From: eskrima-digest-owner@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com To: eskrima-digest@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com Subject: Inayan_Eskrima/FMA-Digest V6 #472 Reply-To: eskrima@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com Errors-To: eskrima-digest-owner@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com Precedence: Inayan_Eskrima/FMA-Digest Mon, 8 Nov 1999 Vol 06 : Num 472 In this issue: eskrima: Re: AC joints eskrima: Re: Inayan_Eskrima/FMA-Digest V6 #471 eskrima: Re: P.Christian's comments & a response eskrima: Lethal attacks eskrima: Sunday Battle eskrima: Training swords eskrima: Re: Inayan_Eskrima/FMA-Digest V6 #471 eskrima: . ========================================================================== Eskrima-Digest, serving the Internet since June 1994. ~1100 members strong! Copyright 1994-99: Ray Terry, Inayan Eskrima, and Martial Arts Resource Replying to this message will NOT unsubscribe you. To unsubscribe, send "unsubscribe eskrima-digest" (no quotes) in the body (top line, left justified) of a plain text e-mail addressed to majordomo@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com. To send e-mail to this list use eskrima@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com See the Filipino Martial Arts (FMA) FAQ and online search the last four years worth of digest issues at http://www.MartialArtsResource.com Mabuhay ang eskrima! Ray Terry, PO Box 110841, Campbell, CA 95011 FMA@MartialArtsResource.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------- From: David Fulton Date: Mon, 08 Nov 1999 10:52:04 -0500 Subject: eskrima: Re: AC joints At 06:25 AM 11/6/99 -0800, Mike Koblic wrote: > >Help, please! > >Anybody has sustained injury to their acromio-clavicular (AC) joint as a >result of MA practice? If so how? > >Anybody got a chronic AC joint problem *without* injuring it acutely first? >If so, what did you do about it? > You can injure the AC joint by trauma or overuse. Mine was due to improper punching technique and overuse from a poorly planned out MA & PT schedule. I was letting my shoulder come forward when punching. Now, I concentrate on keeping my shoulders back when punching, pushing, etc and it doesn't give me problems for the most part. Shoulders back is one of the basics of proper body alignment in TCMA which is where I picked it up. Cortisone shots did zilch for it, ice & anti-inflammatants did zilch for it. Only time, patience and physical therapy straightened it out. HTH Dave Fulton. Dave Fulton dfulton@computerpackages.com Full Contact Martial Arts Association "As iron sharpens iron, so one man sharpens another." ------------------------------ From: Whytewlfe@aol.com Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 11:43:00 EST Subject: eskrima: Re: Inayan_Eskrima/FMA-Digest V6 #471 << From: "Jon Howard" Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 11:48:14 -0000 Subject: eskrima: Re: Inayan_Eskrima/FMA-Digest V6 #470 > >From: "Patrick Christian" >Date: Sat, 6 Nov 1999 16:56:53 -0500 >Subject: eskrima: Re: Inayan_Eskrima/FMA-Digest V6 #469 > >Here's an rough opinion that I haven't seen in regards to knife defense: If >a person attacks you with intent to kill; isn't it our duty as trained >personnel to take the person out of the gene pool as it were? I'm thinking >with regards to the next person that may be attacked by this nutcase. They >may have no training, be female and or a child. I know we can't answer "what >if's", but if you are attacked out of the blue (i.e. mugger/ rapist), then >you can pretty well bet that you are not the first person to be attacked nor >will you be the last. Unless you do something about it... > >Critiques? > >Thank you, > Where the hell do you start responding to this one.!!!!!! What gives you the right to decide who should and should'nt live. I think your surname has gone to your head and quiet literally given your ideas way, Way, WAY, W A Y !!!!! above your station. The only response I would give to this post is to get some professional help (and I dont mean from a MA taeacher) - and buy an extra pair of flame proof shorts while your at it - your gonna need em Jon... >> I think Patrick raises a somewhat valid point. If you read his post, he's not advocating killing innocent people. He's talking about taking out someone whose intent is to kill his victim. Think about it. A guy confronts you with a knife or a ball bat.. decision time. does he want just your wallet, or is your dead body a way of initiation into his gang? I don't trust a thug to be merciful towards me or my family. You seem upset that Patrick is "deciding who lives or dies".. Don't the bad guys do the same thing? The bad guys choose their targets, & I for one would choose to eradicate the one who chose me. BTW, what's with the backhanded swipe at Christianity? Tom ------------------------------ From: "Branwen Thomas" Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 15:34:13 -0330 Subject: eskrima: Re: P.Christian's comments & a response Jon Howard: WHOA. while I understand your response, and agree that we are not (in the general scheme of things) each other's judges/ keepers/watchdogs etc., it is a valid question, if stated somewhat bluntly. It's something that should be, and probably is, considered by anyone who trains a combat style and/or may have to use it. It's not a pretty thing to think about, but it is there. I know that if I was attacked by a rapist, if I managed to subdue him (read: break his kneecaps;) in my "altered mental state" I might decide it's better not to take a chance on him getting out there and doing it to someone else. Now, it is *much* more likely that I would just run away and call the cops, but the possibility is _there_. I guess that's why we have laws about "excessive use of force" and self-defense etc., because the temptation for some humans would be to pass judgement then and there, in their own situation. The complications ( I'm simplifying in a big way....) arise when the human then decides that he/she/it can now decide arbitrarily (from "experience") who is bad and must die and who is good and can live. From that of course derives all major human conflict eg. our way is better than your way therefore we destroy you etc etc. Ergo, rules/laws, to try and keep the carnage to a minimum. Some people think hot boiling oil and stoning is too good for rapists/pedophiles/murderers etc...some think attempts should be made to rehabilitate...some think they should be treated like sick animals and put down....just because we all study martial arts esp.FMA doesn't mean we all feel the same way about different issues. I didn't get the impression from Peter's post that he was _advocating_ the "take 'em out of the gene pool" perspective, just that he was querying for opinions about it....which he got ;) jocelyne Roaring Girl * Purveyor Of Fine Books * Beater Of Bodhrans * Smiter Of The Wicked * * Owned By Angus, Most Elegant And Pleasing Of Cats * ------------------------------ From: "Haru Taka" Date: Mon, 08 Nov 1999 15:27:32 CST Subject: eskrima: Lethal attacks "Here's a rough opinion I haven't seen in regard to self-defense: if a person attacks you with intent to kill, isn't it our duty as trained personnel to take the person out of the gene pool as it were? I'm thinking of the next person who may be attacked by this nutcase" Personally, I'm pro-capital punishment. I think that societies would be much better off if punishments were immediate (with incontrovertible proof of course) and severe (i.e., death) in cases of murder. In the example of the "nutcase" above, I wouldn't go as far as to say that it's anyone's "duty" to remove the individual from society, but I sure do think it would make for a far safer society, and even save the government a few bucks (no expenses for keeping the jerks in jail) if murderers and people who attempt murder are taken out social structures. I don't think that as a victim of attack (if you kill the attacker) that you are "no better than the attacker" otherwise I think we could accuse many police officers (the good ones) and innocent victims of attempted murder, of being murderers themselves, which is simply not the case. Granted, they did kill someone, but only in self defense and in the defense of someone else's life. To me, that's a justified killing; it is NOT murder (i.e., killing with a malicious intent). What's interesting about this case is that I believe each state has its own ordinances in regards to self-defense and lethal force. I live in Chicago and our legal system states that any person can defend their lives or the lives of others with lethal force if he or she feels that their person or another's person is being threatened with lethal force. Of course, if it ever came down to this, you'd better have witnesses and a decent lawyer. I'm not saying that the goal should be to kill your attacker (although, I wouldn't have any moral qualms with that), but I am saying that in a lethal situation, you should probably look out for the safety of your self, not of you attacker. Hopefully, in your home towns, your legal systems understand this and will back you up if you ever encountered such an unfortunate situation. Check out your city and state ordinances. All details about self-defense are, or should be, outlined in there. I felt much more comfortable with the idea of having to defend myself after a little research. - -Haru ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ From: Chad Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 14:45:39 -0800 (PST) Subject: eskrima: Sunday Battle Greetings all, November 8, 1999- In retrospect to the Battle yesterday, I was pleased. Everyone learned something about themselves. Stuart learned not to become overconfident. He also had a new revelation about fighting on the ground. Stuart took off his left glove and used a baseball batting glove instead (lucky because during his third fight, he had James in a headlock and punched his mask with solid shots about 6 times and without his gloves he wouldn’t be able to wash dishes for a few weeks. We will continue having closed door battles, but it was fun to have more people there. Leroy shows a lot of interest and potential. James slipped up on exactly the move I told him he would. The fancy stuff if done has to be so intertwined into your subconsious self that you don’t have to think of it. Oh well, hope he tries it on me. BTW, after his first fight, he fought the rest of his fights without elbow pads and using leather moped gloves (trust me these do not protect your hands from hits). I’d like to see him take the knee pads off now. John was overconfident, and in spite of us telling him every time we fight that he has to develop power in his strikes, he still comes out there with this tippy-tappy stuff. Injuries: Stuart now has a second hole in his leg from Leroy (don’t worry Stu, I’ll get my shot in) and a few dents in his mask, Leroy went home with a nice bruise on his shin, a big ol’ stick hickey on his inner thigh, a few welts on his forearms, a bruised and bleeding thumb(first hit caused a bruise, second hit caused some blood), and a mask that got dented the hell out of it, courtesy of Stuart. John has a pinky finger that looks like a hot dog, once again a la Stuart, along with a big ol’ bruise on his inner thigh and a few welts on his forearms and I suspect his back. James walked away with only a few welts on his arms but if it wasn’t for his hard mask, Stuart would have rearranged his face and if I didn’t call a break (this one was supposed to be a “no grappling” match) James would have a mark the size of a punyo right on his adams apple(James, you owe me one). Few of the guys that were supposed to show didn’t, I hope we have more fighters next week Sunday. Guys in Hawaii? What a rush. ===== "Draw me not without reason, sheath me not without honor" Chad Hawaii __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Bid and sell for free at http://auctions.yahoo.com ------------------------------ From: Gints Klimanis Date: Mon, 08 Nov 1999 14:53:37 -0800 Subject: eskrima: Training swords Hi, In order to get a better feel for blade orienation, I'm interested in practicing with metal training blades. Beyond the excellent stuff from Edges2, can anyone recommend training swords, such as sabres used by fencing teams? I swing a sharpened sword just about everyday. Some people have recommended using dulled machetes that can be had for about $10. ------------------------------ From: MdlAgdLftr@aol.com Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 18:17:15 EST Subject: eskrima: Re: Inayan_Eskrima/FMA-Digest V6 #471 >>Real fighting is not fair...awareness is the key to survival<< Nice post, Carlton, and right on the money. When and if the attack comes, it will not be face to face, but out of the blue, behind your back while your arms are full of groceries, your child, etc. The scum that permeate our streets are not looking for a challenge when they scope out a victim...they want a target that offers the least resistance. And there will be no warning. I've had countless fights in my job, and believe me, there is little to no warning; the shit just hits the fan, and in a heartbeat I've had three or more felons crawling all over me or my partner trying to bash our heads in. Your adrenaline goes through the roof, and although training gives you a nice edge, it's guts and adrenaline that gets you through it. I remember a line from one of the cheesiest movies I ever saw, "Roadhouse" with Patrick Swayze, that nonetheless was one of the most truthful statements I've heard regarding fighting. When Swayze's character was asked, "Do you ever win a fight?", he replied, "Nobody ever wins a fight." So true, so true.... Kim Satterfield ------------------------------ From: Ray Terry Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 16:00:30 -0800 (PST) Subject: eskrima: . ------------------------------ End of Inayan_Eskrima/FMA-Digest V6 #472 **************************************** To unsubscribe from this digest, eskrima-digest, send the command: unsubscribe eskrima-digest -or- unsubscribe eskrima-digest your.old@address in the BODY of an email (top line, left justified) addressed to majordomo@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com. Old digest issues are available via ftp://ftp.martialartsresource.com in directory pub/eskrima/digests. All digest files have the suffix '.txt' Copyright 1994-99: Ray Terry, Inayan Eskrima, and Martial Arts Resource Standard disclaimers apply.