Date: Tue, 11 Mar 2003 12:48:01 -0800 From: eskrima-request@martialartsresource.net Subject: Eskrima digest, Vol 10 #105 - 7 msgs X-Mailer: Mailman v2.0.13.cisto1 MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Errors-To: eskrima-admin@martialartsresource.net X-BeenThere: eskrima@martialartsresource.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13.cisto1 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net X-Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net X-Subscribed-Address: fma@martialartsresource.com List-Id: Eskrima-FMA discussion forum, the premier FMA forum on the Internet. List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Unsubscribe: , List-Help: Status: RO X-Status: X-Keywords: Send Eskrima mailing list submissions to eskrima@martialartsresource.net To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/eskrima or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to eskrima-request@martialartsresource.net You can reach the person managing the list at eskrima-admin@martialartsresource.net When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific than "Re: Contents of Eskrima digest..." <<---- The Sudlud-Inayan Eskrima/Kali/Arnis/FMA mailing list ---->> Serving the Internet since June 1994. Copyright 1994-2003: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource The Internet's premier discussion forum devoted to Filipino Martial Arts. Provided in memory of Mangisursuro Michael G. Inay (1944-2000). http://SudludEskrima.com http://InayanEskrima.com/index.cfm See the Filipino Martial Arts (FMA) FAQ and the online search engine for back issues of the Eskrima/FMA list at http://MartialArtsResource.com Mabuhay ang eskrima! Today's Topics: 1. Re:Cabales Serrada in Arizona (debergerac) 2. Re: Classical fencing (debergerac) 3. Re: Inayan Eskrima seminar Paris, France (debergerac) 4. Re: Inayan Eskrima seminar Paris, France (Ray Terry) 5. Re: Classical fencing (JJaje@aol.com) 6. Re: Cabales Serrada in Arizona (serrada@lvcm.com) 7. Chad's postings (Roan Grimm) --__--__-- Message: 1 Date: Mon, 10 Mar 2003 23:53:06 -0800 (PST) From: debergerac To: serrada@lvcm.com Subject: Re:[Eskrima] Cabales Serrada in Arizona Cc: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Who are you? I'm sorry to be a little put off. Usually when people write me i get a little more than a laundry list of questions from someone I neither know nor seems to have the courtesy to explain WHY he's writing to me...WHAT he needs from me..WHO he is(other than "jim") and WHERE did you get permission to talk to me as if you had some authority. In other words, the 5 W's and the H would have been nice. Are you looking for training? If you contest my authority to teach speak to Khalid Khan. If you're just looking for info, then tell me about yourself and ask politely. You might get someplace. God help me but a little courtesy in emails goes along ways. > -----Original Message----- > From: serrada@lvcm.com [mailto:serrada@lvcm.com] > Sent: Monday, March 10, 2003, 9:47 PM > To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net > Subject: Re:[Eskrima] Cabales Serrada in Arizona > > Where are you located in Arizona? What is your rank and who were you > trained by? How long have you trained? How long have you been teaching? > > Jim > _______________________________________________ > Eskrima mailing list > Eskrima@martialartsresource.net > Copyright 1994-2003: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource > http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/eskrima --__--__-- Message: 2 Date: Tue, 11 Mar 2003 00:07:28 -0800 (PST) From: debergerac To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Subject: Re: [Eskrima] Classical fencing Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net FOIL FOIL FOIL AND FOIL. Every other weapon encourages sloppiness when encountered first. The foil is the foundation of all of fencing and it is by far the most difficult, demanding of the three. Compared with the foil, epee and sabre are mere childs play. This is true in Olympic style fencing as well. But even more so in Classical Fencing. Read "ON FENCING" by Aldo Nadi...quite possibly the greatest fencer...period. No one has yet to match his professional fencing record, nor has any fencer been recipient to such complete and unadulterated praise from his 'peers': multi year national and international champions, Olympians and Medallists. Recently, after having only had foil group lessons, I went to a rated tourney and fenced epee. I fenced a man with 30 years experience. I had less than 50 touches. Upon my honor I gave the first touch and only lost 15-10. In foil, with someone of comparable experience I doubt I could get more than 2 or even 3 on a magnificent day. Proof positive that foil is the shining example of fencing to which the epee and even more so the sabre...pales in comparison. As far as martial development...again foil foil foil. Its speed timing and sense of what budo would call 'initiative' or in fencing terms 'right of way' makes for a good solid base from which to develop attributes. Bruce did. His stances were lifted directly from fencing, and the straight blast a combination of the 'extension' and WC's straight punch. Foil guys...without question. > -----Original Message----- > From: Michael Koblic [mailto:mkoblic@uniserve.com] > Sent: Monday, March 10, 2003, 9:47 PM > To: Eskrima digest > Subject: [Eskrima] Classical fencing > > There are those on this list who have done classical fencing. Did you find > it useful in you martial arts development? In what way? Which weapon did you > find most useful? > > Mike Koblic, > Campbell River, BC > _______________________________________________ > Eskrima mailing list > Eskrima@martialartsresource.net > Copyright 1994-2003: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource > http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/eskrima --__--__-- Message: 3 Date: Tue, 11 Mar 2003 00:29:27 -0800 (PST) From: debergerac To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Subject: Re: [Eskrima] Inayan Eskrima seminar Paris, France Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net I once had the pleasure of meeting another Masirib Guro, Jeff Peterson, though of the org headed by Jason Inay. He was quite friendly and knowledgeable about all aspects of the eskrima he was taught. I have seen the website of the Inayan branch of which Emanual Hart is a core member. France is indeed fortunate to have an inner door student of one of Serrada's greatest exponents at one time Mike Inay. I have heard only good things about Guro Hart and his group and judging by the skill exhibited by Masirib Peterson, France is indeed fortunate. Frankly, I'm biased. Of all the stuff they teach, the DeCuerdas and Serrada are the best. Ive seen the DeCuerdas of Gilbert Tenio via Art Gonzales. Its great stuff. And of course Serrada by definition is par excellence. Vive la France, Tony Park Guro, CSE > -----Original Message----- > From: Stéphane Fernandez [mailto:fernast@club-internet.fr] > Sent: Monday, March 10, 2003, 9:47 PM > To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net > Subject: [Eskrima] Inayan Eskrima seminar Paris, France > > Hello, > > We will be hosting Masirib Guro Emanuel Hart for an Inayan Eskrima seminar > in Paris, France, the 12 of april. The program will be around Decuerdas, > Larga Mano, Sinawali and Kadena de mano. > > Any information: fernandez@inayaneskrima.com > > Best regards > Stéphane Fernandez > _______________________________________________ > Eskrima mailing list > Eskrima@martialartsresource.net > Copyright 1994-2003: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource > http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/eskrima --__--__-- Message: 4 From: Ray Terry Subject: Re: [Eskrima] Inayan Eskrima seminar Paris, France To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Date: Tue, 11 Mar 2003 06:56:45 -0800 (PST) Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net > I once had the pleasure of meeting another Masirib Guro, Jeff Peterson, His first name is John... > Frankly, I'm biased. Of all the stuff they teach, the DeCuerdas and Serrada > are the best. Ive seen the DeCuerdas of Gilbert Tenio via Art Gonzales. Its > great stuff. And of course Serrada by definition is par excellence. Inayan Dequerdas is different from the DeCuerdas of Gm Tenio. I don't think Suro Inay ever saw Gm Tenio's DeCuerdas. Ray Terry rterry@idiom.com --__--__-- Message: 5 Date: Tue, 11 Mar 2003 11:49:35 -0500 From: JJaje@aol.com To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Subject: [Eskrima] Re: Classical fencing Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net While in college practicing Tang Soo Do, we had a member, who we eventually became room mates, who fenced. (He even on a lark tried out for the olympic team in the 90's, did well, but didn't make the cut) His impression was that he made more leaps and bounds improvements in his fencing because of the martial arts as opposed to the fencing improving his karate. His main fencing was foil, but he would also dabble in Epee' and Sabre. I tried fencing myself, enjoyed it, but got married and moved on to sticks! Personally, I'd think Epee' would be the least usable, and Saber the most in regards to Martial Arts. Where the fencing did help our Karate was in the footwork. Our particular teacher spent time on marching and one steps, but very little on actual footwork. Since then I believe successful footwork is a requirement for successful martial artists. --__--__-- Message: 6 Date: Tue, 11 Mar 2003 10:58:24 -0800 From: serrada@lvcm.com To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Subject: Re: [Eskrima] Cabales Serrada in Arizona Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Normally matters such as this are delt with privately, but there has been too much said publicly for me to allow this to slide. debergerac wrote: > Who are you? I'm sorry to be a little put off. Usually when people > write me i get a little more than a laundry list of questions from > someone I neither know nor seems to have the courtesy to explain WHY > he's writing to me...WHAT he needs from me..WHO he is(other than > "jim") and WHERE did you get permission to talk to me as if you had > some authority. Let's just say that if you don't want people to ask these questions, then don't claim to be an instructor. These are questions that everyone should ask when about to spend money on MA. Actually I do have AUTHORITY. I am an instructor in Cabales Serrada Escrima under GM Vincent Cabales and more importantly a member of his family. I also represent the school on matters such as digests, newsgroups, etc. > In other words, the 5 W's and the H would have been nice. Are you > looking for training? If you contest my authority to teach speak to > Khalid Khan. If you're just looking for info, then tell me about > yourself and ask politely. You might get someplace. > > God help me but a little courtesy in emails goes along ways. Well, if you only claimed to be taught by Khalid, then there probably wouldn't be that big of a problem except for the fact of you claiming to be a certified instructor. Cause everyone here already knows about Khalid. See, the problem with Khalid is that he is trying to depend on teaching for his sole source of income. Therefore, you start to worry more about how much money you can bring in vice the quality of what you teach. Example: Khalid says that he can teach you the complete Serrada system in three months. Well, outside of the fact that I spent twice that time on just angle one, that is just absurd. The main problem is the fact that you claim to be taught by GM Cabales. Then there are the rec.martial-arts posts like this one yesterday: >>From: Phillip Inoy (debergerac@ziplip.com) >>Subject: Re: Arnis/FMA/SEAMA Question >>Newsgroups: rec.martial-arts >>Date: 2003-03-10 12:26:42 PST >> >> >>I think they're OK. If you want authentic pilipino arts as taught by >>pilipinos then I'm in Goodyear AZ. >> >>I am the certified instructor for Cabales Serrada Eskrima here in the >>Desert Southwest. I learned in San Jose and Stockton, CA under Gm >>Vincent Cabales and my primary teacher Pangulong Guro Khalid Khan. He >>is one of GM Angel's 17 masters graduates. I am his top student along >>with Guro Antonio Elago, my brother in arms. South of Stockton CA, we >>and Darren Tibon are the top Serrada players. I also learned harimau >>and baguazhang under several instructors and continue that training >>daily in my private practice. You are not a certified instructor for Cabales Serrada Escrima and GM Cabales was or is not your teacher. You stopped by the class ONE DAY to work out with Khalid. You spent most of the time trying to unlearn how to do a shoulder block. I know because I was there. You can say that you worked out with him once, but anything more than that is BS. In Closing Anthony Park aka Phillip Inoy is not certified under GM Vincent Cabales nor does he represent the Academy of Cabales Serrada Escrima. He has minimal knowledge in the Serrada system and should not be considered an instructor. Jim aka GM Cabales' son-in-law >> -----Original Message----- From: serrada@lvcm.com >> [mailto:serrada@lvcm.com] Sent: Monday, March 10, 2003, 9:47 PM To: >> eskrima@martialartsresource.net Subject: Re:[Eskrima] Cabales >> Serrada in Arizona >> >> Where are you located in Arizona? What is your rank and who were >> you trained by? How long have you trained? How long have you been >> teaching? >> >> Jim _______________________________________________ Eskrima mailing >> list Eskrima@martialartsresource.net Copyright 1994-2003: Ray Terry >> and Martial Arts Resource >> http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/eskrima --__--__-- Message: 7 From: "Roan Grimm" To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Date: Tue, 11 Mar 2003 10:23:24 -1000 Subject: [Eskrima] Chad's postings Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net I'm officially chiming in to agree with Chad's postings about Mande Munda, Dogzilla and Pak Vic.  The guy he's talking about is the guy who dragged me to the ground and used both feet and arms to smack me around...new to me and rather infuriating.  Just stumped me in terms of how to deal with it.  About Dogzilla, Mike Tibbits is definitely one of the coolest guys on the block.  Very humble, friendly, nice with a tremendous wealth of experience coupled with the ability to smack me around like a puppet.  I'm really glad he made it to Hawaii...we are lucky to be able to draw from his knowledge and experience.  And yeah, I think both Chad and I are still feeling the elbows he dropped on us like a month or more ago.  Humorous story, Chad wanted to try this groundfighting drill where it's 2 against one.  I got into Mike's guard and Chad established side control (I think) before the drill began.  When Chad said go, I'm still not sure exactly what happened except that I remember being dragged around by my face a lot and Mike quite happily tossing us about.  Aahhh, good times.... As to the workshop with Pak Vic this weekend, all I can say is "wow".  To see this man in action and to listen to his direct, no BS approach to Serak was eye opening.  I know that Chad and I picked up some different approaches to the stick game that we're going to try and use to ambush the other fighters in our group.  :D  After reading so much about him, it was a fantastic experience to finally get a chance to meet and learn from him.  And like Chad said, what he presented as Serak silat was very different from my understanding of general indonesian silat.  All in all, one of the 2 best MA seminar/workshops I've attended.  The Dog Bros. 2002 summer seminar was the other. Unfortunately, I visited the doctor yesterday and I have a SLAP tear (superior labral?) which is allowing shoulder joint fluid to leak out, forming a cyst which is pressing on a nerve causing extreme weakness in my right shoulder. I go in for arthroscopic (sp?) surgery on Mar. 20th and the doc says my fighting HAS to stop for at least 4 months, maybe up to a year. So I'm severely bummed because that's gonna interfere with my summer Gathering plans as well as derail my fighting with the hawaii gang. The only plus side is that I now have the perfect catalyst to begin exclusive left handed training for several months. I'm sure the doc can and will prescribe some rehab, but has anyone else on the digest dealt with this type of injury? What did you do for/during rehab? Sorry aboput the rambling and thanks for the space. Aloha, Kalani --RKG "Somedays you're the windshield, some days you're the bug."--Anonymous "Left to themselves, things tend to go from bad to worse."--Murphy -- __________________________________________________________ Sign-up for your own FREE Personalized E-mail at Mail.com http://www.mail.com/?sr=signup --__--__-- _______________________________________________ Eskrima mailing list Eskrima@martialartsresource.net http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/eskrima http://eskrima-fma.net Old digest issues available @ ftp://ftp.martialartsresource.com. Copyright 1994-2003: Ray Terry, MartialArtsResource.com, Sudlud.com Standard disclaimers apply. Remember 9-11! End of Eskrima Digest