From: eskrima-digest-owner@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com To: eskrima-digest@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com Subject: Inayan_Eskrima/FMA-Digest V6 #180 Reply-To: eskrima@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com Errors-To: eskrima-digest-owner@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com Precedence: Inayan_Eskrima/FMA-Digest Thurs, 29 April 1999 Vol 06 : Num 180 In this issue: eskrima: Cross-training eskrima: Plethora of techniques vs. a few eskrima: surface conditioning eskrima: Pekiti seminars eskrima: Southeast Asian fighters eskrima: Bruce Siddle eskrima: Re: Inayan_Eskrima/FMA-Digest V6 #176 eskrima: Eskrima Digest eskrima: Greetings eskrima: Re: Fw: Returned mail: Service unavailable eskrima: . .......................................................................... Eskrima-Digest, serving the Internet since June 1994. 1050+ members strong! Copyright 1994-99: Ray Terry, Inayan System of Eskrima, Martial Arts Resource Replying to this message will NOT unsubscribe you. To unsubscribe, send "unsubscribe eskrima-digest" (no quotes) in the body of an e-mail (top line, left justified) addressed to majordomo@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com To send e-mail to this list use eskrima@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com See the Filipino Martial Arts (FMA) FAQ and online search the last two years worth of digest issues at http://www.MartialArtsResource.com Mabuhay ang eskrima! Ray Terry, PO Box 110841, Campbell, CA 95011 FMA@MartialArtsResource.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Mike Casto Date: Wed, 28 Apr 1999 18:10:59 -0700 (PDT) Subject: eskrima: Cross-training << Each school will develop on the basis of their instructors likes and dislikes. That is where the arts develop or become stale. It cannot be helped. It is the nature of things. For me I try and choose the arts that I believe add to my base if they are available. If not then the closest derivative is sought. If that's all that is available then so be it. >> Very interesting point. This is why I cross-train as much as possible and why my instructor advocates cross-training. While we cover a lot of ground in our Kali and Silat training, I have found that I get important things from training in other styles. For instance, the way that Bukti Negara Silat does a specific type of takedown will work fine and I can do it. However, the way Kali effects the same takedown suits me better. A certain stick choke from Kali is great for me, but I found at a seminar with Dr. Gyi that Bando does it in a slightly different manner that I personally prefer. Another thing that cross-training gives me is different perspectives on the same material. When I first heard Guro Dan's explanation of the double Pak Sao entry to trapping, it made sense, but I didn't *get* it until I heard Sifu Bustillo explain it. It was the exact same technique, but Bustillo's explanation clicked with me better than Guro Dan's. Now, when I'm trying to teach this, I try Sifu Richard's explanation first (because it's usually the first one to come to my mind), and if it doesn't work, then I try Guro Dan's explanation of the concept. If this still doesn't work, then I'll try to come up with another explanation. Really, the only difference between their explanations was in the key points that they stressed ... but that minute difference made a world of difference in my perception of the concept. And, of course, the other (and most common) reason for cross-training is to fill gaps in your material. I don't know if I really had a point to make or I was just rambling ... but FWIW, that's my 2 cents on cross-training. Mike === Mike Casto Assistant Instructor Asian Fighting Arts Filipino Kali/ 5099 Springboro Pike Indonesian Pentjak Silat Dayton, OH 45439 Phone: (937) 293-5520 URL: http://www.guild-hall.com/afa/ _________________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com ------------------------------ From: Mike Casto Date: Wed, 28 Apr 1999 18:13:29 -0700 (PDT) Subject: eskrima: Plethora of techniques vs. a few << I know guys that have hundreds of ground techniques but I doubt if they can use them in a real fight. I had only three holds for years and week in week out they worked for me on the doors. Nothing new about this. Hundreds of mails on this list have talked about it and is the DBMA not just exactly about that? >> Guro Dan made this point like this: "Shoot has hundreds of locks in their series and that's great. Me, personally, I only need one lock ... and hundreds of ways to get to it." I thought this was such an eloquent observation ... and very true. Mike === Mike Casto Assistant Instructor Asian Fighting Arts Filipino Kali/ 5099 Springboro Pike Indonesian Pentjak Silat Dayton, OH 45439 Phone: (937) 293-5520 URL: http://www.guild-hall.com/afa/ _________________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com ------------------------------ From: "Dawn & Creight Hatico" Date: Wed, 28 Apr 1999 19:25:38 PDT Subject: eskrima: surface conditioning [LURK MODE OFF] Hey folks!, I do the typical JKDC/FMA curriculum and had a question about conditioning my empty hand striking surfaces. I recently began striking my canvas heavy bag without bag gloves in the hopes that it will condition my knuckles and upper fingers and also doing thai kicks without any shin protection/padding. After about two days my knuckles and shins were too sore to do any dedicated striking on the bag, even with protection/padding. My reasoning behind such training was that we don't use protective equipment in real altercations and I wanted to train solo realistically. Should I pad up for power striking and do surface conditioning separately (makiwara for the knuckles and bottle rolling for the shins) ? Or is this something that just comes with time. Do any of you have any tips/tricks for facilitating my development, such as training progressions that have worked or particular liniments that speed healing (dit da jow)? My concern is for longevity. I am not a professional fighter who will fight over a limited amount of years, I do want to be a warrior who can defend myself and those I care about decisively for the rest of my life. I know that injury is sometimes inescapable in our particular blend of martial arts but I am hoping that some of our more "seasoned" warriors can provide tips to maximize conditioning while minimizing downtime due to training caused wear and tear. Creighton Hatico _______________________________________________________________ Get Free Email and Do More On The Web. Visit http://www.msn.com ------------------------------ From: "BILL MCGRATH" Date: Wed, 28 Apr 1999 22:38:28 -0700 Subject: eskrima: Pekiti seminars From: Tuhon Bill McGrath I just got back from seminars in Europe and went through my email to find a question on the relation between western boxing and FMA. In Pekiti-Tirsia the double knife techniques in which both fighters hold their knives in icepick grip are the most "boxing like" in that you have to "slip" past your opponent's weapon arm and often involve a punch to set up a stab. Guro Dan has pointed out that a boxer's speed bad drills in which he uses a hammerfist is an odd drill to practice for a fighter forbidden to use a hammerfist in the ring, but perfectly reasonable for a martial art with no such regulations. I am wondering if any one else on ED have seen a similar parallel between knife and boxing in their systems or do they teach boxing as a separate art? I will give some details from Pekiti when I return from my next seminar. Speaking of which... May 1st & 2nd Myrtle Beach S.C. Icepick vs Hammer grip knife techniques, Advanced hand vs. knife. Cost: $120 Time: 10:00 AM till dark. Contact: Dr. Chris Ash (803) 497-3691 May 8th Musical Theatre Works 440 Lafayette St. ('tween Astor PL and 4th St) Manhattan, NYC 1 to 5 PM $40 Combat Skills Development Seminar Visit the PTI web site for more info: WWW.PEKITI-TIRSIA.COM May 15th Utica, NY Double Stick Overview (a sampling of Attacks, Counters, Recounters and Disarms) Contact: Chris Fry at (315) 724-7479 Regards, Tuhon Bill McGrath ------------------------------ From: " " Date: Wed, 28 Apr 1999 21:47:00 -0700 Subject: eskrima: Southeast Asian fighters I'm looking for information (bios, articles, web sites, etc.) for some of the Greatest Southeast Asian fighters of all-time. Legends like Diesel-noi, Mike Inay, Chai Sirisute, DeThourars, etc. I'd appreciate any cooperation. Clay Parker - -----== Sent via Deja News, The Discussion Network ==----- http://www.dejanews.com/ Easy access to 50,000+ discussion forums ------------------------------ From: Date: Thu, 29 Apr 1999 01:14:09 EDT Subject: eskrima: Bruce Siddle In a message dated 99-04-28 21:15:12 EDT, you write: << cannot find the Bruce Siddle book "Sharpening the Warrior's Edge" mentioned in a previous thread. Any help tracking this down would be greatly appreciated. Thanks! >> You can get this book through Paladin Press. It's on page 25 of the newest catalog, the one with Y2K on the cover. Make sure you check out the book on top of page 24 in this same catalog. :-) Alain Burrese ------------------------------ From: Jesse Manibusan Date: Thu, 29 Apr 1999 01:43:38 -0700 (PDT) Subject: eskrima: Re: Inayan_Eskrima/FMA-Digest V6 #176 > From: "Jeffrey Monaghan" > Date: Sun, 25 Apr 1999 17:15:40 -0700 > Subject: eskrima: RE: Inayan_Eskrima/FMA-Digest V6 #175 [snip] > I try > not to fight someone in their strong range. For example > I box wrestlers, > wrestle kickers, etc. As we all know it is the superior > fighter that > controls the range and where the fight is fought, this is > what I aspire for. Good strategy. Its very likely that on the street, one will meet people stronger, faster, smarter, etc. than himself. But its NOT likely that your street nemesis will be your absolute superior in everythings and you may be able to pull some tricks out of your own magic hat: he may be faster, but you have a better reach, he may be stronger but you can outrun him, etc. So one needs to take the fight to the opponent and fight on your terms. In the military, a smaller force can succesfully overtake a much larger force if the element of surprise and absolute decisive violence of action is utilized by the smaller force: attitude. This is how they force us to think in the Marines. > Ray I have the same complaint about boxers. Most of them > train assuming > everyone is going to fight the same fight they are. So > they are wide open > to low line kicks and grappling/throws. Yup. Excellent punchers though they be, most are really vulnerable in the legs. However, even though the punching ability of boxers is respected, their body-punching would land them in a body bag if they tried to do that to a MT kickboxer. Muay Thai'ers LOVE it when they get people who try to body punch and drop their chin ever so slightly. I know: thats how I got the stitches in my mouth that prevented me from buying my motorcycle :-) I was taught to use knees to the inside of the body if that was what you wanted to hit. I was also taught that uppercuts were kinda like jabs: used to create openings or test reflexes of your opponent. It was NOT a knock-out blow. > I can't remember > who it was but a > world champion boxer (at the time it happened) got mugged > and they asked him > why he didn't fight back and he replied that he was the > world champion boxer > IN the ring. You fight like you train. > Jeff Monaghan I also heard stories of prisoners harassing and intimidating Mike Tyson while he was in prison. Thats because there wasn't a ring in sight so his mastery of his game did not apply to that environment. > From: " " > Date: Sun, 25 Apr 1999 22:19:43 -0700 > Subject: eskrima: Most Athletic Martial Art > > In terms of agility, strength, speed, endurance, > coordination, mental ability, and body control, which > martial art is the most athletic? boy thats a tough one. I don't think any one martial art qualifies. Agility? possibly Capoira or Monkey Style. Strength? Maybe every single martial art. Speed? Don't they say that the Kenpo folks are the fastest strikers? Endurance? Perhaps MT. COordination? I gotta say its one of the acrobatic styles like Monkey style or Capoeira. I would also rank 2-handed weapon styles up there. Mental ability? Gosh, all of them. Body Control? I am running out of GUESSES...:-) because thats exactly what my comments are... > From: Patrick Davies > Date: Mon, 26 Apr 1999 16:13:39 +0100 > Subject: eskrima: its how you do it that counts > > There are a lot of people who really don't have much > choice in the arts that > they train in. Maybe they live in a town where there is > only one martial > art. Some people would have to travel a long way to > choose. Some would have to fly to another city. That sucks. Lucky for you mainlanders, you get people like Guro Dan and GM Canete doing clinics. People in Hawaii do not get that kind of variety. In response to Ray's question about mix, mine is FMA, MT and boxing. Eventually I would like to incorporate BJJ into my melting pot. > I know guys that have > hundreds of ground > techniques but I doubt if they can use them in a real > fight. I rolled with some Jujitsu guy I saw training in a workout room adjacent to mine. I don't have any Jujitsu training and I was in awe of his choking and grappling skill. However, he seemed very easy to hit. He may have been in numerous training instances where he learned how to reverse grappling holds. But it didn't seem like he had the punishing training that boxers or other full-contact guys get. So a couple of lucky punches in his stomach or his head might be the end of his grappling. _________________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com ------------------------------ From: "Prof. Dr. Werner Brecht" Date: Thu, 29 Apr 1999 13:18:42 +0200 Subject: eskrima: Eskrima Digest Hi, all there! In ED v06#179 Tom Skoglind asked about Bruce Siddle's book "Sharpening ...". I just found it at Paladin Press (http://www.paladin-press.com). Greetings from Werner (Berlin/Germany) ------------------------------ From: "Kyud" Date: Thu, 29 Apr 1999 07:03:48 -0700 Subject: eskrima: Greetings Just a note that the Arnis Balite Site has moved has more information on the philosophies of the art. http://www.wizard.com/~kyud/index.html Hope everyone is in good health and high spirits. Can anyone tell me about WEKAF Hawaii Challenge - International Martial Arts Tournament, being held in Lahaina, Maui on 31 Jul and 1 Aug of 99? And finally the Kuntaw - Sayaw An book is out and on sale. at http://members.tripod.com/~Kyud/koinoniaindex.html Steven K. Dowd ------------------------------ From: Date: Thu, 29 Apr 1999 08:05:42 -0700 (PDT) Subject: eskrima: Re: Fw: Returned mail: Service unavailable Forwarding. Ray - ------------------------------------------------------ Woof Ray: Yes I saw your thing about orb.xxx and spam routing etc but we're two days away from the Gathering-- would you be so kind as to post this? Crafty > --------------------------------------------------------------- > Arrival-Date: Wed, 28 Apr 1999 16:22:29 -0700 (PDT) > Final-Recipient: RFC822; eskrima-digest@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com > Action: failed > Status: 5.5.0 > Remote-MTA: DNS; onet2-y.cup.hp.com > Diagnostic-Code: SMTP; 554 Service unavailable; [207.217.120.85] blocked using relays.orbs.org > > From: "Marc Denny" > To: "eskrima-digest" > Subject: Gathering Update & Mad About You > Date: Wed, 28 Apr 1999 16:25:07 -0700 > > A Howl of Greeting to All: > > Just two days to go until the "Dog Brothers' Spring Gathering of the > Pack-- the Second Decade Begins". We already have 28 fighters > pre-registered from around the US and abroad-- once again we are an > international event! If you want to see who the fighters will be, go the > Gathering Info section on the website and click on the list. Drummer > extraordinaire Brent "Earth Tribe Rhythms" Lewis will be on drums once > again and Fox News will be covering the event which will be a feature piece > next week on the evening news. Salty Dog and the Santa Fe Clan will be > there, Dog Loki from Canada, Mongrel's mutts, Dog Nick and his New York > pack, and of course Top Dog and I and the Hermosa Clan will be there-- 16 > fighters in all from the Dog Brothers tribe. TD is looking pretty sharp > for a 41 year old geezer, and yours truly will be accepting invitations > using a staff to hobble onto the field of honor. I may be getting older, > but I refuse to grow up. > > Woof, > Marc "Crafty Dog" Denny > DBIMA > > PS: VP In Charge of Reality Cindy "Pretty Kitty" Sheeley (soon to be Cindy > Denny BTW) will have a table full of t-shirts, videos, etc for sale so > BRING MONEY!!!-- and help us defray the cost of this party! > > PPS: Ron Balicki, humble husband to Dan's Deadly Daughter Diana Balicki > (the alliteration is an in-joke) tells me that Diana will be on the TV show > "Mad TV" on Saturday night fighting, get this, Jerry Springer!!! Details > Ron, we want details! ------------------------------ From: Date: Thu, 29 Apr 1999 08:09:47 -0700 (PDT) Subject: eskrima: . ------------------------------ End of Inayan_Eskrima/FMA-Digest V6 #180 **************************************** To unsubscribe from this digest, eskrima-digest, send the command: unsubscribe eskrima-digest -or- unsubscribe eskrima-digest your.old@address in the BODY of email (top line, left justified) addressed to majordomo@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com. Old digest issues are available via ftp://ftp.martialartsresource.com, directory pub/eskrima/digests. All digest files have the suffix '.txt' Copyright 1994-99: Ray Terry, Inayan System of Eskrima, Martial Arts Resource Standard disclaimers apply.