Date: Thu, 17 Aug 2006 19:36:56 -0700 From: eskrima-request@martialartsresource.net Subject: Eskrima digest, Vol 13 #267 - 9 msgs X-Mailer: Mailman v2.0.13.cisto1 MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Errors-To: eskrima-admin@martialartsresource.net X-BeenThere: eskrima@martialartsresource.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13.cisto1 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net X-Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net X-Subscribed-Address: fma@martialartsresource.com List-Id: Eskrima-FMA discussion forum, the premier FMA forum on the Internet. List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Unsubscribe: , List-Help: Status: O X-Status: X-Keywords: Send Eskrima mailing list submissions to eskrima@martialartsresource.net To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/eskrima or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to eskrima-request@martialartsresource.net You can reach the person managing the list at eskrima-admin@martialartsresource.net When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific than "Re: Contents of Eskrima digest..." <<---- The Sudlud-Inayan Eskrima/Kali/Arnis/FMA mailing list ---->> Serving the Internet since June 1994. Copyright 1994-2006: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource The Internet's premier discussion forum devoted to Filipino Martial Arts. 2300 members. Provided in memory of Mangisursuro Michael G. Inay (1944-2000). See the Filipino Martial Arts (FMA) FAQ and the online search engine for back issues of the Eskrima/FMA digest at http://MartialArtsResource.com Mabuhay ang eskrima! Today's Topics: 1. Mongol rulz (Bandile Dlabantu) 2. Swords (Ollie Batts) 3. Doce Pares UK Seminar (Ollie Batts) 4. Re: Swords (Steve Ames) 5. East, West and Mongols (Marc MacYoung) 6. How to experience big blades (Marc MacYoung) 7. Re: How to experience big blades (Jonathan Kessler) 8. sparring (Keith Slatoff (SP FTA)) 9. Marine Corps Martial Arts Program (Ray) --__--__-- Message: 1 Date: Thu, 17 Aug 2006 08:26:27 +0000 (GMT) From: Bandile Dlabantu To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Subject: [Eskrima] Mongol rulz Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net The Kamikaze came in at the second invasion in 1281. It was after Kublai Khan had secured his hold over China and Korea. The first invasion the Japanese were thorpughly trounced by Mongol tactics ( arrows and bombs) in the Battle of Bunei (1274). The samurai fleed the battle field after suffering heavy losses and facing the battle hardened Mongols who had fought both European and Asian armies. However, heavy casualties, lack of supplies, rebellion brewing among the Korean and Chinese auxilaries that made the majority of the army, and a storm on its fleet forced the invasion off. Had the Mongols marched on to Kyushu they would have easily subdued Japan. The second battle the Japanese had better prepared with fortifications and lots of prayer so a Kamikaze saved them.Lack of addiquate planning and logistics also played a part in the Mongol defeat. They used flat-bottomed Chinese riverboats for invasion force. Such ships were not designed to deal with the high seas, let alone a massive typhoon. Had Kublai used ocean going ships, which have a curved keel to prevent capsizing, his navy may have largely survived the storm. What I wanted to say was armour and arms are only as strong as the mind that is weilding them. The old battle fields were realy complex, begs the question of whether the "battle" techniques we practise nowadays would be usefull in those days. Bandile D. Admire only the diamond that can bear the hits of a hammer - Kabir --__--__-- Message: 2 Date: Thu, 17 Aug 2006 12:18:47 +0100 From: Ollie Batts To: Subject: [Eskrima] Swords Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Yes there are several places where genuine old blades can be viewed 'behind glass' as you say Michael. The Fitzwilliam museum here in Cambridge, UK, is local to me and they have some nice weapons on show - one or two of them are not even behind glass either. Some old country houses in the UK also house collections, and are often worth seeking out when you can. Raven Armoury near Saffron Walden (about 20 miles from me) makes replica swords, including for museums such as the British Museum, and they'll even allow visitors to handle their weapons too. You can visit their website on the following: http://www.raven-armoury.co.uk/ Pugil From: "Michael Koblic" To: "Eskrima digest" Date: Wed, 16 Aug 2006 20:53:18 -0700 Subject: [Eskrima] How to experience big blades --__--__-- Message: 3 Date: Thu, 17 Aug 2006 12:30:52 +0100 From: Ollie Batts To: Subject: [Eskrima] Doce Pares UK Seminar Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Please be advised of the forthcoming FMA Doce Pares training seminar: Event: Filipino Martial Art Open Training Seminar with DANNY GUBA - Grandmaster and 10th Degree black belt in the Doce Pares system Date: Sunday 3rd September. Times: 11am - 4pm (1100 - 1600hrs). Venue: Netherhall Lower School Gym., Gunhild Way, Cambridge. (Off Wulfstan Way, off Cherry Hinton Road & Queen Edith's Way) Costs: £40 (in advance). £50 on-the-door (if places available). We advise you to pre-register, in order to secure your place. Info: Tel: 01223 565 020 or email me: ollie@kalifit.com Ollie Batts Director & Senior Instructor Cambridge Academy of Martial Arts® http://www.cambridgemartialarts.com --__--__-- Message: 4 Date: Thu, 17 Aug 2006 10:16:00 -0400 From: Steve Ames To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Subject: Re: [Eskrima] Swords Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net The Frazier Historical Arms Museum in Louisevill, KY. http://fraziermuseum.org/ They have a solid collection. -Steve On Thu, Aug 17, 2006 at 12:18:47PM +0100, Ollie Batts wrote: > Yes there are several places where genuine old blades can be viewed 'behind > glass' as you say Michael. The Fitzwilliam museum here in Cambridge, UK, is > local to me and they have some nice weapons on show - one or two of them are > not even behind glass either. > > Some old country houses in the UK also house collections, and are often > worth seeking out when you can. > > Raven Armoury near Saffron Walden (about 20 miles from me) makes replica > swords, including for museums such as the British Museum, and they'll even > allow visitors to handle their weapons too. You can visit their website on > the following: http://www.raven-armoury.co.uk/ > > Pugil > > > From: "Michael Koblic" > To: "Eskrima digest" > Date: Wed, 16 Aug 2006 20:53:18 -0700 > Subject: [Eskrima] How to experience big blades > _______________________________________________ > Eskrima mailing list, 2300 members > Eskrima@martialartsresource.net > Copyright 1994-2006: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource > Standard disclaimers apply > http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/eskrima --__--__-- Message: 5 From: "Marc MacYoung" To: Date: Thu, 17 Aug 2006 10:47:11 -0600 Subject: [Eskrima] East, West and Mongols Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net > The Mongols also tasted defeat at the hands of the Javanese... > > It seems that Pencak Silat also has glorious roots... Ummm... on my book shelf I have books by Lamb, Grousset and a number of others. In college I was a history major with a specialty on the nomadic tribes of Central Asia. History and warfare is more complex than many people in the martial arts want it to be. The overall consensus is that weather, disease, environment, terrain, hoof rot, parasites and the strains of the temperature on the men and horses bred for extreme cold is considered what forced the Mongols to turn back from the whole of South East Asia... not the fighting arts they encountered there. When your troops and horses are all sick, dead or dying, it's time to pull back. http://afe.easia.columbia.edu/mongols/china/china4_a.htm Columbia University is a pretty solid source. If you can come up with a better source on how the deadly fighting arts of the natives were what caused them to withdraw, I'd love to hear it. M --__--__-- Message: 6 From: "Marc MacYoung" To: Date: Thu, 17 Aug 2006 10:59:28 -0600 Subject: [Eskrima] How to experience big blades Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net > In the North America one can handle a few blades here and there at shows. > The Blade Show in Atlanta is particularly good for this (and other > reasons - > it caters to the Inner Child admirably!) Majority of the swords there are > new constructions, however, which tell us little about their historical > ancestors. How does a Cold Steel Warrior katana compare with a Murasama > blade? Museum Replicas in Atlanta Georgia. Not exact, but they give you a general idea since they are modeled after the originals. I just don't recommend fighting with them, but doing drills with them is an eye opening experience. Also in West Los Angeles on Washington Blvd, just East of Sepulveda and before Blvd and Place merge again, you have a Japanese sword store that also carries some other type of historical blades. Their hours are kind of funky, but they know their blades and metallurgy. Also the gunstore where the Washingtons merge used to carry a number of historical blades...I don't know if they do anymore You might also want to try anywhere in the US any of the collector's arms shows. You can find them in the Gun Show Calendar. You can find that magazine at most larger newsstands. Of course if you go to a Renaissance Faire/blade show where Jim Hrsulas sells his stuff, you'll find some nice weighted blades. M --__--__-- Message: 7 Date: Thu, 17 Aug 2006 11:44:29 -0700 (PDT) From: Jonathan Kessler Subject: Re: [Eskrima] How to experience big blades To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net That place on Washington in Venice/West LA is one of my pilgramage stops! They always have great stuff. They had a particularly fine Schiavona that they were good enough to let me handle. Changed my understanding of 16th century swords completely. What an incredible blade. There are some great swordmakers in the Czech republic, if you can get over there. 2 of my favorites: http://www.lutel.cz/ http://www.armouronline.com/ Some of Cold Steel's reproduction European swords are quite good, as well. Their 1837 (Blucher) saber compares very favorably with the orignal I handled, and I got to use them side by side. Their Shamshir compares nicely to several Turkish shamshir's I've handled in the past. Wonderful blade... I can't speak for the Chinese or Japanese blades at all, though. JK Marc MacYoung wrote: > In the North America one can handle a few blades here and there at shows. > The Blade Show in Atlanta is particularly good for this (and other > reasons - > it caters to the Inner Child admirably!) Majority of the swords there are > new constructions, however, which tell us little about their historical > ancestors. How does a Cold Steel Warrior katana compare with a Murasama > blade? Museum Replicas in Atlanta Georgia. Not exact, but they give you a general idea since they are modeled after the originals. I just don't recommend fighting with them, but doing drills with them is an eye opening experience. Also in West Los Angeles on Washington Blvd, just East of Sepulveda and before Blvd and Place merge again, you have a Japanese sword store that also carries some other type of historical blades. Their hours are kind of funky, but they know their blades and metallurgy. Also the gunstore where the Washingtons merge used to carry a number of historical blades...I don't know if they do anymore You might also want to try anywhere in the US any of the collector's arms shows. You can find them in the Gun Show Calendar. You can find that magazine at most larger newsstands. Of course if you go to a Renaissance Faire/blade show where Jim Hrsulas sells his stuff, you'll find some nice weighted blades. M _______________________________________________ Eskrima mailing list, 2300 members Eskrima@martialartsresource.net Copyright 1994-2006: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource Standard disclaimers apply http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/eskrima --__--__-- Message: 8 Date: Thu, 17 Aug 2006 18:23:02 -0500 From: "Keith Slatoff \(SP FTA\)" To: Cc: "Alex Mauricci \(SP FTA\)" Subject: [Eskrima] sparring Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Does your school do any live sparring? Ray Terry rterry@idiom.com We do light, medium, and heavy sparring with wood and bladed weapons only within the organization and its' members. When we spar with bladed weapons we use some protective gear for vital areas. Regards, Keith Keith Slatoff Associate Store Team Leader Whole Foods Market Ft. Apache 8855 W. Charleston Blvd. Las Vegas, NV 89014 702-254-8655 "I cannot attach right or wrong to actions other than my own." --__--__-- Message: 9 From: Ray To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net (Eskrima) Date: Thu, 17 Aug 2006 20:33:16 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Eskrima] Marine Corps Martial Arts Program Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Camp Fuji pushing the pace in its martial-arts program Pacific edition, Saturday, August 12, 2006 Camp Fuji is trying to put its Japan-based Marines on a faster track up the martial-arts belt chain. Personnel with tan and gray belts are getting together once a week for sustainment training at Little Guns Gym. Marines and sailors wearing green, brown and black belts also are encouraged to attend a 5:30 a.m. session every Tuesday or Thursday. All have been issued logbooks in an effort to track hours and speed up promotions. It's part of the Marine Corps Martial Arts Program, a system that combines new and old hand-to-hand and close-combat techniques. The program, which began in 2001, trains Marines and attached U.S. Navy personnel in unarmed combat, edged weapons, weapons of opportunity, and rifle and bayonet techniques. About 200 servicemembers assigned to Fuji's Combined Arms Training Center are participating, according to Staff Sgt. Jon Willman, who schedules black- belt instructors to visit the base. "You're required to do so many hours of sustainment training before you test for belts," said Willman, a green belt. "Sometimes, they'll do combat-conditioning drills. It's a real rigorous circuit course where they incorporate different moves, throws and strikes. A lot of repetition. " . The push is to get as many people as possible qualified up to highest belts while they're here at Camp Fuji." MCMAP evolved from the Linear Infighting Neurological Override Engagement, or LINE, combat system, a martial-arts program used by the Marine Corps from 1980 to 2002. But it was found to be lacking in flexibility and techniques for use in situations that didn't require deadly force, such as peacekeeping operations. "It was a really rigid style of fighting," Willman said. "We learned it when we went to boot camp. After that, if you didn't keep up with that kind of training, you lost it real fast. "MCMAP is for Marines with flak vests, packs and gear on, which LINE training wasn't really designed for. It's basically a bunch of mixed martial arts that the moves are tailored for. You're not gonna strip down to your trousers and T-shirts to fight somebody, so they tweaked all the moves to make it easier and better to do in your gear itself." The program's core unarmed combat system is based on 10 traditional martial arts. "It's a more fluid and flexible style of fighting," he said. "We call it giving you a bigger toolbox. . It incorporates a lot more weapons than LINE training used to. . It pretty much teaches you can use anything for a weapon." Sgt. Brian Moody heads to Okinawa next week to get certified as a black-belt instructor-trainer. Upon his return, he'll become the MCMAP chief instructor at Fuji and also be responsible for training Marines stationed at other bases on the Kanto Plain. Willman said 99 percent of Fuji personnel have reached gray-belt status, the second-highest level. "We're trying to get everybody up to green belt, which is the third," he added. "Sgt. Moody will be gone about six weeks. While he's away, everybody will get the sustainment time they need to really push forward on this." --__--__-- _______________________________________________ Eskrima mailing list Eskrima@martialartsresource.net http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/eskrima http://eskrima-fma.net Old digest issues @ ftp://ftp.martialartsresource.com/pub/eskrima Copyright 1994-2006: Ray Terry, MartialArtsResource.com, Sudlud.com Standard disclaimers apply. Remember September 11. End of Eskrima Digest