From: the_dojang-owner@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com To: the_dojang-digest@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com Subject: The_Dojang-Digest V6 #11 Reply-To: the_dojang@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com Errors-To: the_dojang-owner@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com Precedence: The_Dojang-Digest Sun, 10 Jan 1999 Vol 06 : Num 011 In this issue: the_dojang: Magazines the_dojang: fighter vs. artist the_dojang: The TKD spirit? the_dojang: Re; magazines the_dojang: No Subject, not read the_dojang: Re: The_Dojang-Digest V6 #10 the_dojang: Re: ATA the_dojang: . ......................................................................... The_Dojang, serving the Internet since June 1994. ~800 members strong! Copyright 1994-99: Ray Terry, California Taekwondo, Martial Arts Resource To send e-mail to this list use the_dojang@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com To unsubscribe, send "unsubscribe the_dojang-digest" (no quotes) in the body of an e-mail (top line, left justified) addressed to majordomo@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com Replying to this message will NOT unsubscribe you. See the Korean Martial Arts (KMA) FAQ and online search the last two years worth of digest issues at http://www.MartialArtsResource.com Pil Seung! Ray Terry, PO Box 110841, Campbell, CA 95011 KMA@MartialArtsResource.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Date: Fri, 8 Jan 1999 21:21:54 EST Subject: the_dojang: Magazines Magazines: Taekwondo Times is primairly Korean arts Blackbelt Martial Art Training Karate/Kung Fu Illustrated (all 3 from Rainbow Pub.) Inside Kung Fu Inside Karate Martial Arts Illustrated World of Martial Arts Kung Fu - Qigong Tai Chi Qi Journal of Asian Martial Arts (most expensive of them at almost $10) Those are the ones I know off hand, there are a couple others specifically on Aikido, and at least one more on Tai Chi but I don't know the names off hand. Alain Burrese aburrese@aol.com ------------------------------ From: "John Bennett" Date: Sat, 9 Jan 1999 11:42:34 -0600 Subject: the_dojang: fighter vs. artist Eduardo Miranda wrote: "If you don't train wishing to reach a higher level as humam being you're not a martial artist, you a only a figther." I don't want to be an artist. I train to be an effective fighter. I go to church to learn how to become a better person. Is that wrong? ------------------------------ From: "John Bennett" Date: Sat, 9 Jan 1999 11:19:13 -0600 Subject: the_dojang: The TKD spirit? Stephen Sanner wrote: "But don't you think that ATA (perhaps for commercial purposes?) is losing the TKD spirit diluted in a mix of everything?" I don't really know what the "TKD spirit" is, but my impression is that TKD was sythesized from other arts back in the 1950's. So, if the ATA wants to incorporate Kali sticks and Judo throws, who cares? To me, that what TKD has always done. John Bennett ------------------------------ From: "Jamaica Power" Date: Sat, 09 Jan 1999 10:00:44 PST Subject: the_dojang: Re; magazines Hi all and Happy new year: What magazines are available for martial artists other than black belt? Is there one for Tang Soo Do? Tang Soo!Allison4th gup, International Tang Soo Do +++++++++++++++++++++ Some sites you might want to check out. This is an online site for Tang Soo Do articles http://pubweb.nwu.edu/~dnw855/tsd/issues/index.html The blackbelt magazine site lists 5 of their other publications. http://www.blackbeltmag.com/ This site lists a few different magazines that are quite good. http://judo1.net/mags.htm Jamaica ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ From: "John Bennett" Date: Sat, 9 Jan 1999 11:36:34 -0600 Subject: the_dojang: No Subject, not read >The_Dojang-Digest Fri, 8 Jan 1999 Vol 06 : Num 009 >In this issue: > the_dojang: Re: The_Dojang-Digest V6 #8 > the_dojang: Re: The_Dojang-Digest V6 #8 > the_dojang: Re: The_Dojang-Digest V6 #8 > the_dojang: Re: The_Dojang-Digest V6 #8 > the_dojang: Re: The_Dojang-Digest V6 #8 > the_dojang: . I know you guys can do better than this.... ------------------------------ From: Chuck Sears Date: Sat, 09 Jan 1999 12:16:45 -0600 Subject: the_dojang: Re: The_Dojang-Digest V6 #10 > > > From: Eduardo Miranda > Date: Fri, 08 Jan 1999 19:16:54 -0200 > Subject: the_dojang: re dojang v6#8 > > > Take what is useful, regardless of > > "tradition" (which is usually considered a four letter word here in the > > states) > > > > The ATA seems to have taken useful parts of other martial arts > > and tried to make a "complete, modern" martial art. > > > When someone look for a martial art he is usually looking for tradition also, not only workout and self-defense. If you don't > train wishing to reach a higher level as humam being you're not a martial artist, you a only a figther. If is that you guys are > looking for (I sincerely doubt) you better stop using "DO" in your name, because this is a way to nowhere. > > It seems to me you shaking the devils hand to often. > Mr. Hancock has said it all: A is for Amway. Now I have to believe that this message was posted with a true lack of knowledge about the ATA, other than what Mr. Miranda and others have read in this newsgroup and the conclusions that have been jumped to. The Amway wisecrack is a perfect demonstration of this. The ATA is a VERY traditional martial arts organization. We begin and end with courtesy, respect and discipline. Our goal, first and foremost, is the development of the individual as a complete person, not just a good fighter or someone who looks cool doing a form. Our core curriculum is Taekwondo. Within the last 4 - 5 years, we have started offering other forms of martial arts, such as the single and double sticks, ground fighting, single and double song jeol bong, long staff, etc., as training tools to improve our students' skills. However, everything relates back into our Taekwondo training. You might consider a parallel to college: Taekwondo is our "major" subject; the others are our "electives". To re-explain the seniority fees that led to the Amway crack about pyramid schemes - please go back and re-read the original post. Seniority fees are paid to the instructor who taught you how to be an instructor, no one else. Amway has a kickback scheme where you get credits for people developed by people developed by people that you developed; ATA doesn't. If I, running school A, develop one of my Black Belt students into a certified instructor, who opens his own school (B) and develops a student into a certified instructor who then opens his own school (C), I do not receive seniority fees for testings in school C. Keep in mind that the seniority fee is an honorarium, nothing more. ATA seems to get a lot of negative postings like the one I'm responding to, and they are from people who do not understand what we are about. Might I respectfully suggest that you join the organization and learn about it before you badmouth it? It's not perfect by a long shot, but ATA has made a conscious effort to differentiate itself in the martial arts world based upon standardization, good business practices, overall quality of instruction, progress and positive goals, and I think they have been quite successful at it. ------------------------------ From: Eric Mueller Date: Fri, 08 Jan 1999 23:30:08 -0500 Subject: the_dojang: Re: ATA - - > > From: Chuck Sears > Date: Thu, 07 Jan 1999 17:31:34 -0600 > Subject: the_dojang: Re: The_Dojang-Digest V6 #7 > > > Well, the way it's supposed to be is this: If you, as an instructor, develop a student through the instructor > certification process and that new instructor then opens a school of their own, you are supposed to receive a > "seniority" fee based upon the number and rank of the students testing at the new school. This seniority fee is > incorporated into the testing fees paid by the students and is forwarded to you by Grand Master Lee and ATA > Headquarters. Why your friend didn't get the fees, I don't know. I've been the "senior" for two schools and have > received the fees for both on a regular basis. > > However, the seniority fee is not very large. It's supposed to be a rememberance, a token of respect to the person who > made it possible for you to be an instructor. It doesn't get to be a large amount of money unless you have developed a > whole bunch of instructors who are now running schools of their own with lots of students in them. Sounds Kinda Like a Pyramid scheme. I don't know of any ATA schools in my area, and my only experience was with a student at my sons Former Dojang who had recently moved to our area from the South (Alabama??/Mississippi??). His father was decidedly unimpressed with the ATA school due to quality issues. This kid had been a Purple Belt and had won some local/regional ATA tournament for his forms. He had a decent Roundhouse. With his Right leg. Only. I am not trying to make any global statement about the ATA, because I really have only this one individual to reference; But whenever I hear "ATA" I always think of this Kid, and his level of proficiency warrented only a White belt (absolute beginner) at my sons former dojang. His skills did improve with time, and (as far as I know) he is still enjoying TKD. BTW, the kid really seemed to like the ATA school although his father felt he hadn't gotten his moneys worth after he moved here and saw other TKD Dojangs. Eric Eric ------------------------------ From: Date: Sun, 10 Jan 1999 11:13:47 -0800 (PST) Subject: the_dojang: . ------------------------------ End of The_Dojang-Digest V6 #11 ******************************* Support the USTU by joining today! US Taekwondo Union, 1 Olympic Plaza, Ste 405, Colorado Spgs, CO 80909 719-578-4632 FAX 719-578-4642 ustutkd1@aol.com http://www.ustu.com --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe from this digest, the_dojang-digest, send the command: unsubscribe the_dojang-digest -or- unsubscribe the_dojang-digest your.old@address in the BODY of email (top line, left justified) addressed to majordomo@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com. Old digest issues are available via ftp://ftp.martialartsresource.com, in pub/the_dojang/digests. All digest files have the suffix '.txt' Copyright 1994-99: Ray Terry, Martial Arts Resource, California Taekwondo Standard disclaimers apply.