From: eskrima-digest-owner@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com To: eskrima-digest@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com Subject: Inayan_Eskrima/FMA-Digest V6 #119 Reply-To: eskrima@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com Errors-To: eskrima-digest-owner@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com Precedence: Inayan_Eskrima/FMA-Digest Wed, 24 March 1999 Vol 06 : Num 119 In this issue: eskrima: K9 defensive tactics eskrima: Re: Inayan_Eskrima/FMA-Digest V6 #118 eskrima: Dog Attacks eskrima: Dogs eskrima: Pentjak Silat Seminar eskrima: Arnis in Anchorage??? eskrima: Arnis in Anchorage??? eskrima: Arnis in Anchorage??? Re: eskrima: Arnis in Anchorage??? eskrima: . .......................................................................... Eskrima-Digest, serving the Internet since June 1994. 1050 members strong! Copyright 1994-99: Ray Terry, Inayan System of Eskrima, Martial Arts Resource Replying to this message will NOT unsubscribe you. To unsubscribe, send "unsubscribe eskrima-digest" (no quotes) in the body of an e-mail (top line, left justified) addressed to majordomo@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com To send e-mail to this list use eskrima@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com See the Filipino Martial Arts (FMA) FAQ and online search the last two years worth of digest issues at http://www.MartialArtsResource.com Mabuhay ang eskrima! Ray Terry, PO Box 110841, Campbell, CA 95011 FMA@MartialArtsResource.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Date: Wed, 24 Mar 1999 13:39:38 -0800 Subject: eskrima: K9 defensive tactics >I have been asked about the best strategy to fend off an untrained but >determined biter - not a 'killer' - with a cane or cane sized stick...we >have a large retired population and more than one 'pack' of street dogs. >I'm talking about a nasty pet, not rampaging killers. I'm not a big K9 expert, but my sister has raised large dogs (malamutes) for 35 years, and she learned from ex-military K9 trainers, among others. I've owned or lived with malamutes, dobermans and several other smaller breeds, so I do have some experience. In some ways, I think I learned more about handling people from handling dogs than anything else I've done. First - dogs are very fast. It's like being in a knife fight - if you don't get hurt, you were lucky. That said, here are several strategies: *If you face a pack, do NOT let them get behind you! Get in a corner, against a wall or tree, or best, up off the ground out of reach or behind a barrier (door). I've been there, too! I got rescued from several hours in an oak tree when 2 of my sister's malamutes broke out of a yard and came up on the dog pack (over a dozen); the dog pack lost its nerve and fled. *If you have a weapon, you have to keep it moving to hold them at bay. If they are determined, they can harass you until you get tired. Like the guy in Jurassic Park that gets eaten by the little lizards .... With a stick, the kill spot is the top of the skull. If you draw an X, going from each eye to the opposit ear, the soft spot is about 1 inch behind the center. Dogs are determined, so you should keep swinging, even just back and forth, to hold them back. I've used all the basic escrima moves, but downward figure 8's, repeated downward strikes, etc. Some dogs, like pitbulls, might just ignore being hit. If they are holding on to something (other than you) shove a hose in the mouth or at the nose and turn it on. If the animal is ignoring you, repeated kicks to the groin usually get its attention. *Kiai - a loud, determined yell CAN work. I've turned back a charging mastiff with one (WHEW!) A large part of dog fights are psychological; dogs establishing heirarchy. Acting like the "top dog" can deter an animal that has not been trained to fight humans. *Drop low - If a dog harasses a human, it identifies a vertical figure. Going low changes the profile; a charging animal will generally veer off and take another look. You are exhibiting a defensive fighting posture and presence, body language the animal recognizes. Staying high opens your targets, like groin, throat and arms. Might be hard for old people, though. *Kicking - up under the throat, jaw or soft underbelly (harder to reach in a direct attack). Be quick or be meat! Dogs don't like this at all. If the animal is coming up towards your face or neck, use your knee into the chest. *Trapping the jaws - two ways to prevent a dog from biting. One - clamp the jaws shut. The power is in closing them, not opening. Same for crocadiles ... Two - if it gets to this, jam your thumb behind the canine teeth (the longest sharp ones) and pin the jaw open to the dogs chest so it can't close it's jaws. The only option the animal has is to back up, so preventing this is important.. I've done this from the ground facing an animal, but better if you can take the back. I've never had to cram my fist down a dogs throat to choke it. Well, maybe once ... If you grapple, you must control the muzzle; sometimes a neck control can do the job, but if the animal can thrash loose, those teeth are right there. *Jabbing with a stick might hold off a threatening animal, but without a spear tip, I doubt it would do much for a serious attack. If you have a long weapon, reversing to hit with opposite ends is disorienting to most dogs. Making noise, banging the stick, can also be a deterent. *Finally, pepper spray. Animals are highly sensitive to this. In Canada, it is illegal to spray people, but it is used agains bear attacks. *** When trouble arises and things look bad, there is always one individual who perceives a solution and is willing to take command. Very often, that individual is crazy. *** Jeff "Stickman" Finder stickman@autobahn.org ------------------------------ From: "Marc Denny" Date: Wed, 24 Mar 1999 15:16:37 -0800 Subject: eskrima: Re: Inayan_Eskrima/FMA-Digest V6 #118 A Howl etc: Ted wrote: > I have been asked about the best strategy to fend off an untrained but > determined biter - not a 'killer' - with a cane or cane sized stick...we > have a large retired population and more than one 'pack' of street dogs. > I'm talking about a nasty pet, not rampaging killers. > > I hope someone has given this some thought or even has worked with dogs > enough to give a workable reply. What is implied here is an older person with a cane and a dog of size unknown. Without further data, I offer the following: 1) Most canes are very light on purpose, too light to easily hurt a rowdy dog. I remember Alvis's first FMA teacher, GM Seneres checked out the first seminar Eric and I did for Alvis and he had his cane with him-- it was a golf club sans head. THIS would be pretty f@$%^g effective I think-- especially the way GM Seneres could whip it. 2) Possible tactics ( each of which depends on the circumstances) a) offer forearm/stick and as dog goes for it, knee him in the chest. Dogs hate this. Of course if older person lacks stability and balance to do this without getting knocked on duff, this would be a bad call. b) continuous vertical redondos. Remember importance of attitude- forward cocky attitude, shout "Baad Dog!", talk trash, strong eye to eye contact. Be able to hit hard in combination. FWIW, there it is. Woof, Crafty ------------------------------ From: Michael Melone Date: Wed, 24 Mar 1999 17:06:44 -0800 (PST) Subject: eskrima: Dog Attacks >>>From: Ted Truscott Date: Wed, 24 Mar 1999 08:11:23 -0700 Subject: eskrima: Re: Dogs The guys over at the knife forum seem to have a consensus that the only safe way to handle a dog attack is to shoot the offender. They got off onto a thread about attack trained dogs or police dogs which doesn't really apply to my situatin here. I have been asked about the best strategy to fend off an untrained but determined biter - not a 'killer' - with a cane or cane sized stick...we have a large retired population and more than one 'pack' of street dogs. I'm talking about a nasty pet, not rampaging killers. I hope someone has given this some thought or even has worked with dogs enough to give a workable reply.<<< - --- Hi Ted, IMO, first thing to keep in mind in a dog attack is *don't run*, unless you have somewhere to go that's very safe and *very* close. Secondly, don't turn your back. Get something behind you (i.e. wall, car, tree). Try to get the attention of the owner, if possible. Try to look as big as possible. In the past I was able to fend off an attacking canine by holding a big tree branch over my head and yelling "Hah!" as loud as I could. Your proposed scenario has you carrying a cane. Great! Whack that dog in the nose with it. Of course using some appropriate footwork and body angulation as the situation dictates. I wouldn't bother with any other targets becase they'll be either to hard to hit or not have any deterent effect. A good whack in the nose should stop all but the most psychotically aggressive dogs. If not, keep bashing it in the nose and yelling for the owner. YMMV. === Ciao Mike Melone memelone@yahoo.com _________________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com ------------------------------ From: Date: Wed, 24 Mar 1999 20:14:17 EST Subject: eskrima: Dogs Using a knife or hammer or baseball bat will work with hungry feral dogs that are starved, and are not genetic superiors in terms of canines. I have read hundreds of accounts and spoken to dog men across the country for 10 years now. If you have to deal with a "game bred dog". You will have to shoot him. They can take knives, and sometimes bullets to non lethal areas. A 190 pound filipino/brazilian trained LEO is a joke to a dog that can catch and hold a 400 pound Russian Wild Boar with 4" tusks. Hell, a 16 pound Patterdale Terrier can kill a 70 pound coyote in a one on one fight. I has to do with the fight in the dog, and its ability to resist shock, and deal with pain. The ability to continue the fight when it is injured and the situation hopeless. Rare qualities in dogs or men.... Tom Furman, proud owner of Ripley,,American Pit Bull Terrier, Colby bred since 1890 ------------------------------ From: Date: Wed, 24 Mar 1999 21:00:58 EST Subject: eskrima: Pentjak Silat Seminar A 2-Day Seminar Featuring Guru Besar JIM INGRAM of Pentjak Silat Mustika Kwitang. Experience training with a Dutch - Indo who has been doing it for 60 years! When: Saturday and Sunday, April 24th & 25th -10:00 a.m. to 4:00 p.m. Where: Johnston, Rhode Island Preregistration-$50.00/day or $80 for both days. [Sorry, no personal checks. Cashiers checks or money orders only.] Send check or money order to: Fred Fullerton 32 Whitin Ave. Warwick, RI 02888-2014 More more info email: Frederick_Fullerton@Brown.edu or DEB@BROWNVM.BROWN.EDU (David Boylan) or Kilap@aol.com Regards, Travis ------------------------------ From: "Scott Smith" Date: Wed, 24 Mar 1999 19:18:19 PST Subject: eskrima: Arnis in Anchorage??? I am from Canada and I just moved to Anchorage, AK. I am looking for an Arnis club in the area but can't seem to find any. If anyone knows of one could you please let me know??? Thanks, Scott Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ From: "Scott Smith" Date: Wed, 24 Mar 1999 19:20:34 PST Subject: eskrima: Arnis in Anchorage??? I am from Canada and I just moved to Anchorage, AK. I am looking for an Arnis club in the area but can't seem to find any. If anyone knows of one could you please let me know??? Thanks, Scott Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ From: "Scott Smith" Date: Wed, 24 Mar 1999 19:20:43 PST Subject: eskrima: Arnis in Anchorage??? This is a multi-part message in MIME format. - ------=_NextPart_000_6511b7db_41946ead$4782d0f4 Content-type: text/plain I am from Canada and I just moved to Anchorage, AK. I am looking for an Arnis club in the area but can't seem to find any. If anyone knows of one could you please let me know??? Thanks, Scott ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com - ------=_NextPart_000_6511b7db_41946ead$4782d0f4 Content-type: text/html I am from Canada and I just moved to Anchorage, AK. I am looking for an Arnis club in the area but can't seem to find any. If anyone knows of one could you please let me know???

Thanks,

Scott

Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com
- ------=_NextPart_000_6511b7db_41946ead$4782d0f4-- ------------------------------ From: Date: Wed, 24 Mar 1999 19:34:46 -0800 (PST) Subject: Re: eskrima: Arnis in Anchorage??? Once is enough, please... Ray Terry raymail@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com ------------------------------ From: Date: Wed, 24 Mar 1999 19:45:50 -0800 (PST) Subject: eskrima: . ------------------------------ End of Inayan_Eskrima/FMA-Digest V6 #119 **************************************** To unsubscribe from this digest, eskrima-digest, send the command: unsubscribe eskrima-digest -or- unsubscribe eskrima-digest your.old@address in the BODY of email (top line, left justified) addressed to majordomo@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com. Old digest issues are available via ftp://ftp.martialartsresource.com, directory pub/eskrima/digests. All digest files have the suffix '.txt' Copyright 1994-99: Ray Terry, Inayan System of Eskrima, Martial Arts Resource Standard disclaimers apply.