Date: Fri, 30 Apr 2004 03:01:50 -0700 From: eskrima-request@martialartsresource.net Subject: Eskrima digest, Vol 11 #171 - 9 msgs X-Mailer: Mailman v2.0.13.cisto1 MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Errors-To: eskrima-admin@martialartsresource.net X-BeenThere: eskrima@martialartsresource.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13.cisto1 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net X-Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net X-Subscribed-Address: fma@martialartsresource.com List-Id: Eskrima-FMA discussion forum, the premier FMA forum on the Internet. List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Unsubscribe: , List-Help: Status: O X-Status: X-Keywords: Send Eskrima mailing list submissions to eskrima@martialartsresource.net To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/eskrima or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to eskrima-request@martialartsresource.net You can reach the person managing the list at eskrima-admin@martialartsresource.net When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific than "Re: Contents of Eskrima digest..." <<---- The Sudlud-Inayan Eskrima/Kali/Arnis/FMA mailing list ---->> Serving the Internet since June 1994. Copyright 1994-2004: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource The Internet's premier discussion forum devoted to Filipino Martial Arts. 1900 members. Provided in memory of Mangisursuro Michael G. Inay (1944-2000). See the Filipino Martial Arts (FMA) FAQ and the online search engine for back issues of the Eskrima/FMA digest at http://MartialArtsResource.com Mabuhay ang eskrima! Today's Topics: 1. A Point of Information - Modern Arnis for College Credit in USA (Absolom Jones) 2. Crossfit.com and FMA (Ralph G.) 3. Machetes lose to guns in Thailand (Marc Denny) 4. Follow-up to machete vs. guns (Marc Denny) 5. Kali / Kalis (Marc Scott) 6. Clint Cayson's Arnis in Schools (jay de leon) 7. Re: Kali / Kalis (Ray Terry) 8. Re: Crossfit.com and FMA (jmarana@verizon.net) 9. (no subject) (George Storm) --__--__-- Message: 1 From: "Absolom Jones" To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Date: Thu, 29 Apr 2004 13:34:28 +0000 Subject: [Eskrima] A Point of Information - Modern Arnis for College Credit in USA Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Ccayson@bocaresort.com, has written the following comment: > >Hello everyone! > >Modern Arnis was used to be taught in the major Colleges in Manila ang >nearby >provinces on 70's to 80's. Now is just taught as College Student Club not >elective PE like it used to. May be some school still used Arnis but not >Modern >Arnis in particular. And how to pick a instructor, well is the same as >they >promote you to be a black belt, then you can teach Arnis before, like I did >on >1978, I was tested by Senior Blackbelt Willy Annang, my Certificate is >signed >by Professor Remy Presas before I even become a Blackbelt. I know this is >not >happening now. Like other MA Arnis is only found in small student Arnis >Club. > I would just like to inform everyone that there is a Modern Arnis program being taught for college credit by Dr. Jerome Barber, at Erie Community College in Orchard Park, NY. The program has been running since 1987 and was given a written seal of approval by GM Remy Presas in 1991. If anyone would like more info on the program you can reach Dr. Barber at . Respectfully, Absolom _________________________________________________________________ FREE pop-up blocking with the new MSN Toolbar – get it now! http://toolbar.msn.com/go/onm00200415ave/direct/01/ --__--__-- Message: 2 Date: Thu, 29 Apr 2004 08:10:16 -0700 (PDT) From: "Ralph G." To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Subject: [Eskrima] Crossfit.com and FMA Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Does anyone here supplement their FMA training with the workouts provided at www.crossfit.com? The site claims to provide the best in strength and conditioning for sport activity, especially physical activity related to martial arts and law enforcement. They use an array of exercises including bodyweight conditioning, Olympic lifting, kettlebells, gymnastics and running (sprints mostly). I was curious as to whether anyone has seen positive results by using Crossfit.com for their FMA training. -Ralph --------------------------------- Do you Yahoo!? Win a $20,000 Career Makeover at Yahoo! HotJobs --__--__-- Message: 3 From: "Marc Denny" To: Date: Thu, 29 Apr 2004 11:53:06 -0700 Subject: [Eskrima] Machetes lose to guns in Thailand Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Woof All: The following article touches on some themes/matters of interest here: a) use of machetes b) Thailand c) rebellious Muslim minority in SE Asia >From today's online Left Angeles Times. The print version was longer (and better) Woof, Crafty Police and troops were lying in wait when the Islamic raiders attacked. The ensuing clashes and casualties underscore growing unrest in south. By Richard C. Paddock, Times Staff Writer PATTANI, Thailand - After battling authorities for months, the Islamic militants needed guns, so they planned a daring raid. Armed mainly with machetes, they would launch simultaneous attacks on police stations across southern Thailand, killing as many officers as they could. Unknown to the extremists, however, someone in their group had tipped off the police. When the rebels attacked 12 police stations at dawn Wednesday, police and soldiers were lying in wait and gunned them down. By the end of the day, 108 fighters were dead, most of them teenagers. Thai security forces, which recently suffered dozens of casualties at the hands of the extremists, did not hold back. When 30 of the fighters took refuge in a mosque, the troops fired tear gas, bullets and grenades into the building, killing every rebel inside. The militants' death toll made Wednesday one of the bloodiest days in modern Thai history. It also highlighted the extent of a growing rebellion in the south by Muslims who believe that they are mistreated by the nation's Buddhist majority. Seventeen militants were arrested during the day's fighting, which also left three police officers and two soldiers dead. Authorities defended their response to the rebel assault. "They came to attack, so the police and soldiers just defended themselves," said Interior Ministry Permanent Secretary Siwa Saengmanee. Some now worry that the rebel death toll may increase hatred of the government among Thailand's Muslims, who live mainly in the south and make up about 5% of the population. But Prime Minister Thaksin Shinawatra told reporters in Bangkok, the capital, that the fighters' deaths would help bring an end to a rebellion that had festered for decades in the southern provinces. Under Thaksin, Thailand has played down the growing rebellion and the presence of international terrorists - in part to avoid scaring off tourists and investors. But now, it will be difficult for this Southeast Asian nation to escape comparisons with two other countries in the region, Indonesia and the Philippines, where Muslim fighters have engaged in bloody clashes with Christians or government forces. For years, Thailand has been a way station for terrorists connected with the Al Qaeda network and its regional affiliate, Jemaah Islamiah, authorities say. They say at least two initial meetings to plan the October 2002 bombings in Bali, Indonesia, were held in Thailand. Last year, Hambali, allegedly a top figure in Al Qaeda, was arrested in central Thailand. Authorities also broke up what they said was a plot by Muslims in southern Thailand to bomb popular tourist destinations in the country. It is unclear whether Al Qaeda and Jemaah Islamiah have forged links with the rebel movement in southern Thailand, but authorities believe that some extremists from the region may have received training in Afghanistan or Indonesia. Southern Thailand, particularly the provinces of Pattani, Yala and Songkhla, has been volatile for years. The government had made some concessions to the Islamic community there and quelled the rebel movement a decade ago. This year it became clear that the extremists had regrouped. On Jan. 4, rebels raided an army barracks, killing four soldiers, and set 20 schools on fire. In March, they torched dozens of government buildings in coordinated attacks. More than 60 police and public officials have been killed this year. Also among the rebels' victims were Buddhist monks, who were hacked to death in the street. In recent weeks, the government has deployed heavily armed troops to patrol the region and imposed martial law in some areas. A wave of abductions has silenced government critics such as Somchai Neelahphajit. The well-known Muslim human rights lawyer, who had alleged that police tortured terrorist suspects he represented, has not been seen for six weeks. Some fear that the government's heavy-handed approach is backfiring and fueling the growth of the extremist movement. The rebels may also be moved to violence by Thailand's decision to send 450 troops to Iraq in support of the U.S.-led occupation. Not much is known about the rebels, but it is clear they are organized and highly motivated. At least 250 fighters were involved in Wednesday's raids, which took place in the three southernmost provinces, authorities said. The fighters were divided into groups of at least 20 men, with two or more leaders for each unit. Some of the combatants had automatic rifles, perhaps obtained in previous raids. But most were armed only with machetes. The government learned Monday about the planned assault and mobilized its forces to lay a trap for the rebels. "Those attackers were well trained," Defense Minister Chettha Thanajaro said in a television interview. "The police and army didn't do anything more than they should have done. They were just protecting themselves. If they hadn't, they would have suffered a lot of damage." --__--__-- Message: 4 From: "Marc Denny" To: Date: Thu, 29 Apr 2004 12:05:41 -0700 Subject: [Eskrima] Follow-up to machete vs. guns Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Thailand Guards Against Potential Attacks By ALISA TANG Associated Press Writer PATTANI, Thailand (AP) -- Thailand sent reinforcements to its Muslim-dominated south Thursday to prevent retaliatory attacks amid accusations that government forces used excessive force to repel raids on security outposts, killing more than 100 suspected militants. Frightened and angry residents said some of those killed were innocent civilians caught in the mayhem when security forces opened fire Wednesday after militants stormed 15 police and army posts in apparently coordinated attacks. The government had been tipped off about the dawn attacks in the southern provinces of Yala, Pattani and Songkhla and were lying in wait with overwhelming firepower. Human rights groups and Muslim preachers condemned Wednesday's killings and accused security personnel of responding with excessive force to attacks by poorly armed mobs, mainly teenagers. Officials have blamed escalating violence this year in southern Thailand on Islamic separatists, who have launched daily attacks killing policemen, teachers and officials from the Buddhist-dominated government. Others warned that a cycle of separatist violence would only escalate. "It is the beginning of the people's war," prominent cleric Vithaya Visetrat told The Associated Press. The United States and neighboring Malaysia also expressed concern about the violence and the Thai parliament went into a rare closed session after the opposition demanded an explanation from the government. The death toll rose to 113 after a suspected Islamic fighter died of his wounds, bringing to 108 the number of militants killed, officials said. Three police officers and two soldiers also died. Prime Minister Thaksin Shinawatra has defended the actions of the security forces and two senior cabinet ministers played down reports that the militant mobs were armed only with machetes, saying several fired automatic weapons as they led others into battle. However, after accusations of brutality, the government took away the command of a top general who used rocket-propelled grenades to attack a mosque, killing 32 people - some of them allegedly unarmed civilians. "Killing people in a holy place - in a mosque, in a monastery or in a church - is unacceptable. And I do believe that several innocent worshippers were among the dead," Vithaya, the cleric, said. In a rubber plantation village in Songkhla province, wailing mothers and fathers buried 18 men - who used to play soccer together - in an Islamic graveyard Thursday. All had been shot by police, apparently after they attacked a security checkpoint. "I am in shock," said Hayee Cheh, 44, a rubber farmer, whose 18-year-old son was among those killed. "He loved to play soccer. He only played soccer." The men, ages 15 to 30, told their parents the previous night that they want the "entire soccer team to be buried together" if something were to happen to them, said Adul Wani, a representative of the provincial government. Defense Minister Chettha Thanajaro warned that militants who survived the bloody clashes could be "waiting for the right time for revenge" and might launch "second and third waves" of attacks. The minister sent two additional battalions of 700 troops each to Thailand's southern provinces, where about 2,500 soldiers already are deployed. Chettha said each group of attackers consisted of about 20 young men, led by a commander in his mid-30s. The attackers were trained militiamen and some may have been "trained abroad," he said without elaborating. Thai newspapers described suicide-like attacks by small groups of men wearing black shirts and camouflage pants, wielding knives and machetes and shouting: "The time to liberate has come. We will die for our God!" Relatives of the suspected militants gathered Thursday at the military outposts to collect remains for quick funerals, in accordance with Muslim rites. They said they did not know why the strikes were launched, but they predicted more violence. "We are Muslims and this is not a Muslim country," said a man who identified himself only as Holi and was waiting to collect his brother's remains in Pattani. "The people in Bangkok don't understand our culture, our religion. "The people here do not like the government. There will be more trouble." Police and army patrols in Yala province scoured the hills and forests for militants. "We are 100 percent sure they will attack again. We are waiting," Sgt. Danupol U'Sae said from a police station littered with bullet casings and stained with blood. The prime minister says the insurgency is fueled by money from local drug traffickers and corrupt politicians who have reignited a decades-old separatist struggle. He denied a link to international terrorists, although al-Qaida's regional arm, Jemaah Islamiyah, is known to have had a presence in Thailand. Copyright 2004 Associated Press. All rights reserved. --__--__-- Message: 5 Date: Thu, 29 Apr 2004 09:25:21 -0700 (PDT) From: Marc Scott To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Subject: [Eskrima] Kali / Kalis Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net The following was posted on the Stick-and-Knife.com forum. http://www.stick-and-knife.com/cgi-bin/yabb/YaBB.pl In the Kalis Ilustrisimo subforum It is written by Romeo Macapagal, one of the Masters of Kalis Ilustrisimo, and the system's archivist "The word “kali” did not come about until about 20 years ago and seems to have been coined somewhere, sometime by Filipinos living in the USA. I have personally conducted a search for the word “kali” amongst old people of the major tribes and, except for “kalis” which means sword and “kali” in Ilocano, which means “a hole in the ground”; there is no other word or cognate of “kali”. Ilustrisimo used “kali” on the instance of Mr. Leo Gaje who had visited with Tatang and also by an American anthropologist specializing in haplology (which is a study of handheld, non-missile weapons), who seemed to have picked it up from Dan Inosanto’s book. When I joined Tatang, “Kali Ilustrisimo” had been registered for about two or three years. Tony Diego and I, after the research mentioned, decided that “Kalis” is the more appropriate word because it means “sword” and would then mean the “Sword of Ilustrisimo”. The name has not been formally registered except on a website but we had decided on this even when Tatang was still active and alive. I am enclosing a picture where a t-shirt worn by Yuli Romo clearly states “Kalis” with the old man in the foreground and Tony Diego in the background. This is to clarify information that “kalis” is a postmortem change. " __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Win a $20,000 Career Makeover at Yahoo! HotJobs http://hotjobs.sweepstakes.yahoo.com/careermakeover --__--__-- Message: 6 From: "jay de leon" To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Cc: theclassic33@hotmail.com Date: Thu, 29 Apr 2004 17:01:38 +0000 Subject: [Eskrima] Clint Cayson's Arnis in Schools Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net During the 70's and 80's Arnis was taught in >schools in fact it was not an option during that time. I was one a student >(way back 1970's) from a public school in Mindanao... Moro-moro and doce >pares >are the traditional and common. Can you tell us what cities, towns or provinces this took place? I did read that you mentioned Iligan City. Would you characterize these programs/styles as more northern or Visayan, versus Muslim influenced? Also, during this time, did you see any silat or kuntao, whether as part of the school programs or in commercial form? Thanks, Jay de Leon _________________________________________________________________ Lose those love handles! MSN Fitness shows you two moves to slim your waist. http://fitness.msn.com/articles/feeds/article.aspx?dept=exercise&article=et_pv_030104_lovehandles --__--__-- Message: 7 From: Ray Terry Subject: Re: [Eskrima] Kali / Kalis To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Date: Thu, 29 Apr 2004 14:29:02 -0700 (PDT) Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net > ... and also by an > American anthropologist specializing in haplology > (which is a study of handheld, non-missile weapons), He probably meant hoplology, the study of human combative behavior. Ray Terry rterry@idiom.com --__--__-- Message: 8 From: To: CC: Subject: Re: [Eskrima] Crossfit.com and FMA Date: Thu, 29 Apr 2004 18:35:44 -0500 Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Ralph, Travis Downing and Joey Pena of Integrated Martial Arts (www.intmartialarts.com) use Crossfit and have said very positive things about the program. Joe > > From: "Ralph G." > Date: 2004/04/29 Thu AM 10:10:16 CDT > To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net > Subject: [Eskrima] Crossfit.com and FMA > > Does anyone here supplement their FMA training with the workouts provided at www.crossfit.com? > > The site claims to provide the best in strength and conditioning for sport activity, especially physical activity related to martial arts and law enforcement. They use an array of exercises including bodyweight conditioning, Olympic lifting, kettlebells, gymnastics and running (sprints mostly). > > I was curious as to whether anyone has seen positive results by using Crossfit.com for their FMA training. > > -Ralph > > > --------------------------------- > Do you Yahoo!? > Win a $20,000 Career Makeover at Yahoo! HotJobs > _______________________________________________ > Eskrima mailing list, 1900 members > Eskrima@martialartsresource.net > Copyright 1994-2004: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource > Standard disclaimers apply > http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/eskrima --__--__-- Message: 9 From: "George Storm" To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Date: Thu, 29 Apr 2004 14:57:13 -0700 Subject: [Eskrima] (no subject) Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Can we rather safely assume that Guru Lamont Norshadow was Barber's first student? LOL <><><><> George S. I would just like to inform everyone that there is a Modern Arnis program being taught for college credit by Dr. Jerome Barber, at Erie Community College in Orchard Park, NY. The program has been running since 1987 and was given a written seal of approval by GM Remy Presas in 1991. If anyone would like more info on the program you can reach Dr. Barber at . Respectfully, Absolom _________________________________________________________________ FREE pop-up blocking with the new MSN Toolbar ? get it now! http://toolbar.msn.com/go/onm00200415ave/direct/01/ _______________________________________________ Eskrima mailing list, 1900 members Eskrima@martialartsresource.net Copyright 1994-2004: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource Standard disclaimers apply http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/eskrima _________________________________________________________________ Watch LIVE baseball games on your computer with MLB.TV, included with MSN Premium! http://join.msn.com/?page=features/mlb&pgmarket=en-us/go/onm00200439ave/direct/01/ --__--__-- _______________________________________________ Eskrima mailing list Eskrima@martialartsresource.net http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/eskrima http://eskrima-fma.net Old digest issues @ ftp://ftp.martialartsresource.com/pub/eskrima Copyright 1994-2004: Ray Terry, MartialArtsResource.com, Sudlud.com Standard disclaimers apply. Remember September 11. End of Eskrima Digest