Date: Thu, 15 Jan 2004 03:01:50 -0800 From: eskrima-request@martialartsresource.net Subject: Eskrima digest, Vol 11 #17 - 9 msgs X-Mailer: Mailman v2.0.13.cisto1 MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Errors-To: eskrima-admin@martialartsresource.net X-BeenThere: eskrima@martialartsresource.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13.cisto1 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net X-Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net X-Subscribed-Address: fma@martialartsresource.com List-Id: Eskrima-FMA discussion forum, the premier FMA forum on the Internet. List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Unsubscribe: , List-Help: Status: O X-Status: X-Keywords: Send Eskrima mailing list submissions to eskrima@martialartsresource.net To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/eskrima or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to eskrima-request@martialartsresource.net You can reach the person managing the list at eskrima-admin@martialartsresource.net When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific than "Re: Contents of Eskrima digest..." <<---- The Sudlud-Inayan Eskrima/Kali/Arnis/FMA mailing list ---->> Serving the Internet since June 1994. Copyright 1994-2004: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource The Internet's premier discussion forum devoted to Filipino Martial Arts. 1800 members. Provided in memory of Mangisursuro Michael G. Inay (1944-2000). See the Filipino Martial Arts (FMA) FAQ and the online search engine for back issues of the Eskrima/FMA list at http://MartialArtsResource.com Mabuhay ang eskrima! Today's Topics: 1. Re: Chinese 'kettlebells' (Felipe Jocano) 2. Martial arts cults (Marc Macyoung) 3. new training group in Calgary (gordon walker) 4. Re: Martial arts cults (Phil Elmore) 5. Kettlebell Training in Avon, New Jersey (Stephen Lamade) 6. Angling (Michael Koblic) 7. Re: Angling (Ray Terry) 8. Bong Jornales (rich parsons) 9. RE: Chinese 'kettlebells' (S. H. WEE) --__--__-- Message: 1 Date: Tue, 13 Jan 2004 22:52:25 -0800 (PST) From: Felipe Jocano Subject: Re: [Eskrima] Chinese 'kettlebells' To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Hi, The ones shaped like a Chinese lock are called chio so, literally stone lock. These are widely used in Fujianese ngo cho kun (five ancestors fist) as well as in pe ho ( (white crane). The training method is this: you stand in a horse stance and hold the handle, then toss it up and catch it with your other hand. The thing is, as you toss it, you also make it spin on its long axis and catch it with the other hand. At the more advanced level, you toss/spin and catch with the same hand. You go for as many repetitions as possible. You also have to involve your waist and hips in tossing the device. Usually, this is introduced after the trainee is able to demonstrate snapping power with the fundamental sam chien form. Bot --- Young Forest wrote: > >Talking about the Kettlebell, similar device has > been used by some > >styles of Kung Fu for conditioning and I have seen > something similar > >shown in Ming & Qing dynasty military literatures. > However, instead of > >round shape, some of them are shaped like a > traditional Chinese lock. > >From what I can remember, there are certain forms > designed for this > >kettlebell look-alike. > > Tibetan White Crane uses something called the 'mook > yan pai' or 'wood ear > plaques' - basically a thick square plank, with a an > oblong hole cut from > one side as a grip. For training, they just go > through their basic punches, > which are long range and have a lot of swing to > them. > > Can't remember the name of the ones that look like a > Chinese lock. > > Badger > Ottawa ON > > _________________________________________________________________ > The new MSN 8: advanced junk mail protection and 2 > months FREE* > http://join.msn.com/?page=dept/bcomm&pgmarket=en-ca&RU=http%3a%2f%2fjoin.msn.com%2f%3fpage%3dmisc%2fspecialoffers%26pgmarket%3den-ca > _______________________________________________ > Eskrima mailing list, 1800 members > Eskrima@martialartsresource.net > Copyright 1994-2004: Ray Terry and Martial Arts > Resource > Standard disclaimers apply > http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/eskrima __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Hotjobs: Enter the "Signing Bonus" Sweepstakes http://hotjobs.sweepstakes.yahoo.com/signingbonus --__--__-- Message: 2 From: "Marc Macyoung" To: Date: Wed, 14 Jan 2004 04:02:07 -0700 Subject: [Eskrima] Martial arts cults Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net From: Marc "Animal" MacYoung Something that has been bothering me lately is a trend of what I consider to be "cults" in the martial arts/self-defense world. For the last week I have been working on this Webpage. http://www.nononsenseselfdefense.com/cults.htm Then silly me, I allowed myself to be the intellectual chew toy of four Ph.Ds in Psychology to see if I was off base. Tell you what, show you're smarter than me, if you ask for peer review, make sure you ask people who are not smarter than you...they'll make you work your tail off to correct errors, cross your t's and dot your i's. Unfortunately, they didn't see any major mistakes in my arguments -- and all four of them are also martial artists -- so it might behoove folks to spend some time reading this long piece about the nature of martial arts cults and what to look for so you don't get sucked into one. Marc --__--__-- Message: 3 Date: Wed, 14 Jan 2004 10:50:55 -0500 (EST) From: gordon walker To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Subject: [Eskrima] new training group in Calgary Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Hi, I am trying to set up a training group in Calgary. I have been training since 1997 in Ninjutsu (3 years), chenstyle taichi (2 years), and Rutano Estokada (3 years). I have attended seminars in Ninjutsu, Chenstyle push hands, Modern Arnis and have also done some Wing Chun on the sly with my tai chi instructor. I think I bring a lot to the table in terms of teaching ability and knowledge. Any interested peoples can get in contact with me via the email address that you see on this submission. Thank you, Gordon --------------------------------- Post your free ad now! Yahoo! Canada Personals --__--__-- Message: 4 Date: Wed, 14 Jan 2004 08:15:59 -0800 (PST) From: Phil Elmore Subject: Re: [Eskrima] Martial arts cults To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net That is an excellent article. Some of the points you outlined mirrored *perfectly* the seemingly years-long vitriolic argument I had with Jack "Savage" Sellner, True Believer of Hikuta (the fighting art descended from the Ancient Pharoah's Bodyguards, don't you know). Phil www.themartialist.com Marc Macyoung wrote: From: Marc "Animal" MacYoung Something that has been bothering me lately is a trend of what I consider to be "cults" in the martial arts/self-defense world. For the last week I have been working on this Webpage. http://www.nononsenseselfdefense.com/cults.htm Then silly me, I allowed myself to be the intellectual chew toy of four Ph.Ds in Psychology to see if I was off base. Tell you what, show you're smarter than me, if you ask for peer review, make sure you ask people who are not smarter than you...they'll make you work your tail off to correct errors, cross your t's and dot your i's. Unfortunately, they didn't see any major mistakes in my arguments -- and all four of them are also martial artists -- so it might behoove folks to spend some time reading this long piece about the nature of martial arts cults and what to look for so you don't get sucked into one. Marc _______________________________________________ Eskrima mailing list, 1800 members Eskrima@martialartsresource.net Copyright 1994-2004: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource Standard disclaimers apply http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/eskrima -------------- - Phil Elmore --__--__-- Message: 5 From: "Stephen Lamade" To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Date: Wed, 14 Jan 2004 20:35:04 +0000 Subject: [Eskrima] Kettlebell Training in Avon, New Jersey Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net My teacher, Bill Schettino, asked me if I would post this workshop information. His advice and recommendations are always on the mark: "K.O.ntact Champ and Strength Coach extraordinaire Steve Cotter is offering his patented Full K.O.ntact Kettlebells workshop on Sat. Jan. 31 and Sun. Feb. 1 at The Training Room in Avon, NJ. This will be a 2 day, Level 1 and Level 2 course. The content includes: Level 1 2 and 1 hand swings, cleans, double cleans, front squats, Turkish get-ups, presses (strict military press, double press, alternate press,1 leg press, seated press, waiter's press), snatch, jerk, double jerks, rack holds and overhead holds Level 2 This will cover figure 8s, around the worlds, 1 leg DL, windmills (low, high, doubles), double swings, double snatch, alternating cleans, alternating snatch, bottoms-up cleans, bottoms-up press, side press, bent press, 2 hands anyhow, Renegade rows, overhead squats, and specialized Full K.O.ntact movements for martial arts. The theme of the course is applied strength for Martial Art application, using kettlebells as the ideal auxiliary training tool for developing explosive power in all ranges Both courses will cover in-depth power breathing and auxiliary stretching methods necessary to properly perform the kettlebell lifts. You will leave the workshops with a thorough understanding of proper lifting mechanics, program design, and goal setting/achievement. Pre-registration is required. Fee is $200 for 1 day and $300 for both. The workshops are both 5 hr in duration. The host facility, The Training Room in Avon, NJ (Avon-by-the-sea) is now handling all registration. Please contact the gym directly to register. Contact Jim Milkowski at trainingroom@monmouth.com to sign up for 2 days of educational torture with yours truly. trainingroom@monmouth.com Let me know if you have any questions, requests, comments. In Strength, Steve Cotter Full K.O.ntact Kettlebells www.fullkontact.com" Best, Steve Lamade _________________________________________________________________ Check out the new MSN 9 Dial-up — fast & reliable Internet access with prime features! http://join.msn.com/?pgmarket=en-us&page=dialup/home&ST=1 --__--__-- Message: 6 From: "Michael Koblic" To: "Eskrima digest" Date: Wed, 14 Jan 2004 15:09:05 -0800 Subject: [Eskrima] Angling Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net An attack of nasty flu (yes, this year's vaccine sucks!) is no excuse for an armchair warrior to be inactive. It is a great opportunity to review videos. While doing so I came across an interview with, I believe, Arlan Sanford (DBMA, "Combining stick and footwork") who made some interesting comments about angling. If I understood him correctly, he stated that although he had been taught a lot about angling footwork, when it came to sparring, it just was not there for him. Now this is a fighter with a reputation of being one of the hardest to bring down. This intrigued me. I then went on to review as many of the DBMA fights as I could find, using slow motion replays etc., and lo and behold, it seems that he was right. In all the encounters on display I could not find one defender who got off the line of attack successfully, all were either hit or taken down. Succesfull defences seem to consist of a stiff-arm hand-off or a sound whack if the attacking block missed its intended target. The attacks were more of a variety. Most were of the straight-in charge variety preceeded by an attacking block, merge etc. It is instructive to see that the attacker can take as many as 3 steps forward to defender's one backward. There were some particularly elegant ones on the male triangle pattern (or should I say lower canine?). One fighter in a red shirt (the shape and movement suggest Tricky Dog Loki but I cannot be sure) was particularly excellent at this. So the question to the forum is: Is this perception true? Should one review one's approach to defense? What should such approach be? FWIW the message I took home from this is that a) attack is the best form of defense and b) if possible, attack into the attack and throw his timing off. Or is this just fever talking? Mike Koblic, Campbell River, BC --__--__-- Message: 7 From: Ray Terry Subject: Re: [Eskrima] Angling To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Date: Wed, 14 Jan 2004 15:23:07 -0800 (PST) Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net My experience has shown that it is less about angling back and far more about circling back away from a charging attacker. When charged one frequently needs to circle back, to the left or right. That is more difficult for the attacker to adjust to. Ray Terry rterry@idiom.com --__--__-- Message: 8 Date: Wed, 14 Jan 2004 17:57:49 -0800 (PST) From: rich parsons To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Subject: [Eskrima] Bong Jornales Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Bong Jornales is a must see. If you get the chance to watch the man in action, it is great. He has so much to offer, and he is very friendly and humble teacher. I like him, and I recommend for people to check him out. Enjoy __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Hotjobs: Enter the "Signing Bonus" Sweepstakes http://hotjobs.sweepstakes.yahoo.com/signingbonus --__--__-- Message: 9 From: "S. H. WEE" To: Date: Thu, 15 Jan 2004 10:28:49 +0800 Subject: [Eskrima] RE: Chinese 'kettlebells' Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Hi Badger, The one I have seen is made of stone with wooden handle, about A4-size. Regards, S. H. Wee > Message: 1 > From: "Young Forest" > To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net > Date: Tue, 13 Jan 2004 16:33:24 +0000 > Subject: [Eskrima] Chinese 'kettlebells' > Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net > Tibetan White Crane uses something called the 'mook yan pai' > or 'wood ear > plaques' - basically a thick square plank, with a an oblong > hole cut from > one side as a grip. For training, they just go through their > basic punches, > which are long range and have a lot of swing to them. > > Can't remember the name of the ones that look like a Chinese lock. > > Badger > Ottawa ON --__--__-- _______________________________________________ Eskrima mailing list Eskrima@martialartsresource.net http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/eskrima http://eskrima-fma.net Old digest issues available @ ftp://ftp.martialartsresource.com. Copyright 1994-2004: Ray Terry, MartialArtsResource.com, Sudlud.com Standard disclaimers apply. Remember September 11. End of Eskrima Digest