From: the_dojang-owner@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com To: the_dojang-digest@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com Subject: The_Dojang-Digest V6 #4 Reply-To: the_dojang@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com Errors-To: the_dojang-owner@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com Precedence: The_Dojang-Digest Wed, 6 Jan 1999 Vol 06 : Num 004 In this issue: the_dojang: Re: The_Dojang-Digest V6 #3 the_dojang: new subscribers Re: the_dojang: Re: Quality control (and the ATA) the_dojang: slipping/side stepping the_dojang: Re: ATA religeon??? the_dojang: Re: The_Dojang-Digest V6 #3 the_dojang: Korean Business Customs? the_dojang: Aloha Online! (fwd) the_dojang: Re: The_Dojang-Digest V6 #3 the_dojang: . ......................................................................... The_Dojang, serving the Internet since June 1994. ~800 members strong! Copyright 1994-99: Ray Terry, California Taekwondo, Martial Arts Resource To send e-mail to this list use the_dojang@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com To unsubscribe, send "unsubscribe the_dojang-digest" (no quotes) in the body of an e-mail (top line, left justified) addressed to majordomo@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com Replying to this message will NOT unsubscribe you. See the Korean Martial Arts (KMA) FAQ and online search the last two years worth of digest issues at http://www.MartialArtsResource.com Pil Seung! Ray Terry, PO Box 110841, Campbell, CA 95011 KMA@MartialArtsResource.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Date: Wed, 6 Jan 1999 13:54:18 EST Subject: the_dojang: Re: The_Dojang-Digest V6 #3 In reference to John Hancock's comment: << So...who needs and organization. Well..I can only think of one time....and that is if you are like me...and no mater how much to absorb from whatever source...you still won't SELF PROMOTE. In other words....I don't just wake up one morning and say..."Hey...today I think I'm a 10th Dan Grandmaster... >> You might want to check out the AAU Taekwondo Program. I have an independent school and have been very happy with the AAU because it doesn't tell you how to run your school, but it gives a fair and honest tournament venue for your students to compete at, and they now have an optional Dan testing program that allow independent schools to still move up in rank. The cost to charter a school is dirt cheap. It costs me $50 per year! Look at www.aautaekwondo.org for basic info (note the .ORG as aautaekondo.COM is a different site). Sincerely, David Mazor Long Time Lurker & Dojang-Digest Lover ------------------------------ From: Date: Wed, 6 Jan 1999 11:10:09 -0800 (PST) Subject: the_dojang: new subscribers Hi all, While the list was slowed down due to the holidays new subscribers were not allowed on. This was to reduce any problems that might occur during my rather limited access to the internet. Many new subscribers are receiving the_dojang digest for the first time. Welcome and feel free to join in the fun. Ray Terry raymail@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com ------------------------------ From: Date: Wed, 6 Jan 1999 11:14:26 -0800 (PST) Subject: Re: the_dojang: Re: Quality control (and the ATA) > > > No quality control? Obviously you know nothing about the ATA. (Maybe you reall > > > don't know about the ATA - you didn't lis > > > > > > > it wasn't me that made the quality control comment, but do not think the > > ATA is to be left out. A good friend ran an ATA dojang for several years. > > - -- > > His experience wasn't all that positive. > > > I'd be interested in understanding more details about your friend's > experience. It was solely from a school owner's perspective. He loved the ATA's forms (which seems to be commonly felt), but somehow the politics and $$ got in the way. Perhaps he was the problem or perhaps the problem was shared. I'll try to find out more. I need to talk with him anyway... Ray Terry raymail@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com ------------------------------ From: Greg Giddins Date: Wed, 6 Jan 1999 12:04:52 -0700 Subject: the_dojang: slipping/side stepping When I was in my first Tang Soo dojang we were taught to step softly in a semi circle around our opponent. Always trying to get to his blind side. We created an imaginary circle around him and skirted around it. Later, in Tae Kwon Do they were teaching a linear 45 degree anle step to the same spot (the blind side). Not straight at him, and not quite to the side, kind of stepping "past" him to one side. But in NONE of the schools were we directly taught to step backwards to avoid an attack. That's something everyone picks up on their own, no need to illustrate it in class, haa haa. It's usually considered very poor form, and in most schools it is strongly discouraged. The time for running away is before he throws his attack, not after. Greg Giddins ggiddins@ossinc.net You can't shake the Devil's hand and say you're only kidding. ~ They Might Be Giants ------------------------------ From: jberwin@sc45.dseg.ti.com (John Brett Erwin 972-952-3738 ERWN) Date: Wed, 6 Jan 1999 13:24:56 -0600 (CST) Subject: the_dojang: Re: ATA religeon??? >PS: What is about these ATA guys? they seem to be in religion or >something like that!!! Nothing is perfect, you have keep your mind open >and accept your imperfection, otherwhise we would never evolve. I agree with your second statement, and hope that your first statement is mere sarcasm. ATA has been around for 30 years and because it's collective mind was open, it has seen much change and evolution. And because of this, ATA is quite proud (arrogant :) about it. Is it better than other organizations??? As a whole, who can say. But parts of it probably is, and other parts probably aren't. Trust me, I could write a dissertation on this topic. :) You can't have progress without change. This is why ATA... * Developed new forms to incorporate more kicking techniques reflected by rank. (ie. front kick and side kick in white belt form) * Developed advanced sparring combinations and one-steps for improved foot-work and timing. * Now requires street self-defense techniques proportional to each rank to develop pressure point and joint lock/manipulation knowledge. * Now has a large collection of seminars/curriculum on weapons and training suppliments such as: - single and double escrima sticks - single and double nunchaku - long staff - self-defense with a hooked cane (really cool and fun) - knife throwing (??? this one is new to me ???) - joint manipulation - ground fighting (learned from Gracies) - Sexual Harrassment Awareness and Rape Prevention (SHARP) - Pressure Point Control Tactics (PPCT) - cardio kickboxing aerobics - Most of these (if not all) ATA developed as programs by learning from Masters of other arts/orgnaizations * Recently added Tai-Chi clinics * Recently added Olympic-style sparring clinics (I wouldn't be surprised to see Black Belts sparring this way in ATA tournys in the future) * Formal instructor certification curriculum and training procedure * Business seminars on teaching, finance, curriculum, etc... There are some problems with ATA, but they are making efforts to go out and expand, and make themselves a complete martial art organization. Now to be fair, here are some problems that I see. * Camoflauge belt - most outsiders think it's silly. Always a point of conversation. But it doesn't really hurt anything. Kids like it. * ATA has a system where school owners can do very well financially and sometimes get caught up in McDonjang/belt factory syndrome. * Too easy to get to 1st degree black belt (in some schools). See the above statement. * A school hosting a tournament can make upwards of $20K - $30K so some schools who are active there tend to push tournaments too much. - - Brett Erwin Allen, TX ------------------------------ From: Chuck Sears Date: Wed, 06 Jan 1999 13:59:12 -0600 Subject: the_dojang: Re: The_Dojang-Digest V6 #3 - ------------------------------ > > From: Eduardo Miranda > Date: Tue, 05 Jan 1999 22:55:56 -0200 > Subject: the_dojang: Re: digest 515 > > Greg comments about federations brought an important issue. Sometimes we > have to chose between our loyalty to our GM and our belief. > > Unfortunately what Karla suggest, change if you're unhappy, is > imposible: It isn't easy to change your flag, you have to inform your > students, up date yourself and even teach new forms that you have never > practiced before!!! Beside that, do you trust in a dojang that keep > changing its style??!! no way!! > > PS: What is about these ATA guys? they seem to be in religion or > something like that!!! Nothing is perfect, you have keep your mind open > and accept your imperfection, otherwhise we would never evolve. > Religion? I don't think so. I most assuredly do not start the day praying to Grand Master Lee. One of the reasons I have stayed with the ATA as long as I have is precisely the fact that they keep evolving. I have been involved with other organizations and I must say that I think ATA has the best "quality control" of any of them. They also have the best "R & D" that I have seen to date. Are they perfect? Heavens, no. Are they commercial? You bet, because to be successful in today's world, one has to be both a business person and a martial artist. ATA teaches us how to be a martial artist first and foremost, then if we want, they will teach us how to be a good business person as well. Do we have some bad apples in the organization? Just like any other large organization, some will slip through the cracks. But success speaks for itself. We are one of the largest martial arts sanctioning bodies in the world, with over 150,000 active members. We got that way in less than 30 years. Obviously, we're doing something right and I think it is all in how and what we teach. The best explanation that I've heard yet came from Senior Master Robert Allemier, who said that we teach life skills and that we use Taekwondo as the teaching medium. And I agree. ------------------------------ From: Stan Lim Date: Wed, 06 Jan 1999 12:08:18 -0800 Subject: the_dojang: Korean Business Customs? Hello, people! I am going on a 2 day business trip to Seoul, Korea later this month, and this will be my first trip there. Unfortunately, I won't have any time for sightseeing, but I would like to get any pointers in how to interact with Korean business men. Should I bow? Do I need to bring small gifts? Do Koreans make a ceremony out of exchanging business cards (like some Japanese do?). Any tips and pointers would be helpful. Thanks. Stan ps: What's the weather like? I'm told it is cold. ------------------------------ From: Date: Wed, 6 Jan 1999 12:56:11 -0800 (PST) Subject: the_dojang: Aloha Online! (fwd) Forwarding. Ray - -------------------------------------------------------------------------- Forwarded message: From: "Burt R. Riveira" Subject: Aloha Online! Date: Wed, 30 Dec 1998 08:29:45 -0800 Aloha and Happy New Year! UPCOMING EVENTS/SEMINARS! 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Mahalo, BR ------------------------------ From: John Hancock <4karate@bellsouth.net> Date: Wed, 06 Jan 1999 15:53:58 -0500 Subject: the_dojang: Re: The_Dojang-Digest V6 #3 > I am also wondering is there a term for live in student in Korean like the > Japanese "Uchi Desi". > Master Geoff J. Booth > Australian Hapkido Group > http://hapkido.netro.com.au Yes there is. I believe they call him "house boy". ------------------------------ From: Date: Wed, 6 Jan 1999 13:03:34 -0800 (PST) Subject: the_dojang: . ------------------------------ End of The_Dojang-Digest V6 #4 ****************************** Support the USTU by joining today! US Taekwondo Union, 1 Olympic Plaza, Ste 405, Colorado Spgs, CO 80909 719-578-4632 FAX 719-578-4642 ustutkd1@aol.com http://www.ustu.com --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe from this digest, the_dojang-digest, send the command: unsubscribe the_dojang-digest -or- unsubscribe the_dojang-digest your.old@address in the BODY of email (top line, left justified) addressed to majordomo@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com. Old digest issues are available via ftp://ftp.martialartsresource.com, in pub/the_dojang/digests. All digest files have the suffix '.txt' Copyright 1994-99: Ray Terry, Martial Arts Resource, California Taekwondo Standard disclaimers apply.