Date: Mon, 18 Dec 2006 02:59:28 -0800 From: eskrima-request@martialartsresource.net Subject: Eskrima digest, Vol 13 #382 - 7 msgs X-Mailer: Mailman v2.0.13.cisto1 MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Errors-To: eskrima-admin@martialartsresource.net X-BeenThere: eskrima@martialartsresource.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13.cisto1 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net X-Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net X-Subscribed-Address: fma@martialartsresource.com List-Id: Eskrima-FMA discussion forum, the premier FMA forum on the Internet. List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Unsubscribe: , List-Help: X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on plus11.host4u.net X-Spam-Status: No, hits=1.3 required=5.0 tests=MAILTO_TO_SPAM_ADDR, NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: * Status: O X-Status: X-Keywords: Send Eskrima mailing list submissions to eskrima@martialartsresource.net To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/eskrima or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to eskrima-request@martialartsresource.net You can reach the person managing the list at eskrima-admin@martialartsresource.net When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific than "Re: Contents of Eskrima digest..." <<---- The Sudlud-Inayan Eskrima/Kali/Arnis/FMA mailing list ---->> Serving the Internet since June 1994. Copyright 1994-2006: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource The Internet's premier discussion forum devoted to Filipino Martial Arts. 2300 members. Provided in memory of Mangisursuro Michael G. Inay (1944-2000). See the Filipino Martial Arts (FMA) FAQ and the online search engine for back issues of the Eskrima/FMA digest at http://MartialArtsResource.com Mabuhay ang eskrima! Today's Topics: 1. Re: jkd kali international (iPat) 2. Re: Father of Eskrima in the US (jay de leon) 3. Re: Father of Eskrima in the US (Ray) 4. re: father of FMA (michael s) 5. RE: Father of Ekrima In The Us (Al Sardinas) 6. Re: re: father of FMA (Ray) 7. Re: RE: Father of Ekrima In The Us (Ray) --__--__-- Message: 1 Date: Sun, 17 Dec 2006 10:40:33 +0000 From: iPat To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Subject: Re: [Eskrima] jkd kali international Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net its Bob Breens organisation. The Inosanto International Martial art Instructors Association is seperate. On 12/16/06, Gordon Walker wrote: > hi, > just wondering if the jkd-kali organization is a UK institution founded by > bob breen or if its Guro Inosanto's international organization. > First I've heard of it. > Regards, > Gordon -- Pat Davies www.amag.org.uk --__--__-- Message: 2 Date: Sat, 16 Dec 2006 18:47:01 -0800 (PST) From: jay de leon Subject: Re: [Eskrima] Father of Eskrima in the US To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net For whatever it is worth, here is my personal view on the spread of FMA in the US. http://www.filipinofightingartsintl.com/Publications/martial_arts/spread-filipino-martial-arts.html Also, in this article, note the write-up on Angel Cabales, Leo Giron and Ben Largusa. http://www.filipinofightingartsintl.com/Publications/martial_arts/legendary-founders.html Other related articles may be found in any of my websites. Jay de Leon www.tipunan.com Ray wrote: > Insoanto is responsible for exposing the majority of US FMA practicioners to > these arts. > I never heard of him being called the father of Filipino Martial Arts in the > US, and he is Filipino!!! That title typically goes to Angel Cabales. In Danny's 1980 book he states "I feel that Master Cabales, more than any other, is responsible for the emergence of Escrima in the United States." Under a pic of the Stockton eskrima group with Angel (Mary Tovar, Mike Inay, Al Concepcion and Remy Estrellia), Danny states "the future of the art is in their capable hands". Clearly Angel and his many students, including Danny, and the students of those students, have done the most to spread the FMAs in the US. Ray Terry rterry@idiom.com _______________________________________________ Eskrima mailing list, 2400 members Eskrima@martialartsresource.net Copyright 1994-2006: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource Standard disclaimers apply http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/eskrima --__--__-- Message: 3 From: Ray Subject: Re: [Eskrima] Father of Eskrima in the US To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Date: Sun, 17 Dec 2006 09:00:06 -0800 (PST) Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net What always seems to be missing in the discussion of the -real- leaders in bringing FMA to the US are the contributions of someone like Manong Al Concepcion. A real behind the scenes type of guy. Probably next after Dentoy, Al was one of Angel's earliest students. Al had come to the US on a student visa and wanted to stay longer once it ran out. By volunteering to fight in Vietnam he earned the right to remain in this country. He was the sponsor of many of the best known eskrimadors into the US. He was the first to bring in Cacoy and many others. Sure, Cacoy and the many other eskrima masters that Manong Al brought into the US would have eventually made it here with someone elses help, but it would have perhaps taken another five or ten years. Ray Terry rterry@idiom.com --__--__-- Message: 4 Date: Sun, 17 Dec 2006 14:16:54 -0800 (PST) From: michael s To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Subject: [Eskrima] re: father of FMA Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Ray, I agree 100%... That title typically goes to Angel Cabales. In Danny's 1980 book he states "I feel that Master Cabales, more than any other, is responsible for the emergence of Escrima in the United States." Under a pic of the Stockton eskrima group with Angel (Mary Tovar, Mike Inay, Al Concepcion and Remy Estrellia), Danny states "the future of the art is in their capable hands". Clearly Angel and his many students, including Danny, and the students of those students, have done the most to spread the FMAs in the US. Ray Terry .......however, all that being said and after everything written in the past; there has been opportunity to elevate Angel Cabales through a number of platforms. Most recently the 2 most prominent platforms that come to mind are the Martial Arts Museum and Hall of Fame and the Black Belt Magazine Hall of Fame. Within the Martial Arts Museum and Hall of Fame, a person can only be nominated by present members of the Martial Arts Museum and Hall of Fame. Why then has Angel Cabales not been nominated; in all seriousness, he had influence on at least 3 members that I am aware of in Dan Inosanto, Graciela Casillas & Professor Leo Fong. Additionally, such an influential member as Wally Jay Sensei had the opportunity to meet Angel Cabales and see the value of Cabales Serrada Escrima. What could possibly stand in the way of an induction to the Martial Arts Museum and Hall of Fame for Angel Cabales??? Because I'm not "monetarily connected" in/to the West Coast, nor am I tied "politically" to the inner workings of Martial Arts on the West Coast, I believe these to attribute to my lack of understanding in this matter. I look forward to my enlightenment in the replys that follow. My best to all during this holiday season. Mike --__--__-- Message: 5 From: "Al Sardinas" To: Date: Sun, 17 Dec 2006 18:35:34 -0500 Subject: [Eskrima] RE: Father of Ekrima In The Us Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Ray, you may be right that Angel Cabales is the Father of Eskrima in the US. But does that apply to Arnis? Kali? To the East Coast? My first exposure to FMA's was at Aaron Banks' Oriental World of Self Defense in 1974 - Remy Presas performed at this Madison Square Garden event. Then in 1977, I saw Tuhon Gaje performed Kali in Chinatown. Presas must be given credit for spreading thre FMA's regardless of how diluted or unorganized the state of Modern Arnis is today. And Gaje also must be given credit for spreading then and now the FMA's and he has kept his art pure. Thirty years ago we did not have the benefit of having ED nor did we have today's martial art exposure. Back then everything was by word of mouth or a once in a while magazine article. So how did I learn of Cabales, through my PTK instructor. So since Father is a big title (almost divine), with all due respect, the title should be shared by Cabales, Presas and Gaje. Respectfully, Al Sardinas Student of the Garimot System of Arnis --__--__-- Message: 6 From: Ray Subject: Re: [Eskrima] re: father of FMA To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Date: Sun, 17 Dec 2006 17:07:38 -0800 (PST) Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net > .......however, all that being said and after everything written in the past; there has been opportunity to elevate Angel Cabales through a number of platforms. > > Most recently the 2 most prominent platforms that come to mind are the Martial Arts Museum and Hall of Fame and the Black Belt Magazine Hall of Fame. I believe that Angel is already in the Black Belt Hall of Fame as the Father of Eskrima in the US. As to the dozens of other halls of fame, well, just how many halls of fame do we really need.?.?. Ray Terry rterry@idiom.com --__--__-- Message: 7 From: Ray Subject: Re: [Eskrima] RE: Father of Ekrima In The Us To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Date: Sun, 17 Dec 2006 17:08:37 -0800 (PST) Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net > Ray, you may be right that Angel Cabales is the Father of Eskrima in the US. > But does that apply to Arnis? Kali? To the East Coast? Eskrima, Kali (Arnis). Same same... Ray Terry rterry@idiom.com --__--__-- _______________________________________________ Eskrima mailing list Eskrima@martialartsresource.net http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/eskrima http://eskrima-fma.net Old digest issues @ ftp://ftp.martialartsresource.com/pub/eskrima Copyright 1994-2006: Ray Terry, MartialArtsResource.com, Sudlud.com Standard disclaimers apply. Remember September 11. End of Eskrima Digest