominator here is a >sense of disenfranchisement, of not having any other avenues to >effect desired change, and so using whatever means possible to >get the desired outcome. IMHO the social structure for which the human animal is intended (i.e. that in which he evolved) is roughly that of the American Indian before the white man came. Instead, today we often have to interact with vast numbers of strangers. To the extent that there are shared cultural values this can work, but when it seems that all values are evanescent, the glue of culture dissolves. I suspect that our evolutionary biology will lead at least some of us to recreate the bond of the pack, the bond of the tribe, and the shared mission thereof. > I think this is > true even (especially?) with those in government who may be truly > motivated to "do the right thing" but either have no idea what that is > or lack any meaningful tools to do that. Passing yet even more > misguided and unenforceable laws sure doesn't seem to work, but it > seems like the only tool they have. I guess when all you have is a > hammer, everything looks like a nail. Another aspect is a prominent > inability to accept that others may not agree, and to try to pound > them flat. Yes! > Unfortunately, these actions based on unrealistic viewpoints lead to > lots of unintended consequences. Sort of like finding out that "all > that fancy shit" looks really, really good in stickwork but doesn't > work against a determined Kalista with a good forehand, backhand, > roofblock and the desire to close (see any of the DB tapes as > references). Well, actually I would like to quibble here. I would say our message is that the fancier stuff doesn't work without having the essence of the basics. When you do have the basics solid, then you might be really surprised at what comes up. > In our society the government legislates, regulates and > judiciates more and more unenforceable laws, or makes illegal those > things that are already illegal and wonders why the laws don't work > (hmmm, must need more!). I would maintain that the good guys are > already obeying the laws, even the ones we don't like, and the bad > guys don't give a shit. In the civil world more and more lawsuits are > used to violently enforce a point of view, and in my opinion, are > every bit as dangerous as anything the government does, at least short > term. Yes, but I would suggest that the lawsuits are a consequence of laws. > The curve ball here is that I really don't think anything has changed > over all these millennia! I think this kind of stuff went on in the > past, just now we live in "a new paradigm" and "things are different," > or so we think (just like the economy). I'm sorry, I just don't think > human nature has changed very much. And unfortunately, as the legal > screws are tightened, and as civil authority expands into new areas, > and as those who can't afford a lawyer or politician or interest group > find "alternative" means, at some point we may find ourselves even > farther along in someplace we really don't belong, where very bad > things happen to us as a society. EXACTLY!!! > So this is my analysis of at least part of the problem. What are the > answers? I think not getting blindsided is a good place to start. And > at least not rolling over and shrieking (although I feel that way > myself at times) is another good place to start. Also, I really do > think individuals, and groups of individuals can be forces for > positive change. I have found that people are capable of truly > alternative forms of functioning together, that there is a "higher > nature," although it takes work to find and develop it on a day to > day basis. Agreed, including the point about higher nature. So, an effort at summarizing what we have so far in our effort to derive a concise statement of principles: 1) There is an inherent inalienable right of self-defense. In the US it is expressed in the Ninth Amendment of the Constitution. 2) For this right to be meaningful, the good cannot be less armed than the bad. The good can be trusted, indeed must be trusted, to be armed. 3) The standards applied to the exercise of this right should be stated in simple form and made known to the people so that they may hesitate to act when necessary out of fear of the legal system. I would suggest also that for the very reasons the Iroquois Indians had a confederacy, (the root of US federalism via Ben Franklin BTW--a little known fact) we need to remember that political units should not get too big-- thus people should have more of a sense that they can make a difference without violently going outside the system. 4) When we impose our "good ideas" on those who do not agree through governmental action, we are being violent and violence begets violence. Your thoughts? May I suggest keeping pet peeve rants to a minimum? (I know, look who is talking, yeah yeah ;-) ) Remembering that this is a FMA forum, in particular what standards do we think should apply to the use of violence? Woof, Crafty Dog PS: Animal, sorry about the implication about getting hit in the head-- I was just trying to give a compliment. ------------------------------ From: Rocky Pasiwk Date: Thu, 11 Mar 1999 19:02:26 -0800 Subject: eskrima: Just stuff in genral Drew wrote: > As for helmet/seat-belt laws, these are for generating revenue, not > increasing public safety or as, is generally claimed, reducing > Thank you some one who thinks like me ( boy that probably just gave you the hebejebes ) this is why I no longer refer to them as police or Leos but rather Revenue generators, which seems to be their primary function. Here in Michigan to police that I have owned at one time or another have told me that they average 2 to 3 dozen tickets a day. All you have to do is sit in front of one of my stores for a day and you will believe it, I have watch one officer pull dozens of people over in a matter of hours, right in front of my store. Now think about it the average ticket is about $65 to $95 As far as this political stuff relating to FMA, I know Ray this is an FMA digest so I'll make it quick. But look at history, Hitler's first order of business was to take everyone's guns away, now don't you think that if Martial Arts was as big back then as it is now that he would have out lawed them to!!!!!!!!!!! HHMMM! On last little nip, Here in Michigan at first you had to wear a seat belt, but they couldn't pull you over for just that. After they got people use to that for a few years, then they said well it just isn't working people still aren't wearing their seat belt, so now were going to let police pull you over if they see you or think they see you not wearing a seat belt. My question is for the LEO's what kind of person works like this. Ok back to FMA Jeff please explain to me how you train. As I have mentioned before, not trying to be disrespectful here, but how do you go thru a pair of sticks in one day. Do you guys do a lot of sinwalli type of drills and smash the sticks together constantly, or use skinned or light sticks. I am not being a smart ass but damn I have never gone thru a pair of good rattan in a day, but again this is wear we may differ we don't do a whole lot of constant stick smashing type of drills, maybe that's the difference, which would be understandable. Also a question for some of you herbal and vitamin wizards out there does anyone do anything about HGH human growth hormone, many weight lifters take it , its like $150.00 for 16 oz bottle, what's it do, is it dangerous. Thanks Rocky ------------------------------ From: Kalki Date: Thu, 11 Mar 1999 18:39:45 -0600 Subject: eskrima: Re: Inayan_Eskrima/FMA-Digest V6 #105 > I think not getting blindsided is a good place to start. And > at least not rolling over and shrieking (although I feel that way > myself at times) is another good place to start. Also, I really do > think individuals, and groups of individuals can be forces for > positive change. I have found ... that there is a "higher > nature," although it takes work to find and develop it on a day to > day basis. > That's one doggone good post hombre. More power to you pal. We can't be lazy en la cabeza. It all rests on our values. Our values are the basis of our motivations. Our motivations drive our actions which can be either haphazard by fits and starts, or purposeful, well-reasoned and consistent. Consistent application in all fields of action lead us reliably closer to our goals, whether they be reliable fighting skills or any other valued attribute. Be well, Mik ------------------------------ From: Lonnie Pollard Date: Thu, 11 Mar 1999 19:32:23 -0500 Subject: eskrima: "Garimot" Largo Mano Time constraints restrict me from being able to elaborate much for now on the subject of largo mano as taught in the "Garimot" system. For now I can only say that, assuming I'm understanding what people mean by the following terms, that "bambooing", "slipping, bobbing, weaving, and snapback motions", "elastico", etc., have little to nothing to do with the largo mano concepts that I was writing about and that I've been exposed to in the "Garimot" system. That isn't to say that there is anything wrong with those things, but rather to explain that it is a separate subject from the one I was trying to explain. The largo mano I've been learning I'd best describe as a complete systematic analysis of position and range. There are numerous factors involved, and as we learn to map out our position etc. in relation to our opponent, we are taught to position ourselves such that when we both remain static, we can reach our opponent but our opponent can't reach us. Guided by the concepts, models, etc. that we learn, we are supposed to mentally map out the ground and examine the various aspects of our opponent and then position ourselves to be in the position of advantage. We then test it by remaining in a static position without swaying so that we can see if we're actually in a position of advantage. Later if adding in what is perhaps similar to "elastico", any swaying would be used more as a counter measure to prevent the opponent from swaying in close enough to reach, yet allowing a range where the opponent is still reachable, thus maintaining advantage. Perhaps swaying is a poor choice of word, but for now it will have to do. We are expected to practice largo mano with a wide range of body types, including those with reach advantage. Gat Puno Abon often will stand in a position and ask me if I think I can reach him and if I think he can reach me. It is easy for me to judge when I'm working with a student with equal or less experience than me, but more difficult with more experienced students. With Gat Puno Abon sometimes when he asks me it looks as though he's even almost close enough to punyo, yet when I extend the stick I discover that even if I lean toward him the stick still misses him by an inch. Yet he easily reaches out and taps me on the head even though I have a natural reach advantage over him. Sometimes he even does it with the free hand side in the lead position, and yet he still reaches me while I can't reach him, and it is something that must be experienced to be bekieved. He's also demonstrated largo mano positioning with multiple opponents, putting himself in a position where he could reach them but they couldn't reach him. At the least, any discussion about the largo mano concepts that I was trying to articulate would require a discussion about angles, factors of how the feet are analyzed, into concepts of sectoring, and any of numerous other topics unrelated to any type of swaying movement. The positioning eventually comes naturally without all of the analysis, but to arrive at that point requires the time spent in the practice of analyzing and testing. What I am being taught as largo mano could easily be considered a science/art within itself, separate from stickwork. There is much to the largo mano footwork, yet if you watch the footwork you see very little footwork going on. That probably won't make sense to most people. The footwork is controlled and lacks the excessive moving about that is so often seen elsewhere. What is great about it is that the artists footwork actually improves all the way into late age, rather than depend on the rapid movement that is available to us when we are in our younger years and in our prime. Rather than peaking early and relying on physical ability, the artist is expected to rely on intellect first and to always be improving, even into the late years. Sorry I can't go further into describing much about largo mano right now, but hopefully the above yields maybe some clarification about what I was talking about without offending anyone, since after all there is absolutely no offense intended toward anyone or any style. I hope that maybe a few readers have even enjoyed reading the above. Best wishes, Lonnie a student of the "Garimot" system of Arnis ------------------------------ From: Date: Sat, 11 Mar 2000 08:22:03 -0500 Subject: eskrima: epi/nori Hello, Med Man Mik wrote in #97: >> Since one of the psychological effects of adrenaline is the presence of >> negative thoughts, >Not critiquing here firend, just curious ... how do you connect >adrenaline with negative thoughts? (Rolling up my sleeves and getting into my on-guard stance, scrambling around looking for my knife and stick, ready for anything ;-) LOL) Sorry Mik, maybe I was not clear in my post, I noted down what Geoff Thompson has wrote in his book DEAD OR ALIVE and from an interview with him in Black Belt magazine and it was not me writing that. I shall defer to what you posted as more correct than what Geoff T. wrote in his book. Just curious, awhile back there was a mini-thread on fear and if memory serves, Chris of Executive Edge sent in a Oscar De la Hoya quote in response to what you posted, and I sent in 2 Tyson/Spinks quotes along with Geoff Thompson's "Fear Adrenal Map". Is the Fear Adrenal Map valid? I'm ready to take this to private email if the Grand Poobah of the Internet requests it. If you need me to email you the FAM, please let me know. Interested to hear your comments on it. >Ah, pardon the noise. Sorry if this technical tendency of mine seems >picky. I'm gonna change my ways in this posting thing (no mo'guarana) OK by me. How else would I or the rest of ED learn? If no one corrects a post and they know it to be wrong or misleading, it would be a shame. The other 998 of the ~1,000 strong ED would take the post to be the "truth". You should see me when I've had 2 cans of Jolt!? [a whole lot of technical info that is useful in understanding fear and adrenalin snipped] >sum it up to say that we should step into the psych process before >the adrenaline gets dumped into the blood because whether negative or >positive it will push us further in the direction that we're going >psychologically. Regular training and mental rehearsal can go a long >way in this regard. I re-read your post a few times and it was a tad bit technical for me and am trying to understand it better. I'm in accounting, so thank you for the "bottom line" :-) Thank you very much for correcting me on my research into the relationship of fear and adrenaline. I would not knowingly post erroneous info. Very best, Hy bakayaru@pipeline.com p.s. CONGRATULATIONS Marc! If it's a boy, how about naming him Auggie? as in Auggie Doggie? :-) ------------------------------ From: "Carlo Seletaria" Date: Thu, 11 Mar 1999 20:59:54 PST Subject: [none] Does anyone here know where I can contact Grandmaster Remy A. Presas of Modern Arnis? (Thru mail or email) Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ From: "J H" Date: Thu, 11 Mar 1999 22:48:17 PST Subject: eskrima: Wekaf tournaments Hello all! I've go a lady friend who's interested in some stick fighting tournments in the West coast area... Any bites? Fry Bread Boy ** Does anyone know how or where to get any sampalog or pastilla's( pilipino kind) in the San Francisco/ South Bay area? Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ From: Patrick Davies Date: Fri, 12 Mar 1999 11:10:19 -0000 Subject: eskrima: The big fight Lewis! Holyfield has been a favourite of mine for a while but time to move over They will give us something to bite into I think! ; ) pat the brits are coming ------------------------------ From: Date: Fri, 12 Mar 1999 05:07:35 -0800 (PST) Subject: eskrima: smoke -n- mirrors > students. With Gat Puno Abon sometimes when he asks me it looks as though > he's even almost close enough to punyo, yet when I extend the stick I > discover that even if I lean toward him the stick still misses him by an > inch. Yet he easily reaches out and taps me on the head even though I have > a natural reach advantage over him. Sometimes he even does it with the free > hand side in the lead position, and yet he still reaches me while I can't > reach him, and it is something that must be experienced to be bekieved. Sounds like magic to me... Ray Terry raymail@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com ------------------------------ From: Date: Fri, 12 Mar 1999 05:09:27 -0800 (PST) Subject: eskrima: . ------------------------------ End of Inayan_Eskrima/FMA-Digest V6 #106 **************************************** To unsubscribe from this digest, eskrima-digest, send the command: unsubscribe eskrima-digest -or- unsubscribe eskrima-digest your.old@address in the BODY of email (top line, left justified) addressed to majordomo@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com. Old digest issues are available via ftp://ftp.martialartsresource.com, directory pub/eskrima/digests. All digest files have the suffix '.txt' Copyright 1994-99: Ray Terry, Inayan System of Eskrima, Martial Arts Resource Standard disclaimers apply.