Date: Thu, 29 Jun 2006 18:20:39 -0700 From: eskrima-request@martialartsresource.net Subject: Eskrima digest, Vol 13 #207 - 11 msgs X-Mailer: Mailman v2.0.13.cisto1 MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Errors-To: eskrima-admin@martialartsresource.net X-BeenThere: eskrima@martialartsresource.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13.cisto1 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net X-Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net X-Subscribed-Address: fma@martialartsresource.com List-Id: Eskrima-FMA discussion forum, the premier FMA forum on the Internet. List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Unsubscribe: , List-Help: X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on plus11.host4u.net X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Status: O X-Status: X-Keywords: Send Eskrima mailing list submissions to eskrima@martialartsresource.net To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/eskrima or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to eskrima-request@martialartsresource.net You can reach the person managing the list at eskrima-admin@martialartsresource.net When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific than "Re: Contents of Eskrima digest..." <<---- The Sudlud-Inayan Eskrima/Kali/Arnis/FMA mailing list ---->> Serving the Internet since June 1994. Copyright 1994-2006: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource The Internet's premier discussion forum devoted to Filipino Martial Arts. 2300 members. Provided in memory of Mangisursuro Michael G. Inay (1944-2000). See the Filipino Martial Arts (FMA) FAQ and the online search engine for back issues of the Eskrima/FMA digest at http://MartialArtsResource.com Mabuhay ang eskrima! Today's Topics: 1. Re: Bareknuckle -v- Gloves (iPat) 2. Info on Kali Events (isagani abon) 3. Re: Bareknuckles v. Gloves (Steve Ames) 4. RE: Short sword or machete (Ken Borowiec) 5. Re: Bareknuckles v. Gloves (iPat) 6. RE: Short sword or machete (Anthony C) 7. Looking for FMA in/near Silver Spring, MD (Alex.France@kp.org) 8. Boxing sweating/wetness (Ollie Batts) 9. RE: Looking for FMA in/near Silver Spring, MD (Joseph Marana) 10. list slow or down (Ray) 11. Good Article on Violence (michael tomlinson) --__--__-- Message: 1 Date: Thu, 29 Jun 2006 09:13:27 +0100 From: iPat To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Subject: Re: [Eskrima] Bareknuckle -v- Gloves Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Ive spoken to coaches who train with lighter gloves (12-14oz) and who consider that the heavier gloves can be more dangerous, encourage injury also through the rotator and elbow. Im not saying thats right, but im still looking as to the best weight for training/sparring. I do recall a study several years back so ill do a search to see if there is anything on the web. On 6/28/06, Steve Ames wrote: > > On Wed, Jun 28, 2006 at 11:06:59AM +0100, iPat wrote: > > What is the reasoning why we use 16oz gloves to train with? That the > padding > > disperses the force? Is that negated by the weight of the glove? > > Lots of reasons. > > 1. The extra weight gives you a harder/less optimal workout; > 2. your backward... the fact that the padding reduces force transfer > negates the extra weight (with regards to force). > 3. Bigger gloves provide more protection when your hands are up in > a shieldlike manner. > 4. Gloves are less likely tu cut your opponent or give them the > cauliflower ear. > > If you take two hits in isolation, completely ignoring any other > factors and assuming they are the same, the gloved fist is going to > transfer less force to the target. -- Pat Davies www.amag.org.uk --__--__-- Message: 2 Date: Thu, 29 Jun 2006 03:42:50 -0700 (PDT) From: isagani abon To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net, escrima_arnis@topica.com Subject: [Eskrima] Info on Kali Events Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Due to a lot of inquiry about the Rapido Realismo Kali and their interest to Train and start their own Rapido Realismo Kali Training Group to represent the Arts in their country/Location. Since mostly they ask the date of any Instructor Course, PunongGuro Henry Espera decided to do a one time this year a One Month Intensive Basic Instructor Camp (IBIC) and everyone who is interested is Invited. Warrior and Mastery Camp 2006 “ Train to Learn, Train to Fight, Train to Teach “ November 6, 2006-December 11, 2006 Manila and Cavite For more info click: http://www.rapidorealismo.netfreehost.com/rapidorealismo-ftopic97.html Or email rapido_realismo@yahoo.com combatpamuok2@yahoo.com (+63) 921 6176010 http://www.angelfire.com/art2/rapidorealismo --------------------------------- How low will we go? Check out Yahoo! Messenger’s low PC-to-Phone call rates. --__--__-- Message: 3 Date: Thu, 29 Jun 2006 09:52:49 -0400 From: Steve Ames To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Subject: Re: [Eskrima] Bareknuckles v. Gloves Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net On Wed, Jun 28, 2006 at 04:30:48PM -0700, Michael Koblic wrote: > I wonder to what extent the hand bandages *under* the glove contribute to > increase in power transfer. As we all know there are significant power > leaks to any punch where the skeletal structure is not aligned just right, > notably the shoulder, the elbow and the wrist. If any of these collapse at > impact the power of the punch is reduced not to mention the increased > likelihood of injury to the puncher. Bandaging the hand and the wrist > reduces the wrist collapsing. Marc Denny covered this quite thouroughly already. I honestly can't add a thing. Good stuff. > Also, I wonder to what extent the glove padding actually *increases* the > power delivery due to increased friction on the human skin of the target > area - a bare fist thrown slightly off target will glance off and some of > the power will be dissipated as a result, particularly if there is a > significant amount of sweating or other wetness of the fist or the target > surface. Interesting question. Gloves are designed to be fairly smooth to reduce cutting, scratching, eye gouging. But I see your point... maybe someone will weigh in on this. -steve --__--__-- Message: 4 Subject: RE: [Eskrima] Short sword or machete Date: Thu, 29 Jun 2006 10:39:11 -0400 From: "Ken Borowiec" To: Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net "if I had to fight a duel and if I knew how to handle a short sword, then I'd choose the short sword. If I had to fight in a melee, then I'd chose the machete, and so on..." ~Stephen Lamade Another question would be can the same Form be used for the machete and, say the gladiolus. I believe the gladiolus is a stabbing weapon and the machete is a slicing. And so Steve made the statement above. Is this why? Ken --__--__-- Message: 5 Date: Thu, 29 Jun 2006 16:27:54 +0100 From: iPat To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Subject: Re: [Eskrima] Bareknuckles v. Gloves Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net 'cept it was marc mcjung On 6/29/06, Steve Ames wrote: > > Marc Denny covered this quite thouroughly already. I honestly can't add > a thing. Good stuff. -- > Pat Davies > www.amag.org.uk --__--__-- Message: 6 Date: Thu, 29 Jun 2006 11:10:20 -0700 (PDT) From: Anthony C Subject: RE: [Eskrima] Short sword or machete To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Actually the Gladius, assuming we are discussing the legendary Roman short sword, has a very vicious double edge to it for slashing. It is sometimes thought of as a stabbing weapon as the Romans heavily emphasized it be deployed in this manner during battle. It retains a very strong slashing capability. In fact, the first century version of the sword actually sports a noticeable recurve in the blade on both sides of the sword. To me, I have always considered it the ideal short sword for the FMA style of Espada y Daga. Does anyone else share this opinion? - Anthony Ken Borowiec wrote: "if I had to fight a duel and if I knew how to handle a short sword, then I'd choose the short sword. If I had to fight in a melee, then I'd chose the machete, and so on..." ~Stephen Lamade Another question would be can the same Form be used for the machete and, say the gladiolus. I believe the gladiolus is a stabbing weapon and the machete is a slicing. And so Steve made the statement above. Is this why? Ken _______________________________________________ Eskrima mailing list, 2300 members Eskrima@martialartsresource.net Copyright 1994-2006: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource Standard disclaimers apply http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/eskrima --------------------------------- Sneak preview the all-new Yahoo.com. It's not radically different. Just radically better. --__--__-- Message: 7 To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net, escrima_arnis@topica.com From: Alex.France@kp.org Date: Thu, 29 Jun 2006 13:53:22 -0700 Subject: [Eskrima] Looking for FMA in/near Silver Spring, MD Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Received the following inquiry today: >>Nice talking to you over the phone. Just what I have shared in brief, my son Nathan is interested in taking up arnis this summer. I would appreciate it if you could make some connections with people you know of in this part. We're from Silver Spring, Maryland 20904.<< Any recommendations for FMA schools in or near Silver Spring, Maryland? Any suggestions? Thank you in advance, Alex(ander Bautista Bayot France) Pamana ng Mandirigma (Warriors' Legacy) "Preserve the Legacy, Add to the Legacy, Pass the Legacy On" --__--__-- Message: 8 Date: Thu, 29 Jun 2006 22:32:27 +0100 From: Ollie Batts To: Subject: [Eskrima] Boxing sweating/wetness Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net If you look, and not that closely either, you'll see that most trainers and cornermen smear Vaseline on their gloved-fighter's face. It certainly helps to slip punches and/or not take the full force when they don't land dead square. Pugil "Also, I wonder to what extent the glove padding actually *increases* the power delivery due to increased friction on the human skin of the target area - a bare fist thrown slightly off target will glance off and some of the power will be dissipated as a result, particularly if there is a significant amount of sweating or other wetness of the fist or the target surface." Michael Koblic, Campbell River, BC --__--__-- Message: 9 Date: Thu, 29 Jun 2006 16:19:14 -0700 From: "Joseph Marana" Subject: RE: [Eskrima] Looking for FMA in/near Silver Spring, MD To: Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Filipino Martial Arts is somewhat limited in MD/DC but here are a few resources: Guro Bob Shin Sayoc Kali, Atienza Kali www.mdkali.com or bobshin@sayoc.com Guro Bob's class is in Columbia/Ellicott City. From Silver Spring, taking 29N should get up there pretty quick. Mr. Carlos Patalinghug Jr. Doce Pares Eskrima, GM Cacoy Canete System www.kickconnection.com The Doce Pares curriculum at Kick Connection is heavily influenced by WEKAF and so if Nathan might be interested in armored/point competition and tournaments this is a great place to go. His school is located in Glen Burnie. These were my two teachers in Maryland however there are a few others as well. If you go to http://inosanto.com/instructors.php you can find a list of instructors under Guro Dan Inosanto, including Guro Mike Krivka (who I think is is closer to Silver Spring, in Gaithersburg I think but his site seems to be down), Guro Bobby Ladra, also in Glen Burnie who trains under GT Leo Gaje in Pekiti Tersia. Feel free to contact me if you have any questions. Joe Joseph F.C. Marana, MEd Sayoc Kali Inosanto-Lacoste Kali Atienza Kali "In the end, I think it must be about faith. And if faith is a choice; if faith is never completely understanding God's plan, maybe understanding part of it; our part, is what it is to have a soul. And in the end that's what being human is, after all." Thomas, "The Prophecy" -----Original Message----- From: Alex.France@kp.org [mailto:Alex.France@kp.org] Sent: Thursday, June 29, 2006 1:53 PM To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net; escrima_arnis@topica.com Subject: [Eskrima] Looking for FMA in/near Silver Spring, MD Received the following inquiry today: >>Nice talking to you over the phone. Just what I have shared in brief, >>my son Nathan is interested in taking up arnis this summer. I would appreciate it if you could make some connections with people you know of in this part. We're from Silver Spring, Maryland 20904.<< Any recommendations for FMA schools in or near Silver Spring, Maryland? Any suggestions? Thank you in advance, Alex(ander Bautista Bayot France) Pamana ng Mandirigma (Warriors' Legacy) "Preserve the Legacy, Add to the Legacy, Pass the Legacy On" _______________________________________________ Eskrima mailing list, 2300 members Eskrima@martialartsresource.net Copyright 1994-2006: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource Standard disclaimers apply http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/eskrima ma --__--__-- Message: 10 From: Ray To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net (Eskrima) Date: Thu, 29 Jun 2006 17:18:38 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Eskrima] list slow or down Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net The Eskrima/FMA digest will be down or slow for the next several days as I journey out of town. Just fyi... Ray Terry rterry@idiom.com --__--__-- Message: 11 From: "michael tomlinson" To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Date: Fri, 30 Jun 2006 00:06:19 +0000 Subject: [Eskrima] Good Article on Violence Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net I thought this might be appropriate to our discussions as of lately...what do you all think about this big juicy nugget????? Michael Tomlinson On Sheep, Wolves, and Sheepdogs - Dave Grossman By LTC (RET) Dave Grossman, author of "On Killing." Honor never grows old, and honor rejoices the heart of age. It does so because honor is, finally, about defending those noble and worthy things that deserve defending, even if it comes at a high cost. In our time, that may mean social disapproval, public scorn, hardship, persecution, or as always,even death itself. The question remains: What is worth defending? What is worth dying for? What is worth living for? - William J. Bennett - in a lecture to the United States Naval Academy November 24, 1997 One Vietnam veteran, an old retired colonel, once said this to me: "Most of the people in our society are sheep. They are kind, gentle, productive creatures who can only hurt one another by accident." This is true. Remember, the murder rate is six per 100,000 per year, and the aggravated assault rate is four per 1,000 per year. What this means is that the vast majority of Americans are not inclined to hurt one another. Some estimates say that two million Americans are victims of violent crimes every year, a tragic, staggering number, perhaps an all-time record rate of violent crime. But there are almost 300 million Americans, which means that the odds of being a victim of violent crime is considerably less than one in a hundred on any given year. Furthermore, since many violent crimes are committed by repeat offenders, the actual number of violent citizens is considerably less than two million. Thus there is a paradox, and we must grasp both ends of the situation: We may well be in the most violent times in history, but violence is still remarkably rare. This is because most citizens are kind, decent people who are not capable of hurting each other, except by accident or under extreme provocation. They are sheep. I mean nothing negative by calling them sheep. To me it is like the pretty, blue robin's egg. Inside it is soft and gooey but someday it will grow into something wonderful. But the egg cannot survive without its hard blue shell. Police officers, soldiers, and other warriors are like that shell, and someday the civilization they protect will grow into something wonderful? For now, though, they need warriors to protect them from the predators. "Then there are the wolves," the old war veteran said, "and the wolves feed on the sheep without mercy." Do you believe there are wolves out there who will feed on the flock without mercy? You better believe it. There are evil men in this world and they are capable of evil deeds. The moment you forget that or pretend it is not so, you become a sheep. There is no safety in denial. "Then there are sheepdogs," he went on, "and I'm a sheepdog. I live to protect the flock and confront the wolf." If you have no capacity for violence then you are a healthy productive citizen, a sheep. If you have a capacity for violence and no empathy for your fellow citizens, then you have defined an aggressive sociopath, a wolf. But what if you have a capacity for violence, and a deep love for your fellow citizens? What do you have then? A sheepdog, a warrior, someone who is walking the hero's path. Someone who can walk into the heart of darkness, into the universal human phobia, and walk out unscathed Let me expand on this old soldier's excellent model of the sheep, wolves, and sheepdogs. We know that the sheep live in denial, that is what makes them sheep. They do not want to believe that there is evil in the world. They can accept the fact that fires can happen, which is why they want fire extinguishers, fire sprinklers, fire alarms and fire exits throughout their kids' schools. But many of them are outraged at the idea of putting an armed police officer in their kid's school. Our children are thousands of times more likely to be killed or seriously injured by school violence than fire, but the sheep's only response to the possibility of violence is denial. The idea of someone coming to kill or harm their child is just too hard, and so they chose the path of denial. The sheep generally do not like the sheepdog. He looks a lot like the wolf. He has fangs and the capacity for violence. The difference, though, is that the sheepdog must not, can not and will not ever harm the sheep. Any sheep dog who intentionally harms the lowliest little lamb will be punished and removed. The world cannot work any other way, at least not in a representative democracy or a republic such as ours. Still, the sheepdog disturbs the sheep. He is a constant reminder that there are wolves in the land. They would prefer that he didn't tell them where to go, or give them traffic tickets, or stand at the ready in our airports in camouflage fatigues holding an M-16. The sheep would much rather have the sheepdog cash in his fangs, spray paint himself white, and go, "Baa." Until the wolf shows up. Then the entire flock tries desperately to hide behind one lonely sheepdog. The students, the victims, at Columbine High School were big, tough high school students, and under ordinary circumstances they would not have had the time of day for a police officer. They were not bad kids; they just had nothing to say to a cop. When the school was under attack, however, and SWAT teams were clearing the rooms and hallways, the officers had to physically peel those clinging, sobbing kids off of them. This is how the little lambs feel about their sheepdog when the wolf is at the door. Look at what happened after September 11, 2001 when the wolf pounded hard on the door. Remember how America, more than ever before, felt differently about their law enforcement officers and military personnel? Remember how many times you heard the word hero? Understand that there is nothing morally superior about being a sheepdog; it is just what you choose to be. Also understand that a sheepdog is a funny critter: He is always sniffing around out on the perimeter, checking the breeze, barking at things that go bump in the night, and yearning for a righteous battle. That is, the young sheepdogs yearn for a righteous battle. The old sheepdogs are a little older and wiser, but they move to the sound of the guns when needed right along with the young ones. Here is how the sheep and the sheepdog think differently. The sheep pretend the wolf will never come, but the sheepdog lives for that day. After the attacks on September 11, 2001, most of the sheep, that is, most citizens in America said, "Thank God I wasn't on one of those planes." The sheepdogs, the warriors, said, "Dear God, I wish I could have been on one of those planes. Maybe I could have made a difference." When you are truly transformed into a warrior and have truly invested yourself into warriorhood, you want to be there. You want to be able to make a difference. There is nothing morally superior about the sheepdog, the warrior, but he does have one real advantage. Only one. And that is that he is able to survive and thrive in an environment that destroys 98 percent of the population. There was research conducted a few years ago with individuals convicted of violent crimes. These cons were in prison for serious, predatory crimes of violence: assaults, murders and killing law enforcement officers. The vast majority said that they specifically targeted victims by body language: slumped walk, passive behavior and lack of awareness. They chose their victims like big cats do in Africa, when they select one out of the herd that is least able to protect itself. Some people may be destined to be sheep and others might be genetically primed to be wolves or sheepdogs. But I believe that most people can choose which one they want to be, and I'm proud to say that more and more Americans are choosing to become sheepdogs. Seven months after the attack on September 11, 2001, Todd Beamer was honored in his hometown of Cranbury, New Jersey. Todd, as you recall, was the man on Flight 93 over Pennsylvania who called on his cell phone to alert an operator from United Airlines about the hijacking. When he learned of the other three passenger planes that had been used as weapons, Todd dropped his phone and uttered the words, "Let's roll," which authorities believe was a signal to the other passengers to confront the terrorist hijackers. In one hour, a transformation occurred among the passengers - athletes, business people and parents. -- from sheep to sheepdogs and together they fought the wolves, ultimately saving an unknown number of lives on the ground. There is no safety for honest men except by believing all possible evil of evil men. - Edmund Burke Here is the point I like to emphasize, especially to the thousands of police officers and soldiers I speak to each year. In nature the sheep, real sheep, are born as sheep. Sheepdogs are born that way, and so are wolves. They didn't have a choice. But you are not a critter. As a human being, you can be whatever you want to be. It is a conscious, moral decision. If you want to be a sheep, then you can be a sheep and that is okay, but you must understand the price you pay. When the wolf comes, you and your loved ones are going to die if there is not a sheepdog there to protect you. If you want to be a wolf, you can be one, but the sheepdogs are going to hunt you down and you will never have rest, safety, trust or love. But if you want to be a sheepdog and walk the warrior's path, then you must make a conscious and moral decision every day to dedicate, equip and prepare yourself to thrive in that toxic, corrosive moment when the wolf comes knocking at the door. For example, many officers carry their weapons in church.? They are well concealed in ankle holsters, shoulder holsters or inside-the-belt holsters tucked into the small of their backs.? Anytime you go to some form of religious service, there is a very good chance that a police officer in your congregation is carrying. You will never know if there is such an individual in your place of worship, until the wolf appears to massacre you and your loved ones. I was training a group of police officers in Texas, and during the break, one officer asked his friend if he carried his weapon in church. The other cop replied, "I will never be caught without my gun in church." I asked why he felt so strongly about this, and he told me about a cop he knew who was at a church massacre in Ft. Worth, Texas in 1999. In that incident, a mentally deranged individual came into the church and opened fire, gunning down fourteen people. He said that officer believed he could have saved every life that day if he had been carrying his gun. His own son was shot, and all he could do was throw himself on the boy's body and wait to die. That cop looked me in the eye and said, "Do you have any idea how hard it would be to live with yourself after that?" Some individuals would be horrified if they knew this police officer was carrying a weapon in church. They might call him paranoid and would probably scorn him. Yet these same individuals would be enraged and would call for "heads to roll" if they found out that the airbags in their cars were defective, or that the fire extinguisher and fire sprinklers in their kids' school did not work. They can accept the fact that fires and traffic accidents can happen and that there must be safeguards against them. Their only response to the wolf, though, is denial, and all too often their response to the sheepdog is scorn and disdain. But the sheepdog quietly asks himself, "Do you have and idea how hard it would be to live with yourself if your loved ones attacked and killed, and you had to stand there helplessly because you were unprepared for that day?" It is denial that turns people into sheep. Sheep are psychologically destroyed by combat because their only defense is denial, which is counterproductive and destructive, resulting in fear, helplessness and horror when the wolf shows up. Denial kills you twice. It kills you once, at your moment of truth when you are not physically prepared: you didn't bring your gun, you didn't train. Your only defense was wishful thinking. Hope is not a strategy. Denial kills you a second time because even if you do physically survive, you are psychologically shattered by your fear helplessness and horror at your moment of truth. Gavin de Becker puts it like this in Fear Less, his superb post-9/11 book, which should be required reading for anyone trying to come to terms with our current world situation: "...denial can be seductive, but it has an insidious side effect. For all the peace of mind deniers think they get by saying it isn't so, the fall they take when faced with new violence is all the more unsettling." Denial is a save-now-pay-later scheme, a contract written entirely in small print, for in the long run, the denying person knows the truth on some level. And so the warrior must strive to confront denial in all aspects of his life, and prepare himself for the day when evil comes. If you are warrior who is legally authorized to carry a weapon and you step outside without that weapon, then you become a sheep, pretending that the bad man will not come today. No one can be "on" 24/7, for a lifetime. Everyone needs down time. But if you are authorized to carry a weapon, and you walk outside without it, just take a deep breath, and say this to yourself... "Baa." This business of being a sheep or a sheep dog is not a yes-no dichotomy. It is not an all-or-nothing, either-or choice. It is a matter of degrees, a continuum. On one end is an abject, head-in-the-sand-sheep and on the other end is the ultimate warrior. Few people exist completely on one end or the other. Most of us live somewhere in between. Since 9-11 almost everyone in America took a step up that continuum, away from denial. The sheep took a few steps toward accepting and appreciating their warriors, and the warriors started taking their job more seriously. The degree to which you move up that continuum, away from sheephood and denial, is the degree to which you and your loved ones will survive, physically and psychologically at your moment of truth. --__--__-- _______________________________________________ Eskrima mailing list Eskrima@martialartsresource.net http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/eskrima http://eskrima-fma.net Old digest issues @ ftp://ftp.martialartsresource.com/pub/eskrima Copyright 1994-2006: Ray Terry, MartialArtsResource.com, Sudlud.com Standard disclaimers apply. Remember September 11. End of Eskrima Digest