From: eskrima-digest-owner@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com To: eskrima-digest@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com Subject: Inayan_Eskrima/FMA-Digest V6 #332 Reply-To: eskrima@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com Errors-To: eskrima-digest-owner@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com Precedence: Inayan_Eskrima/FMA-Digest Wed, 11 Aug 1999 Vol 06 : Num 332 In this issue: eskrima: Re: Inayan_Eskrima/FMA-Digest V6 #329 eskrima: Grip strength eskrima: On Datuks eskrima: Re: Inayan_Eskrima/FMA-Digest V6 #328 eskrima: . ========================================================================== Eskrima-Digest, serving the Internet since June 1994. ~1100 members strong! Copyright 1994-99: Ray Terry, Inayan Eskrima, and Martial Arts Resource Replying to this message will NOT unsubscribe you. To unsubscribe, send "unsubscribe eskrima-digest" (no quotes) in the body (top line, left justified) of a plain text e-mail addressed to majordomo@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com. To send e-mail to this list use eskrima@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com See the Filipino Martial Arts (FMA) FAQ and online search the last four years worth of digest issues at http://www.MartialArtsResource.com Mabuhay ang eskrima! Ray Terry, PO Box 110841, Campbell, CA 95011 FMA@MartialArtsResource.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Cplr50@aol.com Date: Tue, 10 Aug 1999 20:20:50 EDT Subject: eskrima: Re: Inayan_Eskrima/FMA-Digest V6 #329 In a message dated 8/9/1999 8:28:53 PM Eastern Daylight Time, eskrima-digest-owner@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com writes: << No, he never did. He just has a knuckleheaded student who he wouldn't criticize in public who interpreted too broadly something he had said. >> Crafty, Bravo!!.. to many of us tend to be immune from the realization that.. opps I F#$%'ed up and got it wrong. It takes character to admit ones errs in public.. I raise my leg to you sir. As for Guro I.. I think that what he did..even took more character to not to embarass you. He obviously realized that he failed to properly communicate his position on the technique first time and waited for you to reach a point in which you would be able to unlearn the misinformation in a face saving situation. Pretty classy, to take the public's crap and back you silently.. my respect for the man grows outside of the martial areana. stone ------------------------------ From: "J K Curtis" Date: Tue, 10 Aug 1999 21:37:49 -0700 Subject: eskrima: Grip strength Hello... I attended a seminar a couple weeks ago by Dr Gyi on the Bando Boar stick system. As a large part of the seminar, Dr Gyi has us work our defense against the (large! :) stick strike. We drilled this by using a six foot piece of PVC pipe with foam insulation taped on around the last couple feet. On one strike the PVC pipe wielder would strike towards the head with the strike terminating when it hit the ground. The defender would block the strike with the live hand as reinforcment, while moving off line. I used my 28" composite stick for most of these drills. I noticed that on occaison I would have to regrip my stick, because the the stick was "walking out of my grip". I was curious as to the experiences of you who have sparred hard with the sticks.... did you find grip strength to be a major issue? Thanks! ~Kev ------------------------------ From: JYCHOW@au.oracle.com Date: 11 Aug 99 13:10:46 +1000 Subject: eskrima: On Datuks I have been away from my PC and am catching up with mail. In response to Peter Lee's (from Sabah, Malaysia), here I am. Yes, the term Datu/Datuk/Dato/Datok is originally a Malay word. The rough English equivalent is a Lord or Duke or some sort of state title like 'Sir' (as in knighthood conferals). It was confered by the Sultan (King) in the old days. It is now conferred by the government. This is how Asians at home view the title. In the old days, before the ruling cliche were replaced by governments, a Datuk refers to a tribal chief of reasonably high ranking. A village or small regional headman is called PENGHULU, which I suppose can be translated as 'village chief' or 'village headman' in Malaysia and Indonesia. I came from Sabah, which is sandwisched between Malaysia, Philippines, and Indonesia, so I know a little about this word as it is (and was) used locally. A DATOK is the head of quite a number of villages or a region, not a mere village or leader of a group of people. (Datok, in spiritual language is a polite reference to the local spirit - the land spirit, a deceased Malay/Indonesian whose spirit is still wandering the locality and is quite powerful and need to be placated. Because it is = sensitive and can be f great assistance or alternatively, a source of trouble, we politely call it 'DATUK')=3D ..... as Lord and owner of the land) Rajah is King in Indian terminology. We had Rajahs because we were once influenced by Indian civilisation. Then the Muslims took over and we used the term Sultans. These are ACTUAL kings also. True blood royal blood. Not a name or a title. Nobody bestows a ranking or title in martial arts as 'King John'. It is simply not done. There are nicknames though, eg. Dao Wang (King of the Saber), Gim Wang (King of the sword). But not a conferred title or rank in martial = arts of King, Emperor, Sultan, Rajah.....etc. Only a Sultan is a Sultan. He is the King. You can not make yourself King. It does not matter whether it is martial arts or not. In the old days, that is treason, and is punishable by death. Imagine the Chinese Emperor found out that his Prime Minister conferred the title of Emperor to his Interior Minister or to his wife as Emperess. All involved will be beheaded. This is not a joke. It is a serious crime to proclaim oneself or anybodyelse the title of King. I think Datuk Lapu Lapu will behead you if he finds out you bestowed the title 'Datuk' on anybody inilaterally. What right do you have to do that. Only he, and the council of Datuks, and other rulers have that right to create a = new Datuk. Unless you make war on all the Datuks and conquer all their lands so that all their territory belongs to you and they submit to you (which is = same as agreeing to create a new Datuk). Simply speaking, the conferal of Datuks is the domain of the political rulers of the region. In the old days, these were the Rajahs, Sultans and Datuks. In modern times, the ruler is the government. So, if you are the government, you may. Or if you are Queen Elizabeth II, you make grant the title Duke of York to anybody. Are you a real King? If you are not, you can not = confer it. The above is the way the tiltles of Datuk, Rajah and Sultan is viewed, even right now in Asia. It is quite silly to introduce oneself as a Datuk to an Asian in Asia if you are not one, much less proclaim oneself one. The title has high ranking and traditional respect, so it is not done that way and not conferred that way. To proclaim a Datuk is taken as an insult. Yes, we do understand you do respect our culture and love our culture, and your teachers of our culture, but doing this, hhmmm...... is not viewed as loving and respecting our culture. We also love and respect too! But do we proclaim and confer Datuks outside of the rights of our State and traditional and hereditary rulers? No, we don't. A traditional Asian considers that disrespectful. (I am have been living in the West for a long= time so I am not so strict on this, but having been brought up in Asia, I do understand what a home-grown feels on this sort of things). Okay, that is Asia. Now, we are talking about America and Europe. I don't know how you want to handle this issue. It is up to you. This is a changing world. But whatever you decide, I request that you bear the sensitivities of those the word came from and use it sparingly if you can, and make clear it is not society you are talking about, but you are refering to a ranking or position within an organisation. You are not confering a real Datuk in the State sense, but as a designation withing the organisation. Just my opinion.......... Plaese, take no offence. One of the 'Datuks' (Abanico Productions) is a nice man. This is no personal shot at anybody. I am just responding to Peter Lee's 'invitation' in this list. ------------------------------ From: "Cartlon H. Fung,D.D.S." Date: Tue, 10 Aug 1999 20:19:53 -0700 Subject: eskrima: Re: Inayan_Eskrima/FMA-Digest V6 #328 >I am a the JKDC side of the fence.) > >JKD Concepts embodies what Bruce was reaching for before his death. He had >made the transitions from Wing Chun, to Jun Fan Gung Fu, and so on, looking >for the right combination of what works. any art (once >formalized) .. but when you make it a philosophy with a set of principals >that can apply to any situation, fight, debate or whatever, you can teach >anybody to utilize what ever they have or can acquire, in an unique way that >works. It's almost Zen, huh? Now, 26 years after his passing his concepts >can be applied to situations he never even dreamed of, to arts yet invented >and so on. > >Original JKD as I understand it tries to teach the art he had developed >prior to going Zen. There is nothing wrong with that except one shouldn't >try to claim it is what he wanted. We know from his writings that he was Interesting where do you get these ideas from? No slight on you just curious. JKD and JKDC are the same. Older perople like me call it JKD. Younger people called it JKDC. I can't remeber when this all got started but the "C" crowd learned the same stuff as the no "C" crowd. There are no secrets. It could have been called JKDA...atrributes or JKDS...stuff. JKD is "formalized" as in HIA Date: Wed, 11 Aug 1999 07:41:40 -0700 (PDT) Subject: eskrima: . ------------------------------ End of Inayan_Eskrima/FMA-Digest V6 #332 **************************************** To unsubscribe from this digest, eskrima-digest, send the command: unsubscribe eskrima-digest -or- unsubscribe eskrima-digest your.old@address in the BODY of an email (top line, left justified) addressed to majordomo@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com. Old digest issues are available via ftp://ftp.martialartsresource.com in directory pub/eskrima/digests. All digest files have the suffix '.txt' Copyright 1994-99: Ray Terry, Inayan Eskrima, and Martial Arts Resource Standard disclaimers apply.