Date: Fri, 24 Aug 2007 02:58:33 -0700 From: eskrima-request@martialartsresource.net Subject: Eskrima digest, Vol 14 #255 - 12 msgs X-Mailer: Mailman v2.0.13.cisto1 MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Errors-To: eskrima-admin@martialartsresource.net X-BeenThere: eskrima@martialartsresource.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13.cisto1 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net X-Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net X-Subscribed-Address: fma@martialartsresource.com List-Id: Eskrima-FMA discussion forum, the premier FMA forum on the Internet. 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Copyright 1994-2007: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource The Internet's premier discussion forum devoted to Filipino Martial Arts. 2400 members. Provided in memory of Mangisursuro Michael G. Inay (1944-2000). See the Filipino Martial Arts (FMA) FAQ and the online search engine for back issues of the Eskrima/FMA digest at http://MartialArtsResource.com Mabuhay ang eskrima! Today's Topics: 1. Re: Re: Sikiran (Ruel Apostol) 2. Re: eBay FMA auction (Kim Satterfield) 3. Sikiran? (Cayson, Clint) 4. Filipino foot fighting-Kuntaw (Lawrence, Marc J.) 5. RE: Re: [Eskrima] Re: Sikiran (mpc60@yahoo.com) 6. Re: Sikiran (Gerry C) 7. Valencia Lameco Eskrima Northern Calif Seminar 9/8 (Argyll -) 8. RE: Sikiran? (mpc60) 9. Re: Re: Manong Lacoste and Kali (Steve Kohn) 10. Re: Mark Wiley (Afern27@aol.com) 11. Re: Re: Mark Wiley (Ray) 12. Re: Larry Hartsell (william mcgrath) --__--__-- Message: 1 Date: Wed, 22 Aug 2007 22:02:07 -0700 (PDT) From: Ruel Apostol Subject: Re: [Eskrima] Re: Sikiran To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net hi! you can check out sikaran and yaw yan over at www.youtube.com. ----- Original Message ---- From: mpc60 To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Sent: Thursday, August 23, 2007 9:40:39 AM Subject: RE: [Eskrima] Re: Sikiran Hello to all of my fellow Escrima/Arnisadors and Silat practitioners. First I want to offer my condolences to the family or Larry Hartsell, he will be missed. I am looing for info on the FMA kicking arts. Are there any references anyone can recommend? KRS -----Original Message----- From: Ray Sent: Wednesday, August 22, 2007 4:58 PM To: Eskrima Subject: Re: [Eskrima] Re: Mark Wiley > Having said that, when I read a post about someone I > know that touches on his reputation and about things > supposed to have done and motives imputed thereby, I > get curious and ask: why was that said and where is > the proof? I guess that is another question to ask Mark. Where was it, what magazine article is it, that I and others recall him making these statements? And what, if anything, has changed since then and now? Ray Terry rterry@idiom.com _______________________________________________ Eskrima mailing list, 2400 members Eskrima@martialartsresource.net Copyright 1994-2007: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource Standard disclaimers apply Subscribe or Unsubscribe: http://eskrima-fma.net _______________________________________________ Eskrima mailing list, 2400 members Eskrima@martialartsresource.net Copyright 1994-2007: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource Standard disclaimers apply Subscribe or Unsubscribe: http://eskrima-fma.net _____________________________________________________________________________ _______ Take the Internet to Go: Yahoo!Go puts the Internet in your pocket: mail, news, photos & more. http://mobile.yahoo.com/go?refer=1GNXIC --__--__-- Message: 2 Date: Thu, 23 Aug 2007 06:41:06 -0700 (PDT) From: Kim Satterfield To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Subject: [Eskrima] Re: eBay FMA auction Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Hi Kristine, Don't let Brandon fool you, the auction was his idea. He's a prince of a guy; a bashful one, but a real prince, and I'm lucky to have him for a student. I would encourage everyone to check out the auction on eBay, and read the story that Brandon attached to it. If there ever was a good cause, this is it. Parker Shelton Sensei has knocked himself out for this family, and I'd like to help him out as much as possible. Kim Satterfield In the words of the late, great John Belushi, "Wise Up" --------------------------------- Luggage? GPS? Comic books? Check out fitting gifts for grads at Yahoo! Search. --__--__-- Message: 3 Date: Thu, 23 Aug 2007 10:07:33 -0400 From: "Cayson, Clint" To: Subject: [Eskrima] Sikiran? Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Do you mean SIKARAN? -------------------------------------- Clint -----Original Message----- From: Ruel Apostol [mailto:little_bad_boy@yahoo.com] Sent: Thursday, August 23, 2007 1:02 AM To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Subject: Re: [Eskrima] Re: Sikiran hi! you can check out sikaran and yaw yan over at www.youtube.com. ----- --__--__-- Message: 4 Date: Thu, 23 Aug 2007 07:10:24 -0700 From: "Lawrence, Marc J." To: Subject: [Eskrima] Filipino foot fighting-Kuntaw Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Reply to -mpc60 I am looking for info on the FMA kicking arts. Are there any references anyone can recommend? KRS I can recommend International Kuntaw Federation for training. A book is available called Kuntaw The Ancient Art of Filipino Hand and Foot Fighting. See Kutaw.com, Their main headquarters in in Spring Valley, CA. Guro Steven Dowd teaches this art in Fallon, Nevada. Marc Lawrence South Bay, CA --__--__-- Message: 5 Date: Thu, 23 Aug 2007 10:38:02 -0500 (CDT) From: "mpc60@yahoo.com" Subject: RE: Re: [Eskrima] Re: Sikiran To: Ruel Apostol Cc: "eskrima@martialartsresource.net" Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Thanks for the input I will check it out. I train in Arnis De mano and Kobe Jiujitsu as well as martial blade concepts under Sensei/Guro Paul Harris. I Want to get my lowline kicking arsenal packed with techniques. Karl Ruel Apostol wrote: > hi! you can check out sikaran and yaw yan over at www.youtube.com. > ----- > Original Message ---- > From: mpc60 > To: > eskrima@martialartsresource.net > Sent: Thursday, August 23, 2007 9:40:39 AM > Subject: RE: [Eskrima] Re: Sikiran > Hello to all of my fellow > Escrima/Arnisadors and Silat practitioners. First I > want to offer my > condolences to the family or Larry Hartsell, he will be > missed. I am looing > for info on the FMA kicking arts. Are there any references > anyone can > recommend? KRS > -----Original Message----- > From: Ray > Sent: > Wednesday, August 22, 2007 4:58 PM > To: Eskrima > > Subject: Re: [Eskrima] Re: Mark Wiley >> > Having said that, when I read a post about someone I >> know that touches on > his reputation and about things >> supposed to have done and motives imputed > thereby, I >> get curious and ask: why was that said and where is >> the proof? > I guess that is another question to ask Mark. Where was it, what > magazine > article is it, that I and others recall him making these > statements? And > what, if anything, has changed since then and now? > Ray Terry > rterry@idiom.com > _______________________________________________ > Eskrima mailing list, 2400 > members > Eskrima@martialartsresource.net > Copyright 1994-2007: Ray Terry and > Martial Arts Resource > Standard disclaimers apply > Subscribe or Unsubscribe: > http://eskrima-fma.net > _______________________________________________ > Eskrima > mailing list, 2400 members > Eskrima@martialartsresource.net > Copyright > 1994-2007: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource > Standard disclaimers apply > Subscribe or Unsubscribe: http://eskrima-fma.net > _____________________________________________________________________________ > _______ > Take the Internet to Go: Yahoo!Go puts the Internet in your pocket: > mail, news, photos & more. > http://mobile.yahoo.com/go?refer=1GNXIC > _______________________________________________ > Eskrima mailing list, 2400 members > Eskrima@martialartsresource.net > Copyright 1994-2007: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource > Standard disclaimers apply > Subscribe or Unsubscribe: http://eskrima-fma.net _____________________________________________________________________________ _______ Choose the right car based on your needs. Check out Yahoo! Autos new Car Finder tool. http://autos.yahoo.com/carfinder/ --__--__-- Message: 6 From: "Gerry C" To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Date: Thu, 23 Aug 2007 13:23:17 -0400 Subject: [Eskrima] Re: Sikiran Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net if interested in sikaran, you can also check out www.sikaran.com to find about about the Lagaregos system, brought to the U.S. in the '50's by Grandmaster Louis Lagaregos.  I hope this helps! --__--__-- Message: 7 From: "Argyll -" To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Date: Thu, 23 Aug 2007 20:22:57 +0100 Subject: [Eskrima] Valencia Lameco Eskrima Northern Calif Seminar 9/8 Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net FYI: Modern Defense Institute Presents FELIX VALENCIA Saturday, September 8, 2007 Space is limited! Register early and reserve your place in class! Cost : Only $80.00! ( if Pre-Registered, $100.00 door price) Location: Modern Defense Institute - 4743 Clayton Road #3, Concord, Ca Time: 10:00AM-4:00PM, Saturday, September 8, 2007 Register/Info Contact: Tim Llacuna at moderndefenseinstitute.com Phone: 925-586-4316 or E-mail: TL-MDI@sbcglobal.net Wear appropriate workout attire. Groin protectors and water are recommended. Best regards, Argyll P.S. I see that Guro Valencia has a website now: http://www.valencialameco.com -- _______________________________________________ Surf the Web in a faster, safer and easier way: Download Opera 9 at http://www.opera.com Powered by Outblaze --__--__-- Message: 8 From: mpc60 Subject: RE: [Eskrima] Sikiran? Date: Thu, 23 Aug 2007 16:12:52 -0400 To: Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Yes. Please forgive me if I missed spelled it. -----Original Message----- From: Cayson, Clint Sent: Thursday, August 23, 2007 10:07 AM To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Subject: [Eskrima] Sikiran? Do you mean SIKARAN? -------------------------------------- Clint -----Original Message----- From: Ruel Apostol [mailto:little_bad_boy@yahoo.com] Sent: Thursday, August 23, 2007 1:02 AM To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Subject: Re: [Eskrima] Re: Sikiran hi! you can check out sikaran and yaw yan over at www.youtube.com. ----- _______________________________________________ Eskrima mailing list, 2400 members Eskrima@martialartsresource.net Copyright 1994-2007: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource Standard disclaimers apply Subscribe or Unsubscribe: http://eskrima-fma.net --__--__-- Message: 9 Date: Thu, 23 Aug 2007 17:09:29 -0700 (PDT) From: Steve Kohn Subject: Re: [Eskrima] Re: Manong Lacoste and Kali To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Hi Jay, How was what I said an argument? There are waaaaay better examples of my arguments in the archives. Search for me and Victor De Thouras or my buddy Al Sardinas for some good rants...that ultimately accomplished nothing. I was just throwin' some stuff out there to think about. Best to all (including Vic & Al), S jay de leon wrote: Y'all are cool, even though y'all keep arguing FOR something that nobody is arguing AGAINST. In fact, both GP Abon Baet and I singled out the Inosanto people and gave them props for defending what they learned from their guro. Also, while it is true that it is extremely difficult if not impossible to describe the essence of arnis in words, like music, what is wrong with having an intelligent discussion about the cultural, philosophical and historical background and origin of arnis as the art, or the etymology of arnis terms themselves? On the other hand, I don't remember anybody posting that talking about it is far more beneficial and enlightening than swinging the sticks themselves. To my kapatid Abon, James Sy and Rocky, I swear, I AM NOT trying to start the thread again. Jay de Leon www.filipinofightingartsintl.com Steve Kohn wrote: Hi all, I'm nearly a month late in responding to this but I have to quote the musician Elvis Costello. He was talking about music in his quote...but I think it applies to all of the arts. He said: "Talking about music is like dancing about architecture". I take this to mean that anything other than actually doing your art is really just B.S. Take it with a grain of salt of course as discussing philosophy is indeed imortant, but at the end of the day...JUST DO IT (I hope Nike doesn't sue me for this). Frank Zappa was even more to the point: "Shut up and play your guitar (or swing your stick - my addendum). I tend to use english terminology more often than not when I teach these days. The Inosanto/Lacoste base that I came up through draws from so many sources and dialects that trying to be faithful to all of them is really just confusing to new students. Additionally, I hate to butcher the languages of other cultures. I'd rather just give credit to the entire country by referring to what we do as "FMAs" I think the below points by Kim and Michael are dead on BTW If i missed the point...nevermind. Be well everyone. Steve Kohn Torrance, CA Michael Gallagher wrote: At 10:36 AM 7/25/2007, you wrote: >.... I have to admit, though, that in all this discussion about the >origins and >legitimacy of the usage of the word "Kali", I am a bit confused on why >this is >an issue (no disrespect intended toward any contributors to this >discussion) .... The word "Kali" >didn't just come out of thin air; I do believe Dan when he says that he >learned >of the term from his teachers and predecessors. I learned a lot of the >history of the Filipino arts, particularly the development of the >arts here in >America, from Dan, and my take on all this is that "Kali" is a term that >came >down from Floro Villabrille and Ben Largusa, and was the term given to the >conglomeration that Villibrille developed from his travels and studies, and >passed down to Largusa. I don't have a problem at all with the >term.....In my opinion, Dan, as well as >Villabrille and Largusa, can call their art anything they want. To me, >these >guys are at the top of the mountain, and concerning matters on their art, I >will defer to them. What the art is called isn't as important to me as the >content of the art. But then again, I'm a pragmatic sort of person, and >substance >over symbolism has always been my priority. > >Kim Satterfield >Midwest School of Eskrima > AMEN! And as to the question of whether the word Kali was used 400 years ago, ok, maybe it wasn't. It wouldn't be the first time a martial art changed names; karate-do springs to mind. The art still existed even if we can not agree on what it may have been called at the time. Beyond that, I prefer to go along with a very wise man who once said, "I'd rather practice." Respects, Michael Gallagher Cortland, New York USA _______________________________________________ Eskrima mailing list, 2400 members Eskrima@martialartsresource.net Copyright 1994-2007: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource Standard disclaimers apply Subscribe or Unsubscribe: http://eskrima-fma.net --------------------------------- Fussy? Opinionated? Impossible to please? Perfect. Join Yahoo!'s user panel and lay it on us. _______________________________________________ Eskrima mailing list, 2400 members Eskrima@martialartsresource.net Copyright 1994-2007: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource Standard disclaimers apply Subscribe or Unsubscribe: http://eskrima-fma.net _______________________________________________ Eskrima mailing list, 2400 members Eskrima@martialartsresource.net Copyright 1994-2007: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource Standard disclaimers apply Subscribe or Unsubscribe: http://eskrima-fma.net --------------------------------- Choose the right car based on your needs. Check out Yahoo! Autos new Car Finder tool. --__--__-- Message: 10 From: Afern27@aol.com Date: Thu, 23 Aug 2007 21:26:40 EDT To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Subject: [Eskrima] Re: Mark Wiley Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net In a message dated 8/23/2007 5:11:56 A.M. Mountain Daylight Time, eskrima-request@martialartsresource.net writes: I guess that is another question to ask Mark. Where was it, what magazine article is it, that I and others recall him making these statements? But it wasn't Mark that brought that up here, it was you Ray. So isn't the burden of proof on you to back up the accusations? ************************************** Get a sneak peek of the all-new AOL at http://discover.aol.com/memed/aolcom30tour --__--__-- Message: 11 Subject: Re: [Eskrima] Re: Mark Wiley To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Date: Thu, 23 Aug 2007 18:52:39 -0700 (PDT) From: rterry@idiom.com (Ray) Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net > But it wasn't Mark that brought that up here, it was you Ray. So isn't the > burden of proof on you to back up the accusations? Ummm, no. I made no accusation (1: the act of accusing). I simply mentioned an article that I had read. Others have recalled reading that same article, or perhaps another article with identical or very similar information. I'm just trying to find that/those cite/s for Bot's bump. Mark should be able to help with that. Maybe not, but it is at least worth asking. Ray Terry rterry@idiom.com --__--__-- Message: 12 Date: Thu, 23 Aug 2007 19:37:46 -0700 (PDT) From: william mcgrath To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Subject: [Eskrima] Re: Larry Hartsell Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net From myself, my instructors and all the members of Pekiti-Tirsia International, our sincerest condolences to the family, friends and students of Larry Hartsell. I have met many people at my seminars who have trained under Sifu Hartsell and they always spoke very highly of him. I know he will be missed. Tuhon Bill McGrath Pekiti-Tirsia International --------------------------------- Shape Yahoo! in your own image. Join our Network Research Panel today! --__--__-- _______________________________________________ Eskrima mailing list Eskrima@martialartsresource.net http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/eskrima Subscribe or Unsubscribe: http://eskrima-fma.net Old digest issues @ ftp://ftp.martialartsresource.com/pub/eskrima Copyright 1994-2007: Ray Terry, MartialArtsResource.com, Sudlud.com Standard disclaimers apply. Remember September 11. End of Eskrima Digest