Date: Mon, 04 Oct 2004 17:37:02 -0700 From: eskrima-request@martialartsresource.net Subject: Eskrima digest, Vol 11 #364 - 14 msgs X-Mailer: Mailman v2.0.13.cisto1 MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Errors-To: eskrima-admin@martialartsresource.net X-BeenThere: eskrima@martialartsresource.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13.cisto1 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net X-Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net X-Subscribed-Address: fma@martialartsresource.com List-Id: Eskrima-FMA discussion forum, the premier FMA forum on the Internet. List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Unsubscribe: , List-Help: Status: O X-Status: X-Keywords: Send Eskrima mailing list submissions to eskrima@martialartsresource.net To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/eskrima or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to eskrima-request@martialartsresource.net You can reach the person managing the list at eskrima-admin@martialartsresource.net When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific than "Re: Contents of Eskrima digest..." <<---- The Sudlud-Inayan Eskrima/Kali/Arnis/FMA mailing list ---->> Serving the Internet since June 1994. Copyright 1994-2004: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource The Internet's premier discussion forum devoted to Filipino Martial Arts. 1900 members. Provided in memory of Mangisursuro Michael G. Inay (1944-2000). See the Filipino Martial Arts (FMA) FAQ and the online search engine for back issues of the Eskrima/FMA digest at http://MartialArtsResource.com Mabuhay ang eskrima! Today's Topics: 1. reply to Sean Putt (fullofschist@juno.com) 2. FMA training in Big Bear? (SiliIrishman@aol.com) 3. RE: RE: The Metaphysical elements in the FMA (marko.ronkainen@nokia.com) 4. Martial Arts Being Worthless... (Bert Edens) 5. re: Chicken Steps (Bert Edens) 6. Bob Orlando (Marc Macyoung) 7. Re:Bob Orlando (Apraiser3@aol.com) 8. Re: reply to Sean Putt (WoodyTX) 9. RE: Interesting Comment 2 (1@msfencing.org) 10. National Eskritedo Federation... (Clint Cayson) 11. RE: Interesting Comment 2 (1@msfencing.org) 12. Re: Interesting Comment 2 (Ray Terry) 13. Re: Interesting Comment 2 (Aaron Alejandro) 14. Re: Cold Steel Challenge (Steve Kohn) --__--__-- Message: 1 From: "fullofschist@juno.com" Date: Mon, 4 Oct 2004 02:31:51 GMT To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Subject: [Eskrima] reply to Sean Putt Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net I agree with you on the point of keeping one's MA knowledge on the DL. If someone with ill intent knows of your skills, they're more likely to bring a weapon to attack you. It's just like if people know you carry a gun, they will attack you from behind, or just shoot first. Or both. People also tend to judge a group by the actions of one individual so if some pud sees "one karate guy get his ass kicked" he may assume all MA is useless. It's just typical shallow-mindedness. I've seen a lot of fights, and know a lot of people who have witnessed hundreds (especially COs) , and most have never seen a martial artist in a street fight. I think the reason why may be the MA mindset. Having sensitivity toward and awareness of one's surroundings allow us to avoid potentially bad situations preemptively. --Witchdoctor ________________________________________________________________ Get your name as your email address. Includes spam protection, 1GB storage, no ads and more Only $1.99/ month - visit http://www.mysite.com/name today! --__--__-- Message: 2 From: SiliIrishman@aol.com Date: Mon, 4 Oct 2004 02:40:54 EDT To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Subject: [Eskrima] FMA training in Big Bear? Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Hi, I have just relocated to Big Bear Ca, does anyone know of any FMA clubs or instructors in or around this area, any info would be greatly appreciated...Thanks J. --__--__-- Message: 3 Subject: RE: [Eskrima] RE: The Metaphysical elements in the FMA Date: Mon, 4 Oct 2004 10:16:14 +0300 From: To: Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Thanks Clint! And to everyone else who have contributed also. It seems that the Filipino beliefs and customs concerning amulets are quite similar to western/European ones. I personally wear an amulet, but it's not for protection or anything, it's more a reminder to myself to delve deeper into the things and learn the essence and true nature of everything I want to study. It's not magically charged or anything, as its purpose is to serve as a reminder. - Marko > -----Original Message----- > From: ext Clint Cayson [mailto:Ccayson@bocaresort.com] > Sent: 28 September, 2004 20:45 > To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net > Subject: [Eskrima] RE: The Metaphysical elements in the FMA > > > Hello Marko, > > I am only adding some info about your inquiries. Please > click on the link and > you will find and understand The How's and Why's... > > http://www.bakbakan.com/anting.html > > Respectfully, > > Clint > > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > Hi, > > I figured that much, I was just thinking that > since there are many who do not actively believe > in them, there also must be some of them published > somewhere. > > - Marko > _______________________________________________ > Eskrima mailing list, 1900 members > Eskrima@martialartsresource.net > Copyright 1994-2004: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource > Standard disclaimers apply > http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/eskrima --__--__-- Message: 4 Date: Mon, 04 Oct 2004 08:47:39 -0500 To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net From: Bert Edens Subject: [Eskrima] Martial Arts Being Worthless... Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net At 16:21 10/1/04, you wrote: > > I want to ask all of you if you too have experienced the notion from non > >martial artists that martial arts are worthless? > >Sure. Heard that sometimes. Never has bothered me, you learn to ignore it >pretty fast, unless it's said in some kind of challenging/threatening >manner. Mostly, though, it don't mean nothin'. Greetings, all... I've kinda viewed the martial arts as something akin to a religion or something else that is so deeply felt... Until you've done it, and it's become part of your being, you can't possible understand the benefits... Or you can, but not emotionally... "Yeah yeah yeah, I can learn to protect myself, OK, got it... So what? I got a pistol here that will do that... " Yeah, but what about when you're places you can't carry the gun? Then what? OK, enough of that :) I think that was my point :) <> - Bert Edens Springdale, Arkansas --__--__-- Message: 5 Date: Mon, 04 Oct 2004 08:53:33 -0500 To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net From: Bert Edens Subject: [Eskrima] re: Chicken Steps Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net > >So if I understand it correctly, it's basically just a stance where your > >weight remains primarily on your back foot, leaving your front foot more > >available for quick kicks, side sweeps, etc.? >Yeah, pretty much. In the female triangle, if you start with your left leg >forward and out about 45 degrees, the switch is to bring that left foot >back, and step out with the right as you turn to face off on the other >45-ish degree line. And you can just use a diamond pattern on the floor and >step around it randomly, keeping that relatively high-stepping, "walk like >a chicken" feel in mind. OK, I think I have the feel for it... I just worked on it a bit in my office here... My co-workers have long-ago quit wondering when I do things like this... :) > >But the trapezoid... How does the weight distribution change as you are >Well, if you're on the left side there, right leg back, left leg leading, >you step up with the right so you're roughly parallel with the baseline for >just a sec, then bring your left leg back to the other side (point 2) of >the base, and set your weight back as you do. You can also, of course, use >the trapezoid pattern with front-weighting, almost sama-sama. OK, I see... I was thinking more like having the front foot forward and keeping it forward as you slid the back foot, then the front foot, which would still change the angle you were facing in that trapezoid... I see what you're saying now... Thanks! > >I think it helps... As with many, it probably would help to see it in >Yep. Always does. Naturally :) > ><> >Boot to the head! ;-) Hey, I also had my head meet some concrete during a demo over the weekend... I don't need any boots to the head right now... Still getting over that mild concussion as it is... :-) <> - Bert Edens Springdale, Arkansas --__--__-- Message: 6 From: "Marc Macyoung" To: Date: Mon, 4 Oct 2004 08:08:27 -0600 Subject: [Eskrima] Bob Orlando Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Todd, in reference to his teacher Steve Plinck, said > It wouldn't be quite accurate to say that Bob was trained in Serak by > Steve > Plinck. The two have met, got on well together and worked out a few times. > That doesn't really constitute significant training in the system. The exact quote was: "We also studied with Steve Plinck for a while." Nothing more or less was implied... M --__--__-- Message: 7 From: Apraiser3@aol.com Date: Mon, 4 Oct 2004 12:38:16 EDT To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Subject: [Eskrima] Re:Bob Orlando Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Sorry about that Ray, I must be looking at an older Uncle Bill website kuntaosilatdethouars.com? Thats the one Mr. Orlando is listed on. On a related note, I had e-mailed Mr. Orlando regarding some Silat training that is available in my area to get his input on it and he promptly wrote back & also said that I could continue to contact him regarding my progress. My training ended up taking a different route, but that was still something that I remember. thanks Rob Perkins --__--__-- Message: 8 Date: Mon, 4 Oct 2004 13:25:11 -0500 From: WoodyTX To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Subject: Re: [Eskrima] reply to Sean Putt Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Not to labor the point, but how do you identify the "martial artist" in the streetfight? Is he the one in the white pajamas? Or is he the one shouting "Kiai!" all the time? Or maybe he's the one whose not there when the dust clears.... (or maybe you're right, and he's the one who's not there when the fertilizer hits the ventilator.) WoodyTX On Mon, 4 Oct 2004 02:31:51 GMT, fullofschist@juno.com wrote: > I've seen a lot of fights, and know a lot of people who have witnessed hundreds (especially COs) , and most have never seen a martial artist in a street fight. I think the reason why may be the MA mindset. Having sensitivity toward and awareness of one's surroundings allow us to avoid potentially bad situations preemptively. > --Witchdoctor --__--__-- Message: 9 From: <1@msfencing.org> To: Subject: RE: [Eskrima] Interesting Comment 2 Date: Tue, 21 Sep 2004 12:26:29 -0500 Organization: 1@msfencing.org Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net I read somewhere that most self-defense experts these days recommend not using head buts, because you might actually knock your own self out in the process. Since I have never attempted one in practice or in a real situation I have no clue to the truth of this. Have any of you successfully used head buts in self defense situations? Ever knocked yourself out? Blessings, Rez Johnson "Standing guard on old, forgotten roads, that no one travels anymore." THE FENCING MASTER by Arturo Perez Rez Johnson, M d'A Headmaster: Mississippi Academy of Arms (Mississippi Fencing Academy) President: United States Traditional Fencing Association Certified Fencing Instructor: (USTFA, TFI, AAI, USFCA) Certified Fencing Master Apprentice: (USTFA, USFCA) Teaching Classical Fencing and Historical Swordsmanship since 1980 Modern Sport Fencing Coach 1980 - 2002 Mississippi Academy of Arms P.O. Box 955 Pelahatchie, MS 39145-0955 E-Mail: 1@MSFencing.org Academy Website: http://MSFencing.org USTFA Website: http://traditionalfencing.org "Eala Earendel engla beorhtast ofer middangeard monnum sended." Crist of Cynewulf > -----Original Message----- > From: Marc Denny [mailto:craftydog@dogbrothers.com] > Sent: Tuesday, September 21, 2004 12:46 AM > To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net > Subject: [Eskrima] Interesting Comment 2 > > Woof Jye wrote > > > " I agree that learning angles helps with defending against > kicks(and everything else), but disagree about the quality of > FMA kicks. Mui Thai fighters kick above the waist, below the > waist, wherever we want to. We also prove that high kicks are > combat effective, everytime we knock an opponent out by > planting our shin right behind their ear. My feeling about > FMA, and Mui Thai, and everything else, is that an art that > focuses on a specific technique will become VERY good at that > technique. Ditto the individual practicioner. For example, > you can't beat Capoeira for headbutts. , , ," > > In a related vein, in DBMA thanks to the pioneering efforts > of Salty Dog, an important strand of influence is Krabi > Krabong-- KK being the Thai military weaponry forerunner to > the ring sport of Muay Thai. Kicking during stickfights is > part of our system. > > I'm curious about the Capoeira headbutting comment. I've seen > some Cap that impressed me greatly (Maestre Boneco used to > teach at the Inosanto Academy) but was not aware of the > headbutting side of the art. Would you share with us what > impresses you about it? > > TIA > Crafty Dog > _______________________________________________ > Eskrima mailing list, 1900 members > Eskrima@martialartsresource.net > Copyright 1994-2004: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource > Standard disclaimers apply > http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/eskrima --__--__-- Message: 10 Date: Mon, 4 Oct 2004 14:33:50 -0400 From: "Clint Cayson" To: Subject: [Eskrima] National Eskritedo Federation... Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net James, It's good thing that you're teaching your 8 year old the Arts. I also have a 7 year old daughter and I'm teaching her what I know in Eskrima. Though I'm a little bit slow and rusted because I stopped years ago but I can still show her the basics and a little bit of history of the Art. I met Master Jabel once and heard stories about him and his system. However, the sword was a nice thing to see. If you like to contact me, feel free to do so... was Mr. Limbaga from Bacolod City? Sincerely, Clint ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Clint, you know I salute you for your wealth of information about NEF, My instructor was P. Limbaga who passed away a couple of years ago, good hearted man, I was not in town then...I went ahead and continued practicing Eskritedo without the kata's anymore, just block and counter style, right now I'm in the process of teaching my 8 year old about who and what I am....and yes Eskritedo was a combination of karate (Okinawa) and arnis...and I did saw the Samurai, it was just for eyes only...I have no contact with the school nor with anybody that is affiliated with the school for that matter, except you...in arnis my favorite is the redonda, good for arms exercises, when I moved here in the States I left my arnis (kamagong) back home, excellent weapon...keep me informed my friend. sincerely James --__--__-- Message: 11 From: <1@msfencing.org> To: Subject: RE: [Eskrima] Interesting Comment 2 Date: Mon, 4 Oct 2004 14:15:33 -0500 Organization: 1@msfencing.org Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Wow. I sent that to the list about three weeks ago. On September 21st. And it's now just arriving on the list. Rez Johnson > -----Original Message----- > From: 1@msfencing.org [mailto:1@msfencing.org] > Sent: Tuesday, September 21, 2004 12:26 PM > To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net > Subject: RE: [Eskrima] Interesting Comment 2 > > I read somewhere that most self-defense experts these days > recommend not using head buts, because you might actually > knock your own self out in the process. Since I have never > attempted one in practice or in a real situation I have no > clue to the truth of this. Have any of you successfully used > head buts in self defense situations? Ever knocked yourself out? > > Blessings, > Rez Johnson > > "Standing guard on old, forgotten roads, that no one travels anymore." > THE FENCING MASTER > by Arturo Perez > > Rez Johnson, M d'A > Headmaster: Mississippi Academy of Arms (Mississippi Fencing Academy) > President: United States Traditional Fencing Association > Certified Fencing Instructor: (USTFA, TFI, AAI, USFCA) > Certified Fencing Master Apprentice: (USTFA, USFCA) Teaching > Classical Fencing and Historical Swordsmanship since 1980 > Modern Sport Fencing Coach 1980 - 2002 > > Mississippi Academy of Arms > P.O. Box 955 > Pelahatchie, MS 39145-0955 > > E-Mail: 1@MSFencing.org > Academy Website: http://MSFencing.org > USTFA Website: http://traditionalfencing.org > > "Eala Earendel engla beorhtast > ofer middangeard monnum sended." > Crist of Cynewulf --__--__-- Message: 12 From: Ray Terry Subject: Re: [Eskrima] Interesting Comment 2 To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Date: Mon, 4 Oct 2004 14:29:34 -0700 (PDT) Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net > I read somewhere that most self-defense experts these days > recommend not using head buts, because you might actually > knock your own self out in the process. Since I have never > attempted one in practice or in a real situation I have no > clue to the truth of this. Have any of you successfully used > head buts in self defense situations? Ever knocked yourself out? They can work amazingly well. You know it is coming, the opponent doesn't. Grab their lapels, pull them into you as you lower your head and tilt it forward a bit. Ray Terry rterry@idiom.com --__--__-- Message: 13 From: "Aaron Alejandro" To: Subject: Re: [Eskrima] Interesting Comment 2 Date: Mon, 4 Oct 2004 16:42:57 -0500 Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Headbutts, Knees and Elbows. Yes they work, yes they are efficient and yes they are most definitely effective. As for the headbutt, it doesn't work well if you are taller than the person you are trying to execute it on. Also, when you reach up to pull them into the TOP of your head, don't grab them around the base of their neck and try to pull them down -- it won't work unless you can just completely out-muscle them. You can, however, pull them down fairly easy by placing your hands around the top quarter of the back of their head and pulling down. As Ray mentioned, just look down at their shoes. This keeps you safe and puts them in the ideal position. In addition, when you walk away, you'll be able to tell an officer or any security personnel what kind of shoes the guy with the bloody nose is wearing. A very simple and effective technique from the FMA. Aaron Alejandro --__--__-- Message: 14 Date: Mon, 4 Oct 2004 18:17:19 -0700 (PDT) From: Steve Kohn Subject: Re: [Eskrima] Cold Steel Challenge To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Al, I was there judging the knife fighting portion of the event on the first day (for the record Al, I had no idea I was going to be a judge when I responded to your post regarding Cold Steel a while back). The folks at Cold Steel did a good job promoting a good attitude and tried to keep the "knife fighting" as real as possible. After a fighter was "cut", we separated them so the fight didn't turn into a short stick fight with guys "stabbing" and "slashing" each other at close range with no realistic reactions to the attacks. Beyond that, we used a simple point system to determine who had the upper hand. I think it was a great success...and I must admit that I was a little skeptical as to how we would be judging this. Everyone fought with a lot of heart and I think there is a definite future in this sort of thing. Respectfully, Steve Kohn aal sardinas wrote: Did anyone attend the Cold Steel Challenge in California about two weeks ago? Were the demonstrations and matches worthwhile? Does it have a future? Respectfully, Al Sardinas Student of Garimot System of Arnis _______________________________________________ Eskrima mailing list, 1900 members Eskrima@martialartsresource.net Copyright 1994-2004: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource Standard disclaimers apply http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/eskrima --------------------------------- Do you Yahoo!? vote.yahoo.com - Register online to vote today! --__--__-- _______________________________________________ Eskrima mailing list Eskrima@martialartsresource.net http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/eskrima http://eskrima-fma.net Old digest issues @ ftp://ftp.martialartsresource.com/pub/eskrima Copyright 1994-2004: Ray Terry, MartialArtsResource.com, Sudlud.com Standard disclaimers apply. Remember September 11. End of Eskrima Digest