Date: Sat, 08 Feb 2003 03:01:49 -0800 From: eskrima-request@martialartsresource.net Subject: Eskrima digest, Vol 10 #53 - 3 msgs X-Mailer: Mailman v2.0.13.cisto1 MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Errors-To: eskrima-admin@martialartsresource.net X-BeenThere: eskrima@martialartsresource.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13.cisto1 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net X-Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net X-Subscribed-Address: fma@martialartsresource.com List-Id: Eskrima-FMA discussion forum, the premier FMA forum on the Internet. List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Unsubscribe: , List-Help: Status: O X-Status: X-Keywords: Send Eskrima mailing list submissions to eskrima@martialartsresource.net To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/eskrima or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to eskrima-request@martialartsresource.net You can reach the person managing the list at eskrima-admin@martialartsresource.net When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific than "Re: Contents of Eskrima digest..." <<---- The Sudlud-Inayan Eskrima/Kali/Arnis/FMA mailing list ---->> Serving the Internet since June 1994. Copyright 1994-2003: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource The Internet's premier discussion forum devoted to Filipino Martial Arts. Provided in memory of Mangisursuro Michael G. Inay (1944-2000). http://SudludEskrima.com http://InayanEskrima.com/index.cfm See the Filipino Martial Arts (FMA) FAQ and the online search engine for back issues of the Eskrima/FMA list at http://MartialArtsResource.com Mabuhay ang eskrima! Today's Topics: 1. Shuai Chiao (Stephen Lamade) 2. Stick Tweaker (lakanmdb@aol.com) 3. Badger Jones (Musilat@aol.com) --__--__-- Message: 1 From: "Stephen Lamade" To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Date: Fri, 07 Feb 2003 20:47:39 +0000 Subject: [Eskrima] Shuai Chiao Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Re. "The throws of Shuai Chiao Kung Fu can be found well-integrated into most Chinese systems. Shuai Chiao is China's oldest fighting "way"." The following may be of interest to those who want to explore some of the history of Shuai Jiao. Below is a description of a particular lineage of Shuai Chiao to be introduced to members of the North American Tang Shou Tao Association this year: "To All NATSTA Members: The NATSTA is sponsoring two Shuai Chiao seminars in the spring of 2003. Dan Harding will offer the seminars in New York, NY on February 22 and 23 and in Denver, CO on April 5 and 6. The purpose of the seminars is to introduce the fundamental concepts of Shuai Chiao to NATSTA members and to examine the elements of Shuai Chiao in the NATSTA Gao Yi Sheng Ba Gua curriculum. Shuai Chiao is the Chinese martial art of wrestling. It is best known for its devastating high amplitude throwing techniques, but also incorporates joint locking (Chin Na), sweeps, and some striking. The essence of Shuai Chiao is to throw the opponent in such a way as for him/her to not be able to break the fall safely. Usually, the majority of the throws result with the opponent landing on his head, or accelerating towards the earth in some awkward position with a broken limb. Because of its practicality and effectiveness, many Shuai Chiao practitioners were employed by the Emperor of China as bodyguards. The relationship of Shuai Chiao to Ba Gua Zhang, specifically Gao Yi Sheng Ba Gua Zhang, can be traced all the way back to Dong Hai Chuan. As most of you know, Dong is considered the originator of Ba Gua Zhang. Dong was not known for teaching many students, but for the ones he did teach, most were already experts in some other style of martial art. >From there he would build their Ba Gua skill on their previous martial foundation. One of Dong Hai Chuan’s most famous students was a man by the name of Cheng Ting Hua. Cheng was famous because unlike most Chinese at the time, he was very open with his teaching and had a high level of skill. Before Cheng was introduced to Dong, he was already well known in Beijing as an expert in Shuai Chiao. When Cheng meet Dong, Dong asked Cheng to attack him with his Shuai Chiao. As the story goes, Cheng never laid a hand on Dong during the exchange and thus immediately afterward Cheng asked to be Dong’s student. The list of Cheng Ting Hua’s Ba Gua descendents is long, with many skilled practitioners. Gao Yi Sheng is one of these descendents who also, like his teacher, taught openly and had many students. Gao was known for his fighting skill as well as his deep knowledge of Hsing I Chuan and Ba Gua Zhang. There are numerous articles in the Pa Kua Journal on Gao Yi Sheng and his lineage if you are interested in learning more. One of Gao Yi Sheng’s top disciples was a man by the name of Liu Feng Cai. Liu was also Gao’s grandnephew. Liu had several students, but one of his best was Wang Shu Sheng. Another of Liu’s students, and family inheritor of the system, is Liu Shu Hang. Liu Shu Hang is also the grandnephew of Liu Feng Cai. Wang Shu Sheng sadly passed away in 1998 of liver problems. Before he passed away, Wang produced two excellent students, Ge Guo Liang and Li Xue Yi. Both Ge and Li are experts in Gao Yi Sheng Ba Gua; however, before they studied with Wang, they were both highly proficient in Shuai Chiao. On one occasion, Marc Melton had a chance to sit down and speak with Ge Guo Liang about his thoughts on Ba Gua and its relationship with Shuai Chiao. Ge said that Gao Yi Sheng studied his Ba Gua from Cheng Ting Hua. Cheng was an expert Shuai Chiao practitioner and so his teacher, Dong Hai Chuan, built Cheng’s Ba Gua system around his previous skill of Shuai Chiao. So, many of the applications, entries, and throws in the Gao Yi Sheng style of Ba Gua are offshoots of Shuai Chiao. However, subsequent generations of practitioners, including Gao Yi Sheng, Liu Feng Cai, and Wang Shu Sheng, did not practice Shuai Chiao. As a result, much of the flavor of the original style of Cheng’s Ba Gua was missing. When Wang Shu Hang (Sheng) took on Ge and Li as students, all three worked together to bring much of the Shuai Chiao that Cheng developed back into the Gao Yi Sheng system. And so it is that NATSTA is offering Shuai Chiao seminars to all association members. In the seminars, Dan Harding will present Sport Shuai Chiao, which involves practicing Shuai Chiao throws in a way that is safe and will allow for long periods of practice while minimizing the risk of injury. In the morning sessions, the participants will focus on Shuai Chiao techniques. In the afternoon sessions the participants work in one of two groups. Students familiar with Gao Yi Sheng Ba Gua will explore the elements of Shuai Chiao in the Separating Palms. Members not familiar with the Gao material will explore the use of Shuai Chiao in sparring. To prepare for the seminars we recommend regular Fu Hu Gong practice as well as frequent review of the Gao Yi Sheng material. The NATSTA is working on bringing Ge Guo Liang, Li Xue Yi, and Liu Shu Hang to the United States in October 2004. The purpose of the Shuai Chiao seminars is to research the martial applications of the Gao Yi Sheng style in terms of its origin, and to prepare Association members for the upcoming visit with Ge, Li, and Liu. During their visit, Ge and Li may also teach some Shuai Chiao techniques in relation to the Ba Gua Zhang." Anyone interested in NASTA can find further information at the following URL: http://members.bellatlantic.net/~vze4fs8i/vince_black.htm Best, Steve Lamade San Miguel Eskrima Association _________________________________________________________________ Add photos to your messages with MSN 8. Get 2 months FREE*. http://join.msn.com/?page=features/featuredemail --__--__-- Message: 2 From: lakanmdb@aol.com Date: Fri, 7 Feb 2003 16:13:38 EST To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Subject: [Eskrima] Stick Tweaker Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Mabuhay to all In response to stick tweaking, well Im a junky. I have one in my hand most times, while im watching tv, in the kitchen hell everywhere, and yes I have replaced many ceiling fans and many light fixtures in my apt. But I take stick tweaking to the next level knife tweaking, I am always working the blade wether it be my balisongs, or just trying new things with the folders. I have also started doing dumog tweaking, but the lady down stairs usually beats on my door when I start that. So if anyone out there knows a 12 step program for a habitual FMA tweaker, please dont reply, because this is one addiction I dont want to kick. Mike B. PTK-SanAntonio --__--__-- Message: 3 Date: Fri, 07 Feb 2003 18:36:19 -0500 From: Musilat@aol.com To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Subject: [Eskrima] Badger Jones Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Badger, I get what your saying, but I can't agree completely. I think that the concepts that govern the techniques in the FMA are actually very concrete. It's just that most people tend to focus more on the volume of technical derivitives than the basic concepts from which they come. It's sort of a case of not seeing the forest for the trees. The Chinese on the other hand tend to solidify their systems and choose not to do much research (though I'm sure there are exceptions). It's more about perfecting what they have. The same basic concepts govern both groups of arts, which is why I feel they can compliment each other. What makes them different is what concepts they choose to emphasize. In music, everyone uses the same notes, but everyones music is unique and they can all blend to some degree. Same idea here. Thanks for the input. Best, Steve Kohn --__--__-- _______________________________________________ Eskrima mailing list Eskrima@martialartsresource.net http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/eskrima http://eskrima-fma.net Old digest issues available @ ftp://ftp.martialartsresource.com. Copyright 1994-2003: Ray Terry, MartialArtsResource.com, Sudlud.com Standard disclaimers apply. Remember 9-11! End of Eskrima Digest