From: eskrima-digest-owner@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com To: eskrima-digest@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com Subject: Inayan_Eskrima/FMA-Digest V7 #27 Reply-To: eskrima@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com Errors-To: eskrima-digest-owner@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com Precedence: Inayan_Eskrima/FMA-Digest Tues, 18 Jan 2000 Vol 07 : Num 027 In this issue: eskrima: Kendo, Iaido and European Fencing Demo eskrima: Re: Silat, etc. eskrima: Re:Silat, etc. eskrima: Re: See more part 3 eskrima: Plastic knife eskrima: Baseball Bat - Slight Reprise eskrima: Not a joke... Re: eskrima: Re: Silat, etc. [none] [none] ========================================================================== Eskrima-Digest, serving the Internet since June 1994. ~1100 members strong! Copyright 1994-2000: Ray Terry, Martial Arts Resource, and Inayan Eskrima Replying to this message will NOT unsubscribe you. To unsubscribe, send "unsubscribe eskrima-digest" (no quotes) in the body (top line, left justified) of a plain text e-mail addressed to majordomo@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com. To send e-mail to this list use eskrima@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com See the Filipino Martial Arts (FMA) FAQ and online search the last four years worth of digest issues at http://www.MartialArtsResource.com Mabuhay ang eskrima! ---------------------------------------------------------------------- From: TaoArt@aol.com Date: Tue, 18 Jan 2000 16:31:11 EST Subject: eskrima: Kendo, Iaido and European Fencing Demo On January 24th at 6:00 PM there will be a one hour Iaido (Japanese Swordsmanship), Kendo (Japanese Fencing) and European Fencing demonstration held at the Waltham Athletic Club by Guard Up, Inc. in Waltham, Massachusetts. Mr. David Harrison of the Boston Kendo Club, one of the highest ranking Kendo instructors in New England, and Mr. Barry Poitras of the Doshi Kai Dojo in Acton will be attending the demo with a number of their students. We will also have US Fencing Association instructors available for questions and quick lessons for any interested. Channel 7 NBC will be there as well as some other press agents. If you are planning on attending this free demonstration, please email or call me so that I may place your name on our guest list (so you don't have to pay the $14 daily fee). For directions to our facility, visit our website: www.guardup.com Hope to see you there! Meghan Gardner Director Guard Up, Inc. www.guardup.com (781) 271-1491 ------------------------------ From: Ed Lam Date: Tue, 18 Jan 2000 13:35:34 -0800 (PST) Subject: eskrima: Re: Silat, etc. Ray, While fighting only for "combat" is the ideal, I believe that the gross majority of the physical confrontations, including surviving a mugging, would be not considered by the courts as "combat". If we train only with techniques that main/kill, then we will have at least two problems: a) our techniques would be de facto useless in the gross majority of the situations that we would run into. Of course it would be a different story if we live in say, Chechnya. b) we would never know if our fatal/maining techniques would really work in real time against resisting opponent. How many people can we scratch / bite/ decapitate in practise? If we have never perform a technique "for real", how do we know if the technique can be performed? Ed > From: Ray Terry > Date: Tue, 18 Jan 2000 7:03:18 PST > Subject: Re: eskrima: Re: Silat, etc. > > > Because you have just turned what could > > have been a situation that you might have > escaped from by tapping, > > apologizing, begging, etc. into a death > match. > > But why fight, outside of a training fight, if > it isn't real combat? IMHO, > we should not bother to train for the little > school-ground scuffle, but for > real combat. There is no tapping-out in > combat. > > Ray Terry ===== __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Talk to your friends online with Yahoo! Messenger. http://im.yahoo.com ------------------------------ From: Kilap@aol.com Date: Tue, 18 Jan 2000 19:27:36 EST Subject: eskrima: Re:Silat, etc. In a message dated 1/18/00 9:49:02 AM Eastern Standard Time, eskrima-digest-owner@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com writes: << I never thought Guro Crafty was trying to take a dig at Silat. But I was < surprised at the response of many Silat afficianodos, which at times seemed < to border on insecurity. ...or humor, that fell in a cyber void. > Biting, scratching, etc.: > Obviously possibly effective techniques, but we are still left with a couple > of problems. If you are in an inferior position (which you probably will be > if you have practiced a lot of biting and scratching forms/djurus while your > opponent was doing Wrestling or BJJ) A number of posts included points on ground work.... >and you choose to bite, scratch, eye > gouge, whatever, and your opponent doesn't die (I know your instructor may > have assured you he would, but in real life sometimes people don't.) you > will be in a world of shit. >> There are two different contexts, one being sport the other being self-defense which seems to have been lost above. Never met anyone who could conditon their eyes or balls (and I don't want to either! ;). I agree though the more skill the better. Fishhooks, rips, and stuff ain't finishers but can also be used as distractions to create other windows of opportunity. Regards, Travis ------------------------------ From: Kilap@aol.com Date: Tue, 18 Jan 2000 19:27:57 EST Subject: eskrima: Re: See more part 3 In a message dated 1/17/00 5:57:23 PM Eastern Standard Time, eskrima-digest-owner@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com writes: << Yes I understand that many silat techniques require weapons or work better with weapons-- I think we all know this-- but perhaps the argument should be used with care lest one wind up in the position of saying that the silat doesn't work without weapons. >> My point on weapons and NHB was not such much that I've got one but that on the street one must be concerned with the opponent's plausibility of having one. Point well taken (from Crafty and Barry (others?)) that it may not be called Silat but there are techniques the same as much. ------------------------------ From: "Rudolf Kimbel (100432.650@compuserve.com)" <100432.650@compuserve.com> Date: Tue, 18 Jan 2000 19:25:37 -0500 Subject: eskrima: Plastic knife to:INTERNET:eskrima@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com I bought a plastic knife that looks like a dagger with 4 " blade and 8" overall. It's marked 'executive leter opener II". It's not the (slightly smaller) lansky. I also bought a piece of pork shoulder with skin. I tried to stab it (through skin & fat) with the plastic knife in an ice-pick grip, which gives a strong stab. I only got through one inch and the tip was damaged (not broken off). I tried the same with an equal sized normal fixed blade knife and got much more penetration, right to the bone, as would be expected. Thought you might like to know. Doesn't seem as dangerous as it wants to be. Rudolf. ------------------------------ From: "Rudolf Kimbel (100432.650@compuserve.com)" <100432.650@compuserve.com> Date: Tue, 18 Jan 2000 19:25:23 -0500 Subject: eskrima: Baseball Bat - Slight Reprise to:INTERNET:eskrima@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com "Mikal Keenan" wrote: >Rereading earlier post ... man, ain't no way in 4 hells I'd try to BLOCK a >baseball bat unless it was a kid with a toy ... the hollow, plastic kind!!! > Like the good Doctor Fung says ... MOVE. Per previous post I'd suggest >move in right away, no delay. H'mm, would a similar response be If you can't block a baseball bat, then you might check your training. Maybe you're forgetting to move in fast with your block, cause if you wait, you learn it the hard way. The only thing really dangerous about full power bat hits is that the bat quickly breaks with all the pionty parts flying around. Train with a sledge hammer handle instead. ------------------------------ From: AnimalMac@aol.com Date: Tue, 18 Jan 2000 19:51:34 EST Subject: eskrima: Not a joke... ...still I fell over onto the couch laughing until my sides hurt. In the January issue of Black Belt magazine I wrote an editorial that asked "Why would you want to be a street fighter?" (It's the one with Gene Labell on the cover) The essence of the editorial is that if you train to be a street fighter, you are training to be a murderer --which is not what the martial arts are about. However in this new issue (March 2000) a guy from IL responded. I had been prewarned so the first line didn't get me. However halfway through I fell over laughing. For the next 20 minutes I giggled while making dinner. My wife Dianna is going to answer thanking the guy for providing me with so much entertainment and suggesting he do a web search. However feel free to throw in your own two cents. ************** Real Fights Not So Deadly After reading the January 2000 guest editorial about street fighting, I find it hard to believe that the author Marc MacYoung has ever seen one or been in one On any given day there are hundreds or thousands of bar fights, street fights and fights for money, marbles or chalk. While they are sometimes rough, there is normally an implied code that is observed by both parties. Although the fight isn't over until the winner says so, the winner doesn't kill the vanquished foe. Street fights involve perfectly normal people -- the same people you go to church with or meet at school. In anger or frustration, they become belligerent and a fight ensues. Seldom does one fight in a thousand involve serious injury or attempted murder. These less-lethal fights are the most common, and that's why they are the ones good martial arts school prepare their students for. John Townsley Palatine IL ********************* Gee, where was this guy when I was slamming and jamming? Probably starting fights in church :D:D:D:D:D:D Anyway the same time that this issue showed up an acceptance letter for the "Analyzing your self-defense trainings effectiveness" from BB came in too. Maybe laughing boy will get a clue. I guess this is what I get for not writing under the nom de plume of Animal.... :o ------------------------------ From: Ray Terry Date: Tue, 18 Jan 2000 17:12:57 PST Subject: Re: eskrima: Re: Silat, etc. > While fighting only for "combat" is the ideal, I > believe that the gross majority of the physical > confrontations, including surviving a mugging, > would be not considered by the courts as > "combat". If we train only with techniques that > main/kill, then we will have at least two > problems: IMHO, Unless this is a school yard fight or an encounter with a drunken friend, an attack is an attack. A stranger that attacks you is not bloody likely to allow you to tap out, they'll just go ahead and break your [insert body part here] or choke you out. At least, more IMHO, this is the mindset one should carry with them if they hope to survive an attack. If you've been attacked you cannot worry about escalating the encounter, it has already been escalated. Yes? We know from various studies that the more force or weapons you use the more likely you will be to survive the attack. Your job is to survive the attack to see your family just least one more day. Now, if someone sticks a gun/knife/otherweapon at me and asks for my $$ I'm probably going to give it to them. But if they jump my bones then I can and should only assume the worst, as that is what is likely to occur. Ray Terry raymail@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com ------------------------------ From: Luis Pellicer Date: Wed, 19 Jan 2000 09:08:06 +0800 Subject: [none] >I just read a Philippine Newspaper on line and there was an article about a >> Filipino >>who claims his father Trovador Ramos beat Bruce Lee in two live matches. >>Apparently, the producers of that match burned the film to protect BL . The >>article went on to say that there is a tape out there were saved negatives >of >>these >>matches. I doubt if this story is true unless some of you guys seen the >saved negatives. > I read that article in the Philippine Star. Sounds like a lot of BS to me, trying to establish a "Masters" rep by making direct unconfirmable comparisons to a dead man. On top of it all, they claim that the film will not be showed publically so as not to hurt Bruces reputation, then why talk an brag about it in a National Daily? Not that these people have no skills, but they're better off bragging about whupping someone good who is ALIVE, and can challenge it. Had this been done in the mid eighties, when I was studying and had closer ties to the JKD fraternity, I probably would have made a counter challenge to put up or shut up. I'm not Bruce, but try ME out, I'm not a corpse. Maybe the current JKD guys have different opinions. LSPIII ------------------------------ From: Ray Terry Date: Tue, 18 Jan 2000 18:13:52 -0800 (PST) Subject: [none] ------------------------------ End of Inayan_Eskrima/FMA-Digest V7 #27 *************************************** To unsubscribe from the eskrima-digest send the command: unsubscribe eskrima-digest -or- unsubscribe eskrima-digest your.old@address in the BODY of an email (top line, left justified) addressed to majordomo@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com. Old digest issues are available via ftp://ftp.martialartsresource.com. Copyright 1994-2000: Ray Terry, Martial Arts Resource, and Inayan Eskrima Standard disclaimers apply.