From: eskrima-digest-owner@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com To: eskrima-digest@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com Subject: Inayan_Eskrima/FMA-Digest V6 #410 Reply-To: eskrima@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com Errors-To: eskrima-digest-owner@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com Precedence: Inayan_Eskrima/FMA-Digest Fri, 1 Oct 1999 Vol 06 : Num 410 In this issue: eskrima: Re: Catfight eskrima: Catfight Report - comments (longish!) eskrima: Ngo Cho Demo Pics eskrima: Re: Im Back eskrima: Re: DB Gathering Report Part 2- The Catfight eskrima: . ========================================================================== Eskrima-Digest, serving the Internet since June 1994. ~1100 members strong! Copyright 1994-99: Ray Terry, Inayan Eskrima, and Martial Arts Resource Replying to this message will NOT unsubscribe you. To unsubscribe, send "unsubscribe eskrima-digest" (no quotes) in the body (top line, left justified) of a plain text e-mail addressed to majordomo@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com. To send e-mail to this list use eskrima@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com See the Filipino Martial Arts (FMA) FAQ and online search the last four years worth of digest issues at http://www.MartialArtsResource.com Mabuhay ang eskrima! Ray Terry, PO Box 110841, Campbell, CA 95011 FMA@MartialArtsResource.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Mike aka Shugendo" Date: Fri, 01 Oct 1999 15:02:00 GMT Subject: eskrima: Re: Catfight Just wanted to say that I enjoyed Marc's post in regards to the catfight and I hope he doesn't get flamed too badly...! :) Fighting as a whole is a two against one battle - it's you vs your fears/ego/is and your opponent. This analogy may help explain the biting incident... both had a lot to lose (physically/emotionally/ status) and that combined with inexperience in the DB venue could have brought out an "inappropriate" response to the situation. Wish I could have been there to see it though... Michael A. Krivka @ Martial Arts Koncepts Home Page: http://home.earthlink.net/~makoncept/ and http://members.bellatlantic.net/~koncepts Email: shugendo@hotmail.com or koncepts@bellatlantic.net Phone: 301/963-6520 ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ From: "Branwen Thomas" Date: Fri, 1 Oct 1999 14:05:13 -0230 Subject: eskrima: Catfight Report - comments (longish!) Hail Crafty Dog and honorable list members :) Thank you for the report; as someone who one day would like to participate in catfights and (joy!) perhaps even win my own cat-name, I greatly appreciate being able to read about it since I can't yet participate. I agree for the most part with your theories on Minerva's possible motivations/perceptions; I have many friends in the SCA, and have been to some events (non-participant pre-training days). Now, as a woman/fighter and having some experience if only on the level of basic sparring, I believe that, especially with no background in the *attitudes* as well as the training in FMA, that Minerva could easily have gotten carried away in a context which is quite different from SCA combat. (SCAdians: this is not meant to imply that you have no rules or ethics - I know you do ). Perhaps it was not made clear enough to her; perhaps she simply reverted completely to her persona. Her comments on the field as reported by Crafty seem to indicate this; from what I know, "surrender or die" etc type-comments would be acceptable in tourney/melee situations (corrections welcome). At any rate, she sounds like someone who does have a "code", even if not the one which fits in Gatherings. Linda/Black Cat (yay!) sounds like an equally honorable person, worthy of her battle-scars (my sympathy), and I hope she continues to participate. As Crafty points out, it's a new direction and there will be benefits & problems...let's hope the bugs get worked out and that the Kitties (Catsisters?) will thrive. Now, for the questions regarding women fighting: 1) women vs men. - I think if both parties are willing, it is an area to explore; however, given the cultural biases/ramifications, it is definitely something to keep private, at least for the time being. In the film "GI Jane", the point is made (quite well, I thought) that the problem with women in combat is not them, it's with the men. Definitely. While I believe there are women who can go "toe to toe" with the men, so to speak, and even some who want to, I don't know if society is yet prepared to see it. Of course, the women of the ancient Celts fought alongside their men, and were just as fearsome...but that was then, and this is now. Hmmm. 2) dynamics - I think woman vs woman is different, just as conversations between Male +Male is different from M + F, and F+F. Of course! When I spar in class with one of the guys, they tend to be (at first) more wary of hurting me - seriously, I've had them throw a kick which connects and then stop and ask if I'm okay (to which I invariably reply - keep going - I'm paying good money for this!;) During training, of course, we don't spar full contact as you do at a Gathering; but as I point out to the boys, if they don't hit so I can feel it, I won't know what it's like - and that too is part of training. However, I am also smart enough to tell them when it's too hard. Basically, we communicate - or at least I do. When sparring with the other senior female student, we do go hard on each other, but we will also stop and "help" each other eg. you're dropping your hands when I kick, then I punch you in the head. When I watch the boys spar against each other, however, it's heads down, let's go - it's about fighting. Now, this is all in training - none of us (to my knowledge) have gone full-out, full-contact, so I don't know what the reactions would be. I am willing to bet, however, that in actual competition it would be "fight/aggressiveness". As for F vs F, it would be vicious. In verbal altercations women are adept at ripping each other to shreds - how much more so, then, when they have sticks to do it. Of course, in a Kitty fight, honorable conduct would presumably be present, but I think we'd still have a pretty good racket :) When women fight, there is always (in the back of the mind) the idea that we aren't really supposed to - in the context of Gathering, I wonder if knowing that we ARE allowed/encouraged to do so might not make us even more aggressive? also Hmmmm. 3& 4) vulnerability - well, yes. although not, I think, in quite so immediate a manner as men are. We also have soft tissue...but I believe we generally have higher pain tolerance, at least for certain types of pain. Also, women will put up with amounts/types of pain that would have most men either lashing out or running screaming (childbirth, anyone?;) The point about looks, of course, may also be an issue,but that really depends on the woman in question. I have no interest in being disfigured/scarred but if I participate in something like that, then that's the chance I have to take. I think that any woman who gets involved in this sort of training, at some point either comes to terms with it, or takes up something less contact-full. I mean, men don't want their nose smashed across their faces, either, but the cultural imperative to avoid it is not the same. It really does simply boil down to the individual: what they want, what they expect, and what they are willing to do or have done to them to get it. The stereotypical cat-fight is, of course, hair-pulling, scratching biting etc. This is partly because we were never (generally) taught to use our fists/feet. Question: would a man also use biting if that were the only option available? (I mean in an actual attack situation, not monitored combat). Men and women, being DIFFERENT (yes it's true and vive la difference!) are going to think of different targets to attack, and different areas to protect. Ultimately, though, vulnerability depends on ability and mindset, just like it does for men. I've gone on a fair bit, but this is fascinating to me so I hope you'll forgive the length.... cheers all, Jocelyne Roaring Girl * Purveyor Of Fine Books * Beater Of Bodhrans * Smiter Of The Wicked * * Owned By Angus, Most Elegant And Pleasing Of Cats * ------------------------------ From: tweeder199@aol.com Date: Fri, 1 Oct 1999 13:36:58 EDT Subject: eskrima: Ngo Cho Demo Pics Hey everyone, I have just decided to share with you a lil secret, I own pics of my school giving a demo of Ngo Cho Kun. Here is the link http://members.tripod.com/~Velle68/demo.html I will have a video up shortly that is of me and fellow student Steve Sheetz performing our Five Parts Power form. Ingats - Patrick ------------------------------ From: TGAce@aol.com Date: Fri, 1 Oct 1999 13:41:17 EDT Subject: eskrima: Re: Im Back In a message dated 9/30/99 7:52:57 PM Central European Daylight Time, eskrima-digest-owner@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com writes: << I worked for MWR with 4 different branches of the military in 4 countries as a civilian check with them first they usually have a list of martial arts teachers and trainers that are there they usually have someone on there list that teaches something and from there once you get back into the loop or know someone that dose you will be able to find people that do some type of martial arts they also put out a newspaper that you can advertise in have you thought about putting an add in the stars and strips looking for others that do eskrima there ? >> Thanks, Ill look into it. Tom G ------------------------------ From: "Al \"Got This Fish On The Move\"" Date: Fri, 1 Oct 1999 14:17:41 -0400 Subject: eskrima: Re: DB Gathering Report Part 2- The Catfight Guro Marc Denny, Your explanation of things was very, very, very long. So I will make my comments very short. GREAT EXPLANATION!!!!! Respectfully, Al Sardinas Student of Garimot System of Arnis ------------------------------ From: Ray Terry Date: Fri, 1 Oct 1999 14:21:40 -0700 (PDT) Subject: eskrima: . ------------------------------ End of Inayan_Eskrima/FMA-Digest V6 #410 **************************************** To unsubscribe from this digest, eskrima-digest, send the command: unsubscribe eskrima-digest -or- unsubscribe eskrima-digest your.old@address in the BODY of an email (top line, left justified) addressed to majordomo@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com. Old digest issues are available via ftp://ftp.martialartsresource.com in directory pub/eskrima/digests. 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