Date: Mon, 19 Sep 2005 17:33:14 -0700 From: eskrima-request@martialartsresource.net Subject: Eskrima digest, Vol 12 #325 - 6 msgs X-Mailer: Mailman v2.0.13.cisto1 MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Errors-To: eskrima-admin@martialartsresource.net X-BeenThere: eskrima@martialartsresource.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13.cisto1 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net X-Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net X-Subscribed-Address: fma@martialartsresource.com List-Id: Eskrima-FMA discussion forum, the premier FMA forum on the Internet. 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Copyright 1994-2005: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource The Internet's premier discussion forum devoted to Filipino Martial Arts. 2200 members. Provided in memory of Mangisursuro Michael G. Inay (1944-2000). See the Filipino Martial Arts (FMA) FAQ and the online search engine for back issues of the Eskrima/FMA digest at http://MartialArtsResource.com Mabuhay ang eskrima! Today's Topics: 1. Re: 16th Dan ??? (james jr. sy) 2. Re: 16th Dan ??? (jay de leon) 3. Re: 16th Dan ??? (Ray) 4. A conflict of interest (Nat Nickele) 5. Re: A conflict of interest (Pierre Honeyman) 6. Re: From the eclectic defense group (edg for short) (Winston Tamisin) --__--__-- Message: 1 Date: Mon, 19 Sep 2005 04:14:24 -0700 (PDT) From: "james jr. sy" Subject: Re: [Eskrima] 16th Dan ??? To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Traditional FMA doesn't have a hierarchial structure, much more a dankyu system. However, because of its convenience in identifying practitioners and its other related benefits, alot of FMA teachers have adopted the dankyu system. This 16th dan is definitely a modern adaption of a modern/eclectic style. More important to its evaluation is the standards that define all the dan grades leading to and including the 16rg dan. Ray wrote: Arnis: A real Pinoy martial art A REAL Filipino martial art is more popular in the United States than here. This is for sure. But Nestor Fernandez believes that Filipino players will take the sport of arnis and will find it as exciting as any other martial arts. The karate, jujitsu, aikido, judo and fut-ga, a little known Chinese martial art master comes home to his homeland to re-introduce a sport, which has been in existence for hundreds of years but being played by a handful of Filipinos. Fernandez, a retired private investigator from Daly City, California, is a 16th dan red belt of the arnis - Fernandez style. His dojo or school in San Francisco City accommodates at least a hundred students per session. His art is known as the U.S. - Philippines Kali - Arnis - Eskrima Federation. Kali, he said, is like arnis, but bladed weapons like bolo is used. It originated from Malaysia and Indonesia and brought to the Philippines during the height of the Sri Vishaya empire that at it's zenith occupied most of Indonesia and Malaysia to Borneo and Brunei. It was probably brought to the Philippines by the mythical 10 datus of Borneo who carved out kingdoms: in Panay, which will be called Visaya from Sri Vishaya; Southern Luzon by the Taga-ilogs or Tagalog; and Bicol. Arnis is, well, using round sticks 30 inches in length and an inch thick. While eskrima is using swords. Fernandez said that there are more exciting disciplines which he teaches to the higher belts, like bone breaking which means breaking the bones or joints. "I only teach this to the black belt and higher. This is good in ending the fight the soonest," he added. Fernandez said that Filipinos took up arnis when the Spaniards banned the use of bolo and other bladed weapons during their rule from 1567 to 1898. Lapu-Lapu and his band of Filipino warriors drove the Spaniards under Ferdinand Magellan using their bolo, kali style. Fernandez said that many Filipinos in the Luzon island know arnis. In fact, many simple old farmers can show you a thing or two about the art. Fernandez started arnis as a kid in Binmaley, Pangasinan before the outbreak of the second world war. He was a sole child, his younger brother was killed by an accident, thus he became the center of his parent's loving care. They too were strict parents and saw to his proper upbringing and knowing at least a martial art. And like many Pangasinense, he should learn arnis. "I did not like it a bit because I was a kid and I should be playing," he recalled, but his father and mother would call arnis masters from the nearby towns of Malasiqui, San Carlos, Calasiao and Bayambang. His teacher were usually relatives. His trainings were intensified when he was in high school in Lingayen (Pangasinan) National High School. Even when he was in Manila taking up pre-medicine at the University of Santo Tomas, his daily routine would include several hours of training. He went to medical school but soon found himself taking up law at the Ateneo de Manila University. As a college student, he also trained in jujitsu and judo, although he is not the athletic type. Fernandez finished law school but did not take the Bar. He worked briefly for the National Bureau of Investigation then left for the United States in 1966 where he got married and had three kids. He worked as a private investigator in Daly City then started his own school. But who will guess that the unassuming 5'2" Filipino arnis master would attract players? He attracted students though. From a small gym inside his garage, Fernandez moved to San Francisco in a small gym called "What a racquet?" in 1977. By 1995, he started holding his school in a bigger gym called San Francisco Bay Club. He has a regular of at least a hundred students and has produced 14 blackbelts in the US and another one here. He charges nothing for his teaching. Even noted taekwondo master Jong H. Lee of the Unified World Taekwondo Association took up training under him and from where he is affiliated now. Lee brought also his 2,000 strong members to train under the Filipino master. Fernandez was also the vice chairman of the United World Martial Arts Federation whose president was Joe Halbuna, a grand master of the kajukenbo discipline. Fernandez took part in several Tiger Claw Clinics where he joined many of America's top martial artists like Halbuna, Ben Abarca, a judo, kobuda and tai chi chuan master; Willy Cahill, a former US team coach in the Goodwill Games, Pan American Games and a jujitsu master; Jong H. Lee; Harlan Lee, a fut ga kuen master and honorary member of the juang su wu shu committee; Arthur Lee, an American champion; and, Bob Maschmeier, kajukenbo, jujitsu, judo, shutokan karate, kyudo and combat jujitsu expert. He came home July last year and settled in Baguio City where he has now attracted some players. He holds classes at the YMCA gym here and is affiliated with the Sphinx Karatedo Philippines whose master, Police Supt. Manuel de Leon, has been his one of strongest supporters. He teaches with his first Filipino balckbelt, Conrado Servito, a third dan blackbelt, who takes turn training his new students. "I am here to teach what I know and hope that our local martial artists will learn and integrate what they learned from me in their skill," he said. "It's a small dream, but if it will help earn medals for our Filipino players then I will be happy," he added. Arnis is quite popular in the United States where regular competitions are held in California, New York, Washington State, Hawaii and Tennessee. Other styles were also imported to the U.S. like the Doce Pares and Balintawak styles. Both were already in the US when he arrived in the 60's. But his style is basically his, more particularly the Pangasinan style, which he has learned from six masters, two of whom are still alive. "There are some distinctive differences, but they are the same. We hope though that the Filipinos will like them," he added. Fernandez will be at the forefront of the first arnis competition here Sunday at the People's Park, where he will show how the sport is played, the Fernandez way. "We hope to attract more players," he added. Arnis is surely back. _______________________________________________ Eskrima mailing list, 2200 members Eskrima@martialartsresource.net Copyright 1994-2005: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource Standard disclaimers apply http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/eskrima --------------------------------- Yahoo! for Good Click here to donate to the Hurricane Katrina relief effort. --__--__-- Message: 2 Date: Mon, 19 Sep 2005 07:40:26 -0700 (PDT) From: jay de leon Subject: Re: [Eskrima] 16th Dan ??? To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Grandmaster Nes Fernandez and I are cousins. We have the same great-grandfather, Don Miguel de Leon of Binmaley, Pangasinan. His late mother was Constantina de Leon, who was cousin and boyhood friend to my late father. Nes Fernandez was a fixture in both FMA and martial arts in the Bay area for many years. When I lived in San Jose, I attended a few of his classes at "What a Racquet" in Daly City, a few of his Tiger Claw seminars and a few other martial events in the Bay Area. Kuya Nes also conducted joint seminars with Master Alfredo Bandalan Jr. of Doce Pares. An educated and articulate man, he has been featured and interviewed in many MA magazine articles. Jay de Leon "james jr. sy" wrote: Traditional FMA doesn't have a hierarchial structure, much more a dankyu system. However, because of its convenience in identifying practitioners and its other related benefits, alot of FMA teachers have adopted the dankyu system. This 16th dan is definitely a modern adaption of a modern/eclectic style. More important to its evaluation is the standards that define all the dan grades leading to and including the 16rg dan. Ray wrote: Arnis: A real Pinoy martial art A REAL Filipino martial art is more popular in the United States than here. This is for sure. But Nestor Fernandez believes that Filipino players will take the sport of arnis and will find it as exciting as any other martial arts. The karate, jujitsu, aikido, judo and fut-ga, a little known Chinese martial art master comes home to his homeland to re-introduce a sport, which has been in existence for hundreds of years but being played by a handful of Filipinos. Fernandez, a retired private investigator from Daly City, California, is a 16th dan red belt of the arnis - Fernandez style. His dojo or school in San Francisco City accommodates at least a hundred students per session. His art is known as the U.S. - Philippines Kali - Arnis - Eskrima Federation. (snipped) " Eskrima mailing list, 2200 members Eskrima@martialartsresource.net Copyright 1994-2005: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource Standard disclaimers apply http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/eskrima --------------------------------- Yahoo! for Good Click here to donate to the Hurricane Katrina relief effort. _______________________________________________ Eskrima mailing list, 2200 members Eskrima@martialartsresource.net Copyright 1994-2005: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource Standard disclaimers apply http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/eskrima --__--__-- Message: 3 From: Ray Subject: Re: [Eskrima] 16th Dan ??? To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Date: Mon, 19 Sep 2005 09:58:52 -0700 (PDT) Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net > Traditional FMA doesn't have a hierarchial structure, much more a dankyu > system. However, because of its convenience in identifying practitioners > and its other related benefits, alot of FMA teachers have adopted the > dankyu system. We see that a few FMA groups have adopted this system, but they usually refrain from using the Japanese terms dan and kyu. Doce Pares was probably the first to use the black belt system within the FMAs. Jay, do you know.?. Did Nez get the idea of using a 16 Dan system from one of the Ninjitsu groups? That is the only other art that I have heard of using a 16th Dan. Ray Terry rterry@idiom.com --__--__-- Message: 4 Date: Mon, 19 Sep 2005 15:36:25 -0700 From: Nat Nickele To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Subject: [Eskrima] A conflict of interest Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Hey all, Law school has been kicking my butt. Now I have an opportunity to kick back. I was talking about looters with one of my professors and, of course, the subject ended up with me talking about martial arts. To my surprise she asked how much I would charge her for private lessons. Wow, this is dangerous ground. It may be a conflict of interest to be punching someone who can flunk me out of school. Whatdaya think? Should I do it? -Nat --__--__-- Message: 5 Date: Mon, 19 Sep 2005 16:32:27 -0700 From: Pierre Honeyman To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Subject: Re: [Eskrima] A conflict of interest Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Quoting Nat Nickele : > Hey all, > Law school has been kicking my butt. Now I have an opportunity to kick back. > I was talking about looters with one of my professors and, of course, the > subject ended up with me talking about martial arts. To my surprise she > asked how much I would charge her for private lessons. Wow, this is > dangerous ground. It may be a conflict of interest to be punching someone > who can flunk me out of school. Whatdaya think? Should I do it? Sure, why not. It's not your conflict of interest anyhow. It'd be hers. Pierre --__--__-- Message: 6 Date: Mon, 19 Sep 2005 17:53:44 -0700 (PDT) From: Winston Tamisin Subject: Re: [Eskrima] From the eclectic defense group (edg for short) To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net I also had the pleasure of seeing Roger Agbulos teach during the Tipunam sa Disneyland as well as the WFMAA Expo. His power and speed with the stick is unbelievable. If you ever have an opportunity to train with Roger, I highly recommend it. Winston Tamisin CEO / Co-Founder SMAK-Stiks, LLC. http://www.smakstiks.com jay de leon wrote:Roger Agbulos is an excellent and entertaining instructor, a very knowledgeable and talented arnisador and a real-deal fighter. He was one of the featured instructors at the recently concluded "Tipunan sa Disneyland" (Gathering at Disneyland) seminar in Anaheim, CA which I hosted. You may read about Guro Roger and the seminar at http://www.fmadigest.com and click on the Special Issue on "Tipunan sa Disneyland" and also at http://www.worldblackbelt.com . Jay de Leon Michael Macro wrote: Dear Readers, Hi folks, I considered myself to be a diligent martial artist. I learnt my Jan fan JKD from the UK and was taught it in a simplistic applicable manner, no frills just hard work and attention to the subtleties (talented instructors make the art look easy). I was taught by an excellent instructor (Sifu Lee Gagnon- Gagnon Martial Arts Academy-he’s on the web, check out one of his classes in Chester UK if you ever get the chance), which took me to where I wanted to go, to be able to defend myself quickly. I never questioned my FMA instruction because it was working for me at that time. However when I moved away from my school, I realized how incomplete my understanding of my training was. No fault of my instructors, just that my perception was askew. I would take a hit for two I delivered or worse one for one. Yet I still trained diligently in the manner I believed was correct, reinforcing drills which were static, with footwork separate and then finally combining the both. I run my own school now and decided to experiment with my own ideas. I realized this could take a long time and I have been told that the best way to get smart at a subject is to seek out like minded people. I was fortunate to be at a seminar hosted by a friend of mine Guro Louie Lindo. Guro Roger Agbulos was instructing his concepts of largo range. Guro Roger was a very close friend and student of the late Punong Guro Edgar Sulite, founder of LAMECO ESKRIMA INTL. Roger’s concept was a breath of fresh air. The reason for this is, as a Law Enforcement Officer, and part time personal trainer (Fitness Instructor as authorized by the British Columbian Recreation and Parks Authority), I realized that I trained my empty hands in a manner which would allow me to function in a fight or flight situation. Guro Roger’s training and methodology had all the right stuff, as he trained his FMA in this manner. You see sometimes it takes a person of Roger’s caliber to make things simple for the rest of us. I never thought to train in this manner, as I thought I already had all the answers (Arrogant? Possibly. Stupid? Absolutely, but humble pie tastes better with a sprinkling of accumulated of knowledge). The worst thing was that this is how I teach specific functional fitness; I could not see the wood for the trees. It allows a practitioner to function at a high caliber in a short time. He is actively conducting seminars in the US and regularly instructs with his colleague Jon J Felperin (The Center for Law Enforcement Training) in Northridge, California. This is just me a small voice out in the wilderness saying “hey guys check this Bloke out when you can”, Kind regards to you all Salamat Michael Macro www.eclecticdefensegroup.com _________________________________________________________________ Powerful Parental Controls Let your child discover the best the Internet has to offer. http://join.msn.com/?pgmarket=en-ca&page=byoa/prem&xAPID=1994&DI=1034&SU=http://hotmail.com/enca&HL=Market_MSNIS_Taglines Start enjoying all the benefits of MSN® Premium right now and get the first two months FREE*. _______________________________________________ Eskrima mailing list, 2200 members Eskrima@martialartsresource.net Copyright 1994-2005: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource Standard disclaimers apply http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/eskrima _______________________________________________ Eskrima mailing list, 2200 members Eskrima@martialartsresource.net Copyright 1994-2005: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource Standard disclaimers apply http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/eskrima --------------------------------- Yahoo! for Good Click here to donate to the Hurricane Katrina relief effort. --__--__-- _______________________________________________ Eskrima mailing list Eskrima@martialartsresource.net http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/eskrima http://eskrima-fma.net Old digest issues @ ftp://ftp.martialartsresource.com/pub/eskrima Copyright 1994-2005: Ray Terry, MartialArtsResource.com, Sudlud.com Standard disclaimers apply. Remember September 11. End of Eskrima Digest