Date: Sat, 29 Jan 2005 12:28:58 -0800 From: eskrima-request@martialartsresource.net Subject: Eskrima digest, Vol 12 #40 - 16 msgs X-Mailer: Mailman v2.0.13.cisto1 MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Errors-To: eskrima-admin@martialartsresource.net X-BeenThere: eskrima@martialartsresource.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13.cisto1 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net X-Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net X-Subscribed-Address: fma@martialartsresource.com List-Id: Eskrima-FMA discussion forum, the premier FMA forum on the Internet. 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Copyright 1994-2005: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource The Internet's premier discussion forum devoted to Filipino Martial Arts. 2000 members. Provided in memory of Mangisursuro Michael G. Inay (1944-2000). See the Filipino Martial Arts (FMA) FAQ and the online search engine for back issues of the Eskrima/FMA digest at http://MartialArtsResource.com Mabuhay ang eskrima! Today's Topics: 1. RE: 15th dan (Mike Casto) 2. RE: 15th dan (Mike Casto) 3. RE: Belts and dans (Mike Casto) 4. 2. Falacy of hardwood (Brian Hamilton) (federicomalibago@earthlink.net) 5. Re: Refused the Belt but still have the knowledge. (david foggie) 6. Re: Falacy of hardwood (George Mason) 7. Video > "San Miguel Eskrima Grandmasters" (Earlwin Famor) 8. Originally, Judo may be from Tibet (Peter Gow) 9. RE: Dogzilla's First Day (Kickin' Family) 10. Re: hardwoods vs. rattan (Todd Ellner) 11. Wood I? (Dale) 12. Bahi and kamagong (jay de leon) 13. Another article about duel in Cebu (Frank Stevens) 14. Re: Originally, Judo may be from Tibet (Ray Terry) 15. Re: 15th dan (WoodyTX) 16. Re: Falacy of hardwood (WoodyTX) --__--__-- Message: 1 From: "Mike Casto" To: Subject: RE: [Eskrima] 15th dan Date: Sat, 29 Jan 2005 00:16:41 -0500 Organization: I.M.P.A.C.T. Academy of Martial Arts Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Personally, I don't currently use belts. My primary instructor started using them a few years ago. Something I've noticed is that when I go up to visit and teach a class the belts are great for me. Since I'm not there on a daily basis I have no way of knowing how different people are progressing. So they give me an idea of what material each person should be working on. That's at least one instance where the belts are useful in a way that's not related to commerce. For an organization like Doce Pares I'm sure that's part of it, too. It's a big organization. If a DP instructor walks into another DP school as a guest instructor he'll have some idea of where the students in the class should be even if he's never met them before. Mike -----Original Message----- From: Steve Kohn [mailto:musilat2@yahoo.com] Sent: Friday, January 28, 2005 3:56 PM To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Subject: Re: [Eskrima] 15th dan Ray, If not for commerce, then why the need for familiarity at all? Why not just train and learn? I don't think anyone is getting too rich off of FMA's by the way and I do understand that some people choose to make a living from it. For the record, when I was posting this, I didnt have Doce Pares in mind. I have no issue with that organization. They've done much for the arts. -Steve Ray Terry wrote: > Why have belt systems been added to the FMA's? One word...commerce. When the Doce Pares clan first adopted a belt ranking system back in the 50s I seriously doubt it was about getting rich off Eskrima. It was done because people were familiar with belt ranking systems since they were commonly used in most of popular martial arts, e.g. Judo and Karate. On the topic of 15th dan... It seems there has been a lot of belt/rank inflation over the last fifty years. Until recent years Korean arts -only- went up to 9th Dan. 10th was used as an honorary rank for those that had passed. But in order to keep up with the Joneses (Japanese), many of the top Korean instructors now claim 10th dan even tho they are still alive and kicking. Some Karate arts that only went up to 5th dan ended up adopting a 10 dan system within the last 50 years or so, again to keep up appearances. To the man (or child) on the street a 9th dan must be lower than a 10th dan and thus somehow inferior. They just don't know enough to realize that rank doesn't matter all that much, and a 9th Dan in a 9 dan system is just as senior as a 10th dan in a 10 dan system. Ray "69th Dan" Terry rterry@idiom.com _______________________________________________ Eskrima mailing list, 2000 members Eskrima@martialartsresource.net Copyright 1994-2005: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource Standard disclaimers apply http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/eskrima --------------------------------- Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail - 250MB free storage. Do more. Manage less. _______________________________________________ Eskrima mailing list, 2000 members Eskrima@martialartsresource.net Copyright 1994-2005: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource Standard disclaimers apply http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/eskrima --__--__-- Message: 2 From: "Mike Casto" To: Subject: RE: [Eskrima] 15th dan Date: Sat, 29 Jan 2005 00:23:13 -0500 Organization: I.M.P.A.C.T. Academy of Martial Arts Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net I'm glad I had swallowed my mouthful of water. That's funny in a very poignant way. Mike -----Original Message----- From: MSKBEvans@aol.com [mailto:MSKBEvans@aol.com] Sent: Friday, January 28, 2005 6:07 PM To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Subject: [Eskrima] 15th dan I think in this new high tech age we live in we should all convert to a "tech" rank. Like Blackbelt version 9.2.. 8-D ps. I think I'm still in beta. _______________________________________________ Eskrima mailing list, 2000 members Eskrima@martialartsresource.net Copyright 1994-2005: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource Standard disclaimers apply http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/eskrima --__--__-- Message: 3 From: "Mike Casto" To: Subject: RE: [Eskrima] Belts and dans Date: Sat, 29 Jan 2005 00:26:06 -0500 Organization: I.M.P.A.C.T. Academy of Martial Arts Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Yup. I've met a lot of adults who wouldn't continue training if they didn't see that next color of the rainbow around the next corner. Mike -----Original Message----- From: Ray Terry [mailto:rterry@idiom.com] Sent: Friday, January 28, 2005 6:20 PM To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Subject: Re: [Eskrima] Belts and dans > I only see belts useful for children. If they do not know they are getting > better they most likely will become discouraged and give up. > An adult does not need this. Piaget felt that children were just short adults. I'd say that many adults are just tall children... :) People (children and adults) learn in different ways and require differing motivations. Ray "a Master of apples and oranges to some" Terry rterry@idiom.com _______________________________________________ Eskrima mailing list, 2000 members Eskrima@martialartsresource.net Copyright 1994-2005: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource Standard disclaimers apply http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/eskrima --__--__-- Message: 4 Date: Fri, 28 Jan 2005 23:47:22 -0600 (GMT-06:00) From: federicomalibago@earthlink.net To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Subject: [Eskrima] 2. Falacy of hardwood (Brian Hamilton) Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Kamagong while pretty, very dense, and very hard, is also very very brittle. Making things worse, even when properly cured, the stress from moving from a high humidity tropical environment in the Philippines to a very dry environment, such as the US can cause alot of stress to build up in the wood from moisture loss. Throw in the factor that alot of "Ebay deals" are deals because they also deal in 2nd or 3rd grade stuff, it is not necessarily surprising your sticks borke. But has been said, what did you hit with your kamagong sticks? They work fine against flesh and bones, because flesh and bones are much softer than the kamagong, but against harder materials it doesnt stand much chance. Federico --__--__-- Message: 5 Date: Sat, 29 Jan 2005 06:13:47 -0800 (PST) From: david foggie Subject: Re: [Eskrima] Refused the Belt but still have the knowledge. To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Peter, There are teacher who do not stress grades, but award them when they feel individuals have assimilated the knowledge transmitted through lessons and made it their own. At times these teachers will then award the student with a grade in recognition of their skills and understandings. Knowledge given cannot be taken away....but is that knowledge a true representation of the teacher's skill and knowledge or simply, a fraction of it? --------------------------------- Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Search presents - Jib Jab's 'Second Term' --__--__-- Message: 6 Date: Sat, 29 Jan 2005 08:49:01 -0600 (GMT-06:00) From: George Mason To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Subject: Re: [Eskrima] Falacy of hardwood Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Hey, Does anyone know about bending wood? I have tried to bend large pieces a few times to make canes but can't seem to get them to bend very well. Geo the Bear ________________________________________ PeoplePC Online A better way to Internet http://www.peoplepc.com --__--__-- Message: 7 From: Earlwin Famor To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net, erwin_mos@yahoo.com, jaybatienza@yahoo.com, AVergara@lfp.com Date: Fri, 28 Jan 2005 22:35:39 -0800 Organization: http://go.to/earlwin Subject: [Eskrima] Video > "San Miguel Eskrima Grandmasters" Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Holy shit, I just saw the video "San Miguel Eskrima Grandmasters." That has gotta to be the funniest shit I have ever seen! No, I wasn't laughing about the grandmasters, actually, they were awesome, I was just laughing so hard about that lady's banter in the background. I don't know her, but she's hilarious. She reminds me of someone I know. Anyway, I won't tell you the joke, because it only applies to Visayans. Whoever runs Capitol Doce Pares website, please don't ever delete, edit or mute that file. If you know anyone who speaks bisaya, please show them the video. It's the best! Well, I haven't seen the other videos. XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX Earlwin Famor [earlwin@compuserve.com] ICQ: 115423282 http://go.to/earlwin X-No-Archive: yes XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX ~ --__--__-- Message: 8 From: "Peter Gow" To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Date: Sat, 29 Jan 2005 11:33:26 +0000 Subject: [Eskrima] Originally, Judo may be from Tibet Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Dear Barry, You question Judo coming from the mainland? I did a little  research and found that judo originally came from Tibet - two Japanese monks went there to study and brought judo back to Japan. Yes, I know this sounds like an episode from monkey with Tribitaka as the boy monk leading the way. >Ninjitso and Judo "Influenced" absolutly,but coming directly from the main >land..??? >Im not so sure of that part." Regards, Peter Gow Australia --__--__-- Message: 9 From: "Kickin' Family" To: Date: Sat, 29 Jan 2005 06:45:45 -0600 Organization: Kickin' Family Subject: [Eskrima] RE: Dogzilla's First Day Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Greetings, all... Remind me to stay away from those El Salvadoran prisons... :) ....... OK, I admit... It looks like fun :) That was a nasty one on the back / ribs... Whew... :) **bows** - Bert Edens Springdale, Arkansas > -----Original Message----- > Woof All: > > We have just posted at www.dogbrothers.com a third action clip titled > "Dogzilla's First Day". > > Yip! > Crafty Dog --__--__-- Message: 10 Date: Sat, 29 Jan 2005 04:39:40 -0800 (Pacific Standard Time) From: "Todd Ellner" To: Subject: [Eskrima] Re: hardwoods vs. rattan Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net A few years ago Aikido Today magazine ran a story on the impact strength of different woods. Hickory was far and away the best. Next was osage orange. --__--__-- Message: 11 From: "Dale" To: Date: Sat, 29 Jan 2005 08:14:15 -0500 Subject: [Eskrima] Wood I? Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net <> I Would. Kamagong, Bahi, Hickory, and another hardwood my importer calls saru. (Which probably means dumb American, but the stix have gotten raves from my customers.) See you in the sticks, Dale www.kalieskrima.com --__--__-- Message: 12 Date: Sat, 29 Jan 2005 07:42:38 -0800 (PST) From: jay de leon To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Subject: [Eskrima] Bahi and kamagong Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net I have a bahi stick I have been using since the early 90's. It has killed many rattan and other sticks. I just use it for "heavy' duty, like when somebody brags he has killer sticks, and against staff (bo), tires, improvised weapons, etc. The thing is darn near indestructible BUT it breaks off in little chips. My stick is now so pockmarked and chipped you will get splinters in your hand using it. One of these days I will have to tape it, just like a rattan stick. I use my kamagong just for show and tell, and for training for their weight. So I have no idea how they will stand up to real use. Jay de Leon Ray Terry wrote: Check out Bahi. A rattan-like hardwood. Not quite as heavy as Kamagong, but it will last far longer in practice or in battle. Ray Terry rterry@idiom.com _______________________________________________ Eskrima mailing list, 2000 members Eskrima@martialartsresource.net Copyright 1994-2005: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource Standard disclaimers apply http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/eskrima __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com --__--__-- Message: 13 From: "Frank Stevens" To: Date: Sat, 29 Jan 2005 10:48:40 -0500 Subject: [Eskrima] Another article about duel in Cebu Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Sounds a bit one-sided but here's another article about the Cacoy - Loloy challenge. HYPERLINK "http://www.sunstar.com.ph/static/ceb/2005/01/12/sports/cacoy.loloy.duel.fiz zles.out.html"http://www.sunstar.com.ph/static/ceb/2005/01/12/sports/cacoy.l oloy.duel.fizzles.out.html Frank Stevens -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.296 / Virus Database: 265.7.4 - Release Date: 1/25/2005 --__--__-- Message: 14 From: Ray Terry Subject: Re: [Eskrima] Originally, Judo may be from Tibet To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Date: Sat, 29 Jan 2005 09:28:05 -0800 (PST) Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net > You question Judo coming from the mainland? I did a little  research and > found that judo originally came from Tibet - two Japanese monks went > there to study and brought judo back to Japan. Yes, I know this sounds > like an episode from monkey with Tribitaka as the boy monk leading the > way. Are you thinking of one of the JuJutsu styles? Judo isn't all that old (just over 100 years) and was Dr. Kano's creation. Ray Terry rterry@idiom.com --__--__-- Message: 15 Date: Sat, 29 Jan 2005 15:11:40 -0600 From: WoodyTX To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Subject: Re: [Eskrima] 15th dan Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net "Life is Beta-testing." I like it. WoodyTX On Fri, 28 Jan 2005 18:07:29 EST, MSKBEvans@aol.com wrote: > I think in this new high tech age we live in we should all convert to a > "tech" rank. Like Blackbelt version 9.2.. 8-D > > ps. I think I'm still in beta. --__--__-- Message: 16 Date: Sat, 29 Jan 2005 15:15:04 -0600 From: WoodyTX To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Subject: Re: [Eskrima] Falacy of hardwood Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Steam. They bend the ribs for canoes and boats by steaming them, flexing them while still hot and moist, then letting them cool and dry in place. I have no idea at what temperature or for how long or other details, but it's probably Google-able. WoodyTX On Sat, 29 Jan 2005 08:49:01 -0600 (GMT-06:00), George Mason wrote: > Hey, > > Does anyone know about bending wood? I have tried to bend large pieces a few times to make canes but can't seem to get them to bend very well. > > Geo the Bear --__--__-- _______________________________________________ Eskrima mailing list Eskrima@martialartsresource.net http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/eskrima http://eskrima-fma.net Old digest issues @ ftp://ftp.martialartsresource.com/pub/eskrima Copyright 1994-2005: Ray Terry, MartialArtsResource.com, Sudlud.com Standard disclaimers apply. Remember September 11. End of Eskrima Digest