Date: Wed, 26 Mar 2003 14:49:02 -0800 From: eskrima-request@martialartsresource.net Subject: Eskrima digest, Vol 10 #124 - 15 msgs X-Mailer: Mailman v2.0.13.cisto1 MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Errors-To: eskrima-admin@martialartsresource.net X-BeenThere: eskrima@martialartsresource.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13.cisto1 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net X-Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net X-Subscribed-Address: fma@martialartsresource.com List-Id: Eskrima-FMA discussion forum, the premier FMA forum on the Internet. List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Unsubscribe: , List-Help: Status: RO X-Status: X-Keywords: Send Eskrima mailing list submissions to eskrima@martialartsresource.net To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/eskrima or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to eskrima-request@martialartsresource.net You can reach the person managing the list at eskrima-admin@martialartsresource.net When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific than "Re: Contents of Eskrima digest..." <<---- The Sudlud-Inayan Eskrima/Kali/Arnis/FMA mailing list ---->> Serving the Internet since June 1994. Copyright 1994-2003: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource The Internet's premier discussion forum devoted to Filipino Martial Arts. Provided in memory of Mangisursuro Michael G. Inay (1944-2000). http://SudludEskrima.com http://InayanEskrima.com/index.cfm See the Filipino Martial Arts (FMA) FAQ and the online search engine for back issues of the Eskrima/FMA list at http://MartialArtsResource.com Mabuhay ang eskrima! Today's Topics: 1. protestwarrior.com (rocky pasiwk) 2. Re: lefthand/right hand (Kes41355@aol.com) 3. Re: Two Hands (Young Forest) 4. Re: Ilustrisimo and HH HADJI MOHAMMAD Jamalul Kiram II Sultan of Sulu (Vincent Bollozos) 5. research clarification (braulio agudelo) 6. Wetik (Paul Briones) 7. Looking for Elrik Jundis (John Chow) 8. Both hands (Michael Koblic) 9. KK Footwork (bill m) 10. FMA (Doce Pares) in Hawaii? (Jasper Liao) 11. Hilot and neck problems (Stephen Lamade) 12. Dog Brothers seminar - Vancouver May 3/4 2003 (Loki Jorgenson) 13. Re: training with both hands (Danny Anderson) 14. both hands training (Roan Grimm) --__--__-- Message: 1 From: "rocky pasiwk" To: Date: Tue, 25 Mar 2003 10:32:13 -0500 Subject: [Eskrima] protestwarrior.com Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net For those of you that are tired of the low life anti American, dirt bag, garbage sucking, bullshit spewing, pig humping, protesters, who are (A). tying up our law enforcement officers whose time would be better spent protecting real Americans. (B) they show a total lack of respect for our military, who have made this country free for us and unfortunately the very dirt bags who spew hatred towards them. This is the site for you to check out protestwarrior.com let these dirt bag's that would let someone like Saddam sodomize their own mother or anything else that would help in the fall of America know that they are not the majority!!!!!!!!! Sorry Ray for being for using the digest for somethin non FMA related. Rocky Pasiwk American Made and Proud of it!!!!!!!! P.S Now that I think about this post is FMA related , if someone like insane Hussein ran America, we wouldn't be able to freely train in the FMA's now would we! --__--__-- Message: 2 From: Kes41355@aol.com Date: Tue, 25 Mar 2003 10:47:20 EST To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Subject: [Eskrima] Re: lefthand/right hand Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net In a message dated 3/24/03 10:49:22 PM US Eastern Standard Time, eskrima-request@martialartsresource.net writes: > Jon Broster wrote: > I was just wondering how list members train their left and right hands. > Hi Jon, I am a natural southpaw, and use the stick/knife in my left hand 99% of the time. However, since I began teaching, I have only ran across two other southpaws that were as seriously lefty as myself...my brother, and a friend of my oldest son who has trained with us for a number of years. Consequently, nearly all of my students are righties, so I have had to learn to use the stick in my right as well, to relate to their perspective. It was hard as hell, let me tell you, but after about 20 years of practice, I can do Sumbrada and lock and block pretty well with my right hand. And here's an interesting note...lefties give me fits. I'm just not used to someone coming at me from that angle...go figure. Kim Satterfield Midwest School of Eskrima --__--__-- Message: 3 From: "Young Forest" To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Date: Tue, 25 Mar 2003 16:22:36 +0000 Subject: [Eskrima] Re: Two Hands Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Personally, I got into working both hands equally through drumming - something I took up a long time before martial arts. Stood me in good stead though, as I picked up double sinawalli in about 10 seconds. My students are constantly switching between their good and off hands during training to develop that bilateralism. The theory here is that one can't predict where violence will come from, or what you'll be doing at the time ("How'd you break your finger?" "I got punched in the nose." as the old joke goes), so you'd better have two good hands. That being said, I still can't get the hang of espada y daga left-handed. Badger Ottawa ON _________________________________________________________________ STOP MORE SPAM with the new MSN 8 and get 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail --__--__-- Message: 4 From: "Vincent Bollozos" To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Date: Tue, 25 Mar 2003 18:27:48 +0000 Subject: [Eskrima] Re: Ilustrisimo and HH HADJI MOHAMMAD Jamalul Kiram II Sultan of Sulu Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Garrote Olisi Eskrimador wrote : >Let's do some arithmetic. Tatang was born in 1907 add 9 that gives us the >year 1916 when he run away from home to Mindanao and was taken by his >supposedly foster father Sultan Muhammad. Wrong! The reigning Sultan of >Sulu during at that time was Sultan Jamalal Kiram II whose reign lasted >until 1936. > >Notwithstanding this discrepancy the book.... Garrote Olisi Eskrimador I beleive you are WRONG. The sultan at the the time Tatang was in Sulu (verified by your math) was HH HADJI MOHAMMAD Jamalul Kiram II, Sultan of Sulu . This is how he signed his name in a treaty with General John C. Bates in Aug. 20-1899. The Bates Treaty which was later abolished unilaterally by the USA in 1904. Tatang made nothing up. Also HH HADJI MOHAMMAD Jamalul Kiram II was only recognized as Sultan until 1915 when he signed memorandum-agreement with the US Governor General of the Philippine Islands which recognised the sovereignty of the USA. The agreement also reduced his sovereignty to that of a spiritual headship until his death in 1936. There are no discrepancy in the book " Secerts of Kalis Ilustrisimo". Vince _________________________________________________________________ STOP MORE SPAM with the new MSN 8 and get 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail --__--__-- Message: 5 Date: Tue, 25 Mar 2003 11:30:57 -0800 (PST) From: braulio agudelo To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Subject: [Eskrima] research clarification Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net I can clarify some info below- The Sultan's full name was Muhammad Jamalul Kiram II, his reign was from 1884-1936. In Basilan there was a Pedro Cuevas who became a prominent leader/Datu, Islamic convert during the same era. These are historical fact. Note: As a boy Tatang could have known the Sultan of Sulu as Muhammad as an adopted son to a foster father. It is also possible to have a Spanish name and still be Muslim. I have no connection to Bakbakan or Kalis Illustrismo. Respectfully Mabagani aka Braulio Garrote wrote - "I presume he must have picked up the story from the late PG Edgar Sulite's book "The Secrets of Arnis Kali and Eskrima". In the book, PG Sulite narrated of the story in Tatang's childhood that he stowed away at nine years of age to Mindanao and was adopted by the Sultan of Sulu, a certain Sultan Muhammad. Sulite further elaborated that Tatang Ilustrisimo trained in Mindanao with a certain Pedro Cortes...doesn't sound ISLAMIC at all? So where's his Moro teacher? None! Let's do some arithmetic. Tatang was born in 1907 add 9 that gives us the year 1916 when he run away from home to Mindanao and was taken by his supposedly foster father Sultan Muhammad. Wrong! The reigning Sultan of Sulu during at that time was Sultan Jamalal Kiram II whose reign lasted until 1936." --__--__-- Message: 6 Date: Tue, 25 Mar 2003 13:14:26 -0800 (PST) From: Paul Briones To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Subject: [Eskrima] Wetik Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Hi all, I have been studying Doce Pares style Eskrima and there is a heavy emphasis on "wetik" which means in Cebuano to quickly snap or switch direction. Hence, the emphasis is on speed via the sparring combos as opposed to strength. I have had a limited exposure to other styles and was curious if 1) other styles share the same emphasis 2) Do these styles share the same emphasis because they come from the same region, specifically the Visayan region of Central Philippines. I was under the impression that certain style emphasize speed over strength and while I make no judgments on such, I would like to know which styles do so. Your input is appreciated, Miko B "bantay lang ka, Bisdak biya ko" --__--__-- Message: 7 Date: Wed, 26 Mar 2003 11:50:18 +1100 From: John Chow Organization: Oracle Corporation To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Subject: [Eskrima] Looking for Elrik Jundis Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Can anybody who knows Elrik Jundis's whereabouts please ask him to contact John Chow ASAP, in regards to a mutual friend in Manila please? His old email at earthlink.net no longer works. Thanks in advance. --__--__-- Message: 8 From: "Michael Koblic" To: "Eskrima digest" Date: Tue, 25 Mar 2003 18:07:01 -0800 Subject: [Eskrima] Both hands Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net FWIW from a martial arts muppet (sorry if I am stating the obvious): 1) Although I am more ambidexterous than most (so people tell me) this relates mainly to fine work. I have allowed to overdevelop my right side (mainly through tennis) to the point that I confuse health professionals (e.g. x-ray techs who try to fit me on to a chest x-ray plate - it never looks right). The esthetics do not matter much, but with advancing age I pay for the imbalance of the two sides with all kinds of nerve entrapment syndromes etc. I would urge anybody to at least do some work with the weak side to maintain body symmetry. I spent a whole winter playing racquet ball left-handed... 2) The weak side is not just weak because of the hand itself. Most (?) people have a stronger body turn to one side than to the other. Right handed people tend to turn more strongly to their left (as in a forehand shot, right-handed golf swing, caveman strike etc.) I realized this fully playing the aboveme-mentioned left-handed racquet ball when my (left-handed) back hand was more powerful than the left-handed forehand. Thus, although I have a fairly decent left jab from the orthodox stance, the left cross (fighting as a southpaw) stinks for that very reason. 3) There is an interesting treatise on using the two sides of the body on Bob Orlando' site. Mike Koblic, Campbell River, BC Build a man a fire and you will warm him only for a night. Set a man on fire and you will warm him for the rest of his life. --__--__-- Message: 9 From: "bill m" To: Date: Tue, 25 Mar 2003 21:50:30 -0800 Subject: [Eskrima] KK Footwork Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net In his post on training with both hands Crafty wrote: "To this end we do a lot of siniwali work with an emphasis on integrating foot and triangular footwork, blending in the footwork of Krabi Krabong." Marc, I have heard many good things about Krabi, but have never seen it. Can you elaborate on the footwork and how it differs from that used in Filipino or Indonesian martial arts? Regards, Tuhon Bill McGrath Email: tuhonbill@pekiti-tirsia.com PTI website: http://www.pekiti-tirsia.com/ --__--__-- Message: 10 Date: Wed, 26 Mar 2003 02:43:52 -0800 (PST) From: Jasper Liao To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Subject: [Eskrima] FMA (Doce Pares) in Hawaii? Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Greetings to all... I am moving to Hawaii after spending some time in China, and was wondering if ayone could recommend an FMA club. I've studied Doce Pares before, but I'm not necessarily limiting my search to that. I'll be living in Manoa Valley, so the closer the better. Also, has anyone ever trained in a Chinese boxing art called Sanda? I sat in on a class and it seemed to have a lot of similarities to Muay Thai, but with more of a focus on takedowns. Thanks, Jasper __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Platinum - Watch CBS' NCAA March Madness, live on your desktop! http://platinum.yahoo.com --__--__-- Message: 11 From: "Stephen Lamade" To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Date: Wed, 26 Mar 2003 11:50:56 +0000 Subject: [Eskrima] Hilot and neck problems Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Try Sam Tendencia. You may be able to contact him through Danny Inosanto's organization. Master Tendencia would be in his early '80's by now. Best, Steve Lamade San Miguel Eskrima Association _________________________________________________________________ Add photos to your e-mail with MSN 8. Get 2 months FREE*. http://join.msn.com/?page=features/featuredemail --__--__-- Message: 12 From: Loki Jorgenson To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Date: Wed, 26 Mar 2003 07:54:57 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Eskrima] Dog Brothers seminar - Vancouver May 3/4 2003 Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Seminar: Guro Marc "Crafty Dog" Denny Dog Brothers Martial Arts Location: Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada Date: May 3/4 2003 Ask me for details ... or see www.maelstromcore.com -- maelstrom \ Loki Jorgenson martial _ \ Pekiti-Tirsia kali loki@maelstromcore.com arts / O_/ Dog Brothers MA www.maelstromcore.com \ Inosanto Academy (604) 340-2480 \ silat Jati Wisesa --__--__-- Message: 13 From: "Danny Anderson" To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Date: Wed, 26 Mar 2003 16:12:10 +0000 Subject: [Eskrima] Re: training with both hands Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net In our school, training with both hands is mandatory.  I broke my right hand doing a David Letterman stupid pet trick (a board break) and had to learn it the hard way.  Later when I trained with Remy Presas, I found that he was left handed and he had to train his right hand.  This gave him an advantage against right handers.  One would be very familiar with going right on right but when he switched to his left, things got confusing right away for the recipient.  One may be a natural "righty" but it is good to train the other side to be balanced.Yours,Dan Anderson ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Add photos to your messages with MSN 8. Get 2 months FREE*. --__--__-- Message: 14 From: "Roan Grimm" To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Date: Wed, 26 Mar 2003 08:41:50 -1000 Subject: [Eskrima] both hands training Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Hi all, I'd like to share my experiences with training both hands.  Up until a couple of weeks ago, I trained my left hand (my "weak" side) purely as a complement to my right side.  If I remember correctly, there have been a few observations/agreements with this method.  The theory being along the lines of, "If I'm in a real encounter, I'm going to use my strong side" and "If in said real encounter my opponent 'defangs' my strong side, they will have no problem 'defanging' my weak side so why bother trying to bring it up to par with my strong side."  Like I said, up until a couple weeks ago I felt the exact same way.  Now this is contrary to the way my instructor taught us.  He ALWAYS made us learn new material with our weak side and train it until we were comfortable with our weak side abilities, then he'd allow us to train strong side.  His theory being that once you learned it weak, transferring to strong would be quicker and less aggravating.  However, since I stopped training with him (I moved), out of laziness and rationalization that weak side training wasn't realistic because in a real fight I'd go strong side anyway, I chose to deemphasize my weak side training.  Instead I focused on it serving a complementary role to my strong side.  I think this influence came partially because I had read in a Mark Wiley book that Angel Cabales only believed in strong side training, again because in a fight an opponent who can beat your strong side can beat your weak side as well.  (If this is wrong info, please feel free to correct me.)  Anyway, all this rambling is leading to the point that about a month ago, I found out I was going to have to undergo surgery on my right (strong side) shoulder.  Well, I had the surgery last Thursday and now my right side is pretty useless...it is now my 'weak' side.  So now, I have to exclusively train for my left side to do what my right side was doing because I have no other option.  Now I'm cursing myself for relegating my weak side to complementary action training, because I SUCK with my left!!  It is humiliating to try and swing a real stick with my left with any semblance of control necessary for hard training/fighting.  Several times in the past couple of days, I've been frustrated to the point of wanting to give up.  But, as with anything else, success only comes after hard work.  I keep focusing on the goal of being able to effectively fight with my stick in either hand and be truly comfortable.  I guess the point of this rather long-winded monologue is that I am now a firm believer in TRYING to achieve true parity in both strong and weak sides because sometimes you don't get to decide which options are available.  I can only use my weak side for at least the next four months or so.  Again, just my thoughts, of no strategic importance to anyone but me. Thanks for letting me ramble.  Peace, respect and an open mind. Aloha, Kalani --RKG "Somedays you're the windshield, some days you're the bug."--Anonymous "Left to themselves, things tend to go from bad to worse."--Murphy -- __________________________________________________________ Sign-up for your own FREE Personalized E-mail at Mail.com http://www.mail.com/?sr=signup --__--__-- _______________________________________________ Eskrima mailing list Eskrima@martialartsresource.net http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/eskrima http://eskrima-fma.net Old digest issues available @ ftp://ftp.martialartsresource.com. Copyright 1994-2003: Ray Terry, MartialArtsResource.com, Sudlud.com Standard disclaimers apply. Remember 9-11! End of Eskrima Digest