From: eskrima-digest-owner@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com To: eskrima-digest@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com Subject: Inayan_Eskrima/FMA-Digest V8 #508 Reply-To: eskrima@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com Errors-To: eskrima-digest-owner@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com Precedence: Inayan_Eskrima/FMA-Digest Wed, 28 Nov 2001 Vol 08 : Num 508 In this issue: eskrima: Metro Manila eskrima: Re: Research on FMA eskrima: Looking for class in Michigan eskrima: Re: Research on FMA eskrima: Why not Arnis? eskrima: thanking one and all... eskrima: . ========================================================================== Eskrima-Digest, serving the Internet since June 1994. 1200 members strong! Copyright 1994-2001: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource The premier internet discussion forum devoted to Filipino Martial Arts. Provided in memory of Mangisursuro Michael G. Inay (1944-2000). http://InayanEskrima.com Replying to this message will NOT unsubscribe you. To unsubscribe, send "unsubscribe eskrima-digest" (no quotes) in the body (top line, left justified) of a "plain text" e-mail addressed to majordomo@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com. To send e-mail to this list use eskrima@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com See the Filipino Martial Arts (FMA) FAQ and the online search engine for back issues of the Eskrima-Digest at http://MartialArtsResource.com Mabuhay ang eskrima! ---------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Ray Terry Date: Wed, 28 Nov 2001 10:31:07 PST Subject: eskrima: Metro Manila Another one for Mr. de Leon... from filipino.com Composed of four cities and 13 municipalities, Metro Manila is home to roughly 20 percent of the country's 62 million Filipinos. The capital, Manila, is situated at the mouth of a natural harbor -- the Manila Bay of world-famous sunsets. Malacanang Palace, the official residence of the Philippine President, stands regally on the banks of the Pasig River, which meanders through the length of the metropolis. Within the city limits are located the medieval walled city of Intramuros, Spain's stronghold in Asia during its Empire era; Escolta and Sta. Cruz, two of the oldest commercial centers in the country; and historic Paco and Luneta Parks. Here, too, can be found enclaves as exotic and enduring as Chinatown, the Muslim quarter of Quiapo, and the noisy bargain mecca that is Divisoria. Along the sunset strip lining Manila Bay, luxury hotels vie for the tourist trade with the poshest accommodations and the best views, while a few blocks away along Ermita's bar-lined streets, more racy pursuits await the night owl. The country's premier business district, Makati, throbs with a different life. Busy sidewalks and avenues lead to hushed office sanctums, sparkling malls, elegant shops, swank galleries and boutiques, and some of the most valuable residential real estates in the country. Evenings, this classy entertainment city pulsates with the thousand and one lights of discos, pubs, bistros, restaurants, music lounges, jazz bars, karaoke bars and 24-hour diners. Where to stay is never a problem in Metro Manila. The visitor can choose from any of the wide range of accommodations to suit every taste and budget-from the most prestigious hotel chains to deluxe motels to cozy pensions and family-run inns. A wealth of diversions and attractions await the visitor. Museum tours offer glimpses of the rich historical and cultural heritage of the islands. At Ayala Museum in Makati, colorful dioramas depict scenes from Philippine history. The Cultural Center of the Philippines Museum showcases archaeological 'and ethnological finds, as well as contemporary artworks. The Metropolitan Museum of Manila mounts exhibits of classical and modern masters. There are also private galleries and specialized museums, like Casa Manila, the model turn-of-the-century Spanish house at Intramuros; the Rizal Shrine in Fort Santiago, the Ecclesiastical Art Collection of the San Agustin Church, and the Museo de Malacanang at the Presidential Palace. Ballet companies, symphony orchestras, theater guilds and pop artists regularly take to the stage. Hotels and restaurants beckon nightly with band music, folk and jazz singers, and ethnic dance troupes. Open-air concerts and performances entertain weekend crowds at Paco Park, Puerta Real Gardens and Luneta Park. Metro Manila has 3 greens, which offer some of the best golfing in Southeast Asia. Affordable rentals and green fees, coupled with the balmy weather and friendly, English-speaking caddies, make for a perfect golfing holiday. ------------------------------ From: "Buz Grover" Date: Wed, 28 Nov 2001 13:13:19 -0500 Subject: eskrima: Re: Research on FMA The quote begins: Hi; > I'm doing research on the various FMA's and I found your address on the > internet when I was searching Eskrima topics. Is there any advice you can > give a beginner in Serrada but who is open to other styles? I would like to > hear your opinions on what I should do training wise, what I should look for > in books/videos and lastly, what kind of gear I should own to train with? > I'm also looking to do a live stick tournament at some point. I would > appreciate any advice on that and what kind of gear I would need to use/own > to do it, especially the WEKAF style. Thanks again for any help that you > can provide and I hope you'll reply and help me out. > Think I got five or six identical inquiries from this gent over the course of several months. Replied to the first one and have been trashing the rest. Are other folks dealing with repeat requests? If so it might be time to ask him to alter his research methods. Regards, Buz Grover ------------------------------ From: Brian Stapleton Date: Wed, 28 Nov 2001 10:17:42 -0800 (PST) Subject: eskrima: Looking for class in Michigan Greetings; I am looking for a good place to take some classes in Southeastern Michigan. I live in Allen Park which is a suburb of Detroit. I used to study under Chuck Gauss, who studied under Professor Presas. Mr. Chuck is an excellent teacher, and is extreemly talented, but I've lost his # since I dropped out of class and the place where we studied is now closed. Does anyone know where I can find a good school in my area? Hopefully Mr. Chuck's school? Thanks for the help. I've been a member of this list for quite some time now, but I have to confess that I've not been keeping up lately. If this is an inappropriate place to ask my question, then please accept my apology. ===== Brian Stapleton BrianStapleton@yahoo.com __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! GeoCities - quick and easy web site hosting, just $8.95/month. http://geocities.yahoo.com/ps/info1 ------------------------------ From: Date: Wed, 28 Nov 2001 12:54:46 -0600 Subject: eskrima: Re: Research on FMA Mr. Killick; I appreciate your PRIVATE reply, but I was HORRIFIED that you also posted it with my name and e-mail address to the Eskrima Digest. Had I wanted to post it there, I can and would do it it myself. If you had paraphrased your reply WITHOUT my name or address, I would be less upset than I am. Like many list subscribers, I don't use my personal contact data in public forums for obvious reasons. BK - ----Original Message Follows---- From: "Richard Killick" CC: Subject: Re: Research on FMA Date: Wed, 28 Nov 2001 14:33:39 -0000 Hi Bill I am only to pleased to help just bare in mind that stick fighting/training in dangerous. I do not know two much about Serrada I did get to train with Mike Inlay once which was great. Want I do with my students who want to stick fight is get them to do the dog brother format. This means beginners wear a fencing mask, groin guard, light street hockey gloves and soft elbow and knee pads. We use a 28 to 32 inch sticks. We start with the lighters ones and move up to the standard Dog Brother sticks you can get from Kombat Instruments . com. The WEKAF helmets are ok for beginners but they are a pain to get off during grappling. People tend to develop bad habits with them as well i.e. like sticking their head out. I some times go with out any gloves, knee and elbow pads but as you can imagine you do get hurt doing this stuff. The up side is your skill level goes through the roof. I do not currently use soft sticks but I am looking in to them as Burton Richardson has some great drills with them. For training get the first set of Dog Brother videos (from dogbrother . com) and follow their guide lines. Videos by Burton Richardson would also be good. My guys and I just work the basics with good foot work and do some of the drills we got from Marc Denny. We hit ties and heavy bags and spar regularly (once a week). If you have excellent basics with good foot work, the rest of the drills are not needed, as long as you are sparing. Some of my students also cross train in other systems as they like to study the "full art" drills and all, rather than just stick fighting. We have taken the last year off of the stick fighting and have been working on our vale tudo stuff. Once you can deal with the sparing, you pick areas to work on that are your strong or weak points like stick grapping etc. The good thing about the dog brothers format is you find your weak areas very quickly, you learn want it takes to knock some one out and its harder for people to BS you (because you KNOW the truth or a truth anyway). From sparing you get correct timing, I say correct timing because I do not think you can get the right sort of timing from just doing the regular drills (I may be wrong here). Last year my group and I worked a lot of the Krabi Karbong basics which meant that we starting dropping people with kicks and flying knees etc. There are some great systems around and they all have something to offer. Do you belong to the escrima digest? It a really great place to pick the brains of some top FMA people. Also check out dogbrother.com If you can try to take part in a DB gathering or at least check the tape. Its a life changing experience. I have spared without a helmet but the chance of losing an eye really is not worth the risk. Just like if you want to get good at grappling you roll with Rickson, find the best stick fighters and spar with them. Top Dog would be a good place to start. Just remember that stick fighting is dangerous and that I can not accept responsibility if you follow my advice and manage to hurt yourself. I am not an expert its just my opinion. All the best. Richard Killick. - ----- Original Message ----- To: Sent: Tuesday, November 27, 2001 7:05 PM Subject: Research on FMA > Hi; > I'm doing research on the various FMA's and I found your address on the > internet when I was searching Eskrima topics. Is there any advice you can > give a beginner in Serrada but who is open to other styles? I would like to > hear your opinions on what I should do training wise, what I should look for > in books/videos and lastly, what kind of gear I should own to train with? > I'm also looking to do a live stick tournament at some point. I would > appreciate any advice on that and what kind of gear I would need to use/own > to do it, especially the WEKAF style. Thanks again for any help that you > can provide and I hope you'll reply and help me out. > _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp ------------------------------ From: "WILLIAM MCGRATH" Date: Wed, 28 Nov 2001 13:41:10 -0500 Subject: eskrima: Why not Arnis? RE: Why is Arnis not more popular in its homeland? Here is an interesting story confirming what our Filipino friends on the digest wrote about the mentality of some in the Philippines regarding anything "home grown" vs. "foreign". Tuhon Gaje gave a demo & training proposal a few years back to a police group in the Philippines. Their response? "We have seen Arnis before. Don't call us, we'll call you." Knowing how some Filipinos think, Tuhon Gaje then sent an American student in to give the very same demo and training proposal a few weeks later to the very same police group. Their response? They thought it was the greatest thing since sliced bread and signed the training contract, despite the demo being a virtual clone of Tuhon Gaje's. During the subsequent training no one seemed to notice that it was Tuhon Gaje who was doing most of the training with the student as an assistant. RE:Why is Arnis not more popular in the U.S.? Excellent post from G.H. on this subject. Tuhon Gaje called the FMA "The graduate school of martial arts" and I think the analogy is fitting in many ways. I remember being in grammar school and the whole class repeating in rote our multiplication tables (very much like a kid's class in a commercial karate school is taught). The few college classes I have taken were much more "messy" and had much more reliance on the student's own initiative. I am told you see this same distinction in army boot camp vs. specialized training for special forces personnel as well. "Okay you pukes, drop and give me 20!" is replaced with "Okay men, give me three possible ways to solve this problem." Now which still picture would look more impressive to a layman? Neat, even rows of soldiers doing push-ups or five guys drawing a diagram in the sand with a stick? Which group however is getting the more advanced training? If you look at the demographics of martial arts students in this country you will see something of a broad based pyramid, with lots of kids at the bottom and a small number of adults at the top. We in the FMAs are really serving a niche market at the top of the martial arts pyramid in our teaching. We may think it best to start with weapons, but the general public does not. A question for you. What percentage of your students are true beginners with no martial arts training prior to walking in your door and what percentage came to you from an "empty hand" art and came to you to get weapons training? I am not saying that kids can't be taught FMA, just that it is a hard sell in today's society. Even if there were no prejudice against weapons training in modern western culture, you would still be hard pressed to earn a living teaching FMA to kids. I believe that the best way to teach concepts as complex as one finds in FMA to a child, is to teach it as it was done in the Philippines, one on one (and even then, preferably with someone the child already looks up to as an authority figure like a father or grandfather). Imagine you taught music to kids. In one class you were given 30 students and told that they would have to perform for their parents together as a class once every three months. How would you teach them? All together in unison, simple things, purely by rote, just like a kid's karate class perhaps? Now in another class you were told that any students here would have to be able to earn a living as a jazz musician when they graduated the class. If you had to have kids rather than adults in this class, would you not limit it to small numbers and a long period of study? I have had classes with large number in them. But these were with adults, the great majority of which were experienced martial artists. My largest classes were during seminars were students came from several different schools to attend. At the end of a seminar I usually have at least one person say to me that Pekiti-Tirsia is the most mentally challenging class they have ever had in the martial arts. While I take that as a compliment, it is not a statement conductive to bringing in large groups of kids on a regular basis to weekly classes. This is why I encourage my students who want to open their own schools to keep their day job and just teach out of a rented space for a few hours a week. If you are teaching quantum physics you are simply not going to have the same number of students walk through your door as does a basic grammar school. Based on numbers, grammar schools are far more "popular" than graduate schools, but what kind of job can you get with nothing but a grammar school education? I think that we have to decide which we would rather have, popularity or excellence. Regards, Tuhon Bill McGrath Visit the PTI web site at: http://www.pekiti-tirsia.com/index.html ------------------------------ From: "Walter Vorhauer" Date: Wed, 28 Nov 2001 13:00:13 -0800 Subject: eskrima: thanking one and all... I just wanted to say thank you to all the individuals who helped clear up my questions concerning the whole situation within the Philipines, and make me more politically savey of the situations that are take place so many miles away. On a side note, I heard it mentioned once before on this digest of a pekiti-tirsia digest group out there that one could subscribe to. Does anyone have the address or know how I can get into contact with someone who does know the e-mail address and how I can get on it? Thanks to all. __________________________________________________ FREE voicemail, email, and fax...all in one place. Sign Up Now! http://www.onebox.com ------------------------------ From: Ray Terry Date: Wed, 28 Nov 2001 17:51:10 PST Subject: eskrima: . ------------------------------ End of Inayan_Eskrima/FMA-Digest V8 #508 **************************************** To unsubscribe from the eskrima-digest send the command: unsubscribe eskrima-digest -or- unsubscribe eskrima-digest your.old@address in the BODY (top line, left justified) of a "plain text" e-mail addressed to majordomo@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com. Old digest issues are available via ftp://ftp.martialartsresource.com. Copyright 1994-2001: Ray Terry and the Martial Arts Resource Standard disclaimers apply. Remember 9-11!