Date: Sat, 21 Apr 2007 02:58:31 -0700 From: eskrima-request@martialartsresource.net Subject: Eskrima digest, Vol 14 #110 - 17 msgs X-Mailer: Mailman v2.0.13.cisto1 MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Errors-To: eskrima-admin@martialartsresource.net X-BeenThere: eskrima@martialartsresource.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13.cisto1 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net X-Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net X-Subscribed-Address: fma@martialartsresource.com List-Id: Eskrima-FMA discussion forum, the premier FMA forum on the Internet. 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Copyright 1994-2007: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource The Internet's premier discussion forum devoted to Filipino Martial Arts. 2400 members. Provided in memory of Mangisursuro Michael G. Inay (1944-2000). See the Filipino Martial Arts (FMA) FAQ and the online search engine for back issues of the Eskrima/FMA digest at http://MartialArtsResource.com Mabuhay ang eskrima! Today's Topics: 1. Re: The Mad Max Society (Jonathan Kessler) 2. GM Cacoys seminar schedule.. (Karol Krauser) 3. Re: Guns (Jon Broster) 4. Re: The Mad Max Society (iPat) 5. Militia (Joseph Rusnak) 6. Re: GM Cacoys seminar schedule.. (Ray) 7. Re: Militia (Ray) 8. RE: Guns (Michael Gallagher) 9. Re: More on Guns (Michael Gallagher) 10. Re: Guns (Michael Gallagher) 11. Sayoc Kali in Long Beach (Joseph Marana) 12. RE: Guns (Leo Daher) 13. Re: Guns (Leo Daher) 14. Gun/death stats (BBC) (Loki Jorgenson) 15. Re: Gun/death stats (BBC) (Ray) 16. Help in Florida "Where is Garmoit?? is this spelling correct?? (howard@one.net) 17. Re: Sayoc Kali in Long Beach (jay de leon) --__--__-- Message: 1 Date: Thu, 19 Apr 2007 22:47:30 -0700 (PDT) From: Jonathan Kessler Subject: Re: [Eskrima] The Mad Max Society To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Ray wrote: So it sounds like we should use this quote wrt Franklin... "Sell not virtue to purchase wealth, nor Liberty to purchase power." Now how to work that into an FMA theme... :) "Don't pawn your barong to pay the rent. Just train harder. And as for power, remember that a chainsaw can carve a nice angle 2." OK, it's late, I'll stop now. JK --__--__-- Message: 2 Date: Fri, 20 Apr 2007 01:36:35 -0700 (PDT) From: Karol Krauser To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Subject: [Eskrima] GM Cacoys seminar schedule.. Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Aloha all... Does anyone have an updated version of GM Cacoys seminar schedule while he is hear in the states this year ? Thanks Karol --------------------------------- Ahhh...imagining that irresistible "new car" smell? Check outnew cars at Yahoo! Autos. --__--__-- Message: 3 Date: Fri, 20 Apr 2007 10:11:58 +0100 (BST) From: Jon Broster To: Eskrima Digest Subject: [Eskrima] Re: Guns Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Hi Does anyone have any data comparing the rates of legal gun ownership and their use in crime in the USA, with the rates of illegal gunownership and their use in crime in countries like the UK? Over here, (in the UK) basically the only people who have guns (outside the military) are: a relatively small number of police and criminals. (Certain Olympic shooting sports are, in effect, illegal in Britain!) Despite this prohibition on guns, replete with ever increasing penalties for their posession, there is no clear reduction in their illicit use - at least as far as I can see reported (& we can be absolutely certain that politicians would be shouting about it if there were!) I think that what we need to do is look at why other countries with high gun ownership- Switzerland, Canada seem like 2 good examples - seem to have lower rates of this sort of mayhem. Jon "There's nothing more dangerous than a blunt knife" http://www.pecahan.net --__--__-- Message: 4 Date: Fri, 20 Apr 2007 10:46:30 +0100 From: iPat To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Subject: Re: [Eskrima] The Mad Max Society Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net lol you certainly waited till we had stemmed the onslaught and jumped on the bandwagon once you decided who would win. But seriously, too many people gave up their lives for this to become a frivolous matter, including relations of mine. [You missed out the MMS funding Irish Terrorism] On 4/20/07, bgdebuque wrote: > The last time I checked, it seems that the "Mad Max Society" had already > saved the "Outside World" three (3) times: > > 1. WWI (which BTW was started by the more civilized "Outside World") > 2. WWII (which again was started by the more civilized "Outside World") > 3. Cold War (which again was started by the more civilized "Outside World") > -- Pat Davies www.amag.org.uk --__--__-- Message: 5 Date: Fri, 20 Apr 2007 06:33:38 -0700 (PDT) From: Joseph Rusnak To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Subject: [Eskrima] Militia Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net >> The United States Annotated Code Title 19, >> Subtitle A, Part I, Chapter 13, § 311 states >> the militia "consists of all able bodied males at >> least 17 years of age . . . and under 45 years of >> age who are, or who have made a declaration of >> intention to become, citizens of the United >> State. . . ." Hmmm... Under 45 years of age... Unless I miss my guess, Ray, you are no longer part of the "well-regulated militia". Time to turn your guns! :-) (Just kidding!!!!) Joe __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com --__--__-- Message: 6 Subject: Re: [Eskrima] GM Cacoys seminar schedule.. To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Date: Fri, 20 Apr 2007 05:52:27 -0700 (PDT) From: rterry@idiom.com (Ray) Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net > Does anyone have an updated version of GM Cacoys seminar schedule while he is hear in the states this year ? > Yes. Already posted to the list a couple of times and available in the list archives. Ray Terry rterry@idiom.com --__--__-- Message: 7 Subject: Re: [Eskrima] Militia To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Date: Fri, 20 Apr 2007 06:50:24 -0700 (PDT) From: rterry@idiom.com (Ray) Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net > Hmmm... Under 45 years of age... Unless I miss my > guess, Ray, you are no longer part of the > "well-regulated militia". Time to turn your guns! > :-) Damn... Busted again... Ray Terry rterry@idiom.com --__--__-- Message: 8 Date: Fri, 20 Apr 2007 12:09:28 -0400 To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net From: Michael Gallagher Subject: RE: [Eskrima] Guns Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net At 01:30 AM 4/19/2007, you wrote: >.... The blood dancing gun banners are always >talking about "sensible" gun laws. That always means: remove everyone >else's guns. Many of the most adamant banners have people hired to protect >them ..... Don't remember his name, but some years ago, this ardently anti-gun columnist shot someone in self defense (so he claimed). Turned out the gun he had was unlicensed; he got in trouble for that. So like you say, every gun but theirs. --__--__-- Message: 9 Date: Fri, 20 Apr 2007 12:10:17 -0400 To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net From: Michael Gallagher Subject: Re: [Eskrima] More on Guns Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net At 05:18 AM 4/19/2007, you wrote: >.... But don't you see that to >many people living in 'the outside world', you seem to be heading towards >some kind of Mad Max society? Those people have probably fallen prey to the same fallacies gun control advocates spout. But one of those countries in the "outside world" is England, where the British government is looking at banning SWORDS. Not surprisingly, Japanese swordsmanship practitioners are up in arms about that. The good news is the language of that bill does allow "legitimate" clubs and collectors to have them, but that implies a cumbersome licensing process that, at the end of the day, just makes life harder for martial artists and probably does nothing to stop the fruitcake who wants to slice and dice. --__--__-- Message: 10 Date: Fri, 20 Apr 2007 12:10:36 -0400 To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net From: Michael Gallagher Subject: Re: [Eskrima] Guns Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net At 05:26 PM 4/18/2007, you wrote: >..... we do not allow people to drive vehicles without some sort of >assessment of their competence to do so. Would it not make sense to apply >the same standard to firearms? Requiring prospective gun owners to take a safety course would be the equivalent of a driver's test. It sounds like a good idea, but so do a lot of things before you try them. --__--__-- Message: 11 Date: Fri, 20 Apr 2007 09:46:09 -0700 From: "Joseph Marana" To: Cc: , "Travis" Subject: [Eskrima] Sayoc Kali in Long Beach Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Hi everyone, I just wanted to announce that Tuhon Chris Sayoc, head of Sayoc Kali and Sayoc Fighting Systems will be giving a seminar in Long Beach, CA. Tuhon Sayoc will be accompanied by Tuhon Rafael Kayanan, Tuhon Tom Kier, Tuhon Ray Dionaldo, Tuhon Felix Cortes and the Atienza brothers. The seminar will be hosted by Integrated Martial Arts and will go from 11am to 5pm. Cost is $75. This is a rare opportunity to train with Tuhon Sayoc on the West Coast. Please feel free to contact Guro Travis Downing at Integrated Martial Arts: Integrated Martial Arts/CrossFit Long Beach 562-492-6951 www.intmartialarts.com For more information regarding Sayoc Kali or Sayoc Fighting Systems please go to www.sayoc.com. Thanks, Joe Marana --__--__-- Message: 12 From: "Leo Daher" To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Subject: RE: [Eskrima] Guns Date: Fri, 20 Apr 2007 14:06:16 -0400 Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net His name was Carl Rowan: "The fate of being charged with illegal gun possession was not escaped by Carl Rowan when the pro-gun-control columnist used a .22 pistol to shoot a midnight intruder, who turned out to be a teenage skinny-dipper using his backyard pool. Mr. Rowan's sensational 1988 trial ended in a hung jury and he was not retried. In his autobiography, Mr. Rowan said he still favors gun control but admits being vulnerable to a charge of hypocrisy." http://www.mcsm.org/moreuse.html Previous to that incident, Mr. Rowan had written in his column that he advocated " a law that says anyone found in possession of a handgun except a legitimate officer of the law goes to jail -- period." He also called for "A complete and universal federal ban on the sale, manufacture, importation and possession of handguns (except for authorized police and military personnel)." A hypocrite indeed. "Praise be that which toughens" - Nietzsche -------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Michael Gallagher Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Subject: RE: [Eskrima] Guns Date: Fri, 20 Apr 2007 12:09:28 -0400 At 01:30 AM 4/19/2007, you wrote: >.... The blood dancing gun banners are always >talking about "sensible" gun laws. That always means: remove >everyone >else's guns. Many of the most adamant banners have people hired to >protect >them ..... Don't remember his name, but some years ago, this ardently anti-gun columnist shot someone in self defense (so he claimed). Turned out the gun he had was unlicensed; he got in trouble for that. So like you say, every gun but theirs. _______________________________________________ Eskrima mailing list, 2400 members Eskrima@martialartsresource.net Copyright 1994-2007: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource Standard disclaimers apply Subscribe or Unsubscribe: http://eskrima-fma.net --__--__-- Message: 13 From: "Leo Daher" To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Subject: [Eskrima] Re: Guns Date: Fri, 20 Apr 2007 14:21:25 -0400 Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net For an even more extreme example of why it's a fallacy to blame violent crime on the "easy availability of (legal) guns", we can look at some countries with draconian gun laws, such as Brazil and Mexico, which have much higher rates of firearm-related crimes than the US. More often than not, opponents of private gun ownership are collectivists who dislike the concept of self-reliance. That's why they insist on their crusade, even against all evidence. It goes way beyond guns. "Praise be that which toughens" - Nietzsche -------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Jon Broster Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net To: Eskrima Digest Subject: [Eskrima] Re: Guns Date: Fri, 20 Apr 2007 10:11:58 +0100 (BST) Hi Does anyone have any data comparing the rates of legal gun ownership and their use in crime in the USA, with the rates of illegal gunownership and their use in crime in countries like the UK? Over here, (in the UK) basically the only people who have guns (outside the military) are: a relatively small number of police and criminals. (Certain Olympic shooting sports are, in effect, illegal in Britain!) Despite this prohibition on guns, replete with ever increasing penalties for their posession, there is no clear reduction in their illicit use - at least as far as I can see reported (& we can be absolutely certain that politicians would be shouting about it if there were!) I think that what we need to do is look at why other countries with high gun ownership- Switzerland, Canada seem like 2 good examples - seem to have lower rates of this sort of mayhem. Jon "There's nothing more dangerous than a blunt knife" http://www.pecahan.net --__--__-- Message: 14 Date: Fri, 20 Apr 2007 17:57:59 -0800 From: Loki Jorgenson Organization: maelstrom Core To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Subject: [Eskrima] Gun/death stats (BBC) Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Some gun stats provided by BBC article: http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/americas/6562529.stm Most interesting factoid (albeit without much qualifying context) would be the relative rates of death-by-firearm to guns-per-capita for a variety of countries. Happily, there are stats there to make either side of the debate right: The only true thing about statistics is that they can tell any story you want. And they are never, by their nature, applicable to any individual case. But they can be interesting..... -- maelstrom \ Loki Jorgenson martial _ \ Pekiti-Tirsia kali loki@maelstromcore.com arts / O_/ Dog Brothers MA www.maelstromcore.com \ Inosanto Academy (604) 250-4642 \ silat Jati Wisesa --__--__-- Message: 15 Subject: Re: [Eskrima] Gun/death stats (BBC) To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Date: Fri, 20 Apr 2007 19:06:01 -0700 (PDT) From: rterry@idiom.com (Ray) Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net > The only true thing about statistics is that they can tell any story you > want. And they are never, by their nature, applicable to any individual > case. But they can be interesting..... Well, yes and no. There is the appropriate use of statistics and the inappropriate. An example of inappropriate is when you already have a large collection of data and then you try to see what you can "prove" with it. Like the old "a gun in the home is 43 times more likely to shoot a loved one than it is to shoot a robber". That same data was also used to show that "a gun in the home was 33 times more likely to be used to stop a crime than it was used to shoot anyone, friend or foe". You cannot go out and find some data and then determine how you want to use it. Design your experiment, form a hypothesis, collect your data, and then properly analyze the data via inferential statistics. FMA, where are you.?.?. :) Ray Terry rterry@idiom.com --__--__-- Message: 16 Date: Fri, 20 Apr 2007 22:35:31 -0400 (EDT) From: howard@one.net To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Subject: [Eskrima] Help in Florida "Where is Garmoit?? is this spelling correct?? Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Hi everyone, I’ve posted here a time or two and am looking for some help from our friends down south. For the next month or so !! I am helping a friend relocate from the nice area around Cincinnati, OH to the big, bad, area of Miami Florida. Not that it all is sooooooo bad just what us NORTHRTRERS have heard about the place. My background is in TKD, Ok, Ok, Ok ATA TKD!!!. Please leave H.U. LEE out of any bad discussions about the ATA and we can have any open discussion about things. I’m a 44 year old 4th degree Certified Instructor with the ATA that has been out of the MA’s for over 5 years and needs my AASSSS kicked to get back into shape. Is there someone around the Tampa, Florida area that can help me out that is not a large person with a last name that starts with the letter H!!! we will leave it at that. Michael T. is the first person that comes to mind, but, Ray do you know of any of our brothers on the DD that could help, the FMA’s would be a nice new beginning.. Many Thanks, May see you soon, Howard Wilson --__--__-- Message: 17 Date: Fri, 20 Apr 2007 20:07:53 -0700 (PDT) From: jay de leon Subject: Re: [Eskrima] Sayoc Kali in Long Beach To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net any date(s) set yet? Joseph Marana wrote: Hi everyone, I just wanted to announce that Tuhon Chris Sayoc, head of Sayoc Kali and Sayoc Fighting Systems will be giving a seminar in Long Beach, CA. Tuhon Sayoc will be accompanied by Tuhon Rafael Kayanan, Tuhon Tom Kier, Tuhon Ray Dionaldo, Tuhon Felix Cortes and the Atienza brothers. The seminar will be hosted by Integrated Martial Arts and will go from 11am to 5pm. Cost is $75. This is a rare opportunity to train with Tuhon Sayoc on the West Coast. Please feel free to contact Guro Travis Downing at Integrated Martial Arts: Integrated Martial Arts/CrossFit Long Beach 562-492-6951 www.intmartialarts.com For more information regarding Sayoc Kali or Sayoc Fighting Systems please go to www.sayoc.com. Thanks, Joe Marana _______________________________________________ Eskrima mailing list, 2400 members Eskrima@martialartsresource.net Copyright 1994-2007: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource Standard disclaimers apply Subscribe or Unsubscribe: http://eskrima-fma.net --__--__-- _______________________________________________ Eskrima mailing list Eskrima@martialartsresource.net http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/eskrima Subscribe or Unsubscribe: http://eskrima-fma.net Old digest issues @ ftp://ftp.martialartsresource.com/pub/eskrima Copyright 1994-2007: Ray Terry, MartialArtsResource.com, Sudlud.com Standard disclaimers apply. Remember September 11. End of Eskrima Digest