From: eskrima-digest-owner@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com To: eskrima-digest@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com Subject: Inayan_Eskrima/FMA-Digest V7 #32 Reply-To: eskrima@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com Errors-To: eskrima-digest-owner@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com Precedence: Inayan_Eskrima/FMA-Digest Thur, 20 Jan 2000 Vol 07 : Num 032 In this issue: eskrima: Re: Inayan_Eskrima/FMA-Digest V7 #31 eskrima: RE: Inayan_Eskrima/FMA-Digest V7 #31 eskrima: Re:Krabi-Krabong eskrima: This and that eskrima: Re: Inayan_Eskrima/FMA-Digest V7 #31 eskrima: batter up eskrima: Re: Inayan_Eskrima/FMA-Digest V7 #30 eskrima: Re: Inayan_Eskrima/FMA-Digest V7 #31 eskrima: Pat my ass... [none] ========================================================================== Eskrima-Digest, serving the Internet since June 1994. ~1100 members strong! Copyright 1994-2000: Ray Terry, Martial Arts Resource, and Inayan Eskrima Replying to this message will NOT unsubscribe you. To unsubscribe, send "unsubscribe eskrima-digest" (no quotes) in the body (top line, left justified) of a plain text e-mail addressed to majordomo@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com. To send e-mail to this list use eskrima@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com See the Filipino Martial Arts (FMA) FAQ and online search the last four years worth of digest issues at http://www.MartialArtsResource.com Mabuhay ang eskrima! ---------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "arlan and angel sanford" Date: Wed, 19 Jan 2000 19:53:37 -0700 Subject: eskrima: Re: Inayan_Eskrima/FMA-Digest V7 #31 > I have a couple of questions for the members........... > > Does anyone know who and where the Krabi Krabong instructors are in this > country? > > What kind of luck would I have walking into Thai restaurants and looking for > anyone who > knows about Thai sword--Old style Thai? If you want to e-mail me, I can give you some names and numbers. There aren't very many instructors in the states, less than a dozen. Alot of older Thais know at least a little, as it was taught as part of the school cirriculum, much as we do phys ed. However, don't expect much, how much phys ed do you remember from school? The instructors in the states are pretty spread out, from Oregon to CA to Texas, New Mexico, New York. Arlan P.S. shirts would be great! ------------------------------ From: Stuart Igarta Date: Wed, 19 Jan 2000 21:53:16 -0500 (EST) Subject: eskrima: RE: Inayan_Eskrima/FMA-Digest V7 #31 Right on Kalani! Stuart Check our website - http://wwwhelper.com/sigarta ................................................................................. iWon.com http://www.iwon.com why wouldn't you? ................................................................................. ------------------------------ From: Terry Tippie Date: Wed, 19 Jan 2000 19:09:48 -0800 Subject: eskrima: Re:Krabi-Krabong >From: tcsno > >Date: Wed, 19 Jan 2000 17:37:02 -0500 >Subject: eskrima: Krabi krabong > >I have a couple of questions for the members........... >Does anyone know who and where the Krabi Krabong instructors are in this country? > Off the top of my head? Um...Arlan Sanford, Steve Wilson, Clint Heliger, Tony Moore, Greg Nelson, Dan Inosanto. (In no particular order.) It's funny you should mention this because there are a couple of people working on such a list now, but we don't have it ready. Khun Kru Clint Heliger and Ajarn Tony Moore have some information on Krabi-Krabong at http://www.usmta.com/thai-weapons.htm. Khun Kru Clint is working on a list of Krabi-Krabong students from his association with the Buddhai Sawan school. I've also got an action item to get an update from Ajarn Chai Sirisute on which of his students have trained and or been certified in Krabi-Krabong. The latter effort is on hold until Ajarn Chai gets back from Thailand. When I get it I'll post it on www.thaiboxing.com and also send it to Khun Kru Clint for inclusion on the USMTA web page. >What kind of luck would I have walking into Thai restaurants and looking for >anyone who knows about Thai sword--Old style Thai? > Most Thai people know of Krabi-Krabong but they aren't trained in it. Lots of people in Thailand has seen the re-staged battles they do with elephants and tons of Krabi-Krabong guys. (Great fun to see.) They do, however, teach it as an elective in the Bangkok school district to this day. >Has anyone had luck with talking to members of Cambodian, Laotian, ethnic >groups/clubs and seeing if their tribal arts are still active?? > There are a few people around that know Patani Silat from Southern Thailand and a couple of people who are up on some of the Thai Hill Tribe arts, but these are generally Thai nationals residing in Thailand. I'm not aware of these arts in the U.S. yet. Lots of good work to do on Thai martial arts translation. There is a detailed manual, written in Thai, that Ajarn Sumai wrote before his death on Krabi-Krabong. I was gonna pay somebody to translate this, but they said the words were to technical for a non-martial artist. (*sigh*) Actually, I'm planning a trip to Thailand to do some research on early (pre-1787) Muay Thai historical sources. Maybe I can ask around about the Hill Tribe stuff when I'm there. Let me get back to you on this. Terry Tippie Thai Boxing Assocation of the U.S.A. www.thaiboxing.com ------------------------------ From: Chad Date: Wed, 19 Jan 2000 19:46:49 -0800 (PST) Subject: eskrima: This and that > Should I have gave him the bird? Crafty is very well read and understanding on human aggression and so is Konrad Lorenz in his book "On Agression". But then again it seem like you are also(what better way to understand it than to experience it?) which is a good thing. It is important for us to embrace and recognize human aggression so that we can choose our paths accordingly to the situation. I like the saying my instructor says "What difference did your actions make?" Than again it is harder to say "holier than thou" than to live. >our empty hand bat defenses went all to hell because no one telegraphs >large swings or steps in with the bat way back to expose their forearms >and the swing is so fast, no one can get inside and if you wait for it >to go by and try to enter, control of the centrifigal force brings it >right back onto us. It certainly has upped the ante. Don't know if this is relevant but somthing I like to do is have my partner swing a heavy rattan staff back and forth, high or low, on the 3 and 4 angles-----as hard and as fast as he can. Sure you probably won't come accross it on the street but what you get for seeing the blow is you now have tremendous power to deal with. I've seen guys that said "no problem" but don't quite crash through and get bowled over. Anyways its a little training tip that we use. >What kind of luck would I have walking into Thai restaurants and >looking for anyone whoknows about Thai sword--Old style Thai? Good luck, you'll need it. >Has anyone had luck with talking to members of Cambodian, Laotian, >ethnic groups/clubs and seeing if their tribal arts are still active?? I live in Hawaii and have that culture here and haven't found it yet. Most people don't know ,in fact say that their culture doesn't fight. When I ask about tribal warfare they say they used spears. I di however catch one older Vietnamese man demonstrating his Vietnamese MA on public access chanell, but didn't cath his name. It was nice, alot of short punches, hammer fist, and elbows with a few low kicks, similiar to FMA. >It is my understanding that a good way to get a pit or other dog >locked on to release is to stick your thumb up his butt. But how many of our fellow digesters would want to do that??? "I wonder if you did that in battle, would it matter?"(not the thumb thing, I was watching Bravehart the other night and William Wallace/Mel Gibson said it;1 ===== "Draw me not without reason, sheath me not without honor" Chad Hawaii __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Talk to your friends online with Yahoo! Messenger. http://im.yahoo.com ------------------------------ From: "paul martin" Date: Thu, 20 Jan 2000 04:30:53 GMT Subject: eskrima: Re: Inayan_Eskrima/FMA-Digest V7 #31 THe tooshie touch fight: GIVE ME A BREAK! Are we discussing self defense situations where bodily harm could occur or bar room ego battles? As far as the parking lot, you know what you did wrong that led up to the neccessity of worrying about tactics. Who cares about that part of it, the root is the personal control. As far as this butt patting...not padding...:) Who cares. Move away from the jerk, position yourself in the best position to protect and observe for more jerks and get away! This is the problem I see with FMA, in other MA's there is usually some kind of code of conduct that reminds you of the moral obligation that comes with the trained ability to do physical damage. FMA focuses on the fight and does not really express a moral consideration. That is left up to the individual. DOn't get me wrong, I know that there are egos, and machismo in other cultures that have popularized MA's in the states, but FMA in general doesn't even attempt to train character traits that would develop the A.B.C.'s (Attitude, Bearing and Control) that will help you avoid all but the really immediate dangers. And please don't think that I am forgetting the human factor. I would have the overwhelming desire to pound someone in this situation myself, but there is the safety of your significant other and the responsibility of CONTROL when you are trained (legal ramifications?) in a martial art. Emotional reaction aside, violence in this case might feel really good in the moment, but would be bad in the larger picture. Some women would even be horrified or frightened by your use of violence under these circumstances. You could scare away the one you love for the sake of emotional satisfaction. The other major point is it didn't happen to you, so why is it your place to engage this jerk first. Give your girlfriend/wife or what ever a chance to handle it herself. Women are usually more familiar with these situations and know how to handle them within their comfort zones, and with thier own style! You should only be concerned with making sure that the threat doesn't escalate and ensuring a safe environment for her. There is an embarassment factor to the situation for her that you may make worse by drawing more attention to the situation! I know that I am reacting strongly to this, so someone pick up the ball...ARE you or have you ever had an instructor that includes and demonstrates some kind of moral code of conduct that reminds students of the responsibility that comes with training? B Being in the military and TRYING to be a professional, I notice this as a glaring weakness in FMA's. Would you teach someone to shoot a gun w/o ensuring that they knew all the actions esential to safely and correctly use it. Why would you consider physical force under this scenario because you are unarmed? Would you draw and point your gun at this same jerk if you were trained in the martial art of pistolcraft? If you read through all of this, thanks for your patience. ALl responses are welcome. Paul ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ From: "*" Date: Thu, 20 Jan 2000 01:40:13 -0800 Subject: eskrima: batter up i would probally do the same - however, i think the harimau method of silat might be quite useful - (or high/ low game of kali) - if someone is swinging a bat - they have a high line swing, be it to the head or the body - if one drops (be it selo(sempak/dempak) or into a harimau or enok(sp?) harimau or rolls) the bat would simply pass over your head as you attack the low line - i know it's easier said then done however i have seen it done well - thats why harimau players dont worry about punches, they just arent in line with any "boxing" weapons steve reiter ------------------------------ From: "Jon Howard" Date: Thu, 20 Jan 2000 10:17:42 -0000 Subject: eskrima: Re: Inayan_Eskrima/FMA-Digest V7 #30 > >Draw me not without reason, sheath me not without honor. > >I'd come across this saying once while online and I thought it was great. >Now I see everybody and their mother using it, saying it, etc. Where did >this quotation come from? Who said this originally? It's starting to drive >me nuts. > >Ronnie Saturno, Jr > The above was engraved on the sword of General Custer (him of the Little Big Horn fame), now there's irony.... FWIW - Ray, I like the idea about the shirts, I think the plain email header stuff is the best idea - not too corny. Maybe on different coloured shirts, White, Black, Red etc etc Someone mentioned the idea of a rouges gallery - I had this idea a while back, I'm just sorting out some personal web space at the moment and if any one is interested I'll host and the keep the beast updated. Jon... - ------------- Carpe Diem - ------------- ------------------------------ From: "Mike Barnes" Date: Thu, 20 Jan 2000 08:40:11 -0500 Subject: eskrima: Re: Inayan_Eskrima/FMA-Digest V7 #31 My wife, Tatjana, who has been taking Eskrima with me for about two months = was attending a meeting at the day care that she works at.(Now that is a = sentence) They told them a story (I think they said it was true) about a = lady that was shopping for groceries. She finished and went to check out. = The lady had more than the maximum for the express lane and therefore = chose another one. A kid who was working at the express lane said that = she could come to his lane because it was empty. While she was checking = out, a man, who was in a hurry and had just a few items, got in line = behind her. He was upset at having to wait. When he finally got up to = the kid he asked why she was allowed to check out in the express lane. = The kid told him that it is store policy that if the express lane is empty = and the others are backed up, that they can let people through. The man = said something like hurry up and let me get out of here... Well, he did get out of there quickly. He got out of there quick enough = to find the woman and stab the lady. Tatjana did not tell me if she was = killed or not, but she did say that she is glad that she is taking = Eskrima. I don't know if the man ambushed her or what but this is a good example of = how people can snap. Mike Barnes Inayan System of Eskrima Lenoir City, TN =20 ------------------------------ From: "Branwen Thomas" Date: Thu, 20 Jan 2000 11:17:48 -0330 Subject: eskrima: Pat my ass... ...and you better HOPE you had an invite... >What would you suggest doing to someone who has just disrespected you and >your girlfriend/wife by patting her on the ass? Especially if your lady is >offended (to say the least), and knows that you can do damage. I welcome ALL >responses. ...bite his arm off and feed it to him.... oh no I'm just kidding! I'll tell you what I actually did in one of these situations. There was no boyfriend at the time, so I had to take care of it myself...;) This was previous to my martial arts training, but it worked... I was in a bar, friends of mine were playing - the place was packed, and of about 240 people I would estimate 200 of them were friends/acquaintances (we have a very tightly knit music community )...basically I felt extremely safe, good vibes, our regular bar etc. Myself and a friend up front dancing, mashed in but surrounded by friends all having an equally good time. In that situation, you do occasionally get an arm/hand/leg/head/elbow pressed against your butt/breast/face ;) etc...no worries, and generally excused. However, as a woman (although I don't speak for us all) you can usually tell the difference between an accidental touch and a deliberate one. I felt a deliberate one on my butt; whipped my head around and saw some guy I had never seen before right behind me studiously watching the band. So I move away a bit and continued dancing, thinking, okay, drunk, idiot, possibly "accidental". happened again. I look around, same guy, turning away and to the side. I'm just trying to dance, i'm getting irritated, but figure if I ignore him and move away, he'll take a hint. Well, you know what they say "once is funny, twice is stupid, three times you get a spanking". Just as a song was ending, I felt a hand snake around my arm from behind and touch my breast - I snapped - grabbed the arm, whipped around to confront d*ckhead who was backing up saying, "I didn't do anything..." (i had his *arm*!). As I kept hold of his arm he turned back on, (dummy!) and so I applied my 14 hole Doc Marten to his behind in what I now know to be a perfect front scoop kick ;) the impact sent him scrambling forward, trying to get away - I chased him through a crowd of my friends who watched me boot him at regular intervals toward the door while screaming invective (i was PISSED OFF)...the bouncers (who knew me as I often collected cover for the bands) watched me with smirks on their face - the guy scrammed, and was never seen again. I hope his butt still hurts. That'll learn him...the varmint. ;) jocelyne Roaring Girl * Purveyor Of Fine Books * Beater Of Bodhrans * Smiter Of The Wicked * * Owned By Angus, Most Elegant And Pleasing Of Cats * ------------------------------ From: Ray Terry Date: Thu, 20 Jan 2000 07:13:30 -0800 (PST) Subject: [none] ------------------------------ End of Inayan_Eskrima/FMA-Digest V7 #32 *************************************** To unsubscribe from the eskrima-digest send the command: unsubscribe eskrima-digest -or- unsubscribe eskrima-digest your.old@address in the BODY of an email (top line, left justified) addressed to majordomo@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com. Old digest issues are available via ftp://ftp.martialartsresource.com. Copyright 1994-2000: Ray Terry, Martial Arts Resource, and Inayan Eskrima Standard disclaimers apply.