From: eskrima-digest-owner@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com To: eskrima-digest@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com Subject: Inayan_Eskrima/FMA-Digest V7 #412 Reply-To: eskrima@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com Errors-To: eskrima-digest-owner@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com Precedence: Inayan_Eskrima/FMA-Digest Fri, 25 Aug 2000 Vol 07 : Num 412 In this issue: eskrima: RE: Inayan_Eskrima/FMA-Digest V7 #410 eskrima: Re : Kali and Knives eskrima: Fairtex Smoker's this Sat. eskrima: Re: Inayan_Eskrima/FMA-Digest V7 #410 eskrima: garote Larenze, venezuelan stickfighting Re: eskrima: Re : Kali and Knives eskrima: Re: Inayan_Eskrima/FMA-Digest V7 #409 eskrima: . ========================================================================== Eskrima-Digest, serving the Internet since June 1994. 1100 members strong! Copyright 1994-2000: Ray Terry, the Martial Arts Resource, Inayan Eskrima Replying to this message will NOT unsubscribe you. To unsubscribe, send "unsubscribe eskrima-digest" (no quotes) in the body (top line, left justified) of a "plain text" e-mail addressed to majordomo@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com. To send e-mail to this list use eskrima@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com See the Filipino Martial Arts (FMA) FAQ and online search the last five years worth of digest issues at http://www.MartialArtsResource.com Mabuhay ang eskrima! ---------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Steven C. Drape" Date: Thu, 24 Aug 2000 22:32:07 -0700 (PDT) Subject: eskrima: RE: Inayan_Eskrima/FMA-Digest V7 #410 Service Brought To You By http://WWW.DWP.NET - -------------------------------------------- >was struck by how different they were from pretty much all of the >Kali/Arnis/Eskrima I've seen in this country........ The FMA I've seen has been almost entirely >based on a medium length IMPACT weapon. Good observation, Todd. One way to note how the FMA has changed from the blade art it used to be is how most systems in the West use the angles of attack. All the systems I have ever studied still include quite a few thrusts (as many as 5), to places like the chest. These are useless attacks for a stick, yet most people are never taught the difference. A pure stick art would have no more than one or two thrusts in its angles, perhaps the eyes/throat and the groin. This is not the case with the systems I am familiar with. Another point that students are not taught, unless the style is truly a blade style, is the difference between a blade and stick response. A stick response requires power, to strike the attacking limb or weapon with enough force to damage or deflect. To generate that power requires a particular way of moving the hips, waist and shoulders, as well as stepping in the proper manner. A blade, on the other hand, uses little to no force for the same response. All that is necessary is that the blade come in contact with the attacking limb, and a cut results. The body mechanics for the two are very different, as are the footwork and distancing. The blade fighter has very little need to be jumping around and dancing all over the place. Your opponent is just as aware of your blade as you are of his. Size and strength mean nothing. Rushing in, or wild attacks are uncommon. Blade fighting is a much calmer, more well-thought out exercise. A wrong or hasty move can get you killed. The Yaming style of blade fighting, from the island of Negros, is a true blade style. There are no blocks, only parries and deflections. There are few if any slashing counters. Almost all responses off the parries and deflections are thrusts, and the footwork reflects these differences. I would be interested in comparing my system (Yaming) with the South American man's. Perhaps there will be a chance for some video when they meet...(hint, hint!!) Steve Steve_kbs@dwp.net http://www.geocities.com/eartes/KBS_System_index.html ------------------------------ From: Gary Date: Fri, 25 Aug 2000 14:09:35 +0800 Subject: eskrima: Re : Kali and Knives From: Ray Terry Date: Thu, 24 Aug 2000 21:40:04 PDT Subject: eskrima: Kali and knives > ... Kali is > the oldest style of Filipino weaponary art. >>What exactly does this ancient art look like? You may found some historical factors and hints from the Book " The Filipino Martial Art" by Dan Inosnato, in explaining the development of Filipino Martial Art Weaponary. > ... If in a > street fight situation, you are most likely to pick up a tool from the > street to use for the fight, like a piece of wood, wasted water pipe, mod > stick or some other things the shape is similar to a "Stick" and without a > "sharp Blade", as a result, you need to apply "Hitting" technique in order > to deliver a powerful strike. >>Why not just use one of the knives that you would most likely be >>carrying? >Ray Terry >raymail@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com That is a very good question and worth to discuss in depth. In some places(Like in Hong Kong), the law won't allow people to carry a "Blade Weaponary" when walking on the street. And if very unlucky, you need to use your blade weapnoary to defend yourself, and if you hurt your emeny, may be you also subject to legal liability, since you have " An Intention" to use a "Blade Weapnoary" for hurting someone. In a legal point of view, a defensive action is legal, provided it is "Unintentional, and unprepared", if you "prepared" a weapon for defensive purposes, the law may viewed as an offensive action rather than a defensive one. gary ------------------------------ From: "Phil Tong" Date: Fri, 25 Aug 2000 00:44:43 -0700 Subject: eskrima: Fairtex Smoker's this Sat. Hi E-D: Hey does anyone want to hook up and check out the monthly Muay Thai "Smoker's Competition" this Sat. at the Fairtex gym in SF? It will be my first event (watching!!!) I never seen this type of fighting live. Am sure there are all kinds of rules in the ring but no doubt plenty to learn and apply for oneself. It will be from 12-2pm I think 444 Clementina St. which is really an alley between 5th and 6th streets and like Howard St.? http://www.fairtex.com/ (Gotta' love those gyms in alleys! and this one you have to step over the ropes to get in, just like entering the ring :) They have some of the best handwraps too if you need a "shopping reason" to go :P very long, and elasticized not like the stiff short cheapie kind which don't always fit under the gloves. Oh yeah long velcro straps too so those of us with skinny wrists can still attached them securely. (hmm, Chad, you guys wrap your hands when you fight?) People starting to call me "Chop Suey" at the school (cause going all different directions) but like I said, with E-D's help new doors are opening and one can't see enough of the martial arts can we? So let me know, email etc.! Phil Chop-Chop hahaha ps. Mike Casto- you tell your friend Bob to stay strong!!! I am with him in spirit. Time is on his side always! ------------------------------ From: "Marc Halleck" Date: Fri, 25 Aug 2000 07:11:44 -0500 Subject: eskrima: Re: Inayan_Eskrima/FMA-Digest V7 #410 I have a school that is a jkd based school with heavy emphasis on the filipino martial arts. I have 130 students. I am a member of NAPMA (National Association for Professional Martial Artists) and also just started with a billing company to track the late payers. NAPMA is more taylored to aTKD, Karate based school. But the business management is universal to any school and i just taylor what i want from there program to my school, For example i use there Black belt Club, Striping System, No testing fee's, a family oriented school. and believe it or not i have more adults than kids. My kids classes are much more traditional based with a blend of Filipino/Jun fan mixed in at high ranks, (my kids get to start stick work at orange belt) The curicculum is progressive and taught in month blocks. the parents love it, My adult curicculum is strict Filipino/JKD. The ad slicks they send me i cant/dont use. but the business management is very good, anymore questions feel free to ask. Marc Halleck NSA Martial Arts ------------------------------ From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?St=E9phane_Fernandez?= Date: Fri, 25 Aug 2000 15:38:24 +0100 Subject: eskrima: garote Larenze, venezuelan stickfighting Hi to all, A few years ago, there was an article about this venezuelan stickfighting art in Inside Kung Fu. I don't have my back issues with me, but some digest members may do. From what I remember, when looking at the pictures, one will see it is Kali or Arnis or Eskrima (there were pictures stick vs stick, and also espada y daga). The guy in the article stated that his art was coming from the spanish espada y daga techniques and was either stick, machette or knives. He also added that espada y daga was practised troughout latin america (any latin american in the digest to confirm this) You have to remenber that apart the native indians, the venezuelan are mostly spanish blood and that they have no problem aknowledging that their art is from their spanish forefathers. In the Philippines, spanish were not forefathers but invaders, it is hard for the filipinos to aknowledge that invaders brought something "good" with them (things we can understand: spanish conquistadores had done really bad things everywhere they went). It is the same for taekwondo people who tell you that their art is purely Korean and that there is no connection with China or Japan. Also at the begining, japanese karate people were really upset if you told them their art is from China. Same thing with FMA. But we have 2 different places: the Philippines and latin america, a commun denominator: the invasion by the spanish conquistadores during 300 years and we found in these places stickfighting, machettes, knives and espada y daga... I let you make your own conclusions. There is clearly a connection. Regards Stéphane, France ------------------------------ From: Ray Terry Date: Fri, 25 Aug 2000 8:01:43 PDT Subject: Re: eskrima: Re : Kali and Knives > > ... Kali is the oldest style of Filipino weaponary art. > > >>What exactly does this ancient art look like? > > You may found some historical factors and hints from the Book " The > Filipino Martial Art" by Dan Inosnato, in explaining the development of > Filipino Martial Art Weaponary. If you check with Danny, I think you'll learn that while an admirable effort for its time, some (much?) of it is incorrect. The truth is we don't know what the oldest style of FMA was like. Ray Terry raymail@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com ------------------------------ From: Eagle556@aol.com Date: Fri, 25 Aug 2000 10:40:03 EDT Subject: eskrima: Re: Inayan_Eskrima/FMA-Digest V7 #409 >>>1) Is it always in the form of instructor feeding student?<<< Most of the time it is either myself or my training partner Kim Satterfield feeding people. I don't use patterns in most of my training and this is no different. The student is forced to deal with the unknown. The only time that I let students constantly feed other students was when I was in the Army training some other Army guys and decided to take the chance with some of them feeding one another. >>>2) What size blades do you use?<<< I use blades with blade lengths from 3" up to about 24". Most of the time I focus on smaller blades as I feel that is what they are most likely to encounter in the street. I do practice lock and block with the students on occasion with blades. I, as the feeder, will have a machete and smaller knife, the student will have a pipe. We also on occasion do flow sparring with machetes or a machete and a pipe. >>>3) How 'hard' do you go?<<< In the beginning, like everything else, I go nice and slow. However as the student progresses I tend to increase the speed and the intensity. I want the student to experience the effects of andrenelan and what that effect does to fine motor control. It's hard to do all those fancy disarms and other cute movements under andrenal dump. >>>Do people who have trained with live blades also throw in empty hands, knees, etc?<<< If appropriate I will throw in other things. Take care, Rob. ------------------------------ From: Ray Terry Date: Fri, 25 Aug 2000 8:06:18 PDT Subject: eskrima: . ------------------------------ End of Inayan_Eskrima/FMA-Digest V7 #412 **************************************** To unsubscribe from the eskrima-digest send the command: unsubscribe eskrima-digest -or- unsubscribe eskrima-digest your.old@address in the BODY of an email (top line, left justified) addressed to majordomo@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com. Old digest issues are available via ftp://ftp.martialartsresource.com. Copyright 1994-2000: Ray Terry and the Martial Arts Resource Standard disclaimers apply.