From: eskrima-digest-owner@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com To: eskrima-digest@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com Subject: Inayan_Eskrima/FMA-Digest V6 #212 Reply-To: eskrima@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com Errors-To: eskrima-digest-owner@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com Precedence: Inayan_Eskrima/FMA-Digest Wed, 19 May 1999 Vol 06 : Num 212 In this issue: eskrima: Japanese ranking in FMA eskrima: GURO DAN INOSANTO SUMMER CAMP eskrima: Knife Fighting/Knife Defense eskrima: Re: Inayan_Eskrima/FMA-Digest V6 #211 eskrima: re: Japanese ranking in FMA eskrima: Ring of Steel eskrima: Re: Unusual Fighting Style eskrima: Human instincts eskrima: Leo Fong eskrima: price increase Re: eskrima: re: Japanese ranking in FMA eskrima: . .......................................................................... Eskrima-Digest, serving the Internet since June 1994. ~1050 members strong! Copyright 1994-99: Ray Terry, Inayan System of Eskrima, Martial Arts Resource Replying to this message will NOT unsubscribe you. To unsubscribe, send "unsubscribe eskrima-digest" (no quotes) in the body of an e-mail (top line, left justified) addressed to majordomo@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com To send e-mail to this list use eskrima@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com See the Filipino Martial Arts (FMA) FAQ and online search the last two years worth of digest issues at http://www.MartialArtsResource.com Mabuhay ang eskrima! Ray Terry, PO Box 110841, Campbell, CA 95011 FMA@MartialArtsResource.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Dave Green" Date: Wed, 19 May 1999 17:34:36 +0100 Subject: eskrima: Japanese ranking in FMA > Doce Pares, Modern Arnis... Two more that use > the Dan system for ranking. > I did not know this. How did they come to adopt this convention? Many Doce Pares people in the PI also trained in Judo and some in Karate - this is probably where the idea came from. However, Black Belt grades are refered to as "degree" rather than "Dan" as far as I'm aware. Dave Green First "degree" BB - Doce Pares (GB) http://eskrima.cjb.net ------------------------------ From: howard bobs Date: Wed, 19 May 1999 09:32:24 -0700 (PDT) Subject: eskrima: GURO DAN INOSANTO SUMMER CAMP ATTENTION ATTENTION ATTENTION REMINDER GURO DAN INOSANTO WILL BE IN ST.LOUIS JULY 8,9,10 AND 11.COME JOIN US FOR A GURO DAN SUMMER CAMP AND TEACH IN..FOR MORE INFORMATION CONTACT: GATEWAY MARTIAL ARTS P.O BOX 12 ST.LOUIS,MO.63088 314-230-4799 CORDIALLY, STICKBOY _____________________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Free instant messaging and more at http://messenger.yahoo.com ------------------------------ From: Date: Wed, 19 May 1999 12:41:50 -0400 Subject: eskrima: Knife Fighting/Knife Defense The knife-fighting thread reminded me of a question... I came across a copy of a US Cavalry catalog, and inside I saw an ad for Kevlar gloves, forearm "sleeves", and balaclavas that supposedly provided some level of protection from bladed weapons. Has anyone had any experience with these things? Do they provide any appreciable protection? Or are they just a gimmick? Thanks. ------------------------------ From: "Todd D. Ellner" Date: Wed, 19 May 1999 09:36:38 -0700 Subject: eskrima: Re: Inayan_Eskrima/FMA-Digest V6 #211 leighans wrote: >enough with the vet stats....stop trashing a group who were willing to give >the supreme sacrifice, even if they didnt believe in it wholeheartedly...they >deserve our respect, not our stats on suicide and homelessness I fail to see how this discussion has "trashed" anyone. All that anyone has said here is that the men who went over there (willingly or not) have paid a very high price for their service perhaps in part due to the way they were trained. ------------------------------ From: "=?iso-8859-1?Q?Guro_Don_Mu=F1iz?=" Date: Wed, 19 May 1999 11:06:41 -0600 Subject: eskrima: re: Japanese ranking in FMA From: " Bad Karma " Date: Tue, 18 May 1999 19:26:00 -0700 Subject: eskrima: Japanese ranking in FMA >> Doce Pares, Modern Arnis... Two more that use >> the Dan system for ranking. > I did not know this. How did they come to adopt this convention? Let's face , true Martial Arts training did not have rank structure within their schools. My friend Tang said that in China, if you study from a Grandmaster, then you are a Master! Logic dictates: Grandmaster, Master, Mastery Level Students, High Level Students, Regular Students and Beginners. Kinda funny because in the United States Martial Arts World (mostly karate) there are so many Grandmasters... there was guy who said he was the Grandmaster of his own system: Tonfa Spear-Do. His weapons? Two Tonfas with pointy tips on the handles! Trust me... my school of Lead Pipe-Do is not around the corner!! So, many Japanese were in the Philippines prior to WWII and brought Karate, Judo and Jiu-Jitsu to the P.I. Since the proud Filipino People love to scrap as much as the next guy, people started studying these Arts. And, since many old Filipino Masters either: 1) trained to learn how to best defest against different Arts or 2) had students that studied these Arts: they may have liked the ranking structure and incorporated it into their schools. And, although many Filipino Systems that choose not to incorporate this type of ranking structure, most schools do have some type of ranking structure many times to establish pecking order. - -Tatlo Antas / Third level Blackbelt (COMJUKA-Kali Systems USA) Guro Don Founder: Yahoo! Filipino Warrior Arts Club ( http://clubs.yahoo.com/clubs/filipinowarriorarts2 ) ------------------------------ From: "Galicha, JR" Date: Wed, 19 May 1999 12:13:41 -0500 Subject: eskrima: Ring of Steel >>I saw the movie Ring of Steel last week. Its not a great movie by any >>stretch but it had interesting battles between different styles of blade >>arts. I'm sure some of the arts were not genuine. But how accurate can >>a b-rated movie be right? >>The main character is a competitive fencer who gets "trapped" in an >>underground blade fighting tournament. He battles other combatants with >>a rapier and dagger(??). >>The fights are not set up to be to to-the-death but they do get cut. >> Hand strikes, kicking, and a little grappling are put into the mix. >>Except for the flashy moves, I thought it was an interesting movie. I saw that movie. It was interesting to see how a Sword and Rapier are used - - of course this was only in a movie. Movie was OK for a late night, when you can't go to sleep. Some other movie's with weapons: "Shoot Fighter". Saw it a while back, before I even got into FMA, so I'm not sure of what I'd think of it now. But I remember being impressed seeing two fighters go at it with double swords, in what may have been sinawali. The movie starred Bolo Yeung, and it went with the whole formula "underground tournament" thing. The actors aren't going to win any, but it might be worth a rental. "American Samurai". Another underground arena thing. Mark Dacascos was in it, I believe this was his first movie. He plays the bad guy samurai. Some of the swordplay look pretty good. No FMA as far as I could tell. Definite B-movie. "Drive". There was a scene in the end where Dacascos goes at it with the bad guys with machete's. Dacasco's also does some stick work, and there's this neat thing where the baddies attack him with electric batons (sorry don't know what they are called). Overall I was surprised at the quality of this movie. It was actually pretty entertaining - with a lot of Hong Kong style fight scenes throughout the entire flick.. Dacascos knows his stuff. I'd recommend this movie. And here's a weird twist - Kadeem Hardison is the co-star. Jun IESA Anyone seen "Black Mask" yet? Is it worth going to the theater, or should I wait to rent it. ------------------------------ From: "J H" Date: Wed, 19 May 1999 11:13:40 PDT Subject: eskrima: Re: Unusual Fighting Style Hello All! I heard of a fighting style where the fighter utilizes siniwalli's and a staff at the same time. The fighter grips the middle section 6' staff/spear between both of his/her forearm/bicep pits( is there a word for that area???), and holds a 28"-32" sword or stick in each hand. Basically, this style turns one fighter( who's well-versed in this style) a kung fu fightin' octopus! Any of you heard of this one????? Mabuhay Ang Eskrima! Fry Bread Boy _______________________________________________________________ Get Free Email and Do More On The Web. Visit http://www.msn.com ------------------------------ From: Ingo Bojak Date: Wed, 19 May 1999 20:17:13 +0200 (DFT) Subject: eskrima: Human instincts On Wed, 19 May 1999 Marc Denny wrote: > It is commonly believed by many that man has less instinct than animals. > I posit the contrary-- that we have more, and the interplay between this > greater panoply of instincts is what makes humans more complex, and this > interplay is a major component driving the development of our intelligence. > I think Marc is mistaken here. There is in general a trend in animals that the more "intelligent" their behaviour is, the less instincts they display. This is natural - intelligent behaviour is adaptive and learned, not a pre-programmed response. Humans certainly still have instincts, but it is exactly their strong reliance on _learned_ behaviour which separates them from other animals. That is not to say that intelligence is like an all-purpose tool, recent research suggests it's more like a gigantic toolbox. But with "instincts" we basically mean "robotic" reactions which are _not_ the speciality of humans. The sex instinct is a particularily nice example, since it is among the most fundamental urges of all creatures. Nevertheless humans display a bewildering variety of expressing that urge which certainly leaves mere reproduction far behind. And humans can _control_ this urge to an amazing extent. The fact that we are _not_ starting to reproduce around puberty anymore, as Marc pointed out, is a case in point! Humans do not _have to_ reproduce, even if they have enough hormones in their blood to make it sizzle. Some humans even manage to live in celibacy for religious reasons, which is a demonstration that humans can even _learn_ to value certain social norms more than the one and only (biological) reason why they are alive in the first place. Also Marc's "nocturnal emission" example is rather close to that border where we do not talk about instincts but about biological functions. Most people wouldn't call the fact that their heart keeps beating an instinct. If you have a finite storage space which is constantly filled and never emptied, it will at some point overflow... To get back to aggression (and thus to the pretence that this is still FMA-related ;-) ): this certainly is a human instinct. But just as certainly its expression has always been heavily modified by the learned social norms and by the intelligent minds pondering the issue. Nowadays we are getting pretty close to the "celibacy" ideal and to me that isn't a bad thing! I do think that it is possible to turn the remaining aggression to safe places. For people with little natural aggression a quick game of Quake may be enough, for those with more steam games like soccer and American football allows controlled physical aggression and for those people who are a sado-masochistical time bomb on two legs we always have the Dog Brothers... ;-) I certainly do not wish to return to the behaviour pattern of (some of) the Indians, starting to reproduce around 14 because tribal wars with lots of healthy violence probably kill you off before 30, in our modern world. If it is the natural expression of human nature to take the scalp of your enemy in the morning and to play with your children in the evening, then yeah, I'm all for the unnatural forcing yourself to skip the scalp bit... Ciao, Ingo - --- "When you come to a fork in the road, take it." Yogi Berra ------------------------------ From: "Kyud" Date: Wed, 19 May 1999 11:37:09 -0700 Subject: eskrima: Leo Fong I understand he trained with Angel Cabales and Remy Presas for a few years each, but that's about all I know about him. Anyone know or have any other info on him? Leo Fong is a retired minister, retiring a few years ago. He has made numerous movies, which are generally "B" movies and sale well on the east coast and in Europe. He trained with GrandMaster Cabales and use to sale 8mm films of GM Cabales. And shortly after July will offer on video a student of GM Cabales, with flash backs of GM Cabales doing his techniques. He has an organization for seminars called TAO 'Total Approach Organization' which when giving seminars has two, three or more gentlemen that all give lectures during the seminar, usually lasting a whole weekend. Leo Fong wrote "Si (Siu) Lum Kung Fu" and "Choy Lay Fut Kung Fu" back in the early 70's, and many other books which he publishes through his book and video company, > Koinonia Productions > http://www.wizard.com/~kyud/koinonia.html His main style is called Wei Kuen Do 'The Psycho dynamic art of free fighting'. He has lectured and studied with many GrandMasters and also Bruce Lee who was a close friend of his. He sales his books and videos at the site address above and soon will be adding more on various martial arts, and other sections about his seminars, movies, etc. At this moment he is working on a 800 number for ordering and working on accepting credit card orders. At this moment you have to order with check, money order, etc at the address listed. Reason I know a bit about Mr. Fong is that I have known and worked with him for over 20 years. Good Health and high Spirits to all. ------------------------------ From: "Marc Denny" Date: Wed, 19 May 1999 12:49:23 -0700 Subject: eskrima: price increase A Howl etc: Panther Productions has increased its prices to the public and to us as well. Therefore, we must increase our prices to you. As always, our new prices will still be lower than theirs. The old prices stay in effect until June 1st, so if you've been thinking of getting our videos, now would be a real good time to act. Woof, Crafty Dog DBIMA ------------------------------ From: Date: Wed, 19 May 1999 14:58:00 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Re: eskrima: re: Japanese ranking in FMA > >> Doce Pares, Modern Arnis... Two more that use > >> the Dan system for ranking. > > > I did not know this. How did they come to adopt this convention? > > Let's face , true Martial Arts training did not have rank structure within > their schools. Is this really true? They had teaching ranks, you were certified to teach up to this level or that level. However the belt ranking system is newer, ~100 years old. Ray Terry raymail@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com ------------------------------ From: Date: Wed, 19 May 1999 15:00:32 -0700 (PDT) Subject: eskrima: . ------------------------------ End of Inayan_Eskrima/FMA-Digest V6 #212 **************************************** To unsubscribe from this digest, eskrima-digest, send the command: unsubscribe eskrima-digest -or- unsubscribe eskrima-digest your.old@address in the BODY of email (top line, left justified) addressed to majordomo@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com. Old digest issues are available via ftp://ftp.martialartsresource.com, directory pub/eskrima/digests. All digest files have the suffix '.txt' Copyright 1994-99: Ray Terry, Inayan System of Eskrima, Martial Arts Resource Standard disclaimers apply.