From: eskrima-digest-owner@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com To: eskrima-digest@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com Subject: Inayan_Eskrima/FMA-Digest V8 #197 Reply-To: eskrima@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com Errors-To: eskrima-digest-owner@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com Precedence: Inayan_Eskrima/FMA-Digest Tues, 24 April 2001 Vol 08 : Num 197 In this issue: eskrima: My daughters eskrima: Re: Sticks to the Head for higher Consciousness eskrima: the DB experience eskrima: Re: Sad but ture.... eskrima: Re:The Origins of Eskrima by: Dr. Ned Nepangue "to ray eskrima: . ========================================================================== Eskrima-Digest, serving the Internet since June 1994. 1300 members strong! Copyright 1994-2001: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource The premier internet discussion forum devoted to Filipino Martial Arts. Provided in memory of Mangisursuro Mike Inay (1944-2000), Founder of the Inayan System of Eskrima. Replying to this message will NOT unsubscribe you. To unsubscribe, send "unsubscribe eskrima-digest" (no quotes) in the body (top line, left justified) of a "plain text" e-mail addressed to majordomo@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com. To send e-mail to this list use eskrima@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com See the Filipino Martial Arts (FMA) FAQ and the online search engine for back issues of the Eskrima-Digest at http://www.MartialArtsResource.com Mabuhay ang eskrima! ---------------------------------------------------------------------- From: AWSolis@aol.com Date: Tue, 24 Apr 2001 11:36:33 EDT Subject: eskrima: My daughters Woof! > Johnaleen wrote: > > Do you think that the ultimate challenges and stick fighting in the park > > without gear is any of a better example to the commando killer > > streetfighter? what do pictures of black and blue men with only shorts on > and > > stupid grins on there faces tell children of today? or the way the martial > arts > > is projected on TV? remember kids learn by what they see not what there > > told. I have two daughters, Meagan is 9, Ember will be 4 next month. I am Mr. Mom during the day, and I run my school in the afternoons/evenings. I have never spanked my kids, I use redirection and time out instead. My children are well behaved and well mannered. Meagan takes Brazilian Jiu-Jitsu and competes in it as well....at the last tournament she competed in, she had the little boy in a full arm bar, and the boy refused to tap, so she let the arm bar go. The boy passed her guard and got side control, thus winning the match by points 2-0. I asked her why she let it go, and she said it was no worth a medal to knowingly break his arm....besides they have played together at other tournaments after competing and she wants to keep him as a friend. This is a lesson that she has had modeled for her by watching me stickfight and compete in BJJ, both on tape and in person. "Be Friends At the End of the Day!" She loves the feeling of safety I provide by knowing that I can be loving to her, while being able to totally trash someone if I had to. She also knows that I can stand in the eye of a hurricane and not pee my pants, because I have test my art...more importantly, I test my heart. Everyone who has ever stepped on the grass with me, or on the mat with me knows that I grin stupidly after the match....win or lose, because I have learned something about myself that I can pass along to my daughters. BTW, If I charged my students what this experience is worth, no one would be able to afford training with me ;-) Woof! Alvis W. Solis Hound Dog! www.serve.com/solis/ ------------------------------ From: "Johnaleen" Date: Tue, 24 Apr 2001 12:01:28 -0400 Subject: eskrima: Re: Sticks to the Head for higher Consciousness nice list there crafty.... so tell me how are you getting that message out to the kids that are just seeing the pictures and have no understanding of what you are doing? again like i said the post was not an attack... what was posted was to get others to think about what we put out there and what the realty's are on the children and woman in society that deal with it and the long term effects on society that are placed there by others in the field... so again nice list here but what are you doing to change that overall and make sure that the kids know the full deal...? remember what i wrote... they are not there in the park with you and you do not have the connivance of explaining this... do you think they are reading what is written in the mags that go with the pic's? you kidding yourself if you believe that because i have had to face the questions from my students that are under 18 and have buy the mags and books and have asked me about them.. i ask them did you read the story... i get shrugs. the dialog in the magazines is beyond most of the kids and they dont want to read more boring dialog that they already do in school now... this is there point of view not mine.... so what are you doing to make sure they understand.... ? because i had to explain it to my boys, they wanted to know why.... none of them read the story's there boring but the pics are what they see... and what did it tell them? i told them all of what you have there but... i had to be honest when they asked but why would they do that without gear.... ? i smiled at them and said because they take to many hits to the head without a helmet... and have lost there senses... when they go to your site and read your bio of the legality's of what you are and why you do things... what message dose that give them? again do not take this as a personal attack... tis not meant this way... regardless of the facts that you may or may not of wanted to be a figure in there eyes you are.... but i also explained that each have there own paths and own way of doing things... that when we have common sense to back us up and training that is based on education and intelligence we dont need to prove anything to anyone... sparing is important but doing it in a progressive manor with gear is more important... because it shows control and it shows the responsibly that goes behind it... and i believe that's one of the reasons we use progressive sparing and when we do spar we have full gear on that and i dont need to be hit in the head over and over till i cant understand the realty's of what i am doing out in public without giving explanations to others first... " Higher Consciousness through Harder Contact." not when your brain cells are dead from taking too many hits to the head... Ms J........ ps... I spar 2 times a week min with gear on... again i dont have anything to prove doing it without gear... i dont have an ego and i dont have to show off my burses but you will normally see a silly grin on my face regardless of what i am doing.... Please remember this is not an attack and its not a dialog that i started here but your co-drive by dog brother... based the examples that he brought forth from blackbelt mag and killer street fighters... Ms. Johnaleen Castro CEO/F.A.T.E. 1-888-526-4626 Victims Program Facilitating Awareness Through Empowerment FATE@f-a-t-e.org www.f-a-t-e.org ------------------------------ From: Loki Jorgenson Date: Tue, 24 Apr 2001 09:34:55 -0700 (PDT) Subject: eskrima: the DB experience I second that. There is stick fighting and there is Dog Brothers. While it might not look anything different from Extreme Fighting or high school wrestling with baseball bats to the casual observer, the principles that Marc lists below make it different. And in a very immediate sense to most who have been to a Gathering and walked onto the field. To quote a DB a day after, "I felt a lot of love out there". That kind of brotherhood is in rare supply. And if any of that gets back to children of today, the world just got better. Silly grins and all. ::From: "Marc Denny" :: ::Johnaleen wrote: ::>what do pictures of black and blue men with only shorts on and ::> stupid grins on there faces tell children of today? :: :: What some see: :: ::1) No judges: Look to yourself for evaluate the meaning of what and how you ::have done. ::2) No referees: Even in the adrenal maelstrom of a stickfight, look to ::yourself to control yourself. ::3) No trophies: The reason to do is not external recognition, but for the ::value of the experience to you. ::4) "One rule only, Be Friends at the end of the Day". The purpose is not ::to damage other human beings, but rather for the tribe to become stronger. ::5) "The greater the dichotomy, the profounder the transformation. Higher ::Consciousness through Harder Contact."(c) For better or worse, the deepest ::learning comes in the adrenal state. The more one experiences composure ::while operating in the extremes, the more one is transformed. :: ::Crafty Dog - -- 'gards, /\ Pekiti-Tirsia kali / \ silat Jati Wisesa Loki Jorgenson < MANOyBASTON Martial Arts > / __ \ Dog Brothers MA loki@pekiti-tirsia.org (604) 254-0240 / _L \ Majapahit Empire www.pekiti-tirsia.org/ManoBaston/ /________\ (Inosanto-IMAIA) ------------------------------ From: "Johnaleen" Date: Tue, 24 Apr 2001 15:44:27 -0400 Subject: eskrima: Re: Sad but ture.... **** A sad but true story. Ran across this article today. Same applies to Korea and Thailand, and so forth.**** with a sick stomach i read this post and i Remember what it is like in all of these places... but i want to make a statement from someone that has lived in it and been there and seen it.... this applies to 99% of Asian country's and other places that American military have had bases in most of the 3rd world country's and some not so... regardless of the base being open or closed the problems are still there... the community's around most of the bases are catered to the service men sexually this way... to the point of there being free condoms at the gates that are handed out to the military gi's when they leave the compounds... hell half the service men in Korea that were stationed at the 4077 mash unit in 88 through 92 had 2 famleys one there and one here and neither new about it... yeah well i will tell you these are the realty's... you dont have to believe me but they are... and again we are paying for it... and i know the realty's of what the famleys dealt with on both sides... i know what the damage is done to the community's that are involved i have been there and seen it and worked with all of them concerned with the issues... It sucks all of it sucks and the realty's for these children suck and the famleys that deal with it sucks... and we allowed it to happen and that sucks even more... again i think about all of this and the relative damage we have done on society as a whole based on the examples of what we are and what we let happen as a nation... and we pay for it as well with taxes i assure you.. down to every road being paid for by the US government in south Korea... its all paid for and ignored by the governments involved all down to the buck... Why do you think every road overseas in these country's are called msr 1 or msr 2 and so on? MSR=Military Service Route... sigh....... i am going to go and walk on the beach before everyone takes it away and destroys it with there nasty intent on society at large by not giving a damn what they do too it... hopefully i wont see needles on it this year.... Ms J.......... ------------------------------ From: "Johnaleen" Date: Tue, 24 Apr 2001 18:28:25 -0400 Subject: eskrima: Re:The Origins of Eskrima by: Dr. Ned Nepangue "to ray *******Date: Sat, 21 Apr 2001 18:38:30 PDT Subject: eskrima: origins of Eskrima Forwarding... From a Filipino site @ http://clik.to/sves Ray---- The Origins of Eskrima by: Dr. Ned Nepangue****** Ray.... One of my Team Members for the FATE org, and friend to both myself and my busness partner is an anthropologist, he is also a martial artiest and Long term FMA practitioner... over the years on the digest i have sent him and my business partner articles from here that i feel are of interest to them... your recent post on the origins of eskrima was sent to him... his name is Bill.....:) he sent this reply and i wanted to share it with you and the rest of the digest... Ms J... bows deeply..... ************* from Bill, Nice article. As an anthropologist,lots of the escrima/kali stuff bothers me scientifically--ie the spanish name for terms the interchangeability of moves--I have long thought that many of these distinctions were really backdoor attempts at nationalism. it may be more productive to see escrima as a remnant of the collision of 2 sword fighting cultures the Filipino/Indonesian with the Spanosh. All the while realizing that both were in contact with other martial art traditions (like the Chinese & Japanese in asia and the Africans/Arabs for the Spanish). Finally, these are living human beings like us--they don't want to risk their lives to get good at sword fighting and couldn't afford steel blades for novices to break. I bet they have all prcticed with wood for centuries. The rattan of the tropics is superior and only available there. it probably came into vogue with european contact and the invention of lighter steel blades & the style that accompanied them. After all Kendo fencers use a version of the stick. Probably as big a breakthrough was Inosanto's realization that fencers could substitute the stick for the hand--this & modern fascination with Bruce Lee & the spread of global culture have popularized the art to the point that we now have to look for the art among the variations that are sprouting up and moving away from the bladed origins of these arts to tournament arts. Thanks for the article-- ------------------------------ From: Ray Terry Date: Tue, 24 Apr 2001 17:33:19 PDT Subject: eskrima: . ------------------------------ End of Inayan_Eskrima/FMA-Digest V8 #197 **************************************** To unsubscribe from the eskrima-digest send the command: unsubscribe eskrima-digest -or- unsubscribe eskrima-digest your.old@address in the BODY (top line, left justified) of a "plain text" e-mail addressed to majordomo@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com. Old digest issues are available via ftp://ftp.martialartsresource.com. 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