Date: Thu, 20 Dec 2007 02:48:23 +0100 From: eskrima-request@martialartsresource.net Subject: Eskrima digest, Vol 14 #359 - 7 msgs X-Mailer: Mailman v2.0.13.cisto1 MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Errors-To: eskrima-admin@martialartsresource.net X-BeenThere: eskrima@martialartsresource.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13.cisto1 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net X-Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net List-Unsubscribe: , List-Id: Eskrima-FMA discussion forum, the premier FMA forum on the Internet. 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Copyright 1994-2007: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource The Internet's premier discussion forum devoted to Filipino Martial Arts. 2500 members. Provided in memory of Mangisursuro Michael G. Inay (1944-2000). See the Filipino Martial Arts (FMA) FAQ and the online search engine for back issues of the Eskrima/FMA digest at http://MartialArtsResource.com Mabuhay ang eskrima! Today's Topics: 1. RE: No Protective Gear, No Rules - Not Impressed (mpc60) 2. RE: No Protective Gear, No Rules - Not Impressed (Joseph Marana) 3. Re: No Protective Gear, No Rules - Not Impressed (Mike Casto) 4. Re: No Protective Gear, No Rules - Not Impressed (Ruel Apostol) 5. NO rules Fights?? (GatPuno@aol.com) 6. Full contact matches (Steven Lefebvre) 7. Re: List down (Michael Gallagher) --__--__-- Message: 1 From: mpc60 Subject: RE: [Eskrima] No Protective Gear, No Rules - Not Impressed Date: Tue, 18 Dec 2007 19:38:03 -0500 To: Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net I have to agree with Sensei Paul Harris. Training with no protective gear and going full bore is not a smart way to train. I agree that at a minimum eye protection should be worn at all times. Karl Swass -----Original Message----- From: Paul Harris Sent: Tuesday, December 18, 2007 10:37 AM To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Subject: [Eskrima] No Protective Gear, No Rules - Not Impressed "It was full-contact stick fighting, and the rules were very easy to follow..there weren't any. No body targets were off limits, no technique was outlawed, and absolutely no protective equipment was allowed, none, including groin cups. These guys just warmed up and went at it. I've seen a lot in my day, but Ican honestly say that I was more than impressed by the sheer guts of these guys..." There is a word that comes to mind when I read this and it's not "impressed". Do either of these guys have wife's, children or other family that loves and cares about them? Do they have jobs they do to support themselves and their families? Do there realize that with all the medical technology in the world an eye can't be replaced? No, the word is not impressed. "We have no government armed in power capable of contending with human passions unbridled by morality and religion. Our Constitution was made only for a religious and moral people. It is wholly inadequate for the government of any other." John Adams _______________________________________________ Eskrima mailing list, 2500 members Eskrima@martialartsresource.net Copyright 1994-2007: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource Standard disclaimers apply Subscribe or Unsubscribe: http://eskrima-fma.net --__--__-- Message: 2 Date: Tue, 18 Dec 2007 17:59:39 -0800 From: "Joseph Marana" Subject: RE: [Eskrima] No Protective Gear, No Rules - Not Impressed To: Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Sensei Paul, you bring up some valid questions. While I do not speak on behalf of those who fought, I will say that there are those who train hard because of those very concerns, not in spite of them. There are many people who share your exact sentiment about MMA. Not everything is for everyone. Joe -----Original Message----- From: Paul Harris [mailto:pmh1nic@yahoo.com] Sent: Tuesday, December 18, 2007 7:38 AM To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Subject: [Eskrima] No Protective Gear, No Rules - Not Impressed "It was full-contact stick fighting, and the rules were very easy to follow...there weren't any. No body targets were off limits, no technique was outlawed, and absolutely no protective equipment was allowed, none, including groin cups. These guys just warmed up and went at it. I've seen a lot in my day, but Ican honestly say that I was more than impressed by the sheer guts of these guys..." There is a word that comes to mind when I read this and it's not "impressed". Do either of these guys have wife's, children or other family that loves and cares about them? Do they have jobs they do to support themselves and their families? Do there realize that with all the medical technology in the world an eye can't be replaced? No, the word is not impressed. "We have no government armed in power capable of contending with human passions unbridled by morality and religion. Our Constitution was made only for a religious and moral people. It is wholly inadequate for the government of any other." John Adams _______________________________________________ Eskrima mailing list, 2500 members Eskrima@martialartsresource.net Copyright 1994-2007: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource Standard disclaimers apply Subscribe or Unsubscribe: http://eskrima-fma.net --__--__-- Message: 3 Date: Tue, 18 Dec 2007 19:02:31 -0800 (PST) From: Mike Casto Subject: Re: [Eskrima] No Protective Gear, No Rules - Not Impressed To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net I don't know how frequently the guys being discussed do this sort of thing but I think it's important to make a distinction between "training" and "testing." Your precise terminology may vary but you probably know what I mean. To me, if these guys "train" this way, then it means they beat the crud out of each other like this in every class. Each to their own but, personally, I have no interest in doing such for all the reasons that Paul pointed out - and I just don't like hospitals much. If, however, these guys are "testing" this way (not as in "rank test" but as in once in a while they cut loose and really test their fortitude and their material under high stress) then I say, "Have at!" I've done things like this - not quite as extreme but close (we kept head shots to a minimum because it was, after all, a friendly bout but we used rattan and no protection and there were no rules except to restrict shots to the head). Doing things like this once in a while is, IMO, valuable. There are great lessons to be learned. Doing it on a frequent (or even regular) basis is, IMO, a self-limiting practice since time out due to injury/recuperation will, in the long run, tend to interfere with the training time. But I think this sort of thing is good once in a while - once the students have reached a level where they really understand what they're getting themselves into and really have some material that might help them prevent serious injury to themselves. Mike --__--__-- Message: 4 Date: Tue, 18 Dec 2007 21:34:32 -0800 (PST) From: Ruel Apostol Subject: Re: [Eskrima] No Protective Gear, No Rules - Not Impressed To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net is there a linked video about the topic on hand? for some reason, i don't see any. kindly repost it please. but for me... i would say - "to each his own". if their trainees don't like it, i think they are free to leave. ----- Original Message ---- From: Mike Casto To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Sent: Wednesday, December 19, 2007 11:02:31 AM Subject: Re: [Eskrima] No Protective Gear, No Rules - Not Impressed I don't know how frequently the guys being discussed do this sort of thing but I think it's important to make a distinction between "training" and "testing." Your precise terminology may vary but you probably know what I mean. To me, if these guys "train" this way, then it means they beat the crud out of each other like this in every class. Each to their own but, personally, I have no interest in doing such for all the reasons that Paul pointed out - and I just don't like hospitals much. If, however, these guys are "testing" this way (not as in "rank test" but as in once in a while they cut loose and really test their fortitude and their material under high stress) then I say, "Have at!" I've done things like this - not quite as extreme but close (we kept head shots to a minimum because it was, after all, a friendly bout but we used rattan and no protection and there were no rules except to restrict shots to the head). Doing things like this once in a while is, IMO, valuable. There are great lessons to be learned. Doing it on a frequent (or even regular) basis is, IMO, a self-limiting practice since time out due to injury/recuperation will, in the long run, tend to interfere with the training time. But I think this sort of thing is good once in a while - once the students have reached a level where they really understand what they're getting themselves into and really have some material that might help them prevent serious injury to themselves. Mike _______________________________________________ Eskrima mailing list, 2500 members Eskrima@martialartsresource.net Copyright 1994-2007: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource Standard disclaimers apply Subscribe or Unsubscribe: http://eskrima-fma.net ____________________________________________________________________________________ Looking for last minute shopping deals? Find them fast with Yahoo! Search. http://tools.search.yahoo.com/newsearch/category.php?category=shopping --__--__-- Message: 5 From: GatPuno@aol.com Date: Wed, 19 Dec 2007 06:30:59 EST To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Subject: [Eskrima] NO rules Fights?? Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Hello let me stir this topic, Who said the DVD is NO rules, I dont see one fighters with multiple opponent, therefore there is a rules, one opponent at that time. No rules if it will fight two or even the whole barangay. Then we can call that "NO" rules. Remember the arts is designed to live and survived not kill yourself before the real attacker come. Just a though many fight I see is like two guys beating each other anyone can do that even not skilled fighter. To those wearing protective gear and calling it real contact remove it then I agreed that is real contact. Full contact tournament here in the US produced many Champion, I open wonder if they survive to the real world, FMA is design for self preservation not try to kill other friend, yes they agreed to each other, its easy is because one on one basis, remember if this is sport then is okay, if you practiced for self preservation be ready practiced multiple opponent in full speed and as little protective see the difference. Multiple opponent force you to stay on your feet, the fight that I see everyone try to take every single one of them to the ground and wrestle them with the stick, that is not stick fighting, this is stick grappling. Stick fighting is were you used the stick effectively to strike and keep your opponent away from you. Stick should be the equalizer of the fight, even is multiple opponent. Just my opinion.. Gat Puno Abon "Garimot" Baet Garimot Arnis Training Group International Each of the fighters in the film did it by choice. They each have their own reasons and I'm pretty sure their reasons didn't quite have anything to do with trying to impress anyone else but each other. Having the guts to do it was enough. Paul Harris wrote: "It was full-contact stick fighting, and the rules were very easy to follow...there weren't any. No body targets were off limits, no technique was outlawed, and absolutely no protective equipment was allowed, none, including groin cups. These guys just warmed up and went at it. I've seen a lot in my day, but Ican honestly say that I was more than impressed by the sheer guts of these guys..." There is a word that comes to mind when I read this and it's not "impressed". Do either of these guys have wife's, children or other family that loves and cares about them? Do they have jobs they do to support themselves and their families? Do there realize that with all the medical technology in the world an eye can't be replaced? No, the word is not impressed. "We have no government armed in power capable of contending with human passions unbridled by morality and religion. Our Constitution was made only for a religious and moral people. It is wholly inadequate for the government of any other." John Adams _______________________________________________ **************************************See AOL's top rated recipes (http://food.aol.com/top-rated-recipes?NCID=aoltop00030000000004) --__--__-- Message: 6 From: Steven Lefebvre To: Date: Wed, 19 Dec 2007 11:59:40 +0000 Subject: [Eskrima] Full contact matches Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Hello Paul, At anytime in your life an accident can disable an eye, a limb or cripple you for ever. But yet that does not stop us from driving a car, walking down the street, or even working around the home (three of the top areas where people take serious injury). Full contact training is not for every one, nor should it be. Dealing with the fear of being injured or not being able to support your family, are personal reasons possibly not to do this type of training. I don’t believe the idea of the matches was to impress anyone, just to test and challenge each other to new levels. Gumagalang Guro Steve L. www.Bujinkandojo.net --__--__-- Message: 7 Date: Wed, 19 Dec 2007 13:21:57 -0500 To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net From: Michael Gallagher Subject: Re: [Eskrima] List down Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net At 09:43 AM 12/18/2007, you wrote: >Just an early heads-up that the list will be down next week. > >If all goes as planned, email sent to it will bounce back to you. So >be advised. Thanks for the warning. >Ray Terry >rterry@idiom.com >_______________________________________________ >Eskrima mailing list, 2500 members >Eskrima@martialartsresource.net >Copyright 1994-2007: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource >Standard disclaimers apply >Subscribe or Unsubscribe: http://eskrima-fma.net --__--__-- _______________________________________________ Eskrima mailing list Eskrima@martialartsresource.net http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/eskrima Subscribe or Unsubscribe: http://eskrima-fma.net Old digest issues @ ftp://ftp.martialartsresource.com/pub/eskrima Copyright 1994-2007: Ray Terry, MartialArtsResource.com, Sudlud.com Standard disclaimers apply. Remember September 11. End of Eskrima Digest