Date: Sun, 09 Jan 2005 03:03:51 -0800 From: eskrima-request@martialartsresource.net Subject: Eskrima digest, Vol 12 #7 - 7 msgs X-Mailer: Mailman v2.0.13.cisto1 MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Errors-To: eskrima-admin@martialartsresource.net X-BeenThere: eskrima@martialartsresource.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13.cisto1 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net X-Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net X-Subscribed-Address: fma@martialartsresource.com List-Id: Eskrima-FMA discussion forum, the premier FMA forum on the Internet. 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Copyright 1994-2005: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource The Internet's premier discussion forum devoted to Filipino Martial Arts. 2000 members. Provided in memory of Mangisursuro Michael G. Inay (1944-2000). See the Filipino Martial Arts (FMA) FAQ and the online search engine for back issues of the Eskrima/FMA digest at http://MartialArtsResource.com Mabuhay ang eskrima! Today's Topics: 1. RE: Akebono Vs Royce !! (guildmaster@guild-hall.com) 2. Re: Re: Law Enforcement Disarms (Arndt Mallepree) 3. What would you have done? Were you prepared? (Marc Denny) 4. Taser Article and hear failure (Brian Hamilton) 5. RE: knife attack (Stephen luna) 6. Re: Machete Attacks (Beungood8@aol.com) 7. Re: What would you have done? Were you prepared? (George Mason) --__--__-- Message: 1 From: To: Subject: RE: [Eskrima] Akebono Vs Royce !! Date: Sat, 8 Jan 2005 01:33:05 -0500 Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net I don't find it at all surprising that Royce tapped him. I mean, they were playing a submission game, right? That's Royce's bread and butter. I can pretty much guarantee that if Royce faced Akebono in a Basho tournament, Akebono would own him with no trouble. Akebono is one of the top Sumo in the game (if not the current top - it's been a while since I watched Sumo competitions but I know he was up there in the standings). The fact that Royce beat him in a submission contest should come as no surprise and shouldn't be seen as anything negative about Akebono's skills at what he does. Of course, I'm probably stating the obvious with that but it's my thoughts on the subject. Mike -----Original Message----- From: Jared Dame [mailto:jareddame@gmail.com] Sent: Friday, January 07, 2005 5:28 PM To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Subject: Re: [Eskrima] Akebono Vs Royce !! Throw punches the guys only defense on the ground was sheer size along. If he would have shifted even in the slightest to get off a punch then Royce would have submitted him much earlier. nice to see the masters at work....that goes for all you other masters/guro/suros that read this! Salamat J On Fri, 7 Jan 2005 16:04:03 -0500, Jorge Penafiel wrote: > "the other guy was just freakin nasty fat"- exactly!! Just my thoughts ... > Akebono blessed him, as a huge Sumo wrestler with good balance and arm power > should just remained standing and shoving. I've loved to see how Royce would > take him down. Akebono rushed and grappled ASAP - a mistake as shown. Though > he was always on top cause of his size should have thrown some punches as > well... Royce was busy punching and just like a Boa constrictor slowly slither > his way in till the leg wrap and arm submission. What a technician.. > whew!!! > Jorge > _______________________________________________ > Eskrima mailing list, 2000 members > Eskrima@martialartsresource.net > Copyright 1994-2005: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource > Standard disclaimers apply > http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/eskrima _______________________________________________ Eskrima mailing list, 2000 members Eskrima@martialartsresource.net Copyright 1994-2005: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource Standard disclaimers apply http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/eskrima --__--__-- Message: 2 From: "Arndt Mallepree" To: Subject: Re: [Eskrima] Re: Law Enforcement Disarms Date: Sat, 8 Jan 2005 16:51:01 +0100 Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Good point - but while I am a cop I can tell you that the situation is a lot different. Cause you step into a situation you mostly not know and you can not walk away. Also you can not always enter a room with the gun in your hand! So you need a understanding of life blades and you need a solution to avoid a cut on your neck! If the technical level is good enough you should have the oportunity to bring the gun into the game! The late Guro Mike Inay gave a good answer to this question in his reactive knife system! Stay safe Arndt ----- Original Message ----- From: "Halg" To: Sent: Saturday, January 08, 2005 1:35 AM Subject: [Eskrima] Re: Law Enforcement Disarms > After some FMA training I have more respect for live blades than ever. I > have, before I knew better, disarmed knife weilders three times. Looking > back on those incidents with my current knowledge gives me the willies > because I now know what trained knife fighters could have done to me. Even > a Punong Guro can have a bad day on a disarm and most law enforcement > pratitioners will never approach that skill level. > > I have also applied techniques on unarmed 'drugged-up-psychos' and had to > rapidly adapt and escalate to a greater use of force. I would not want to > take chances with a psycho machete man. > > I'm not a Police Officer. > I hope that we continue to train our police to use lethal force in > situations like the one described in the news story. > > Hal > Calgary > _______________________________________________ > Eskrima mailing list, 2000 members > Eskrima@martialartsresource.net > Copyright 1994-2005: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource > Standard disclaimers apply > http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/eskrima --__--__-- Message: 3 From: "Marc Denny" To: Date: Sat, 8 Jan 2005 08:00:01 -0800 Subject: [Eskrima] What would you have done? Were you prepared? Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Woof All: Calgary Hal writes: > > After some FMA training I have more respect for live blades than ever. I > have, before I knew better, disarmed knife weilders three times. Looking > back on those incidents with my current knowledge gives me the willies > because I now know what trained knife fighters could have done to me. Even > a Punong Guro can have a bad day on a disarm and most law enforcement > pratitioners will never approach that skill level. > > I have also applied techniques on unarmed 'drugged-up-psychos' and had to > rapidly adapt and escalate to a greater use of force. I would not want to > take chances with a psycho machete man. > > I'm not a Police Officer. > I hope that we continue to train our police to use lethal force in > situations like the one described in the news story. Hal, how is it that you have had to face knife wielders 3x (or more?) ? Especially if you are not an LEO this is quite a high number. Please share with us what happened in as much detail as you are inclined. For those so interested, I would like to propose a small exercise for us here. Go to our Spanish language site http://www.dogbrothers.com/spanish/article_info.php?articles_id=8 and watch the first of the clips there. Even if you don't speak Spanish the footage is, in my opinion, quite remarkable. Someone in Mexico City, was videoing out there window (second or third floor) and had a ringside seat for a most remarkable and tragic confrontation between the police and a group of criminals with knives. One of the policeman is killed. For the exercise, test your powers as a witness. How many BG were there? How many LEOs? What happened? What caused the LEO's death? WHAT WOULD YOU HAVE DONE? WHAT SHOULD HAVE BEEN DONE? (Comments from our LEOs here especially appreciated) WERE DISARMS POSSIBLE? How well prepared do you feel by your training for this scenario? Then watch the video again. Then watch the subsequent clips about the event. Then share you experiences and observations from the exercise here. (If you speak Spanish, you may wish to read/post about it on our Spanish Language forum at http://www.dogbrothers.com/spanish/yabbse/viewtopic.php?t=44&start=0 ) Those of you who speak Spanish, please do not share the surprise ending until people here have had a chance to honestly experience the progression. Woof, Crafty Dog --__--__-- Message: 4 Date: Sat, 8 Jan 2005 09:08:06 -0800 (PST) From: Brian Hamilton To: escrima digest Subject: [Eskrima] Taser Article and hear failure Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2004/07/19/health/main630519.shtml An interesting article about Taser safety. An interesting note in the later half of the article "Some medical experts believe Taser shocks may exacerbate a risk of heart failure in cases where people are agitated, under the influence of drugs or have underlying health problems. Human rights advocates want law enforcement to stop using Tasers until scientific evidence can show they don't kill. " I have a question (and I *honestly* don't want to sound like a smart ass) what do the Human Rights Activists want to police to use instead? -Brian --------------------------------- Do you Yahoo!? All your favorites on one personal page – Try My Yahoo! --__--__-- Message: 5 From: "Stephen luna" To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Subject: RE: [Eskrima] knife attack Date: Sat, 08 Jan 2005 11:19:27 -0700 Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net One point I noticed that hasn't been brought up is that you need to take it from the cop's perspective. Most of them are married have kids or have a significant other, they want to go home to their loved ones. Despite all the traing in the world they have I don't think it would be worth the risk of losing ones life or becimg severly maimed, especially if the perp is hoped up on drugs. The cops went through all of the non-lethal options they had and none of them worked. So they pulled their side arm and shot to kill, in my humble opinion that was their only and best option. Sure they possibly could have not shot to kill and could only have aimed to wing the guy by aiming for the arm or shoulder, however once that bullet leaves the barrel they are responsilbe for it's projectory and seeing as how that is a very small target area, it is highly probable that they could miss and hit an innocent bystander, not to mention the ricochet factor....not good. Also the bullet could make contact go through and hit someone else, body shots are the best option, 2 in the chest one in the head. Besides like someone else mentioned here, having to ask twice is being to nice :). ~Stephen Luna --__--__-- Message: 6 From: Beungood8@aol.com Date: Sat, 8 Jan 2005 16:36:27 EST To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Subject: [Eskrima] Re: Machete Attacks Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net In a message dated 1/8/2005 7:03:40 AM Eastern Standard Time, eskrima-request@martialartsresource.net writes: Police opened fire when the man, still wielding the machete, jumped through a window and charged them, police said This seems to be happening more and more. Up here in Mass there has been a growth in a violent Salvadoirean gang called MS-13 (maria salvutra) . They sneak in over the border and commit violent attacks against immigrants who are afraid to report these crimes. Locally a couple of the gang members were arrested after throwing machete's at the responding Police Officers. --__--__-- Message: 7 Date: Sat, 8 Jan 2005 15:40:31 -0600 (GMT-06:00) From: George Mason To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Subject: Re: [Eskrima] What would you have done? Were you prepared? Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net I have disarmed knife attackers before. And I felt lucky when I only got cut a little. A knife in the hands of someone that knows their craft is the most deadly and subtle of close range weapons. It's funny that several of the arts that I have trained in have techniques for disarming the knife. But only FMA has techniques that I would actually consider using. The other stuff I have seen will get you killed. ________________________________________ PeoplePC Online A better way to Internet http://www.peoplepc.com --__--__-- _______________________________________________ Eskrima mailing list Eskrima@martialartsresource.net http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/eskrima http://eskrima-fma.net Old digest issues @ ftp://ftp.martialartsresource.com/pub/eskrima Copyright 1994-2005: Ray Terry, MartialArtsResource.com, Sudlud.com Standard disclaimers apply. Remember September 11. End of Eskrima Digest