Date: Tue, 02 Mar 2004 09:58:05 -0800 From: eskrima-request@martialartsresource.net Subject: Eskrima digest, Vol 11 #84 - 8 msgs X-Mailer: Mailman v2.0.13.cisto1 MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Errors-To: eskrima-admin@martialartsresource.net X-BeenThere: eskrima@martialartsresource.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13.cisto1 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net X-Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net X-Subscribed-Address: fma@martialartsresource.com List-Id: Eskrima-FMA discussion forum, the premier FMA forum on the Internet. List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Unsubscribe: , List-Help: Status: O X-Status: X-Keywords: Send Eskrima mailing list submissions to eskrima@martialartsresource.net To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/eskrima or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to eskrima-request@martialartsresource.net You can reach the person managing the list at eskrima-admin@martialartsresource.net When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific than "Re: Contents of Eskrima digest..." <<---- The Sudlud-Inayan Eskrima/Kali/Arnis/FMA mailing list ---->> Serving the Internet since June 1994. Copyright 1994-2004: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource The Internet's premier discussion forum devoted to Filipino Martial Arts. 1800 members. Provided in memory of Mangisursuro Michael G. Inay (1944-2000). See the Filipino Martial Arts (FMA) FAQ and the online search engine for back issues of the Eskrima/FMA list at http://MartialArtsResource.com Mabuhay ang eskrima! Today's Topics: 1. Atienza kali and more! (Steven Lefebvre) 2. Esttacada or Estokada?/garimot seminar (GatPuno@aol.com) 3. the historical veracity of...(insert any martial art here) (Michael Massie) 4. Re: Atienza kali and more! (Steve Ames) 5. Re: the historical veracity of...(insert any martial art here) (Ray Terry) 6. Enough (Ray Terry) 7. Dos Manos/Flexible weapons (R. Trent Codd, III, MA, LPC) --__--__-- Message: 1 From: "Steven Lefebvre" To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Date: Tue, 02 Mar 2004 12:07:06 +0000 Subject: [Eskrima] Atienza kali and more! Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Hello Everyone, Check out the new clip from the Atienza Kali group!! http://www.atienza-kali.com/video/specialweapons.mov or download it from the video gallery, first clip in the list http://www.atienzakali.com/pages/videogallery2.html Very cool stuff!!! Also, in regards to Blaise Loong, wasn't the original post about where he learned "Norse arts"? This question was mentioned several times, by various martial artists, while I was teaching in Sweden. Gumagalang Guro Steve L. www.Bujinkandojo.net _________________________________________________________________ Store more e-mails with MSN Hotmail Extra Storage – 4 plans to choose from! http://click.atdmt.com/AVE/go/onm00200362ave/direct/01/ --__--__-- Message: 2 From: GatPuno@aol.com Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 07:17:46 EST To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net CC: diggs333@ameritech.net Subject: [Eskrima] Esttacada or Estokada?/garimot seminar Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net In a message dated 3/2/04 6:50:09 AM Eastern Standard Time, eskrima-request@martialartsresource.net writes: > Estacada is the personal art of William (Bill) Schettino, who has been one > of my teachers for the past 10 years. I am honored to be one of five > instructors certified to teach Estacada to the public. My understanding of > the principles and foundations that inform the Filipino martial arts has > been greatly enhanced through the study of Estacada; Bill is, quite simply, > a master teacher and coach. He can take anyone, regardless of style and > ability, and make them better at what they do. > > Mr. Lamade, Before I comment, I just wanted to know first, what is the call to your art "Estacada" a personal art of Mr. Bill or is this the same art of the Filipino Estocada? Is this two different arts? Garimot Seminar Notice: I also want to let everyone in Chicago area to know, I will conducting two day Garimot System seminar hosted by Guro Dennis Duria of Bara-barabay Martial Art. This Saturday and Sunday March 6- and 7. The Seminar will focus on Garimot Arnis and Harimaw Buno (Filipino Wrestling). If you are interested to join the seminar contact Dennis (see info at the www.garimot.com) --__--__-- Message: 3 From: "Michael Massie" To: Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 07:56:15 -0600 Subject: [Eskrima] the historical veracity of...(insert any martial art here) Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Interesting remarks, Phil. I'd like to address one of them. You stated: Phil, I have to point something out here. You are insinuating that information found on the "web" is always to be questioned (which it is) and therefore subject to scrutiny (another true statement), yet you are saying that your source of verification in investigating such matters is (surprise) the "web." Seems like you're applying a double-standard here; i.e., "the information on website A is suspect and therefore subject to scrutiny because I don't know anything about the guy who owns the site, but website B must be a bastion of intellectual integrity because I know something about the guy who owns the site." I am sure you can see why a person might question this line of reasoning. But, however flawed your reasoning is in this particular instance, I must commend you for questioning and investigating information you find on the internet. We have a situation in the martial arts world today where hype is almost generally accepted as gospel and those who are popular, of high rank, or are the head of a system are rarely taken to task on the claims they make. We have all heard fantastic stories from high-ranking martial artists that we know are, at best, exaggerated versions of the truth, and at worst, unadulterated lies. While these tales of derring-do might be entertaining at cocktail parties and around campfires, the proliferation of such hogwash makes the martial arts as a whole look very suspect as a legitimate practice in the eyes of the general public. As for Blaise, he researches historically accurate methods of combat and experiments to determine their efficacy. He's not claiming to have channeled the spirit of an ancient Roman gladiator and learned the secrets of Pammachon from him; he's just taking a unique approach to his training and growth. Hell, aren't you curious as to how guys who faced cold steel every single day of their lives survived? I am - and if someone has done their research and can share some of those methods with me, I am all for it. Although this line of discussion was sparked by your comments about Blaise, it actually indicates a greater issue - the validity of *all* modern martial arts practices as legitimately effective and historically accurate forms of armed and unarmed combat. Really, who is to say that your kali or arnis is more authentic than my escrima, or that it is closer to "the way it was done in the old days"? (Man, if I have a buck for every time I have heard that...) Truth be told, every single system can be traced back to some guy or gal that had an insight, inspiration, or idea that allowed him or her to swing a stick or sword a little bit better than the next person, but it is nearly impossible to determine whether the art practiced today is identical to what the founder originally conceived and taught. You may think that Blaise's sources are questionable, and that's your right. But, I'll bet that I'd instantly become the pariah of this list if I started attacking the "blind princess" story or whether Chief Lapu-Lapu was actually a "great" warrior. Maybe she was actually only blind in one eye, or he just got lucky that day when he faced Magellan - who knows? So, one man's sacred cow is another man's beef. You can take that for what it's worth. Michael D. Massie MD Marketing, LLC E-mail massie@small-dojo-big-profits.com Web www.small-dojo-big-profits.com ~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~ "It is not the critic who counts: not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles or where the doer of deeds could have done better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena, whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood, who strives valiantly, who errs and comes up short again and again, because there is no effort without error or shortcoming, but who knows the great enthusiasms, the great devotions, who spends himself for a worthy cause; who, at the best, knows, in the end, the triumph of high achievement, and who, at the worst, if he fails, at least he fails while daring greatly, so that his place shall never be with those cold and timid souls who knew neither victory nor defeat." President Theodore Roosevelt "Citizenship in a Republic," Speech at the Sorbonne, Paris, April 23, 1910 --__--__-- Message: 4 Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 11:52:36 -0500 From: Steve Ames To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Subject: Re: [Eskrima] Atienza kali and more! Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net On Tue, Mar 02, 2004 at 12:07:06PM +0000, Steven Lefebvre wrote: > Hello Everyone, > > Check out the new clip from the Atienza Kali group!! > > > http://www.atienza-kali.com/video/specialweapons.mov Every wonder why in demos the "attacker" is moving slow and leaving their limbs laying out/around while the "defender" moves around them like a dervish cutting/beating them down? Heh. This one wasn't quite that exagerrated but clearly the defender is still moving WAY faster than the attacker. Just one of my pet peeves. -Steve --__--__-- Message: 5 From: Ray Terry Subject: Re: [Eskrima] the historical veracity of...(insert any martial art here) To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 07:28:10 -0800 (PST) Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net > But, I'll bet that I'd instantly become the pariah of this list if I started > attacking the "blind princess" story or whether Chief Lapu-Lapu was actually a > "great" warrior. Maybe she was actually only blind in one eye, or he just got > lucky that day when he faced Magellan - who knows? Actually I suspect most here would ask those same questions... Ray Terry rterry@idiom.com --__--__-- Message: 6 From: Ray Terry To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net (Eskrima) Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 09:55:01 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Eskrima] Enough Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Folks, For some reason I continue to receive "Blaise is a great guy" emails. Enough, please.!. I don't recall seeing anyone indicate that Blaise was a "bad guy" or that he didn't train hard or whatever. I also don't recall seeing any serious attacks on him, only a few basic questions. So again, stop with the Blaise is great guy emails. The point has been made and any more similar comments will simply be deleted. Thanks for understanding. Ray Terry rterry@idiom.com --__--__-- Message: 7 From: "R. Trent Codd, III, MA, LPC" To: Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 13:37:31 -0500 Subject: [Eskrima] Dos Manos/Flexible weapons Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Can anyone recommend good dos manos and flexible weapons videos? Thanks. Trent --__--__-- _______________________________________________ Eskrima mailing list Eskrima@martialartsresource.net http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/eskrima http://eskrima-fma.net Old digest issues @ ftp://ftp.martialartsresource.com/pub/eskrima Copyright 1994-2004: Ray Terry, MartialArtsResource.com, Sudlud.com Standard disclaimers apply. 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