Date: Fri, 08 Apr 2005 03:04:43 -0700 From: eskrima-request@martialartsresource.net Subject: Eskrima digest, Vol 12 #132 - 6 msgs X-Mailer: Mailman v2.0.13.cisto1 MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Errors-To: eskrima-admin@martialartsresource.net X-BeenThere: eskrima@martialartsresource.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13.cisto1 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net X-Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net X-Subscribed-Address: fma@martialartsresource.com List-Id: Eskrima-FMA discussion forum, the premier FMA forum on the Internet. 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Copyright 1994-2005: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource The Internet's premier discussion forum devoted to Filipino Martial Arts. 2200 members. Provided in memory of Mangisursuro Michael G. Inay (1944-2000). See the Filipino Martial Arts (FMA) FAQ and the online search engine for back issues of the Eskrima/FMA digest at http://MartialArtsResource.com Mabuhay ang eskrima! Today's Topics: 1. Re: bad wing chun (Jonathan Broster) 2. Re: Re: ED v12.127 - wing chun brawl (TCKWAN) 3. Re: Re: bad wing chun (Jared Dame) 4. April Modern Arnis Seminars (James Miller) 5. Re: Wing Chun brawl (Steve Kohn) 6. Upcoming Seminar in San Francisco (Alex Ercia) --__--__-- Message: 1 Date: Thu, 7 Apr 2005 10:41:47 +0100 From: "Jonathan Broster" To: Subject: [Eskrima] Re: bad wing chun Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Hi I said a couple of posts ago that I had never really been hooked in by Wing Chun, until a couple of years ago when a WC guy contacted me about taking some eskrima lessons. After about 5 mins I really started to wonder why he had an interest at all in training with me, he is just at another level all together. I have wrestled since I was a kid and I have once managed to take him down in a sparring or kadena de mano situation. His WC is truly non classical and devastating. Except at largo he is capable of utterly dominating me, even though he has a 6th of my stick experience. His trapping is destructive and jarring to the body. I guess it helps that he is a disciple of a Hung Kuen master, but despite an impressive martial arts resume he remains open minded. I think the deal here is that he has gone well beyond the basics - he does not really seem to have any fixed stances or postures - and made everything into a functional coherent whole, remaining very true to his classical roots, while keeping an open mind. He describes us both as "Modern Traditionalists" Jon "There's nothing more dangerous than a blunt knife!" http://www.pecahan.net > > >The thing about Wing Chun is that it is supposed to >work in a fistfight. When you use it in a fist fight >it doesn't look like a Wing Chun workout, it looks >like a fight. So that makes perfect sense to me. When >people expect a fight to look and feel like their >normal workout, then comes the problem regardless of >whatever "technical" art they do. > >A lot of Wing Chun people are stuck in the first form >and in rolling arms. It's the same with a lot of >people in FMA who get stuck in abesedario or sumbrada. >They mistake the drill for the art and they mistake >the art for fighting. No matter what art or style you >train, if you fail to internalize the methods then you >won't be able to use what you've learned in a high >stess fast paced situation. The only way to work >through that is through light and full contact random >combative practice, aka sparring. Both Capoeira and >Wing Chun in general tend not to do too much of that. > ... --__--__-- Message: 2 Date: Thu, 07 Apr 2005 08:40:59 -0400 From: TCKWAN To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Subject: Re: [Eskrima] Re: ED v12.127 - wing chun brawl Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Hi; fwiw, the fight was not a 'challenge' type scenario where both fighters squared off first; it was, IMHO, more of a semi-ambush thing where Emil rushed in from the side and essentially tried to surprised Wm Cheung,; Emil also had a wrestling background... Chuck Bart Hubbard wrote: > > > Just about every fight I hear about that involves > "technical" arts > (Wing Chun, Capoeira, etc) ends up turning into a > ground-and-pound, or > simple fistfight. I'm sure that says something, but > I'm not sure > what. > > Woody > > > > >The thing about Wing Chun is that it is supposed to >work in a fistfight. When you use it in a fist fight >it doesn't look like a Wing Chun workout, it looks >like a fight. So that makes perfect sense to me. When >people expect a fight to look and feel like their >normal workout, then comes the problem regardless of >whatever "technical" art they do. > >A lot of Wing Chun people are stuck in the first form >and in rolling arms. It's the same with a lot of >people in FMA who get stuck in abesedario or sumbrada. >They mistake the drill for the art and they mistake >the art for fighting. No matter what art or style you >train, if you fail to internalize the methods then you >won't be able to use what you've learned in a high >stess fast paced situation. The only way to work >through that is through light and full contact random >combative practice, aka sparring. Both Capoeira and >Wing Chun in general tend not to do too much of that. > >===== >Be Cool. > >Bart Hubbard >Capital Doce Pares >www.capitaldocepares.com >_______________________________________________ >Eskrima mailing list, 2200 members >Eskrima@martialartsresource.net >Copyright 1994-2005: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource >Standard disclaimers apply >http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/eskrima --__--__-- Message: 3 Date: Thu, 7 Apr 2005 09:45:04 -0600 From: Jared Dame To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Subject: Re: [Eskrima] Re: bad wing chun Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net I too have fought some very talented WC practitioners and found that they are some of the hardest to fight with in the trapping arena although going to the ground has always allowed me to overcome them. I guess it is just a matter of how progressive the training has been. J On Apr 7, 2005 3:41 AM, Jonathan Broster wrote: > Hi > > I said a couple of posts ago that I had never really been hooked in by Wing Chun, until a couple of years ago when a WC guy contacted me about taking some eskrima lessons. After about 5 mins I really started to wonder why he had an interest at all in training with me, he is just at another level all together. > > I have wrestled since I was a kid and I have once managed to take him down in a sparring or kadena de mano situation. His WC is truly non classical and devastating. Except at largo he is capable of utterly dominating me, even though he has a 6th of my stick experience. His trapping is destructive and jarring to the body. I guess it helps that he is a disciple of a Hung Kuen master, but despite an impressive martial arts resume he remains open minded. > > I think the deal here is that he has gone well beyond the basics - he does not really seem to have any fixed stances or postures - and made everything into a functional coherent whole, remaining very true to his classical roots, while keeping an open mind. He describes us both as "Modern Traditionalists" > > Jon > > "There's nothing more dangerous than a blunt knife!" > > http://www.pecahan.net > > > > > > >The thing about Wing Chun is that it is supposed to > >work in a fistfight. When you use it in a fist fight > >it doesn't look like a Wing Chun workout, it looks > >like a fight. So that makes perfect sense to me. When > >people expect a fight to look and feel like their > >normal workout, then comes the problem regardless of > >whatever "technical" art they do. > > > >A lot of Wing Chun people are stuck in the first form > >and in rolling arms. It's the same with a lot of > >people in FMA who get stuck in abesedario or sumbrada. > >They mistake the drill for the art and they mistake > >the art for fighting. No matter what art or style you > >train, if you fail to internalize the methods then you > >won't be able to use what you've learned in a high > >stess fast paced situation. The only way to work > >through that is through light and full contact random > >combative practice, aka sparring. Both Capoeira and > >Wing Chun in general tend not to do too much of that. > > > > ... > _______________________________________________ > Eskrima mailing list, 2200 members > Eskrima@martialartsresource.net > Copyright 1994-2005: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource > Standard disclaimers apply > http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/eskrima > -- Jared Dame jareddame@gmail.com "If you would be a real seeker after truth, it is necessary that at least once in your life you doubt, as far as possible, all things." Rene Descartes --__--__-- Message: 4 Date: Thu, 7 Apr 2005 15:04:19 -0400 From: James Miller To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Subject: [Eskrima] April Modern Arnis Seminars Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net The following is a list of Modern Arnis seminars for the month of April taught by Datu Tim Hartman. For more information you can go here www.wmarnis.com Respectfully your, J. Miller · April 9th, Philadephia, PA. This seminar will feature Datu Tim Hartman teaching Modern Arnis disarming and weapon controls. There will be a second session for advanced student covering advanced timing drills as well a "Counter Tapi – Tapi". For more information contact Sal Todaro at 610-543-2624, or e-mailSALVI1@aol.com · April 16th, Albany, NY. Grand Master Huk Planas and Datu Hartman will be teaching a "Double Header" seminar on Parker's Kenpo and Presas Modern Arnis Stick & Knife Concepts. For more information contact Jeff Blay at 518-370-4757 or e-mail jblay1@nycap.rr.com · April 23rd, Winfield, IL. Datu Tim Hartman and Guro Tim Murray will be teaching a "Double Header" seminar on Presas Modern Arnis Stick & Knife Concepts and Military Weapon and Hand to Hand Tactics. For more information contact Tim Murray at 630-260-0353 or hnd2hnd@juno.com · April 30th, Leesburg, VA Datu Tim Hartman will be teaching Modern Arnis disarming and elements of the EDT (Edged weapon Defensive Tactics) program. There will be a second session for advanced student covering advanced timing drills as well a "Counter Tapi – Tapi". For more information contact John Bailie at 571-261-1291 or e-mail jpbstraightblast@hotmail.com --__--__-- Message: 5 Date: Thu, 7 Apr 2005 15:08:49 -0700 (PDT) From: Steve Kohn Subject: Re: [Eskrima] Wing Chun brawl To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net I think it just says that knowing one range isnt enough. -Steve ryan@ghouseproductions.com wrote: [demime could not interpret encoding binary - treating as plain text] So maybe our Filipino dirty boxing, Buno, and Dumog will actually come in handy! Ryan Greene Just about every fight I hear about that involves "technical" arts (Wing Chun, Capoeira, etc) ends up turning into a ground-and-pound, or simple fistfight. I'm sure that says something, but I'm not sure what. Woody> _______________________________________________ Eskrima mailing list, 2200 members Eskrima@martialartsresource.net Copyright 1994-2005: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource Standard disclaimers apply http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/eskrima --------------------------------- Do you Yahoo!? Better first dates. More second dates. Yahoo! Personals --__--__-- Message: 6 From: "Alex Ercia" To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Date: Thu, 07 Apr 2005 16:52:54 -0700 Subject: [Eskrima] Upcoming Seminar in San Francisco Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Hi guys! Here's another seminar. GM Roberto Castro-Eskabodaan system and Master Lito Concepcion-Kombatan system are conducting a seminar on April 24,2005. Where:777 Valencia St. New College cultural center San Francisco CA Time: 11am-330pm For more information please call 415-585-9646. Don't miss it. Alex --__--__-- _______________________________________________ Eskrima mailing list Eskrima@martialartsresource.net http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/eskrima http://eskrima-fma.net Old digest issues @ ftp://ftp.martialartsresource.com/pub/eskrima Copyright 1994-2005: Ray Terry, MartialArtsResource.com, Sudlud.com Standard disclaimers apply. Remember September 11. End of Eskrima Digest