Date: Sat, 09 Aug 2008 02:48:21 +0200 From: eskrima-request@martialartsresource.net Subject: Eskrima digest, Vol 15 #208 - 9 msgs X-Mailer: Mailman v2.0.13.cisto1 MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Errors-To: eskrima-admin@martialartsresource.net X-BeenThere: eskrima@martialartsresource.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13.cisto1 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net X-Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net List-Unsubscribe: , List-Id: Eskrima-FMA discussion forum, the premier FMA forum on the Internet. List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on plus11.host4u.net X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Status: O X-Status: X-Keywords: Send Eskrima mailing list submissions to eskrima@martialartsresource.net To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/eskrima or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to eskrima-request@martialartsresource.net You can reach the person managing the list at eskrima-admin@martialartsresource.net When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific than "Re: Contents of Eskrima digest..." <<---- The Sudlud-Inayan Eskrima/Kali/Arnis/FMA mailing list ---->> Serving the Internet since June 1994. Copyright 1994-2008: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource The Internet's premier discussion forum devoted to Filipino Martial Arts. 2600 members. Provided in memory of Mangisursuro Michael G. Inay (1944-2000). See the Filipino Martial Arts (FMA) FAQ and the online search engine for back issues of the Eskrima/FMA digest at http://MartialArtsResource.com Mabuhay ang eskrima! Today's Topics: 1. Re: KALI THE RESURRECTION (iPat) 2. Re: DIGGING THE LONG BURIED DEAD HORSE NAMED KALI (jay de leon) 3. Re: Arnis or Escrima in NYC ?? (Rich Acosta) 4. Re: tire training (Daniel Arola) 5. tipunan mini-seminar (jay de leon) 6. Re: tipunan mini-seminar (1miser@koltoniuk.org) 7. Re: tipunan mini-seminar (jay de leon) 8. Night of the Living Dead discussion; DG Gathering this Sunday (Marc Denny) 9. Re: Yambao no-no :) (Ray) --__--__-- Message: 1 Date: Fri, 8 Aug 2008 16:09:18 +0100 From: iPat To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Subject: Re: [Eskrima] KALI THE RESURRECTION Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net On Fri, Aug 8, 2008 at 12:52 PM, Red Gonzales > Who were the Eskrimadors who said "dances have always been Used?" I bet > it is The Filipino Martial Arts of Guro Daniel Inosanto. > Prove it! ; ) -- Pat Davies www.amag.org.uk Rehome a Boxer: http://www.boxerwelfarescotland.co.uk/ --__--__-- Message: 2 Date: Fri, 8 Aug 2008 08:35:47 -0700 (PDT) From: jay de leon Subject: Re: [Eskrima] DIGGING THE LONG BURIED DEAD HORSE NAMED KALI To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Like most of the ED old timers, I would rather stay away from this bi-annual, quarterly, whatever event.   Here is my 2 centimos worth, which would literally mean next to nothing.  I repeat, this is my opinion, which is worth the above.   I agree that kali has "no historical, archaeological, anthropological, and linguistic basis."  Evidence seems to point in that direction.  Just like any reasonable man, I reserve the right to change my mind just in case somebody comes up with solid proof to the contrary.   Now, if unity means proscribing the use of the word "kali" at this point in time, that is probably impractical, near impossible and unfair.  That is like the proverbial putting the toothpaste back in the tube.   My brothers in the Phil. should realize that there are thousands of FMA practitioners in the US (and other countries all over the world) who call their art kali.  They did this in good conscience following their guro(s) as they should.  It would be unfair to tarnish them with the same brush and accuse them of propagating a lie, or criticizing arnis or eskrima, etc.  They love FMA which they just happen to call kali, as much as you cebuanos/ visayans, do.   So please keep this on a historical discussion level.  Many writers in the Phil. and many knowledgeably practitioners including several of you in this list are doing an admirable job of presenting facts and evidence regarding this issue.  Thank you, and may this lead to unity instead of exciting passions.   Jay de Leon www.tipunan.com       --- On Fri, 8/8/08, Red Gonzales wrote: From: Red Gonzales Subject: [Eskrima] DIGGING THE LONG BURIED DEAD HORSE NAMED KALI To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Date: Friday, August 8, 2008, 4:50 AM My friends,   Why dig this dead horse again?  WHY???   Kali may sound cool but it has no historical, archaeological, anthropological, and linguistic basis.   For those who use Kali, it may not be worth the argument, but for us Filipinos it is something that destroys the very fiber of our dear martial culture.    Filipinos had stood against invaders of the motherland.  There is no reason we won’t stand against something that is the biggest LIE ever.   For those who would say there is, here is a challenge:  Show SOLID and LEGITIMATE proof.    SOLID and LEGITIMATE proof doesn’t include my instructor said so, it’s what we use, it’s cool, etc.   It doesn’t mean anything even if all your instructors call it Kali.  It’s not proof of its legitimacy as the name of FMA.   Why can’t we unite for the good of the art?  Ever remember how “Kali” say bad things about Arnis and Escrima?  That doesn’t constitute unity, or is it?   For those who are embarrassed for the constant criticism on Kali, finish this once and for all by giving SOLID and LEGITIMATE proof.    Otherwise, as Mr. McGrath said it may well become a bi-annual event or worse, something more often.   Maybe, maybe, if someone can produce such then we can resolve this for good.   But I doubt it that the same can be produced in the next thousand years.    Again, a challenge, PROVE, PROVE, PROVE.  Till then, might as well Kali Kamote.      Red Gonzales New Email addresses available on Yahoo! Get the Email name you've always wanted on the new @ymail and @rocketmail. Hurry before someone else does! http://mail.promotions.yahoo.com/newdomains/ph/ _______________________________________________ Eskrima mailing list, 2600 members Eskrima@martialartsresource.net Copyright 1994-2008: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource Standard disclaimers apply Subscribe or Unsubscribe: http://eskrima-fma.net --__--__-- Message: 3 From: "Rich Acosta" To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Date: Fri, 8 Aug 2008 09:16:37 -0500 Subject: [Eskrima] Re: Arnis or Escrima in NYC ?? Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Guro Wilton Valerio and Guro Joe Wheeler teache in Manhattan on Saturdays 11:30AM-1PM at the following address; Fighthouse 122 West 27th St.(2nd flr.) between 5th & 6th ave. Kuntaw Kali Kruzada http://www.kuntawkali.com/ email: kruzada@email.com phone: 201-674-6609 -- Be Yourself @ mail.com! Choose From 200+ Email Addresses Get a Free Account at www.mail.com --__--__-- Message: 4 Date: Fri, 8 Aug 2008 10:28:57 -0700 (PDT) From: Daniel Arola Subject: Re: [Eskrima] tire training To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net I remember those days too well, Jason! Remember these clips? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i-m3cWLj-Ew -single tire http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=34LITCxFHCc -tireman dummy DAMAG-INC [Daniel Arola Martial Arts Group Inc.] http://www.damag-inc.zoomshare.com Houston, Texas   --- On Wed, 8/6/08, jason couture wrote: From: jason couture Subject: [Eskrima] tire training To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Date: Wednesday, August 6, 2008, 12:48 PM Yup, I've been using a stack of tires as a target for awhile. Works well but, tends to draw unwanted attention from neighbors. _______________________________________________ Eskrima mailing list, 2600 members Eskrima@martialartsresource.net Copyright 1994-2008: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource Standard disclaimers apply Subscribe or Unsubscribe: http://eskrima-fma.net --__--__-- Message: 5 Date: Fri, 8 Aug 2008 10:51:18 -0700 (PDT) From: jay de leon To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Subject: [Eskrima] tipunan mini-seminar Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net   y'all are invited to a Tipunan mini-seminar to be conducted by Roger Agbulos on Aug. 16, 2008, Saturday in Burbank, CA. See complete details/flyer below.   roger agbulos is a dear friend and the master of ceremonies at my Tipunan events. he also happens to be one of what i consider a real deal FMA fighter and guro.  his technical expertise, fighting experience and outgoing personality makes him a favorite seminar instructor.   if you are hearing of roger agbulos for the first time, you may either go to his website or check out these links.   http://www.tipunan.com/Events/tipunan-sa-disneyland/tipunan-disneyland_main.h tml   http://www.tipunan.com/Events/tipunan-sa-disneyland/roger-agbulos.html     please join me in another exciting tipunan (gathering).  salamat po.   jay de leon www.filipinomartialartsmuseum.com   Practical Self-Defense and Combat Conditioning rolled into one dynamic cardiovascular SUPER workout!                                                                           _______________________       Roger Agbulos is one of the original students of the late Grandmaster Edgar G. Sulite   In this workshop, you will learn to: Control long range encounters with broken, flowing or a combination of strikes, all non-telegraphic, regardless of angle! Hit moving targets with speed, power & accuracy.   Increase striking ability in both forward & backward movements utilizing dynamic footwork drills. Understand proper timing to initiate powerful entries – counter strikes, pre-emptive strikes, intercepting strikes and many other practical techniques to get the upper hand in sparring or full contact matches.                                                                                             BRING A PAIR OF RATTAN STICKS, TRAINING KNIFE  & SAFETY GEARS  ex.: HAND PROTECTORS or HOCKEY GLOVES, ARM PROTECTORS, SPARRING HELMET, GROIN PROTECTOR   CALL TO INQUIRE: (818) 357-0440 www.astiglameco.com astiglameco@yahoo.com     Saturday, August 16, 2008 / 1 pm to 5 pm Seminar Fee: $40.00  (Burbank Athletic club Members: $30.00 – must show ID)  BURBANK ATHLETIC CLUB – MEDIA CENTER   226 E. Palm Ave., Burbank, CA 91502            --__--__-- Message: 6 Date: Fri, 8 Aug 2008 11:10:41 -0700 (PDT) From: 1miser@koltoniuk.org Subject: Re: [Eskrima] tipunan mini-seminar To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Flyer didn't show up. Where is the seminar going to be? David Koltoniuk Koltoniuk Empire Inc. 214-608-8545 Koltoniuk; not just a name, it is a way of life! --- On Fri, 8/8/08, jay de leon wrote: From: jay de leon Subject: [Eskrima] tipunan mini-seminar To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Date: Friday, August 8, 2008, 10:51 AM   y'all are invited to a Tipunan mini-seminar to be conducted by Roger Agbulos on Aug. 16, 2008, Saturday in Burbank, CA. See complete details/flyer below.   roger agbulos is a dear friend and the master of ceremonies at my Tipunan events. he also happens to be one of what i consider a real deal FMA fighter and guro.  his technical expertise, fighting experience and outgoing personality makes him a favorite seminar instructor.   if you are hearing of roger agbulos for the first time, you may either go to his website or check out these links.   http://www.tipunan.com/Events/tipunan-sa-disneyland/tipunan-disneyland_main.h tml   http://www.tipunan.com/Events/tipunan-sa-disneyland/roger-agbulos.html     please join me in another exciting tipunan (gathering).  salamat po.   jay de leon www.filipinomartialartsmuseum.com   Practical Self-Defense and Combat Conditioning rolled into one dynamic cardiovascular SUPER workout!                                                                           _______________________       Roger Agbulos is one of the original students of the late Grandmaster Edgar G. Sulite   In this workshop, you will learn to: Control long range encounters with broken, flowing or a combination of strikes, all non-telegraphic, regardless of angle! Hit moving targets with speed, power & accuracy.   Increase striking ability in both forward & backward movements utilizing dynamic footwork drills. Understand proper timing to initiate powerful entries – counter strikes, pre-emptive strikes, intercepting strikes and many other practical techniques to get the upper hand in sparring or full contact matches.                                                                                             BRING A PAIR OF RATTAN STICKS, TRAINING KNIFE  & SAFETY GEARS  ex.: HAND PROTECTORS or HOCKEY GLOVES, ARM PROTECTORS, SPARRING HELMET, GROIN PROTECTOR   CALL TO INQUIRE: (818) 357-0440 www.astiglameco.com astiglameco@yahoo.com     Saturday, August 16, 2008 / 1 pm to 5 pm Seminar Fee: $40.00  (Burbank Athletic club Members: $30.00 – must show ID)  BURBANK ATHLETIC CLUB – MEDIA CENTER   226 E. Palm Ave., Burbank, CA 91502            _______________________________________________ Eskrima mailing list, 2600 members Eskrima@martialartsresource.net Copyright 1994-2008: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource Standard disclaimers apply Subscribe or Unsubscribe: http://eskrima-fma.net --__--__-- Message: 7 Date: Fri, 8 Aug 2008 11:48:02 -0700 (PDT) From: jay de leon Subject: Re: [Eskrima] tipunan mini-seminar To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net good to hear from you, david.   the flyer is copied right after my signature, without the pictures, that is why it might look funky.   The venue and details are in the last paragraph.    Saturday, August 16, 2008 / 1 pm to 5 pm Seminar Fee: $40.00  (Burbank Athletic club Members: $30.00 – must show ID)  BURBANK ATHLETIC CLUB – MEDIA CENTER   226 E. Palm Ave., Burbank, CA 91502    see you there, buddy.  thanks for supporting my seminars all these years, like a true LAMECO stalwart.   jay de leon www.tipunan.com --- On Fri, 8/8/08, 1miser@koltoniuk.org <1miser@koltoniuk.org> wrote: From: 1miser@koltoniuk.org <1miser@koltoniuk.org> Subject: Re: [Eskrima] tipunan mini-seminar To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Date: Friday, August 8, 2008, 11:10 AM Flyer didn't show up. Where is the seminar going to be? David Koltoniuk Koltoniuk Empire Inc. 214-608-8545 Koltoniuk; not just a name, it is a way of life! --- On Fri, 8/8/08, jay de leon wrote: From: jay de leon Subject: [Eskrima] tipunan mini-seminar To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Date: Friday, August 8, 2008, 10:51 AM   y'all are invited to a Tipunan mini-seminar to be conducted by Roger Agbulos on Aug. 16, 2008, Saturday in Burbank, CA. See complete details/flyer below.   roger agbulos is a dear friend and the master of ceremonies at my Tipunan events. he also happens to be one of what i consider a real deal FMA fighter and guro.  his technical expertise, fighting experience and outgoing personality makes him a favorite seminar instructor.   if you are hearing of roger agbulos for the first time, you may either go to his website or check out these links.   http://www.tipunan.com/Events/tipunan-sa-disneyland/tipunan-disneyland_main.h tml   http://www.tipunan.com/Events/tipunan-sa-disneyland/roger-agbulos.html     please join me in another exciting tipunan (gathering).  salamat po.   jay de leon www.filipinomartialartsmuseum.com   Practical Self-Defense and Combat Conditioning rolled into one dynamic cardiovascular SUPER workout!                                                                           _______________________       Roger Agbulos is one of the original students of the late Grandmaster Edgar G. Sulite   In this workshop, you will learn to: Control long range encounters with broken, flowing or a combination of strikes, all non-telegraphic, regardless of angle! Hit moving targets with speed, power & accuracy.   Increase striking ability in both forward & backward movements utilizing dynamic footwork drills. Understand proper timing to initiate powerful entries – counter strikes, pre-emptive strikes, intercepting strikes and many other practical techniques to get the upper hand in sparring or full contact matches.                                                                                             BRING A PAIR OF RATTAN STICKS, TRAINING KNIFE  & SAFETY GEARS  ex.: HAND PROTECTORS or HOCKEY GLOVES, ARM PROTECTORS, SPARRING HELMET, GROIN PROTECTOR   CALL TO INQUIRE: (818) 357-0440 www.astiglameco.com astiglameco@yahoo.com     Saturday, August 16, 2008 / 1 pm to 5 pm Seminar Fee: $40.00  (Burbank Athletic club Members: $30.00 – must show ID)  BURBANK ATHLETIC CLUB – MEDIA CENTER   226 E. Palm Ave., Burbank, CA 91502            _______________________________________________ Eskrima mailing list, 2600 members Eskrima@martialartsresource.net Copyright 1994-2008: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource Standard disclaimers apply Subscribe or Unsubscribe: http://eskrima-fma.net _______________________________________________ Eskrima mailing list, 2600 members Eskrima@martialartsresource.net Copyright 1994-2008: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource Standard disclaimers apply Subscribe or Unsubscribe: http://eskrima-fma.net --__--__-- Message: 8 From: "Marc Denny" To: Date: Fri, 8 Aug 2008 12:19:02 -0700 Subject: [Eskrima] Night of the Living Dead discussion; DG Gathering this Sunday Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Woof All: As one who uses the term Kali: 1) I do so because my teacher does so. 2) Although the legitimacy of quite of few of the explanations of Kali have been seriously challenged, IMHO not all of them have been e.g. there is the matter of the Yambao book. http://dogbrothers.com/phpBB2/index.php?topic=193.0 http://dogbrothers.com/phpBB2/index.php?topic=193.msg10938;topicseen#msg10938 I now return to this thing which I call my Life. This includes by the way our "Dog Brothers Gathering of the Pack" which, in addition to being my idea of a pretty good expression of one aspect of , , , ahem , , , Kali ;-) takes place this Sunday at the Powerhouse Gym in Burbank-- see www.dogbrothers.com for details and see http://dogbrothers.com/phpBB2/index.php?topic=1484.0 for the thread on our forum with all the up-to-the-moment chatter. It looks like we will have well over 40 fighters, Reuters News Agency will be covering the day, and a scout from a TV show I am helping to develop will be there. "Higher Consciousness through Harder Contact" (c) Crafty Dog Guiding Force of the Dog Brothers The Adventure continues! Guro Crafty Dog Dog Brothers Martial Arts --__--__-- Message: 9 From: Ray To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net Subject: Re: [Eskrima] Yambao no-no :) Date: Fri, 8 Aug 2008 14:45:08 -0700 Reply-To: eskrima@martialartsresource.net See the archives, esp Eskrima digest, Vol 14 #206. Ray On Aug 8, 2008, at 12:19 PM, Marc Denny wrote: > e.g. there is the matter of the Yambao book. --__--__-- _______________________________________________ Eskrima mailing list Eskrima@martialartsresource.net http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/eskrima Subscribe or Unsubscribe: http://eskrima-fma.net Old digest issues @ ftp://ftp.martialartsresource.com/pub/eskrima Copyright 1994-2008: Ray Terry, MartialArtsResource.com, Sudlud.com Standard disclaimers apply. Remember September 11. End of Eskrima Digest