Date: Fri, 10 Jan 2003 08:53:02 -0800 From: eskrima-request@martialartsresource.net Subject: Eskrima digest, Vol 10 #12 - 8 msgs X-Mailer: Mailman v2.0.13.cisto1 MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Errors-To: eskrima-admin@martialartsresource.net X-BeenThere: eskrima@martialartsresource.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13.cisto1 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net X-Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net X-Subscribed-Address: fma@martialartsresource.com List-Id: Eskrima-FMA discussion forum, the premier FMA forum on the Internet. List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Unsubscribe: , List-Help: Status: O X-Status: X-Keywords: Send Eskrima mailing list submissions to eskrima@martialartsresource.net To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/eskrima or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to eskrima-request@martialartsresource.net You can reach the person managing the list at eskrima-admin@martialartsresource.net When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific than "Re: Contents of Eskrima digest..." <<---- The Sudlud-Inayan/Eskrima/Kali/Arnis/FMA mailing list ---->> Serving the Internet since June 1994. Copyright 1994-2003: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource The Internet's premier discussion forum devoted to Filipino Martial Arts. Provided in memory of Mangisursuro Michael G. Inay (1944-2000). http://SudludEskrima.com http://InayanEskrima.com/index.cfm See the Filipino Martial Arts (FMA) FAQ and the online search engine for back issues of the Eskrima/FMA list at http://MartialArtsResource.com Mabuhay ang eskrima! Today's Topics: 1. Export Ban on Kamagong (Peter Gow) 2. [No Subject] (Q) 3. Silat seminar in Cleveland (Andrew R Breton) 4. Re: Christianity (Jeremy Bays) 5. RE: Cause of Death (Stovall, Craig) 6. Re: FMA and Christianity (Patrick Davies) 7. Gotch, Crushing (Khalkee@netscape.net) 8. Cebu City tourny rescheduled (Ray Terry) --__--__-- Message: 1 From: "Peter Gow" To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Date: Fri, 10 Jan 2003 02:50:58 +0000 Subject: [Eskrima] Export Ban on Kamagong Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net To All who may be reading this. Firstly I do agree that banning of a species indicates that that particular species may be endangered. But with due respect I do not agree that the ban was caused by "Decadent Westerners wanting to be stick warriors"- really, how many sticks would be required to endanger a tree species? Perhaps we should slow down to 90 on this one before we offend a lot of people. Kamagong is used by all types of humans for a variety of purposes and "decadent westerners are not in charge of export quotas". You may fiind that the World Bank may sometimes ask a developing country to pay off some of the debt that it owes to the World Bank by using some natural resources as a form of payment. Train Hard, Yours in Arnis Peter Gow ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Help STOP SPAM: Try the new MSN 8 and get 2 months FREE* --__--__-- Message: 2 Date: Thu, 09 Jan 2003 22:10:32 -0800 From: "Q" To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Subject: [Eskrima] [No Subject] Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net > Thanks for the reply. Have you directly > trained under Gotch, or with one of > his students? If so, that's a great thing > because from what I understand > there's not many in the States that have seen a > lot of his material other > than through it's integration into Sayama's > Shooto. Great info! I have been exposed to it via his students. It is the worst grappling I ever felt. It is like a boa constrictor...the more you struggle the tighter things get. Sayama trained under gotch too I'm 90% sure of that. What other influence Sayama put into it to make it Shoot I do not know. Yuri Nakamura is the local Shoot king in So Cal.. He has trained several good fighters but I personally have never seen him fight or even spar. I'm not around yuri much never seen him teach and never had a class with him though in the past we have traveled the Inosanto Academy loop. He is still there training and teaching . On occasion I have seen him put on a move or two seeing glimmers of Gotch type maneuvers. I would love to see him put on the gloves to see his body mechanics or feel his technique. The few people he has trained that I have experienced did not feel or emphasize the tightness of the Gotch method but got the moves anyway. Perhaps they were being nice to me. Every Gotch move stole your breath and ground you into submission even before you have a chance to scream as your joint is getting ripped. It really is an experience you just have to try to appreciate. The history of Gotch, pro wrestling, carnaval wrestling, catch, shooting and hooking is a murky debate I find really interesting. Have you done any of this stuff Craig? Regards, C.H. Fung, D.D.S. Torrance, Ca. --__--__-- Message: 3 To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Cc: jason_h_ashby@yahoo.com Date: Thu, 9 Jan 2003 21:03:21 -0600 From: Andrew R Breton Subject: [Eskrima] Silat seminar in Cleveland Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net To anyone in the Cleveland area, I would recommend this seminar. Kelly is my silat instructor. He's a jagabaya (forgive the spelling) in Manda Muda and one of the few practitioners in Menankabau Harimau in the U.S. Kelly is the blond guy in the Paladin Press video on Harimau. Great workout, lots of fun, lots of information. Andy --------- Forwarded message ---------- From: "jason_h_ashby " This is an invitation to a martial arts seminar in Cleveland, Ohio, on January 18 and 19. The instructor is Kelly Smith, an instructor from Dallas, Texas. He teaches two styles of indonesian silat; mande muda, and meningkabau harimau. If you are interested, please email me at jason_h_ashby@yahoo.com The cost is $75 for both days, and group discounts are available. All are welcome! Happy new year! Jason Get 20mb of FreeEZ webspace that is FreeEZ to remember like http://myname.FreeEZ.Com. We have many more FreeEZ URL selections coming soon to choose from... check it out and click to http://FreeEZ.Com or you may visit our new website http://FilipinoMartialArts.FreeEZ.Com where you too can get a FreeEZ web base E-Mail Box like GuroOmiklD@FilipinoMartialArts.FreeEZ.Com ================================================== Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ --__--__-- Message: 4 From: "Jeremy Bays" To: Date: Fri, 10 Jan 2003 08:13:25 -0500 Subject: [Eskrima] Re: Christianity Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net I am an ordained minister in the Church of the Nazarene as well as a practicing martial artist. I see no problem with the two disiplines provided they are both viewed in the proper way. In his book "Martial Arts America" Bob Orlando said, "A warrior may choose pacifism, while all else is doom to it." I am charged with defending myself and the people around me. It is a service that I can provide. At the same time I am charged with protecting the one that attacks me. C.S. Lewis wrote : "Does anyone suppose that our Lord's hearers understood him to mean that if a homicidal maniac, attempting to murder a third party, tried to knock me out of the way, I must stand aside and let him get his victim? I think it impossible that they could have so understood him. I believe the meaning of the words was perfectly clear -- insofar as you are simply an angry man who has been hurt, mortify your anger and do not strike back. If, however, your motives are other than egoistic retaliation, then not only are you free to protect yourself and others; rather, it is your responsibility to do so" Jeremy Bays --__--__-- Message: 5 From: "Stovall, Craig" To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Date: Fri, 10 Jan 2003 08:19:17 -0600 Subject: [Eskrima] RE: Cause of Death Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net The news of Grandmaster Lema, and the question as to the cause of his death reminded me of something else. I never heard the cause of Edgar Sulite's passing. I'm not sure how old he was, but it sure seems like he went well before his time. Can someone explain the circumstances of his death? I apologize for the morbid question, but at the time his passing came as somewhat of a surprise to me and I never heard any of the details. --__--__-- Message: 6 From: Patrick Davies To: 'eskrima digest' Date: Fri, 10 Jan 2003 14:21:51 -0000 Subject: [Eskrima] Re: FMA and Christianity Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net While initially avoiding the subject in case I started another tirade ; ) I noticed this mail. From: "Ryan Meyering" : Actually, as a Christian, FMA is one of the few martial arts I'd consider doing, because it seems to me that it is more of a practical art. A lot of martial arts involve spiritualism that I feel would compromise my faith; all I'm interested in is a practical fighting system. The other year I had a guy in training. At the end he came over and asked what the respects were we gave at the beinning of the class. Those involved with the 'Inosanto Blend' La Coste respects would see a close similarity and I explained the relevence. Having trusted my intincts I sought of saw something coming earlier on and the student went on to denounce the respects as being pagen and offensive. I replied it was actually open to accommodate each persons belief structure as the respect refers to the 'creator' and that can be determined by each and everyone of us according to our way of seeing or prejudice. He actually became quite hostile which, when I questioned his motives, saw him rant a bit before leaving the room never to be seen again, by me anyway. Now im not going to say that this youngs man journey is wrong, he was just going through a process of discovery which at times can see us put ourselves in conflict with people. I certainly wouldn't chastise christianity with his behaviour. We have all at some time tried to force the world into our beliefs which only leads to conflict. I have called myself a pacifist over the years and yet I daily train in the martial arts. I see violence as a state of mind. The intent is what matters. While some argue on the exact meanings of words, which let us not forget have gone through several translations over a long operiod of time, the meaning of words can change. Look at the word 'gay' to see its social connotations throughout the last century. Look at the arguments over words like Kali for example, or the different meaning of the word punyo in different areas of the Ph. Social meanings of why to turn the cheek, as Kru Tippie pointed out, are lost nowadays. Where he asked why they wouldn't use the left hand, there are cultures today who won't eat with the left as they use that to clean themselves after toilet exercises. So in some cultures you see thieves have their right hand cut off as a punishment. The world is bigger than our back yard and each culture has its own ways of dealing with issues and as martial artists dealing with arts from different environments we can surely appreciate that. I just wish that some of our politicians would learn these lessons and maybe there would be more peace in the world. But the practice of martial skills isnt evil, it's the intent with which you use them, in my humble opinion. pat --__--__-- Message: 7 Date: Fri, 10 Jan 2003 10:05:33 -0500 From: Khalkee@netscape.net To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Subject: [Eskrima] Gotch, Crushing Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Sounds just like Shuai Chiao ... but the "follow to the ground" part is, in my limited experience, not to get down there with the fallen but to "finish" ... e.g., falling knee to torso. I've seen this done as a smooth bisset-like flat throw with the master instructor landing with the knee just after the opponent hit the mat. These guys wear a trauma plate while doing this stuff. __________________________________________________________________ The NEW Netscape 7.0 browser is now available. Upgrade now! http://channels.netscape.com/ns/browsers/download.jsp Get your own FREE, personal Netscape Mail account today at http://webmail.netscape.com/ --__--__-- Message: 8 From: Ray Terry To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net (Eskrima) Date: Fri, 10 Jan 2003 08:44:39 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Eskrima] Cebu City tourny rescheduled Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net The Second Doce Pares Federation World Eskrima Championship orginally scheduled for April 25 in Cebu City has been postponed. The tentative date is now mid-August. Ray Terry rterry@idiom.com --__--__-- _______________________________________________ Eskrima mailing list Eskrima@martialartsresource.net http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/eskrima http://eskrima-fma.net Old digest issues are available via ftp://ftp.martialartsresource.com. Copyright 1994-2003: Ray Terry, www.MartialArtsResource.com, www.Sudlud.com Standard disclaimers apply. Remember 9-11! End of Eskrima Digest