Date: Fri, 26 Mar 2004 12:08:02 -0800 From: eskrima-request@martialartsresource.net Subject: Eskrima digest, Vol 11 #131 - 14 msgs X-Mailer: Mailman v2.0.13.cisto1 MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Errors-To: eskrima-admin@martialartsresource.net X-BeenThere: eskrima@martialartsresource.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13.cisto1 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net X-Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net X-Subscribed-Address: fma@martialartsresource.com List-Id: Eskrima-FMA discussion forum, the premier FMA forum on the Internet. List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Unsubscribe: , List-Help: Status: RO X-Status: X-Keywords: Send Eskrima mailing list submissions to eskrima@martialartsresource.net To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/eskrima or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to eskrima-request@martialartsresource.net You can reach the person managing the list at eskrima-admin@martialartsresource.net When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific than "Re: Contents of Eskrima digest..." <<---- The Sudlud-Inayan Eskrima/Kali/Arnis/FMA mailing list ---->> Serving the Internet since June 1994. Copyright 1994-2004: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource The Internet's premier discussion forum devoted to Filipino Martial Arts. 1800 members. Provided in memory of Mangisursuro Michael G. Inay (1944-2000). See the Filipino Martial Arts (FMA) FAQ and the online search engine for back issues of the Eskrima/FMA list at http://MartialArtsResource.com Mabuhay ang eskrima! Today's Topics: 1. Thank you (GatPuno@aol.com) 2. Re: Sword incident in England (randy at SPiNInternetMedia.com) 3. Re: Lock-blade Knives (Sam Bell Jr) 4. Re: Lockblade Knives (Kel620@aol.com) 5. Re: Lock Blade Knives (Scott Kinney) 6. One more time Guru Abon (rockypasiwk) 7. Ray the critic (rockypasiwk) 8. Re: Re: Lock Blade Knives (Ray Terry) 9. Re: Re: Lockblade Knives (Ray Terry) 10. Gat Puno's Challenges and Paete (jay de leon) 11. The Edge 2004 Tournament Updates (Larry St. Clair) 12. Maha Guru 'Pak' Victor de Thouars Pentjak Silat Serak Seminar in SF Bay Area (bjl@stillnessinmotion.com) 13. The Kublan (Ray Terry) --__--__-- Message: 1 From: GatPuno@aol.com Date: Fri, 26 Mar 2004 07:29:49 EST To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Subject: [Eskrima] Thank you Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net In a message dated 3/26/04 6:47:29 AM Eastern Standard Time, eskrima-request@martialartsresource.net writes: > Gat Puno Baet, > > Thank you for responding and lending some clarity to the subject. If Al > Sardinas explained things in the manner that you do, there would be less > arguing and more learning. > > You clearly have nothing to prove. > > Respectfully, > > Steve Kohn > > Steve, Thank you too, for understanding and now we can put this topic on rest. Let enjoy the new topic that will be on the table. I think we all learn something on this thread, positive and negative is both worth learning. We cannot find the good answer without the negative answer. So its worth talking about it in a gentle manner. Salamat/Thanks Gat Puno Abon "Garimot" Baet Laguna Arnis Federation International World Harimaw Buno Federation Hilot Research Center USA --__--__-- Message: 2 Date: Fri, 26 Mar 2004 04:44:41 -0800 (PST) From: "randy at SPiNInternetMedia.com" Subject: Re: [Eskrima] Sword incident in England To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Thanks a bunch for the link!!! ---------------------------------------------------- First published on Thursday 25 March 2004: Samurai sword death attacker jailed for 8 years A WALKDEN drug dealer has started an eight-year jail sentence for stabbing a 37-year-old Salford robber to death with a samurai sword. Carl Lindsay, aged 25, of Hollyoake Road, Walkden, was cleared of murdering Stephen Swindells on the 11th day of the 16 day trial at Manchester Crown Court, but was convicted of manslaughter. The jury heard how drug dealer Lindsay was in his Walkden flat at 9.45pm on February 27, 2003 when he answered the door to four men carrying loaded handguns. One of them was Mr Swindells, aged 33, of Harwood Court, Salford and he was accompanied by Darren Ashton, 29, of Coniston Avenue, Little Hulton, 30-year-old David Ryan, of Culverwell Drive, Salford and Michael Page, 25, of Trentlamlawns, Salford. The court was told the men had gone to Lindsay's flat to rob him. They demanded cash and searched the dealer before Lindsay suddenly whirled round holding a 12 inch samurai sword at shoulder height. The gang fled with about £200 but dropped half of it as they ran. There was a scuffle in the hallway during which Lindsay stabbed Swindells four times in the back. He died soon afterwards from massive blood loss. Jailing Lindsay for eight years Mr Justice Hughes said the dealer had been severely provoked and initially acted in self defence. "As they fled you stabbed one assailant four times in the back," he told Lindsay. "You took a life by deliberate retaliation using a lethal weapon you kept in your home when aware you were a high risk target." Appearing in the dock alongside Lindsay were the robbers Ashton, Ryan and Page. There were loud gasps from the public gallery when they were each jailed for 14 years for armed robbery. Speaking after the trial Det Chief Insp Sam Haworth said: "Four men, including the victim, had set out purposefully to rob Lindsay and this intent ultimately led to Stephen Swindell's death. "I believe the sentences passed reflect the severity of the circumstances." ; ) .randy --- Argyll wrote: > >"randy at SPiNInternetMedia.com" randomx2000@yahoo.com > >Subject: Re: [Eskrima] Sword incident in England > > >Can anyone supply a URL to a news article regarding this story? > > > Here you go: > > http://www.thisislancashire.co.uk/lancashire/archive/2004/03/25/NEWS8ZM. > html > > Best regards, > > Jake __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Finance Tax Center - File online. File on time. http://taxes.yahoo.com/filing.html --__--__-- Message: 3 From: "Sam Bell Jr" To: Date: Fri, 26 Mar 2004 08:42:32 -0500 Subject: [Eskrima] Re: Lock-blade Knives Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net I have both of Datu Kelly Worden's Timberline Worden folders, the model # 11231 and the 11291. The 11231 has around a 3 1/2" blade and really rides in a pocket well, due to its great clip. The 11291 has a 4" blade and for its size rides well too. I have some really big hands and even the smaller 11231 fits well, both seem to have very strong locks also. Just my 2 cents worth, Sam --__--__-- Message: 4 From: Kel620@aol.com Date: Fri, 26 Mar 2004 09:15:40 EST To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Subject: [Eskrima] Re: Lockblade Knives Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net My favorites... Benchmade AFCK Spyderco Gunting Spyderco Endura II Buck 110 CRKT Kasper-Crawford Fighting Folder REKAT Carnivore Spyderco Persian Timberline WorTac _http://www.benchmade.com_ (http://www.benchmade.com) _http://www.spyderco.com_ (http://www.spyderco.com) Good company to purchase a knife... _http://www.newgraham.com_ (http://www.newgraham.com) . --__--__-- Message: 5 From: "Scott Kinney" To: Date: Fri, 26 Mar 2004 09:32:14 -0500 Subject: [Eskrima] Re: Lock Blade Knives Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net "Better" is going to depend on your tastes and other requirements. In addition to liner-locked folders, there are other systems. Round Eye Knife and Tool (REKAT) offers a cam-lock system which creates a very positive lock when opened. Either Cold Steel or Benchmade (I forget which at the moment) offer a similar mechanism that they call an Axis Lock. These locks take a little more momentum to snap open. And, there are many different materials used to make the grips (or 'scales' as they're called.) Being left-handed, having a true left-handed knife drives most of my requirements. (And cuts down my options, somewhat) My normal carry knives are a left-handed Benchmade AFCK, and a left-handed REKAT with a short Tanto blade. You've got some shopping and knife handling to do to find what's comfortable. Also, I can't stress enough real cutting and thrusting practice with your knife. I hang a fence post with bungee cords, slip on my safety glasses and go to work. That will give you some notion of what resistance and mass will do to your grip. Scott Kinney Amateur Barbarian ----- Original Message ----- > > Since one of the latest topics here was on knife drawing drills I have a > question. Can anyone suggest some of the better lock blades out there? I have > always been wary of lock blades, as most do not have a guard and I am worried > about the lock failing. I am also always worried about my hand slipping on > these knives. Thus, I am a big fan of fixed blades with good guards. But lock > blades are just so compact and conveinient... and with today's technology I am > curious if there aren't any lock-blade knives that have great grips. Thanks in > advanced for any help. > > - Tyrkon - --__--__-- Message: 6 From: "rockypasiwk" To: Date: Fri, 26 Mar 2004 09:35:30 -0500 Subject: [Eskrima] One more time Guru Abon Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Guru Abon, I was reading your post about your home town, I know this may sound like I am slow and just don't get it, but can you explain your name again!. Is Gat Puno a title ? or a name, I am thinking know it is a title, if so what does it mean? Is Abon your first name, and Baet your last name? and Gaimot your middle name or is it a name you use to honor your mothers side of the familly, like your mothers fathers last name, or is it used to honor a family art? Sorry if I seem a bit slow on the up take, its just most Gm's Ihave met have a basic first and last name, ex. Remy Presas, or Ted Buot. Are names used different from different towns or villages. Thanks Rocky --__--__-- Message: 7 From: "rockypasiwk" To: Date: Fri, 26 Mar 2004 09:45:38 -0500 Subject: [Eskrima] Ray the critic Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net I read Rays posting on his Blaise Long take, he seemed fair and honest to me, he was asked his opinion of the quality of the material being presented, or how it was presented and he simply did not think it was up to par, he never said the guy wasn't up to par, or that he was no good, or any such personal attack, he simply said the instructional video was not the best he has ever seen. If one wishes for you to "Opine" ( Check it out Crafty, Rocky learned a new word :-) then one should be willing to accept one's findings. Rocky --__--__-- Message: 8 From: Ray Terry Subject: Re: [Eskrima] Re: Lock Blade Knives To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Date: Fri, 26 Mar 2004 07:04:05 -0800 (PST) Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net > Also, I can't stress enough real cutting and thrusting practice with > your knife. I hang a fence post with bungee cords, slip on my > safety glasses and go to work. That will give you some notion of > what resistance and mass will do to your grip. Good advice. Also try that with a bit of K-Y on the handle since blood may be present and blood is rather slippery. But be careful... Ray Terry rterry@idiom.com --__--__-- Message: 9 From: Ray Terry Subject: Re: [Eskrima] Re: Lockblade Knives To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Date: Fri, 26 Mar 2004 07:07:04 -0800 (PST) Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net > My favorites... > Benchmade AFCK > Spyderco Gunting > Spyderco Endura II > Buck 110 > CRKT Kasper-Crawford Fighting Folder > ... I have the Pat Crawford version of this folder. An excellent choice. I'm sure the CRKT flavor is much more affordable. Ray Terry rterry@idiom.com --__--__-- Message: 10 From: "jay de leon" To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Cc: theclassic33@hotmail.com Date: Fri, 26 Mar 2004 16:39:49 +0000 Subject: [Eskrima] Gat Puno's Challenges and Paete Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Gat Puno Abon, Thank you for the kind words regarding challenges, and your own stories about them. I have to point out that it is indeed unique, and impressive, that Paete's dominant (only?) martial arts school is an FMA school. I have been to Paete a few times to play tourist. I wish I knew then about your family's school. I remember the woodcarvings in Paete; these woodcarvings are sold all over RP and even exported. I have been all over Laguna--Binan, Calamba, etc. You should point out that Paete is within a manageable driving distance from Manila. The scenic places you mention are considered weekend getaway destinations for Manilenos, or even tourists. As you can see, I enjoy Philippine travelogues almost as much as martial arts, so keep them coming. Salamat po, Jay de Leon _________________________________________________________________ Is your PC infected? Get a FREE online computer virus scan from McAfee® Security. http://clinic.mcafee.com/clinic/ibuy/campaign.asp?cid=3963 --__--__-- Message: 11 From: "Larry St. Clair" To: Date: Fri, 26 Mar 2004 12:28:53 -0600 Subject: [Eskrima] The Edge 2004 Tournament Updates Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Hey Everyone, Just a few things to update you on. The deadline for Late Registration is today so please contact us ASAP if you are thinking of registering for the event. We are proud to announce that we have 20 solid competitors gearing up for the event which is just one week away! This week gave us heavy action with three new sponsors joining up with The Edge. We are proud to mention that Pointman Productions has signed on again and donated prizes for the event. For the best in martial arts videos and equipment check out www.pointmanproductions.com. Also back with us this year is Cold Steel! As most of you know, Cold Steel makes the strongest knives on the market and really have some razor sharp concepts when it comes to the bladed industry. Check out there stock at www.coldsteel.com. We are also very happy and excited about our new sponsor this year, ActionFlex! They will be flying in to host both a booth with equipment for everyone to see as well as sponsoring our event with their padded sticks for the competitors. They just recently have a new head gear and glove that everyone should check out. For the safest, most durable padded weaponry check out www.actionflex.com. Literally just one week away! The Edge 2004 is truly ramping up to be a great show. Advanced tickets are still on sale until next Friday, April 2nd so purchase them while you can for only $10. You can call 512 339-8264 or purchase them online at www.edgefighting.com. Tickets will also be available at the door for $15. The Edge 2004 will begin at 11:00 AM at Givens Recreation Center. Givens Recreation Center is conveniently located at 3811 East 12th Street near the intersection of Airport Boulevard just East of IH-35. We hope to see you all there! Sincerely, Larry St. Clair Center of Martial Arts The Edge 2004 More information on The Edge 2004 can be found at the website http://www.edgefighting.com or by calling (512) 339-8264. --__--__-- Message: 12 Date: Fri, 26 Mar 2004 11:17:47 -0800 (PST) From: bjl@stillnessinmotion.com To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Subject: [Eskrima] Maha Guru 'Pak' Victor de Thouars Pentjak Silat Serak Seminar in SF Bay Area Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Maha Guru Pak Victor de Thouars will teach a Pentjak Silat Serak seminar in the San Francisco Bay Area on Saturday April 24th from 12pm till 7pm. The seminar will take place at In Motion Center 813 San Pablo Ave. Albany, CA. Advanced reservations are required. Contact: Pembantu Guru Bernard Langan - email bernie@stillnessinmotion.com - website . Phone 510-527-7760 voicemail. 510-528-9560 school. The cost of the seminar is $120.00. There will be a one hour lunch break. --__--__-- Message: 13 From: Ray Terry To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net (Eskrima) Date: Fri, 26 Mar 2004 12:47:07 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Eskrima] The Kublan Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net fyi... >From Taekwondo Times, January 2004. The Kublan, Ninja Warriors of the Philippines No nation has a monopoly on stealth, strategy or technique in the martial arts, though some are more popular than others to be sure. We think of Ninitsu as the Japanese art of stealth exclusively and fail to realize that other cultures' and nations have employed similar methods. One good example of the use of stealth can be found among the Kublan, considered to be sort of super-warriors or heroes of the Philippines. The term Kublan translates as "tough skin" and is derived from the work kubal meaning callous. This alludes to a supposed immunity to wounds obtained in ancient times from bladed weapons and in more modern times from firearms. That is, certain beliefs held by these warriors convinced them that they were invulnerable to bullets and arrows, spears, lances, daggers, swords, and the like. In other words, that the body of the Kublan warrior could not be penetrated by an enemy's weapons. Of course, we must also include in this that such beliefs contended that a mans body was also impervious to blows, strikes and kicks in empty-hand combat. In order to possess this magical or supernatural power, one had not only to train in the martial arts (particularly Kali, the ancient Philippine martial art of blade, stick and foot-fighting) but also had to possess certain amulets know as anting-anting and be able to recite certain prayers called orasyones. Additionally, certain lotions and potions were used. These secret mixtures utilized coconut oil, usually from a plant (coconuts are not true trees) bearing one coconut or fermented coconut water (milk) and coconut wine (lambanog). This latter drink, taken before battle, is very potent, somewhat akin to grappa and vodka. Those familiar with the iron-vest and similar Kung-Fu topics will understand the practice of flagellation. This practice, used during religious seasons or for physical training, also contributed to the skin-toughening process as the fact that many warriors near the costal regions were exposed to sun and salt water on a daily basis. The use of charms, amulets, talismans and such also evoked other legendary ninja-like powers such as flying abilities, the ability to lean over high barriers and walls, becoming invisible, staying dry in rain (especially during a typhoon), being able to walk long distances without tiring, becoming invisible, and being in two places at once. Any discussion of the mystical power of the Kublan with Filipinos -- whether practitioners of martial arts or not -- is extremely difficult for several reasons. First, it is a subject fraught with intense emotionalism; the Filipino is apt to feel one's inquiry is to belittle or debunk such beliefs and practices. The native Filipino will often feign complete ignorance of the practices or relegate such beliefs to barrio folk or those uneducated. He will tend to dismiss such as mere superstition, myth and custom. Secondly, if anyone has true knowledge, he is not going to impart it to anyone except members of his family and close followers, or he will deny any knowledge of the practices altogether. Such people do not advertise their powers and abilities and few know about them, except through hearsay and gossip, thus keeping such arts secret, another ninja-like characteristic. Thirdly, there are special conditions governing how such things can be passed on or handed down. Most amulets and true anting-anting obtain their power on a local basis; that is, their power is derived from supernatural and natural forces located in certain places. Hence, transportation of an amulet made on one island might not work on another and probably not in a foreign country. Such agimat or mutva, as some charms are termed, have only meaning for the holder of such, since they are obtained by undergoing certain tests and trials, much like the sashes and belts of certain martial arts that have no validity outside of their systems. So, before ridiculing the use of amulets by ancient warriors, the modern practitioner should consider his own rank belt since it has -- or should have -- a certain magical quality to it and a deep emotional significance symbolic of strain, sweat, pain, and practice. All these aids to psychophysical training of the Kublan are just that, but when combined with incantations and trance-states induced by the use of herbs and narcotic plants, they tended to make formidable warriors. The Spanish invaders of the Philippines from the time of Magellan in 1521 knew of the ferocity of Filipino warriors, as did the Americans who, in 1898, began a takeover of the Philippine Archipelago of over 7000 islands. The term, "running amuck" refers to such warriors, called juramentado by the Spanish and collies from the Filipino word amok. Along with bundok (boondocks) and yo-yo, it is one of the few words of Philippine origin to enter the American vocabulary. A modern, ninja-like Filipino, known as "Boy Putik" was a notorious outlaw or bandit with the ability to disappear into caribao (water-buffalo) mud wallows. The word putik literally means mud. Commander Putik is said to have inherited an anting-anting from another bandit, Tiagong Akyat. Like ninja, these two had contradictory aspects to their careers. To the common people, they were often viewed as Robin Hoods while to government authorities they were viewed as rebels, bandits and outlaws. Like ninja, the names they used were not their true names, and frequently assumed such titles as "Kummander," "Colonel" and "Kapitan." These titles sometimes served to mask the fact they worked alone as well as to deceive others into thinking they had followers. Some did have followers but the exact numbers were seldom known. They also had, sometime to their undoing, a host of imitators who attempted to emulate them. Another ninja-like character was "Boy Pana"; his name literally meaning "Boy Dart" or "Boy Arrow." The word pana refers to a bow and arrows but can include any number of projectiles and might be termed the Philippines' shuriken. Boy Pana was remarkably ingenious at making weapons from crude and scrap materials and became a notorious character like Boy Putik, both of whose lives were made into movies in the Philippines. The yoyo, considered a harmless toy in the U. S., is actually a weapon. In the hands of an expert, it can be a ninja-like weapon in that it can be concealed, for example, in the palm of the hand and quickly thrown and as quickly retrieved often before the victim realizes it -- thus giving rise to the "no contact punch" or "the strike over distance": the invisible punch. Darts, needles and other objects that can be thrown or hurled could be dipped in poisons, usually from the resin of a particular tree known as the quemanda. Like the ninja of Japan, the Kublan warriors of the Philippines were sometimes adept at concocting poisons and their antidotes. Specialists arose in this esoteric aspect of medicine that could kill or cure and were combined with massage and manipulation techniques that could do the same. Herbalarios and hilots arose and can be found today in the Philippines along with the famous or infamous (whichever your viewpoint) psychic surgeon who presumably can pluck out diseased organs in bloodless operations. The use of bamboo for weapons, traps and breathing tubes for underwater concealment were part of the Philippine warrior training while carrying young coconuts around insured fresh and safe water, especially on sea voyages. An enormous amount of weaponry, particularly bladed ones, can be found in the Philippines to this day, all utilized and developed by ancient Filipino warriors and tested in actual, hand-to-hand combat, much like those of the Japanese Probably the most famous ancient Philippine warrior and a national hero is Lapu-Lapu, the man reputed to have slain Magellan in 1521. Aside from the system of Arnis named after him, Lapu-Lapu is said to have performed legendary feats such as being able to thrust a spear through a coconut plant, hurling a carabao about by its tail, and defeating multiple opponents in combat. Moreover, Lapu-Lapu possessed a huge broadsword (kampilan) and an anting-anting that helped him to repel the Spanish invaders, according to verbal legends handed down from generation to generation. Much more could be written about the exploits of the ancient Philippine warriors who practiced "ninja-like" tactics over the centuries, but that's the makings of a book! ABOUT THE AUTHOR: Halford E. Jones is a freelance writer and a practitioner of Philippine martial arts living in New Hampshire. --__--__-- _______________________________________________ Eskrima mailing list Eskrima@martialartsresource.net http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/eskrima http://eskrima-fma.net Old digest issues @ ftp://ftp.martialartsresource.com/pub/eskrima Copyright 1994-2004: Ray Terry, MartialArtsResource.com, Sudlud.com Standard disclaimers apply. Remember September 11. End of Eskrima Digest