From: eskrima-digest-owner@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com To: eskrima-digest@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com Subject: Inayan_Eskrima/FMA-Digest V8 #183 Reply-To: eskrima@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com Errors-To: eskrima-digest-owner@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com Precedence: Inayan_Eskrima/FMA-Digest Mon, 16 April 2001 Vol 08 : Num 183 In this issue: eskrima: Hock's SDMS System. eskrima: Straight Blast Gym eskrima: gun Seguidas eskrima: Dos Manos eskrima: daikon-do eskrima: quoting Hock eskrima: P-T Gun Seguidas eskrima: Dr. Gyi's two hand stick eskrima: Re: Inayan_Eskrima/FMA-Digest V8 #182 eskrima: LEO baton arts eskrima: moving on eskrima: . ========================================================================== Eskrima-Digest, serving the Internet since June 1994. 1300 members strong! Copyright 1994-2001: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource The premier internet discussion forum devoted to Filipino Martial Arts. Provided in memory of Mangisursuro Mike Inay (1944-2000), Founder of the Inayan System of Eskrima. Replying to this message will NOT unsubscribe you. To unsubscribe, send "unsubscribe eskrima-digest" (no quotes) in the body (top line, left justified) of a "plain text" e-mail addressed to majordomo@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com. To send e-mail to this list use eskrima@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com See the Filipino Martial Arts (FMA) FAQ and the online search engine for back issues of the Eskrima-Digest at http://www.MartialArtsResource.com Mabuhay ang eskrima! ---------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Jeff Allen" Date: Sun, 15 Apr 2001 00:58:51 -0500 Subject: eskrima: Hock's SDMS System. The last issue posed these questions.... > How good this SDMS? Is this the ultimate? It's sound like that really he > created/discovered a new Martial Arts that will conquer the world. I just > want to reminds myself to study hard to my home work so If I face one of the > SDMS guys I am 101% ready.. Something to look forwards to, meeting someone > better and knowledgeable than you are, its time to learn the real deal. I'm sorry. I should have known better than to try to provide comments. At this point, please go to the source...as I've stated numerous times before. I have not made any headway thus far....each time it has been assumed that the e-mail have been exaggerated, or I lack the creditials to make comparisons. I'm done with the public comments on this thread....go to the seminar, watch the videos, read the articles. Hock is a very prolific writer/publisher that has been well accepted any many areas of study. I'll certainly be willing to answer private e-mails to answer your individual questions. Here are some resources if you desire additional information: Hock's web site is: http://www.hockscqc.com/ Hock's e-mail address is: hockhoch@aol.com Hock's seminars are listed at: http://www.hockscqc.com/seminars/index.htm. Hock's SDMS page is at: http://www.hockscqc.com/dms/index.htm Hock's Close Quarter Combat magazine is listed at: http://www.hockscqc.com/magazine/index.htm. Hock's FAQ page is at: http://www.hockscqc.com/faq/index.htm Hock's Biography is at: http://www.hockscqc.com/bio/index.htm Hock's books and videos are listed at: http://www.hockscqc.com/shop/index.htm If you don't like what you see, please find something that pleases you. FMA may be all that you want. Jeff Allen (drjeffallen@home.com) ------------------------------ From: "John Haynes" Date: Sun, 15 Apr 2001 14:37:54 -0500 Subject: eskrima: Straight Blast Gym Has anyone had any dealings with the folks at the Straight Blast Gym in Oregon, or done any training there? If so, what did you think? _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com ------------------------------ From: "Bernd Giller" Date: Sun, 15 Apr 2001 22:18:50 +0200 Subject: eskrima: gun Seguidas >Ray Terry asked: > >Anyone familiar with the P-T Gun Seguidas? > >Are they a kata-like series/sequence of movements? Or? Any mpegs on the >web that show (a portion of) one? > >Ray Terry >raymail@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com Hi! How far as I know they used to be a serial of principles and movements how to apply best a gun. The basics are how to hold a gun in close quarter and how to move - a lot on the ground - while shooting. Good stuff!!!! I am quite sure that you will not see anything on the net, because it was hold secret ;-) I am sure Bill McGrath knows much more to tell. Regards Bernd Giller, Germany ptbernd@gmx.de ------------------------------ From: szorn@webtv.net (S ZORN) Date: Sun, 15 Apr 2001 18:10:02 -0500 (EST) Subject: eskrima: Dos Manos Gat, All I can do is laugh regarding your last post. First off, it seems that you are the only one who thinks that your style is the "ultimate". You act as though the SDMS course is some sort of threat to you or your style yet you know very little about it. As for my training, I am have trained in several styles including Serrada Escrima, Modern Arnis, Kombatan as well as Kenpo Karate, Kung Fu San Soo, Hung Gar Kung Fu, Hawaiian Lua, and Kosho Shorei Ryu Kenpo. I have also been training with Hock for a while. I don't claim to be an expert on any of these arts but I have been around long enough to see what's being taught out there and what isn't. I also understand what works out on the street and what doesn't. As for Hock's material, if you would check out the videos or go to a seminar you might learn something. Hock's material is based on alot of different styles including military and police combatives, things not taught in FMA. Also, Hock has researched fighting styles from several cultures, including ancient Roman styles, which were around long before the FMA. You see, Filipinos did not "discover" or "create" everything that they teach, in fact they took alot of their knowledge from the Spanish, the Chinese, and the Japanese. I should also mention that there is a difference between art and combat. In art they do things because the grandmaster says so, in combat they do things because they want to live. Hock teaches combat, not art. Yes, we train to avoid being hit but in the "real" world and out on the street you are going to be hit. You see even the Dog Brothers can teach you this because they have been hit during their fights. To think that you won't get hit in a real fight means that you have no grasp on reality and you live in a martial arts fantasy world. If you you can open your mind and are seriously interested in learning SDMS, get the videos or go to a seminar. Yes, Hock does seminars in Florida and he also has an instructor in Florida named Steve Vaughn. You can go to Hock's website to get info on seminars and to get contact info for Steve. Go train with Steve for a day, he is an excellent hardcore instructor. The point is that you seem to badgering the subject at hand and it appears that you are not even familar with the material or the course. I suggest that you check out the material before you comment on it. Steve ------------------------------ From: "Michael Koblic" Date: Sun, 15 Apr 2001 16:42:50 -0700 Subject: eskrima: daikon-do "****Mike Koblic...On the other hand, "the greatest fool can ask more questions than the wisest > man can answer".3rd Degree Black Belt in Daikon-Do******* so how long did it take you to get your 3rd Degree Black Belt in Daikon" Japanese Radish"-Do?" Ah, well done, Ms J... It takes two more years than the Chinese equivalent, Lo Bok Kung Fu. But first one must master the aiki-jutsu. BTW the Dos Manos version of this art is particularly deadly. Nothing worse than being radished! Mike Koblic, Campbell River, BC ------------------------------ From: Gerald Boggs Date: Sun, 15 Apr 2001 19:54:01 -0700 Subject: eskrima: quoting Hock Greetings for those that are following the DMS thread. The Hock article referenced from Black Belt magazine. Here's the paragraph in its entirety "In 1987 I began studying the Philippine martial arts. I immediately saw that our military and police training courses lacked a "stick-dedicated" component and skill-developing drills such as those taught in the Philippines, But even though the Philippine arts had some solutions, they weren't doing the crafty things that our experienced police officers and military pugilists were. Additionally, the Filipinos, like the Japanese, tend to become too "artsy" at times, which can make their techniques insubstantial in the chaos of combat. Lesson learned: To create an outstanding stick-combat course that will best ensure a person's safety and success, one has to merge the best of the East with the best of the West. That's why I set about creating DMS, or the dos manos system." Also he lists "sources of Knowledge" with the advice (you would do well to check them out). Philippine stick fighting is at the top of the list Gerald D. Boggs Jr. ------------------------------ From: "BILL MCGRATH" Date: Sun, 15 Apr 2001 20:10:14 -0400 Subject: eskrima: P-T Gun Seguidas Tuhon Gaje learned a series of gun draws, stances, footwork and groundwork from an old Filipino who called it "Mexican bandit fighting." Picture a bunch of outlaws in a 1960's spaghetti western getting into a gunfight in a small crowded bar and you'll have an idea of what some of this stuff looks like. I'm not sure if it was originally arranged this way (I suspect Leo reworked it), but he when showed it to us it was arranged into 3 sets of 12 movements. It involves these theories: 1. Extreme close quarters drawing that presupposes a disarm attempt. 2. Shooting with a wounded arm. 3. Shooting around awkward barricade positions. 4. Shooting from the ground against multiple close opponents. It's some pretty wild stuff. PT Guro Omar Hakim is more practiced in it than I am and he taught it at the 1996 PTI summer camp. I have that class on tape. Once I get a computer editing system I can rely on I'll put together a short MPEG on it. Regards, Tuhon Bill McGrath Visit the PTI web site at: http://www.pekiti-tirsia.com/index.html ------------------------------ From: "BILL MCGRATH" Date: Sun, 15 Apr 2001 20:30:24 -0400 Subject: eskrima: Dr. Gyi's two hand stick Just a reminder that Dr. Maung Gyi will be teaching his U.N. Baton course on May 5th in Fishkill, NY. This is a course his group developed for the United Nations riot police in South Korea in the 50's and uses a two handed grip on the stick. The curriculum will include close quarters stick retention, takedown and control techniques and some interesting techniques for the lanyard of a riot baton. This is also a great system for a heavy walking stick. For more information please visit the PTI seminars page at: http://www.pekiti-tirsia.com/seminars.html Regards, Tuhon Bill McGrath Visit the PTI web site at: http://www.pekiti-tirsia.com/index.html ------------------------------ From: Philip Gelinas Date: Sun, 15 Apr 2001 21:58:49 -0400 Subject: eskrima: Re: Inayan_Eskrima/FMA-Digest V8 #182 Reference your question about the gun segudas from PT. There are at least two series of twelve movements that cover ppositions firing in a 360 degree arc while using the body as cover as well as support for the positions practiced. Fluidity is important as well as fitness to execute the moves as they involve rolling and twisting on the floor. I know of no mpegs. On of the authorities on these moves is Omar Hakim of Dallas. he worked extensively with Tuhon Gaje in the eighties in the southwest. Philip Gelinas ------------------------------ From: Ray Terry Date: Mon, 16 Apr 2001 7:33:20 PDT Subject: eskrima: LEO baton arts > Greetings for those that are following the DMS thread. The Hock article > referenced from Black Belt magazine. Here's the paragraph in its > entirety "In 1987 I began studying the Philippine martial arts. I > immediately saw that our military and police training courses lacked a > "stick-dedicated" component and skill-developing drills such as those > taught in the Philippines. This sounds like the same feeling that Suro Mike Inay had prior to his creation of Inayan Dequerdas in the late 70s(?) or 80s. A stick art especially good for LEOs with a baton. Ray Terry raymail@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com ------------------------------ From: Ray Terry Date: Mon, 16 Apr 2001 7:37:38 PDT Subject: eskrima: moving on > The point is that you seem to badgering the subject at hand and it > appears that you are not even familar with the material or the course. I > suggest that you check out the material before you comment on it. Seems like -both- sides of this issue would rather argue than listen to what each other is trying to say. Lets move on, ok? Ray Terry raymail@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com ------------------------------ From: Ray Terry Date: Mon, 16 Apr 2001 7:40:56 PDT Subject: eskrima: . ------------------------------ End of Inayan_Eskrima/FMA-Digest V8 #183 **************************************** To unsubscribe from the eskrima-digest send the command: unsubscribe eskrima-digest -or- unsubscribe eskrima-digest your.old@address in the BODY (top line, left justified) of a "plain text" e-mail addressed to majordomo@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com. Old digest issues are available via ftp://ftp.martialartsresource.com. Copyright 1994-2001: Ray Terry and the Martial Arts Resource Standard disclaimers apply.