Date: Tue, 21 Jan 2003 18:52:02 -0800 From: eskrima-request@martialartsresource.net Subject: Eskrima digest, Vol 10 #25 - 8 msgs X-Mailer: Mailman v2.0.13.cisto1 MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Errors-To: eskrima-admin@martialartsresource.net X-BeenThere: eskrima@martialartsresource.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13.cisto1 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net X-Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net X-Subscribed-Address: fma@martialartsresource.com List-Id: Eskrima-FMA discussion forum, the premier FMA forum on the Internet. List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Unsubscribe: , List-Help: Status: O X-Status: X-Keywords: Send Eskrima mailing list submissions to eskrima@martialartsresource.net To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/eskrima or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to eskrima-request@martialartsresource.net You can reach the person managing the list at eskrima-admin@martialartsresource.net When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific than "Re: Contents of Eskrima digest..." <<---- The Sudlud-Inayan/Eskrima/Kali/Arnis/FMA mailing list ---->> Serving the Internet since June 1994. Copyright 1994-2003: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource The Internet's premier discussion forum devoted to Filipino Martial Arts. Provided in memory of Mangisursuro Michael G. Inay (1944-2000). http://SudludEskrima.com http://InayanEskrima.com/index.cfm See the Filipino Martial Arts (FMA) FAQ and the online search engine for back issues of the Eskrima/FMA list at http://MartialArtsResource.com Mabuhay ang eskrima! Today's Topics: 1. Re: Survey - Modern Arnis Blasphemy? (natushka) 2. Re: Traumatizing kids (Ray Terry) 3. Re: Survey - Modern Arnis Blasphemy? (Ray Terry) 4. Re: Any Advice Anyone? (Ray Terry) 5. Re: trip to Hawaii (Chad Getz) 6. Fatal Alliance - 3 of 4 (Ray Terry) 7. Re: Traumatizing kids (Ben Fajardo) 8. Re: Survey - Modern Arnis Blasphemy? (Ben Fajardo) --__--__-- Message: 1 Date: Tue, 21 Jan 2003 19:04:43 -0500 From: "natushka" To: Subject: Re: [Eskrima] Survey - Modern Arnis Blasphemy? Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net If human beings refused to step outside of their social norm in fear of what others might think or if they might be wrong. Then our civilization would never have seen any advancements in medicine, science,literature and even art. In the center of a washing machine is a device that is called an agitator. Without an agitator things would not get as clean as we want the first time. we would have to send them through many times hoping that the next time the outcome would be what we want. Agitation in a community may not be comfortable nor may it always effect an outcome that everyone agrees with, but without it we become stagnant and may not see the future. BUHAWI Dong Meyong Pangamot systems may it --__--__-- Message: 2 From: Ray Terry Subject: Re: [Eskrima] Traumatizing kids To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Date: Tue, 21 Jan 2003 14:04:34 -0800 (PST) Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net > on quick. Well we were doing Abcedario the other day and she cracked me a > good one, split the side of my melon good, probably should have gotten > stitches. Now she is terrified of training, my thought is to make her jump > right back into it. I told her it was my fault and all, but still, even as > smart as she is you are still dealing with a child. > > Any suggestions. Turn the other cheek and let her clock you on taother side... :) Ray Terry rterry@idiom.com --__--__-- Message: 3 From: Ray Terry Subject: Re: [Eskrima] Survey - Modern Arnis Blasphemy? To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Date: Tue, 21 Jan 2003 16:38:46 -0800 (PST) Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Well, I must admit that without knowing the complete story I wondered (to myself) why the use of "Modern Arnis". But now that you explain the whole situation, I say go-for-it! Seems reasonable to me. Ray Terry rterry@idiom.com --__--__-- Message: 4 From: Ray Terry Subject: Re: [Eskrima] Any Advice Anyone? To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Date: Tue, 21 Jan 2003 16:43:52 -0800 (PST) Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net > suggestion on what to do there. More specifically, I will be staying in OAHU. > It doesn't have to be martial arts related but if there is anything that > someone can suggest it would be greatly appreciated. Check out Chad and/or Andy and/or Randy (Derobio) for Eskrima stuff. Pearl Harbor and the Arizona Memorial is a must. The Bishop Museum is great. The Battleship Missouri, where the WWII surrender was signed is right near the Arizona. Rent a car or motorcycle and tour around the island. Ray Terry rterry@idiom.com --__--__-- Message: 5 Date: Tue, 21 Jan 2003 17:13:25 -0800 (PST) From: Chad Getz To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Subject: [Eskrima] Re: trip to Hawaii Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net >From: "Jason" >Subject: [Eskrima] Any Advice Anyone? >Greetings all, >I am planning a trip to Hawaii next month and was wondering if anyone >had suggestion on what to do there. More specifically, I will be staying in >OAHU. It doesn't have to be martial arts related but if there is anything >that someone can suggest it would be greatly appreciated. You can respond >privately >jason@pyrczak.com or on the forum. Thank you for your time. > > >Jason :) Hey Jason, Burt Richardson is here in Oahu, info is on his web site, he has a good MA school with some nice application stuff. Gracie Academy here in Oahu, lots of guys to train with there. Mostly gi though. Grappling Unlimited has some top notch fighters that make me play drums. I always love to work out with some of those guys. There is also these bunch of guys that train at a park on Sunday afternoons. You can try stickfighting there. Likes to train sticks, knife, double, long, boxing, clinching, stickgrappling, grappling, realistically. E-mail me if interested at stickshi@yahoo.com . I can also point you in a few directions as well. --------------------------------- Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now --__--__-- Message: 6 From: Ray Terry To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net (Eskrima) Date: Tue, 21 Jan 2003 13:56:06 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Eskrima] Fatal Alliance - 3 of 4 Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Fatal Alliance - Part 3 of 4 Magellan began the ceremony with a long, ponderous sermon in which pointed out the many advantages Christianity would bring to Humabon's people. With Enrique interpreting, he told Humabon that he should thank God for inspiring him to become a Christian, for now he would more easily vanquish his enemies. Humabon replied that, while he wanted very much to become a Christian, some of his chiefs would not obey him, for they considered themselves to be his equals. Magellan replied that any chief who refused to obey Humabon would be killed and his possessions confiscated. Soon he would be going to Spain, but he would return with my ships and men. Then, if Humabon proved himself a loyal Christian, would be made ruler of the entire archipelago. Although one might wish for stronger evidence, Pigafetta's account of these events hints at the strategy evolving in Magellan's mind for asserting and maintaining control over his discoveries. As there was no evidence that the Portuguese had reached these islands, for discovery and alliances with local rulers, especially if they could be persuaded to accept Christianity, would provide a solid basis for claiming Spanish sovereignty. In the several weeks since he had arrived, Magellan had observed that the islands were occupied by diverse peoples ruled by independent rajahs. Because he would need to return to Spain for reinforcements, he would require a reliable native ally to provide a foothold from which-with the new fleet he would bring from Spain-he could gain control of the entire archipelago. With its rajah about to become a Christian, Cebu, the center of an extensive trade network extending all the way to Siam on the Asian mainland, was well suited for just such a foothold. The artillery salutes and elaborate religious ceremonies were not just manifestations of puffery by a self-annointed religious fanatic; they were calculated to overawe and intimidate the numerous, independent, potentially rebellious people of these islands. On the baptismal platform, Magellan was resplendent in his robe of dazzling white, the intense black of his full beard standing out in stark contrast. He looked on as the fleet chaplain, Pedro de Valderrama, baptized Humabon, his heir apparent, and principal retainers and allies, including Colambu. All were given Christian names: Don Carlos (after Charles V) Humabon, Don Fernando (after Charles's brother) for the heir apparant, Don Juan for Colambu, and Cristobal for the Moslem trader from Siam, who diplomatically forsook the crescent for the cross. Later that day, the chaplain baptized Humabon's wife and forty other prominent women. The ranee was given the Christian name Dona Juana, in honor of the emperor's royal mother. Humabon's daughter was christened Dona Catalina, and Colambu's wife received the name Dona Isabel. After Dona Juana was christened, Magellan presented her with a wooden image of the Holy Mother holding the infant Jesus. Thirty-four years after the deaths of Magellan and most of his principal officers, a little wooden image of the Christ child, apparently of Flemish workmanship, was discovered by Juan Zamus, a sailor in the expedition of Miguel Lopez Legazpi, the first to reach Cebu after Magellan. Found in a house whose occupants had fled when the Spaniards bombarded the city, the wooden image was recognized by the expedition's navigator-priest, Andres de Urdaneta, who built a chapel for it. The icon has been preserved in the Augustinian church in Cebu City, where it is venerated as a sacred relic. By the end of that memorable Sunday, 800 men, women, and children had been baptized, and the fervor would continue for eight days until nearly everyone on Cebu, and some from neighboring islands, had followed Humabon's example. All told, some 2,200 conversions resulted from Magellan's inspired preaching. A fortuitous incident in which the captain general, filled with hubris, tried his hand at spiritual healing, probably did much to stimulate these wholesale conversions. The older brother of Humabon's heir apparent, ill and near death, had been too weak to present himself for baptism. On looking into the matter, Magellan discovered that the women attending the sick man, in a desperate attempt to cure their dying patient, had been making offerings to their customary idols. Scolding them for their pagan ways, Magellan promised that if they would burn their idols, and the patient would agree to be baptized, the power of Jesus Christ would cure him. Told that the patient had consented, Magellan led a solemn procession to the house of the sick man who, according to Pigafetta, "... could neither speak nor move." After the patient, his wife, and ten daughters had been baptized, Magellan asked him how he felt. The man responded immediately, saying that he felt fine. Magellan then gave him some almond milk to drink, and sent to his house a mattress, sheets, coverlet, and a pillow. Each day the patient was given almond milk, oil and water of roses, and some of Magellan's quince preserves. In less than five days, the man was walking. Perhaps the miraculous cure had something to do with the quince preserves that had kept Magellan and the members of his mess healthy during the Pacific crossing, perhaps it was the psychological impact of the intense, powerful stranger, or perhaps the power of faith was indeed at work. In the Philippines, faith healing, given a spectacular start by Magellan, is still widely practiced. While the captain general was preoccupied with religious matters, the sailors and some of the officers were up to their usual tricks with the local women. Cebu was proving to be an even better liberty port than Rio. Pigafetta remarked that "... [the men of Cebu] have as many wives as they wish, but one of them is the principal wife. Whenever any of our men went ashore, both by day and by night, everyone invited them to eat and drink ... [and] the women loved us very much more than their own men. All of the women from the age of six years upward have their vaginas gradually opened because of the men's penises." This outrageous treatment of female children was designed to prepare them to endure the barbarous custom of palang, which persists to this day in remote parts of the Philippines and Borneo. Pigafetta described the practice as follows: The males, large and small, have their penis pierced from one side the other near the head, with a gold or tin bolt the thickness of a goose quill. In both ends of the same bolt, some have what resembles a spur with points on the ends; others like the head of a can nail. I very often asked many, both old and young, to see their penis, because I could not credit it. In the middle of the bolt is a hole, through which they urinate. The bolt and spurs always hold firm. He then went on to describe what must have been, for the women, the painful process of accepting, during intercourse; what has been aptly described as this "load of phallic hardware" It is easy to understand why the women of Cebu preferred Magellan's sailors to their husbands and usual overs, and Magellan's men were more than willing to oblige them. Among the fleet's officers eager to come to the aid of the long-suffering women of Cebu was Duarte Barbosa, captain of the Victoria. At Rio, similar behavior by Barbosa, an otherwise reliable officer, had incensed the puritanical captian general. Enraptured by his success with faith healing, and engrossed with winning converts to the cross, Magellan at first paid little heed to his men's debaucheries. While he and the chaplain were busy baptizing and preaching Christian values, the ships' crews demonstrated a wanton disregard for the doctrines of sexual restraint and the sanctity of marriage. The frequent, indiscriminate coupling with native women by Magellan's randy sailors outraged the men of Cebu, who particularly resented it when their vives and daughters were involved. Learning that Barbosa had left his ship for a love nest ashore, Magellan was furious. He removed Barbosa from command of the Victoria, replacing him with Cristovao Rebelo. Like Barosa, Revelo had sailed from Spain as a supernumerary on the Trinidad. During the voyage, he had impressed Magellan with his strong character, performing ably when sent ashore as the first of Magellan's ambassadors to Rajah Humabon. A Portuguese, Rebelo was a native of Poro, and though his relationship to Magellan is obscure, Rebelo is thought by at least one authority to have been his natural son. On the day of his baptism, Humabon told Magellan that several independent local chiefs would not submit to his authority. Determined to make Humabon the undisputed ruler of these islands, Magellan sent messages to the independent chieftains ordering them to acknowledge Humabon's authority. If they failed to do so, he warned, they would suffer death and the confiscation of their property. Several village chiefs flatly refused. Magellan sent a small force of sailors and marines in two ship's boats to punish one of the recalcitrant chiefs, burning his village, a town named Bulaya, and returning with a haul of confiscated livestock. Magellan then ordered the other defiant chiefs to deliver to Humabon a symbolic tribute consisting of a goat, a pig, a basket of rice, and a jug of honey. Should they fail to comply, their villages would suffer the same fate as Bulaya. Two of them delivered the tribute, but Lapulapu, a chieftain on Mactan Island, refused, sending word that if the Spaniards came to burn his village, he would be waiting for them. Unwilling to tolerate the defiance of a petty chieftain, Magellan proposed to attack Lapulapu's village. Like Napoleon as he was about to invade Russia, and Robert E. Lee before Gettysburg, Magellan was dazzled by his earlier success. Feeling invulnerable, he boasted to Humabon that he would need only sixty men and would personally lead the attack. Humahon opposed the idea, as did Juan Serrano, Magellan's senior and most experienced captain, who told him that such a campaign would be foolhardy. The ships were in poor condition and too lightly manned to spare the sixty men. However, knowing that Magellan was not easily dissuaded once his mind was made up, Serrano added that if the captain general thought it necessary to attack the village, he should not go himself, but send someone in his place. This was sound advice, and Magellan would have been wise to heed it. While the instructions King Charles had given him did not specifically forbid him to go ashore in areas controlled by hostile populations, he was well aware of the disastrous consequences for the Solis expedition when, in the La Plata Estuary in 1516, its leader imprudently left his flagship to go ashore and was killed by Querandi. Magellan chose to ignore this lesson, Humabon's cautious advice, and the simple logic of his oldest, wisest captain. His confidence in the superiority of Spanish arms and the protection of the Holy Virgin made him certain he could intimidate and easily defeat the primitively armed defenders of a small village. Perhaps too, he was swayed by his knowledge of the military adventure in the Moluccas that secured an exalted status on the island of Ternate for his friend Serrao. At midnight on April 26-27, 1521, Magellan set forth from Cebu for Laulapu's village with sixty well-armed volunteers in three shallops on which were mounted light, portable swivel guns. In addition to swords and lances, the men carried harquebuses and crossbows. Although they wore armor, for ease in getting in and out of the boats they dispensed with their reaves (leg armor). Lapulapu's village was shielded by a fringe of mangroves on the shore of a little bay at the northeastern end of Mactan Island, about nine nautical miles from Cebu City. Knowing Lapulapu for a formidable opponent, Hunabon heartily disapproved of Magellan's plan. Nevertheless, as he didn't vant his new ally to come to grief, he assembled a force of 1,000 warriors in thirty war canoes to back up the small Spanish assault force. The attackers proceeded northeastward through the channel between Cebu and Mactan, and after rounding Bantolinao Point, entered the shallow bay fronting the village before dawn. Magellan intended to land his men quietly for a surprise attack, but he had been listening to divine voices instead of doing his homework. Uncharacteristically for one usually so painstakingly thorough, he had neglected to consider the tide. It was low, and a partially exposed reef extended 1,000 yards seaward of the beach. The shallops were unable to get close enough inshore to land their men or even to provide covering fire from their swivel guns. Undeterred, Magellan was determined to wade ashore with his men under cover of darkness and burn the village. Humabon warned him to wait until daylight, because he knew the village would be surrounded by trenches with sharp bamboo stakes set to impale unwary night attackers. He urged Magellan to let him attack first with his 1,000 men, for he was familiar with Lapulapu's fortifications. Magellan's men could be held in reserve, ready to enter the fray when and where needed. Such tactical support, Humabon argued, would provide a tremenous morale boost for his warriors, and the attack would surely succeed. Magellan was indignant. The whole object of this attack was to demonstrate the invincibility of Spanish arms. Not only did he reject Humabon's suggestion, he gave him express orders to keep his men in their canoes, offshore and out of the battle. From there they would see how Castilians fought. At first light the shallops moved as close inshore as they could without grounding. Leaving the boat crews and swivel gunners with the shallops, Magellan leapt into the shallow water, closely followed by forty-eight fighting men, and waded ashore, setting a precedent for General MacArthur's landing on nearby Leyte over 400 years later. Unlike MacArthur, however, he had no cameramen along to record the event for posterity. Magellan and his men had to wade "two crossbow flights" (about 2,000 feet) before reaching the beach. Accounts of the ensuing battle vary somewhat. Pigafetta, who fought alongside Magellan, gave the most dramatic version, but his story was written several years after the event with the object of titillating audiences in the courts of the crowned heads of Europe. Like Rustichello's rendering of Marco Polo's story, Pigafetta's account needs a grain of salt. In its essentials it probably is mostly true, but some details were very likely colored to make the story better for telling. --__--__-- Message: 7 Date: Tue, 21 Jan 2003 18:19:49 -0800 (PST) From: Ben Fajardo Subject: Re: [Eskrima] Traumatizing kids To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net ---The fear of getting hit and the fear of hitting someone is part of the phycological training of weapons. In a life or death situation it vital! but in training its a lesson learned in red (blood)not death. Learn from it but don't freeze from it! In my experience its important to keep going. I have been stab twice, in two different situations mostly two on one! and had my finger almost cut off which I fixed myself with duct tape later, but still fought to save my life. Than After months in the hospital from my last knife experience. I am still training and working with the knifes and sticks. I'm not a Rambo but you have to deal with the fear of getting hit or stabbed and get through it! These actions or not a part of my life anymore but it has helped me to teach what really needs to be addressed in weapons defense. Just my worthless two bits! Nubreed Martial Arts Systems Ben Fajardo Ray Terry wrote: > > on quick. Well we were doing Abcedario the other > day and she cracked me a > > good one, split the side of my melon good, > probably should have gotten > > stitches. Now she is terrified of training, my > thought is to make her jump > > right back into it. I told her it was my fault and > all, but still, even as > > smart as she is you are still dealing with a > child. > > > > Any suggestions. > > Turn the other cheek and let her clock you on > taother side... :) > > Ray Terry > rterry@idiom.com > _______________________________________________ > Eskrima mailing list > Eskrima@martialartsresource.net > Copyright 1994-2003: Ray Terry and Martial Arts > Resource > http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/eskrima __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com --__--__-- Message: 8 Date: Tue, 21 Jan 2003 18:39:30 -0800 (PST) From: Ben Fajardo Subject: Re: [Eskrima] Survey - Modern Arnis Blasphemy? To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net ---Professor Anderson, It has a nice ring to it! Your a great martial artist and tournament Champion "Super Dan" Modern Arnis would be better? I have your book and use it as a bible of fighting! I feel that what ever you do with the art, you will bring respect to Arnis, I have been training with Guro Dan Daniels, I'm sure you know him. And he has pretty much done his own thing as well. I've trained in many Filipino Martial arts. And I have be able to learn from some of the best Instructors in the World. I was told by Sifu Al Dacascos my first instructor back in 1973, to always remember were you come from your roots, but always seek to grow in knowledge. And above all respect for your Instructors and their training. Good Luck in your art! Nubreed Martial Arts Systems Guru Ben Fajardo Danny Anderson wrote: > Dear Martial Artists,  > > I am putting my butt out here on the line and am > doing a survey as to > what has been referred to (by another) regarding > what I am doing with > Modern Arnis as misleading, misinforming and > disrespectful to my late > teacher, Remy Presas. I thought I'd get some > opinions and feedback from > others who had trained under him as well as > experienced martial artists. > The two main points of contention are that I have > named my own style of > Modern Arnis as Modern Arnis 80 and that I titled > myself Professor as > well as founder of Modern Arnis 80.  Here are some > facts to begin with: > > Point of contention #1 - the name Modern Arnis 80. > > Back in 1998 or so I asked Prof. Presas permission > to form my own > sub-system of Modern Arnis, subservient to his. When > I went up to visit > him at a joint seminar of his and Wally Jay's, I got > his verbal > permission to do so. When Prof. Presas died there > was the big deal made > about successorship, who were the top students and > so forth. I had > predicted this would happen back in 1994 in a letter > to Bram Frank. To > sidestep the whole mess I came public with my style > of what I had learned > from the professor and named it Modern Arnis 80. > Here is why. > > First of all, the Filipino martial art I learned was > Modern Arnis, not > Balintawak or Serrada escrima, etc. The 80 has two > meanings. 1) 1980 is > the year I began training. 2) If you turn the 8 on > its side you have the > symbol for infinity. I remember how Prof. Presas > would show us endless > variations based off of one move. That gives the > idea of an infinite > number of actions one can do. I also remember how > direct he could be if > you put the heat on him? The 80 means "the > possibility of anything (8) to > the simplicity of the moment (0)." The 8------0 is > sort of a > philosophical thing. > > For me, to say I am teaching Modern Arnis, Remy > Presas style, is > incorrect as he taught in a seminar fashion and not > a structured one.  > Nor did he ever set up any kind of heirarchy.  This > is how he taught in > the United States. How he taught in the Philippines > may be another > matter. As to seniority, Remy Presas was my > instructor and he didn't tell > me that any of current Modern Arnis groups or > individuals were my > seniors. As I trained directly under Prof. Presas, > he was my senior and > shortly before he died all he said to me was, > "Danny, get involved." and > that was it. > > Point of contention #2, the use of the titles > Professor for myself > Filipino martial arts wise and Founder, Modern Arnis > 80. > > A founder, by dictionary definition, is one who > establishes something. > George Washington, Benjamin Franklin and others were > the founders of our > country. That is the usage of the term as I apply it > to what I do. I have > not claimed to have found a lost 1980's art or > 1980's way of teaching > something as has been stated by another. I founded > the style that I > teach, the steps of progression and that is the > usage of founder that I > go by. > > The reason for the Professor title is simple. Many > instructors call > themselves something. A dictionary definition of > professor is "one that > teaches or professes special knowledge of an art, > sport, or occupation > requiring skill." I have been teaching martial arts > for 34 years. I have > been teaching Modern Arnis in some form or another > for 22 years. I am one > of the Professor's highest ranked students in the > U.S. (6th Degree Black > Belt and Senior Master). I was awarded the Professor > title by ATAMA in > Karate but I feel I have earned it as an overall > instructor as well. I do > not put myself on the same status with Remy Presas > and never have.  I do > not claim that position by using the term Professor. > There are a number > of titles I could adopt. Like I said, many > instructors call themselves > something. I don't use Guro, Punong Guro, Master, > Senior Master, Grand > Master as none of them fit. To me in the above > definition, Professor > fits. > > As far as it being disrespectful to my teacher, it > would be far more > disrespectful for me to name what I do "Dan Anderson > Arnis," "American > Arnis," "Super Dan's Stickfighting" or something > like that. I use the > term Modern Arnis because that is my base Filipino > art. I use the term to > show where I got my skill from - Remy A. Presas. > > As a senior practitioner in the martial arts, your > input is valuable to > me. I feel I am helping take my instructor's art > into the new millennium > and am doing it somewhat the same way he did, by > learning a base art (for > me Modern Arnis) and then expanding my own > knowledge, as he did with his > family art and Balintawak escrima. Is this > misleading, misinforming and > disrespectful to my late teacher or is it just one > person's opinion? Your > reply and opinions, whether they agree with my own > or not, are very > welcome. > > Thank you in advance, > > Dan Anderson > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > Tired of spam? Get advanced junk mail protection > with MSN 8. > _______________________________________________ > Eskrima mailing list > Eskrima@martialartsresource.net > Copyright 1994-2003: Ray Terry and Martial Arts > Resource > http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/eskrima __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com --__--__-- _______________________________________________ Eskrima mailing list Eskrima@martialartsresource.net http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/eskrima http://eskrima-fma.net Old digest issues are available via ftp://ftp.martialartsresource.com. Copyright 1994-2003: Ray Terry, www.MartialArtsResource.com, www.Sudlud.com Standard disclaimers apply. Remember 9-11! End of Eskrima Digest