From: eskrima-digest-owner@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com To: eskrima-digest@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com Subject: Inayan_Eskrima/FMA-Digest V8 #443 Reply-To: eskrima@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com Errors-To: eskrima-digest-owner@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com Precedence: Inayan_Eskrima/FMA-Digest Fri, 5 Oct 2001 Vol 08 : Num 443 In this issue: eskrima: Re: Training Bags eskrima: The whole "truth"... eskrima: Re: Sayoc Kali Seminar-Brooklyn, NY eskrima: Tuhon-translation eskrima: Meaning of "Tuhon" eskrima: Tom Bisio eskrima: Heavy Bags eskrima: . ========================================================================== Eskrima-Digest, serving the Internet since June 1994. 1200 members strong! Copyright 1994-2001: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource The premier internet discussion forum devoted to Filipino Martial Arts. Provided in memory of Mangisursuro Michael G. Inay (1944-2000). Replying to this message will NOT unsubscribe you. To unsubscribe, send "unsubscribe eskrima-digest" (no quotes) in the body (top line, left justified) of a "plain text" e-mail addressed to majordomo@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com. To send e-mail to this list use eskrima@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com See the Filipino Martial Arts (FMA) FAQ and the online search engine for back issues of the Eskrima-Digest at http://MartialArtsResource.com Mabuhay ang eskrima! ---------------------------------------------------------------------- From: gints@att.net Date: Thu, 04 Oct 2001 23:52:29 +0000 Subject: eskrima: Re: Training Bags > There are "conventional" heavy bags, water-filled bags, water/air bags, and now > gel-covered bags. Any comments on experience with any/all of these? I like the > water-filled bags like the one from Balasz, heavy sucker, difficult to move. > Haven't tried a gel-covered one yet. I've gotten smirks from some pseudo > ruffnecks who like to punch hard heavy bags. Then I ask: "How much of your > actual striking force can you apply when hitting that ... and how many times can > you hit it as forcefully as you're capable of hitting?" There's a major point. > I prefer bags that yield so that I can hit/kick as hard as I please in lengthy > workouts, as many times as I please ... without jarring myself unnecessarily or > risking the increased probability of injuring self by pounding an unyielding > target. Comments? Has anyone used one of the gel-covered heavy bags? I've used a number of bags over the years. As of two years, I've found the I&I Ju-jitsu man to be the most useful for non-tournament training. It's a 150 lb bag shaped like a man, complete with a crotch to smash. Overall, I agree with your comments on hitting hard heavy bags. In fights, you don't want to break your hands punching skulls and arms. However, a soft heavy bag will have an effective impact distance that's longer than that of a hard bag. So, I get the most mileage out of the dummy man and a 6' Thai style bag. I use the Thai bag for gross body development and a good workout. The dummy man is for every thing else. Damn, do I love to kick that guy in the crotch. It's also fun to break his ribs, hand butt his nose, chop his neck, break his collar bones with your forearm, hook punch his ribs, shin kick his thighs, did I say kick his crotch ?, stomp his toes, knock his wind out with straight forward toe kicks, and knee him in the crotch. You get the picture. Heavy bags are great for developing body mechanics, but they offer little in the way of the development of accuracy. With bag gloves, much time is spent pounding the bag in the simulation of a punch to the skull. While sports such as boxing and kickboxing are won with these strikes, men are easier to disable with eye pokes, groin kicks, shin kicks and knee and elbow strikes. There is a reason these strikes are excluded from tournament action: the physical cost is too high for the contender pool. Speaking from experience with numerous finger fractures (in fact, I'm typing with a broken thumb right now), smashing your opponent's skull with your fist is a great way to break your hand. After a finger tip, it feels like you lost your finger nail because your finger feels rubbery. When you break your metacarpals, you knuckles more around in an unusually, flexible and rubbery way. In all of my hand breaks, including my current #7, it takes a couple minutes to perceive the pain. The swelling and spasms start quickly but not immediately. You mileage may vary. ------------------------------ From: T David Reyes Date: Thu, 04 Oct 2001 16:53:23 -0700 Subject: eskrima: The whole "truth"... > I know guro means teacher. I was wondering what Tuhon meant or translated as > in english? For the Ilokano fighter one will find; tu-"tuhan"-nun, translating to one who is seeking knowledge from a greater source. The root word coming from "tutu-hon", a loan word borrowed from the Maguindanaw which translates to a follower and seeker of the "Tuhon". The term or title Tuhon is defined as "the one" who is all knowing and all seeing and has achieved the ultimate truth and splendor. There is also the Siquijodnan fighter who is also mana-hilotuan (sage and healer), to which he is referred to as of "tuan". However, and certainly the title/term, definition and spelling of Tuhon or Tuhan is dictated upon the region and the locale of its usage and can have an entirely different meaning therein. Isplit na, David Reyes~ ------------------------------ From: GuroJeff@aol.com Date: Thu, 4 Oct 2001 20:44:26 EDT Subject: eskrima: Re: Sayoc Kali Seminar-Brooklyn, NY greetings and respect to all... just an announcement that there will be another one day seminar for Sayoc Kali Knifetraining in Brooklyn, NY. Seminar will be taught by Jeff Chung October 21, 2001 10am till 5pm 57 Jay Street 2nd floor Brooklyn, NY Contact: Jeff Chung for information 917-345-0987 or email: GuroJeff@yahoo.com $65 pre-paid, $75 at the door ------------------------------ From: GatPuno@aol.com Date: Thu, 4 Oct 2001 22:16:31 EDT Subject: eskrima: Tuhon-translation Steve, Not to correct GM Bo Sayoc, I know he just refer that as Teacher. We have a good Father and Son relationship. I would never go agaoints his will nor dis respect my father. I already study this case ten years ago when I met GM Bo Sayoc. He refer Leo Gaje as Grand Tuhon Leo Gaje. So I am curious what Tuhon meaning in our Filipino Language, I look it up in any Filipino History Book, I found records, but never used by a Man. Used by woman Chieftain, called Tuhan. So if you refer to a Man is Tuhon meaning Chieftain.. A man usually used by words Datu, Gat, Lakan, Raja, Pang'Lima", Apo, Lakay, Gurangan, and all of this meaning "Chieftain" or head of the tribes. Salamat, Just my two cents. Gat Puno Abon "Garimot" Baet Laguna Arnis Federation International << > I know guro means teacher. I was wondering what Tuhon meant or translated as > in english? I asked Tuhon Bo Sayoc for an exact translation just last month, and he told me it also means teacher. >> ------------------------------ From: "jose saguisabal" Date: Thu, 04 Oct 2001 20:47:42 -0700 Subject: eskrima: Meaning of "Tuhon" The word "Tuhon" does not have a direct translation. Rather, it is a "what". Tuhon is one of two titles: 1. The religious/spiritual/fortune teller leader of a group, and 2. The King-like power position that also doubles as that group's god sort of a god-king, like "Pharoh". They were found in the northern areas of the Philippine-Indonesian section of Asia before the European occupation of that region. Today, people may confuse the title with "rajah", which is the king of any group of people in Southern Philippines to India, or "datu", which was more like a small tribal chief than a king. The difference is the tribal religious connection. Only the title "Datu" is still used today, and it's used as an honorary one, like giving a "Key to the City". Nothing to do with the Islamic religion, nothing to do with the martial arts--historically, that is. Jay Make a difference, help support the relief efforts in the U.S. http://clubs.lycos.com/live/events/september11.asp ------------------------------ From: "Stephen Lamade" Date: Fri, 05 Oct 2001 04:09:11 Subject: eskrima: Tom Bisio I want to thank Steve Drape for the information about GM Casio. If I may elaborate just a little: The San Miguel Eskrima Association is based in the United States and is not affiliated with any organization in the Philippines. “San Miguel Eskrima,” as it is taught in the United States today, is Tom Bisio’s interpretation of what Momoy Canete was teaching from the late 70’s through the late 80’s and into the early 90’s. I think it is fair to say that as Tom has continued to practice his art, he has incorporated what he has learned from Chinese internal martial arts into his eskrima - and has done so because it dovetails perfectly with what he learned from Master Canete. What struck Tom as particularly noteworthy about Master Canete’s eskrima was the quality of his movement. Master Canete was in his seventies when Tom started training with him, and even well into his eighties, he could still move with grace and power - yet his musculature appeared soft and relaxed. Master Canete’s mechanics, distancing, and timing were honed to perfection. He exemplified the result of strong internal development over a lifetime of training. As a result of conversations with Tom in the early 1990’s, Master Canete gave Tom permission to use the name “San Miguel Eskrima,” both to promote his art here in the United States, and to avoid confusion with the Doce Pares organization. Momoy Canete considered his eskrima to be an expression of an "older" Doce Pares, and wanted its qualities to be retained - hence the name change. “San Miguel” also refers to the crossed-legged footwork pattern that occurs in the system. It may have gotten its name from statues in the region that depict St. Michael slaying a dragon in the same crossed-legged stance. With respect to whether Tom still teaches martial arts: While Tom occasionally teaches Filipino martial arts, most of his time is spent teaching Xing Yi Quan and Ba Gua Zhang, in addition to running a busy Chinese medicine clinic. Both Xing Yi and Ba Gua have an extensive weapons repertoire, and anyone wishing to improve their Filipino martial arts would benefit from taking classes from him in these arts, since the skills learned are foundational. Regards, Steve Lamade San Miguel Eskrima ------------------------------ From: Ken McDonough Date: Fri, 5 Oct 2001 03:37:07 -0700 (PDT) Subject: eskrima: Heavy Bags This posted queried: Date: Fri, 05 Oct 2001 7:55:22 PDT Subject: eskrima: . ------------------------------ End of Inayan_Eskrima/FMA-Digest V8 #443 **************************************** To unsubscribe from the eskrima-digest send the command: unsubscribe eskrima-digest -or- unsubscribe eskrima-digest your.old@address in the BODY (top line, left justified) of a "plain text" e-mail addressed to majordomo@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com. Old digest issues are available via ftp://ftp.martialartsresource.com. Copyright 1994-2001: Ray Terry and the Martial Arts Resource Standard disclaimers apply.