Date: Fri, 8 Feb 2002 17:44:02 -0800 (PST) From: eskrima-request@martialartsresource.net Subject: Eskrima digest, Vol 9 #54 - 7 msgs X-Mailer: Mailman v2.0.8 MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Sender: eskrima-admin@martialartsresource.net Errors-To: eskrima-admin@martialartsresource.net X-BeenThere: eskrima@martialartsresource.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.8 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net X-Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net List-Help: List-Post: X-Subscribed-Address: rterry@idiom.com List-Subscribe: List-Id: Inayan Eskrima / FMA discussion forum, the premier FMA forum on the Internet. List-Unsubscribe: Status: OR Send Eskrima mailing list submissions to eskrima@martialartsresource.net To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/eskrima or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to eskrima-request@martialartsresource.net You can reach the person managing the list at eskrima-admin@martialartsresource.net When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific than "Re: Contents of Eskrima digest..." <<-------------- The Eskrima/FMA mailing list -------------->> Serving the Internet since June 1994. Copyright 1994-2002: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource The Internet's premier discussion forum devoted to Filipino Martial Arts. Provided in memory of Mangisursuro Michael G. Inay (1944-2000). http://InayanEskrima.com See the Filipino Martial Arts (FMA) FAQ and the online search engine for back issues of the Eskrima/FMA list at http://MartialArtsResource.com Mabuhay ang eskrima! Today's Topics: 1. Bakbakan International (Kali Ilustrisimo) (Justo370@aol.com) 2. Ring of Fire 2002 - Las Vegas Nevada (Ray Terry) 3. Modern Arnis Camp (Ray Terry) 4. Bakintawak + Kabaroan Seminar (L. E.) 5. Guru ? (Ray Terry) 6. RE: Guru ? (Mike Casto) 7. RE: Guru ? (Ray Terry) --__--__-- Message: 1 From: Justo370@aol.com Date: Fri, 8 Feb 2002 12:06:30 EST To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net CC: Bakbakan@aol.com Subject: [Eskrima] Bakbakan International (Kali Ilustrisimo) Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net March 2002 will bring about several events sponsored by Bakbakan International. March 2nd - Bakbakan Kali (Ilustrisimo) Workshop in Central New Jersey. March 9th - The Complete Sinawali seminar conducted by Author and Chief Instructor, Master Reynaldo S. Galang. March 16th - Masters of the Blade FMA Tournament. Our annual tournament continues to serve as a venue for building brotherhood and camaraderie within the FMA community. March 23rd - Certification Program begins for each of the major aspects of Bakbakan Kali (Ilustrisimo). Topics include Sinawali, Solo Baston, Tulisan (The Knife Fighting Art of Kali Ilustrisimo), Espada Y Daga and Short Staff / Long Sword Techniques. **NOTE: This is not an instructorship course. There are 9 attainable levels of certification. You will be evaluated and receive certification based on your proficiency and comprehension of the material covered in the chosen area of study.** Visit www.bakbakan.com for complete details on these events. --__--__-- Message: 2 From: Ray Terry To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net, the_dojang@martialartsresource.net, policedo@martialartsresource.net Date: Fri, 08 Feb 2002 10:59:59 PST Subject: [Eskrima] Ring of Fire 2002 - Las Vegas Nevada Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Forwarding from Pak Vic's Serak list. Forwarded message: Selamat All: The Ring of Fire in las Vegas Nevada is comming up June 29 and 30, 2002 Cutoff date for early registration is June 1, 2002 No exceptions Two full days early registrtion before June 1, 2002 = $225 After June 1 or at the door of the event it will be = 275 One day early registration is $150 After June 1 or at the door of the event it ill be = $200 The event room will only hold 50 participants safely Please register early, the VDT Academy has Grown in Members, so I hate to turn away VDT Members when the event is sold out. And if you are registered, the full two days would be more of a value. Instructors: Guru Dan Inosnto, Guru Bob Vanata, Pak Vic Guest Instructors are: Guru Plinck, Guru Andre, Sifu Janet Gee It will be all in one big room, so all will have the Instructor who is teaching. At present I am making arrangements for the rooms in Blocks The rooms are $45 per nite. So if any of you like to have that price structure Please register early when you get the application to register. Also this time, reserve your Video Order ealy for the Event of the Ring of Fire. The lat time Pointman production fall short to produce the Video for the first one we had in 2000. No Video Taping allowed Picture taking only on Sunday after the event schedule Please send your address to: VDTacademy@aol.com so I can send you the registration form for the ring of Fire. Hormat Pak Vic --__--__-- Message: 3 From: Ray Terry To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net, policedo@martialartsresource.net, the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Date: Fri, 08 Feb 2002 11:33:43 PST Subject: [Eskrima] Modern Arnis Camp Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Attachment deleted, check out website... Forwarded message: Greetings, Attached is a copy of camp flyer for May. For more information go to our website www.wmarnis.com/camp. More updates will be posted on the site as they come. Respectfully yours, Datu Tim Hartman Remy A. Presas' Modern Arnis --__--__-- Message: 4 From: "L. E." To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Date: Fri, 08 Feb 2002 21:10:28 Subject: [Eskrima] Bakintawak + Kabaroan Seminar Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Greetings Friends: On Sunday March 17, the Inosanto Academy of Martial Arts proudly presents a seminar featuring both: GM Ising Attilo of the Balintawak & GM Ramiro U. Estalillia of the Kabaroan Systems of Eskrima - Arnis. This seminar will provide a rare opportunity to train & meet with the pioneers of two unique & diverse teaching facets of the spectrum that we call the Filipino Martial Arts. Cost: $95.00 Time: 9:00 am Location: Inosanto Academy of Martial Arts 7298 West Manchester Ave. Suite #B Los Angeles, CA 90045 (310) 348-9944 email: bbiama@aol.com Best regards to all, maraming salamat, Lino Espejo _________________________________________________________________ Send and receive Hotmail on your mobile device: http://mobile.msn.com --__--__-- Message: 5 From: Ray Terry To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Date: Fri, 08 Feb 2002 16:49:44 PST Subject: [Eskrima] Guru ? Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Just for fun... Recall how we've gone round-n-round over the use of the title Master? Here is how some on the 'other side' feel about the use of the title Guro/Guru. Provided only in hopes of enlightenment. :) Ray Forwarded message: Subject: the title "guru"-meant to be provocative I noticed that in one of the announcements, several well-known martial arts teachers had given themselves the title "guru". Now I have a lot of respect for martial arts teachers, I have known many and almost all have been good people. I also know that technically guru means teacher. But still, I object to the use of this title. The word has a wider meaning and inplications in Indian culture and in our own culture. Guru for me implies a deeply spiritual and scholarly person who has devoted him or herself to God and to enlightenment. Despite their devotion to their art, I do not put most martial arts teachers in the same category. Do you really think that a martial artist who will preside over "the Ring of Fire" in Las Vegas is properly referred to as "Guru" ? Martial artist who practice martial arts as a spiritual discipline are a minority and even among this minority the title "Guru" would be misplaced. To me, this sounds more like the hype of spirituality that Bruce Lee was so critical of. As great a martial artist as he is, is Dan Inosantos really a "Guru"? I think that throwing these terms around so carelessly threatens to make them meaningless. I know I will get some angry rebuttals to this, but I though I would throw it into the mix and see what happens. --__--__-- Message: 6 Date: Fri, 08 Feb 2002 18:30:02 -0600 From: Mike Casto Subject: RE: [Eskrima] Guru ? To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net I think this guy is taking the term out of context. In Indonesia, the term is used for "teacher" or "instructor" and is synonymous to "sifu", "sensei", "kru" etc. The fact that in Hinduism the word has more spiritual connotation is somewhat irrelevant given that the subject at hand is Indonesian martial arts, not Hinduism. The word "guru" has many connotations in English. There are those who use the Hindu meaning with spiritual connotations. There are "computer gurus" who are wizkids on computers but not spiritual or instructors. Per Webster's Dictionary: 1 in Hinduism, one's personal spiritual advisor or teacher 2 any leader highly regarded by a group of followers: sometimes used derisively So ... even in English the term is applicable (in definition 2) to a highly regarded martial arts instructor. Mike -----Original Message----- From: eskrima-admin@martialartsresource.net [mailto:eskrima-admin@martialartsresource.net]On Behalf Of Ray Terry Sent: Friday, February 08, 2002 6:50 PM To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Subject: [Eskrima] Guru ? Just for fun... Recall how we've gone round-n-round over the use of the title Master? Here is how some on the 'other side' feel about the use of the title Guro/Guru. Provided only in hopes of enlightenment. :) Ray Forwarded message: Subject: the title "guru"-meant to be provocative I noticed that in one of the announcements, several well-known martial arts teachers had given themselves the title "guru". Now I have a lot of respect for martial arts teachers, I have known many and almost all have been good people. I also know that technically guru means teacher. But still, I object to the use of this title. The word has a wider meaning and inplications in Indian culture and in our own culture. Guru for me implies a deeply spiritual and scholarly person who has devoted him or herself to God and to enlightenment. Despite their devotion to their art, I do not put most martial arts teachers in the same category. Do you really think that a martial artist who will preside over "the Ring of Fire" in Las Vegas is properly referred to as "Guru" ? Martial artist who practice martial arts as a spiritual discipline are a minority and even among this minority the title "Guru" would be misplaced. To me, this sounds more like the hype of spirituality that Bruce Lee was so critical of. As great a martial artist as he is, is Dan Inosantos really a "Guru"? I think that throwing these terms around so carelessly threatens to make them meaningless. I know I will get some angry rebuttals to this, but I though I would throw it into the mix and see what happens. _______________________________________________ Eskrima mailing list Eskrima@martialartsresource.net http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/eskrima --__--__-- Message: 7 From: Ray Terry Subject: RE: [Eskrima] Guru ? To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Date: Fri, 08 Feb 2002 18:18:18 PST Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net > I think this guy is taking the term out of context. Agreed. My point is only that those that feel Master is inappropriate may feel that Guro is ok. While those that feel Guro in inappropriate may feel that Master is ok. Actually, either term is appropriate and reasonable. Ray Terry raymail@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com --__--__-- _______________________________________________ Eskrima mailing list Eskrima@martialartsresource.net http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/eskrima Old digest issues are available via ftp://ftp.martialartsresource.com. Copyright 1994-2002: Ray Terry and the Martial Arts Resource Standard disclaimers apply. Remember 9-11! End of Eskrima Digest