From: the_dojang-owner@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com To: the_dojang-digest@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com Subject: The_Dojang-Digest V6 #220 Reply-To: the_dojang@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com Errors-To: the_dojang-owner@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com Precedence: The_Dojang-Digest Mon, 26 April 1999 Vol 06 : Num 220 In this issue: the_dojang: Re: Jamaica's female poll the_dojang: Re: women in ma experience the_dojang: Adding Classes the_dojang: Adding Classes the_dojang: Re: Class length the_dojang: Re: More On Referee Qualifications the_dojang: Re: The_Dojang-Digest V6 #219 the_dojang: Re: sure is slow the_dojang: Re: The_Dojang-Digest V6 #219 Awards the_dojang: Re: Questions for female M.A's the_dojang: Trivia Humor Between Cultures the_dojang: Re: Sake Tasting the_dojang: Questions for Women M.A's the_dojang: Re: Summer fun the_dojang: (Off topic) For Piotr... the_dojang: Re: Women M.A.'s the_dojang: Re: Awards the_dojang: Re: Kumdo paperwork and more. the_dojang: Re: Class length the_dojang: Shi Da Xian kung fu the_dojang: Forms the_dojang: Martial Arts - not "practical" enough? the_dojang: . ......................................................................... The_Dojang, serving the Internet since June 1994. ~800 members strong! Copyright 1994-99: Ray Terry, California Taekwondo, Martial Arts Resource Replying to this message will NOT unsubscribe you. To unsubscribe, send "unsubscribe the_dojang-digest" (no quotes) in the body of an e-mail (top line, left justified) addressed to majordomo@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com To send e-mail to this list use the_dojang@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com See the Korean Martial Arts (KMA) FAQ and online search the last two years worth of digest issues at http://www.MartialArtsResource.com Pil Seung! Ray Terry, PO Box 110841, Campbell, CA 95011 KMA@MartialArtsResource.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Date: Sun, 25 Apr 1999 12:34:38 EDT Subject: the_dojang: Re: Jamaica's female poll Okay, here we go. Are you keeping tract? Wouldn't hurt to have some ex post facto data lying around for if/when you come up with a hypothesis to test. << To my female counterparts on this digest I would like to ask a few questions. Do you feel your training is really preparing you for an unexpected assault or confrontation that might occur outside the dojang. my TKD training? NO! Hapkido & women's self-defense class - YES. Have your awareness capabilities increased? yes Do you think you have within you the ability to attack back (if the situation deemed necessary) by your assailant? "if the sit. deemed nec" is not really what concerns me. It's the question of ability, opportunity and focus. I can hit back ANYONE who assaults me. IMO they give up any rights they may have had when they seek me out to do me harm. Would you be able to physically assault them if it was you or them, ie grabbing out the eyes, ears, and other sensitive areas to render harm. Yes, yes and yes. Have you been taught alternate ways of escape? not sure what you mean here. recently we learned a technique where you assume you are already on the ground and the assailant is is moving to tackle or choke you. it feels clumsy but I think practice will solve that. when down well your assailant's arm is in jeapordy and you have him pinned with your legs. Have you been taught safety on the internet? nope! but honestly common sense will go a long, long way on this issue. Would you be able to attack your opponent if they were another woman, teenager (female or male). oh you bet! In today's society I still see the majority of women putting themselves at great risk to help another woman, woman with a child or teenager even though it could be a setup to greater problems. well, you got me here. don't nec. see how that'll change given my personality. the important thing to me is to LOOK at the sit. some of the newer scams to get women out of malls were recently discussed here. NONE of them made any sense at all. [i.e. come out to the parking lot b/c the light is better and we'll do a commericial] FWIW, EVERY time I have helped a woman w/without a child I haven't had any trouble. More thoughts on your training or past experiences? How do you feel when you spar or throw a large male martial artist? Are you confident or deep down inside does it make you feel very uncomfortable? spar- feel weak and helpless and angry at myself. Every chance to flip or throw a man in class makes me feel powerful. I have to fight the urge to do it again, and again and again. Seeing a techinique to its completion, and successful at that, gives me a feeling of hope - like I can do it if need be. Do you train with weapons? nope. like which ones? Do you feel your instructors address your situations as a female. Absolutely! jamaica_power@hotmail.com >> well, Jamaica this outta be a good thread :0) Dawne ------------------------------ From: Date: Sun, 25 Apr 1999 11:50:00 -0500 Subject: the_dojang: Re: women in ma experience To answer Jamaica's (as usual very good) questions: >To my female counterparts on this digest I would like to ask a few >questions. >Do you feel your training is really preparing you for an unexpected >assault or confrontation that might occur outside the dojang. "Really preparing me"? Well this is difficult to answer. I have not had such a confrontation since I started ma. Did have a rude drunk neighbor of a friend try to start something and I handled that by getting in my truck and going home, the same thing I would have done without ma training :) Years ago I had jobs that required making large bank deposits and I was robbed at gunpoint twice. I gave the robbers the money and that was that. Same thing I would do now. But what I think you really meant was... I do not believe the type of training most of us are doing makes us unbeatable street fighters. I do believe it is quite valuable in that we learn a few very important things including 1) we will not die if someone punches or kicks us; 2) if we punch or kick someone they will not likely die either; 3) a sense of where opponent's body movements are leading to; 4) a sense of evasion/timing/distance judgement that you don't learn without actually "fighting" another human being on a regular basis; and hopefully 5) an enhancement of our common sense and awareness that will make us less likely to get into such a confrontation in the first place. >Have your awareness capabilities increased? Somewhat, though they were in place before taking ma perhaps a bit more than the avg. person. >Do you think you have within you the ability to attack back (if the >situation deemed necessary) by your assailant? Absolutely. >Would you be able to physically assault them if it was you or them, >ie grabbing out the eyes, ears, and other sensitive areas to render >harm. Absolutely. >Have you been taught alternate ways of escape? What exactly do you mean? >Have you been taught safety on the internet? What exactly do you mean? If you mean "how to avoid psychotic internet stalkers" no, not in the dojang or anywhere else. This is an area where Common Sense will preclude almost all problems. If you mean keeping my computer from getting a virus, I am admittedly a bit deficient in this area of knowledge, and my ma instructor probably is too :) >Would you be able to attack your opponent if they were another woman, >teenager (female or male). If it was them or me, you bet. >In today's society I still see the majority of women putting >themselves at great risk to help another woman, woman with a child or >teenager even though it could be a setup to greater problems. Are you saying we shouldn't? Again, that old friend Common Sense will be needed, but when things get to the point that no decent people will offer a hand to someone who needs it out of fear I'm moving to another planet. Jamaica, I am pretty sure you didn't mean that that way, judging from your persona on this list, and that wasn't meant to be offensive to you personally in any way. But it is a hot issue to me. And I don't think it is just a gender issue either, although probably more people will stop to help a woman or a child than a man, especially a man alone. That is sad. It needs to be corrected. I'm not saying we should all stop to pick up every hitchhiker or follow strangers in to abandoned buildings, but be willing to at least spend a quarter to call the police for someone in need. >More thoughts on your training or past experiences? >How do you feel when you spar or throw a large male martial artist? >Are you confident or deep down inside does it make you feel very >uncomfortable? I am very comforable with this. But I personally have never had a "fear of men" problem (despite some personal experiences that often have caused this in others). I do realize some women do and this needs to be addressed for and by them. Sparring larger people, which in my case are almost always going to be men, is great experience for all sorts of things technical. It also allows one to do things one can't do with an opponent who is much smaller than we are. It's nice being medium sized, get to practice a full range of stuff :) >Do you train with weapons? I am learning bo staff. I also know about shooting and firearm safety, though not through the ma. >Do you feel your instructors address your situations as a female. I feel my instructors address my situation as a student and as an individual and that is what I ask of them. Personally for some reason this question rubs me the wrong way, and I'm not quite sure why. >jamaica_power@hotmail.com Looking forward to seeing other replies to this one, Sandy tokay@netwurx.net ------------------------------ From: "Jamaica Power" Date: Sun, 25 Apr 1999 10:53:55 PDT Subject: the_dojang: Adding Classes >>> I'm thinking of adding a class specifically for self defense and adding elements of this to each and every class wherein a student would walk out the door with something that works the very first night. Any ideas on this subject? Terry L. Davis>>>>>>>. ========================================== Morning. Sounds like you already have a full agenda and it sounds really great and enthusiastic. Do you have enough employees to help you establish and expand all these programs? Next I like your self defense approach. What I would like to see for men and women is not just basic self defense but have different instructors come in (guests) from different disciplines so you could experience what it would be like to get attacked by another martial artist from a different teaching, an ex police officer, a convict, etc. and then just a clumsy drunk from a bar. Thanks jamaica_power@hotmail.com _______________________________________________________________ Get Free Email and Do More On The Web. Visit http://www.msn.com ------------------------------ From: "Jamaica Power" Date: Sun, 25 Apr 1999 11:05:15 PDT Subject: the_dojang: Adding Classes >>>Cardio Karate readily comes to mind and I'm thinking of an early morning class along the lines of the Military's Physical Training (PT). Others call it Boot Camp and Navy Seal Training seems to be in vogue. This class would focus on calisthenics, aerobic activities and stretching. >> This sounds great. Instead of adding directly to the class perhaps you could have a healthy juicebar or breakfast afterwards for the people. Wouldn't have to be elaborate but continue your workout and instruct people on nutrition and how to make that workout keep going for them. Too many people do the workout and then go home and have diet pop and chips and dip. Or they will be so hungry from your class they will hit the first McDonalds they see for coffee and a McMuffin. Just a thought, or two, or three :) jamaica@hotmail.com. _______________________________________________________________ Get Free Email and Do More On The Web. Visit http://www.msn.com ------------------------------ From: Stan Lim Date: Sun, 25 Apr 1999 12:47:58 -0700 Subject: the_dojang: Re: Class length >From: >Date: Sat, 24 Apr 1999 20:32:57 EDT >Subject: the_dojang: Class length > >I've been in and out of several martial arts schools (both Korean and >Japanese) and I'm currently "shopping around" for a new taekwondo school as I >am in a new location attending college. I found that the majority of >taekwondo schools here havevery short classes (40 minutes to an hour) I >attended a 40 minute class and at the end was standing there thinking >"where's the rest? I'm not done! I haven't even broken a sweat! I liked >the class and the excercises, but I just don't think 3 40 minute classes a >week is going to do me much good, or at least isn't worth my 50-$75 a month. >Any thoughts on this? What are oyur class lengths? First of all, may I encourage fellow members to sign all their posts since some e-mail addresses are not getting through the system. I agree with the poster here that 40-60 minutes for a class is rather short. I usually like to spend at least 15 minutes warming up and stretching, and in an hour class, that's too much time. Sometimes, we are only given 5 minutes to stretch, and that's just not enough for me to get the circulation going. I also agree that often, a hour seems inadequate. However, it also depends on what you are doing. If you are doing forms and step sparring, then you probably won't get a good workout (although I can break a sweat by doing forms). An hour even, 30 minutes of solid cardio workout, like continuous punching and kicking can get quite tiring. At my school, classes are usually one hour. However, the last class of the day starts at 7:30 pm, but we usually run over until 9:00 pm. Once in a while, we run till 9:30, and in a few rare instances, we finished at 10:00. Students who have to leave after 8:30 can do so by bowing out, so staying overtime is optional. Do you have the option of attending more than one class per day? My school allows students (green belts and above, in general) to attend as many sessions as they like. When I am feeling especially guilty for having eaten too much over a long weekend, I sometimes attend both the 6:30 and 7:30 classes. (Then, after the 2.5 to 3 hour workout, I go home and eat more. Hee hee hee!) My $0.02. Thanks. Stan Lim San Jose, CA slim@employees.org ------------------------------ From: Stan Lim Date: Sun, 25 Apr 1999 12:59:17 -0700 Subject: the_dojang: Re: More On Referee Qualifications Jamaica wishes: > >so I will add one or two more things I'd like to see required... > >5). CPR training and certification (adult and child), and >6). First AID training, >7). Blood Borne Pathogen Training, >8). AIDS training. > >#'s 5 through 8 I would like to see implemented not for the ability >to administer treatment but rather to increase the awareness of ref's >prior to any occurrences happening whether they be asthma victims, >epileptic seizures, heart problems, dehydration, sports injuries. >And to increase the abilities to see these situations sooner and then >to request medical attention quicker. Actually, if the referees are certified in CPR and First Aid, I don't see why the they should not render help immediately if needed, instead of waiting for the paramedics to arrive. In some cases, those seconds or minutes could make the difference in the injured fighter's life. If you are only advocating awareness, then #7 and #8 would probably be covered in the same class or training session. AIDS and other blood borne pathogens are transmitted in similar ways. Bottom line is don't touch other people's goo :-) These are excellent suggestions, Jamaica, and I hope that they become mandatory. I was lucky that I had training in all the items you mentioned above as a volunteer emergency response member at work, and there is definitely a lot of valuable knowledge to learn. Stan Lim slim@employees.org ------------------------------ From: Date: Sun, 25 Apr 1999 16:53:21 EDT Subject: the_dojang: Re: The_Dojang-Digest V6 #219 In a message dated 4/25/99 9:23:30 AM Pacific Daylight Time, the_dojang-owner@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com writes: << Subject: the_dojang: 11th Degree Black Belt Test! Just a little humor: http://www.cyberhighway.net/~transnet/humor/tblackbelt.htm >> lol jamaica. melinda chunjido@aol.com ------------------------------ From: Date: Sun, 25 Apr 1999 17:38:17 EDT Subject: the_dojang: Re: sure is slow In a message dated 99-04-25 12:25:00 EDT, you write: Ronda wrote: << I wish........ >> And still you found time to help me out! Folks, meet SuperWoman... our own Ronda Sweet! Thanks for all you do for us individually and for TKD. Sally CBAUGHN@aol.com ------------------------------ From: Date: Sun, 25 Apr 1999 17:44:19 EDT Subject: the_dojang: Re: The_Dojang-Digest V6 #219 Awards I've seen awards inspire children and make them very happy. I don't know that it would mean the same to someone who has certainly already received plenty of awards throughout their career. Awards have never meant much to me. But if it does make someone happy and feel good, then I am in favor of them. CF ------------------------------ From: Date: Sun, 25 Apr 1999 18:43:16 EDT Subject: the_dojang: Re: Questions for female M.A's Hello everyone, I know it has been said a million times before, but WOW Jamaica, great questions! << Do you feel your training is really preparing you for an unexpected >> assault or confrontation that might occur outside the dojang. I really do feel like my training is preparing me for an unexpected assault. However, training does still lack the complete element of surprise. When I am out shopping, walking in the park or whatever else, I have this little training exercise that I do. When I see a person enter "my space" in my peripheral vision, I take a quick glance note their position and then envision them making a specific attack. (For example, maybe a simple wrist grab, or it could be a complete bear hug grab) Then I mentally visualize at least one escape and/or counter attack that would free me of the grab and at the very least, send them off balance or out of attacking range, even if only temporarily. Those few seconds could make all the difference in my ability to a) Run, b) summons help c) grab a weapon or d) prepare for a fight. I spent a few years growing up in Michigan, and we often had tornado drills (kind of like a fire alarm drill) Until the day we actually had to use the training, all of us kids thought it was kind of silly. On the day of the tornado though, just like clockwork, we were all in our trained positions. I don't recall anyone every complaining about tornado drills after that day. :-) >>Have your awareness capabilities increased? Definitely. As I noted above, I always keep aware of who (how many/male or female/size...) is around me. Something else that I keep tabs on is what is available in the area that would make effective weapons. >> Do you think you have within you the ability to attack back (if the >> situation deemed necessary) by your assailant? Would you be able to physically assault them if it was you or them, >> i.e. grabbing out the eyes, ears, and other sensitive areas to render harm. Mentally and emotionally, yes. Physically...I would hope so, but I am a realist and so I know that my size is a weakness against a larger opponent. That is why, IMHO, I always make sure I have "an equalizer" of some sort. :-) I guess I should add that I also incorporate a lot of weapon drills and practice in my training...It definitely helps if you know how to use them! Great thought provoking questions...sure makes you question yourself. Thanks, Mary ------------------------------ From: "Jamaica Power" Date: Sun, 25 Apr 1999 16:04:41 PDT Subject: the_dojang: Trivia Humor Between Cultures Just a little respectful trivia humor and a little silliness on my part. If you don't know, the Korean culture enjoys very much bright colors in comparison to Americans. About, oh say, 10 years ago the Korean GM's in response to the American referees' repeated requests for a different referee uniform from the gray/blue suggested that it was indeed a good idea. But they wanted the the new colors to be bright green. See sometimes you get what you want.... and then some. So you really need to be careful what you ask for. Anyway I figured that they were pretty much following the Sesame Street trend since I always felt the International Ref uniforms reminded me of Big Bird and if the other uniform was changed to green it would be representative of Oscar the Grouch,, hmm or maybe Kermit the Frog. Obviously the change never took place...yet! jamaica_power@hotmail.com _______________________________________________________________ Get Free Email and Do More On The Web. Visit http://www.msn.com ------------------------------ From: Date: Sun, 25 Apr 1999 19:45:32 EDT Subject: the_dojang: Re: Sake Tasting It is verrry difficult to get the true taste of sake via the internet..... It comes across with a sort of plastic-like quality. Not as much kick as right out of the bottle. Maybe I need faster modem? Pardon me, I just had to get that out of my system. By the way, is there a Korean equivalent of sake? If there is, I would like to try it. Pil Seung Stan Wojcoski wojosg@aol.com ------------------------------ From: Date: Sun, 25 Apr 1999 21:06:16 EDT Subject: the_dojang: Questions for Women M.A's Jamaica, these are my answers to your questions Do you feel your training is really preparing you for an unexpected assault or confrontation that might occur outside the dojang. * Not as much as I would like but our instructor is trying hard to make his female students aware of the possible situations. He tries to include extra tips for his female athletes of getting out of sticky situations Have your awareness capabilities increased? * Up to a certain degree, I have to say yes. Do you think you have within you the ability to attack back (if the situation deemed necessary) by your assailant? * Depending on the "size" and "strength" of the assailant attack back yes. Unless this attacker is a 6 footer and 200 pound person I think I could give him a good bloody nose and a few bruises to remember me by. Would you be able to physically assault them if it was you or them, ie grabbing out the eyes, ears, and other sensitive areas to render harm. * Again depending on the "size" and "strength" of the assailant. Unless this attacker is a 6 footer and 200 pound person I would say a resounding YES. Have you been taught alternate ways of escape? * Yes by staying alert and avoiding as much as possible a possible situation. As for another way of escaping physically, not really Have you been taught safety on the internet? * NO Would you be able to attack your opponent if they were another woman, teenager (female or male). * Yes, I don't see why not, in our class our instructor makes it a point to train with every person, size and male and female young and old. In today's society I still see the majority of women putting themselves at great risk to help another woman, woman with a child or teenager even though it could be a setup to greater problems. * I agree but that's part, I think, of the female instincts. More thoughts on your training or past experiences? * It would be great if instructors and students had time to create a specific schedule based on the necessities of each person but that it's almost impossible. Our instructor is open to suggestions and tries hard to include them in class situations. How do you feel when you spar or throw a large male martial artist? Are you confident or deep down inside does it make you feel very uncomfortable? * I feel ok because I'm used to it by now but it's still a bit uncomfortable to spar with someone a lot bigger than one is. Throwing a male on the mat makes me feel more confident as a person and my capabilities as a martial artist but it also makes me aware of the harm I could cause someone. Do you train with weapons? * yes we train with bo and nunchuks Do you feel your instructors address your situations as a female. *As much as he possibly can. It also helps that in the adult class there are quite a few women in the class. But he also has to make sure that men don't get bored!! Olivos@aol.com ------------------------------ From: "Darlene" Date: Sun, 25 Apr 1999 19:17:42 -0700 Subject: the_dojang: Re: Summer fun Our dojang sometimes has a summer sleep-over as a reward for younger students who have been reading books all summer (our summer mind-exercise program). We also have a fund-raiser sleep-over on New Year's Eve. This one provides cheap babysitting so parents can go out, the kids are safe and the cost benefits a good cause (our team going to Nationals). Kids arrive at 8:00 pm, and are picked up around 9:00 am. We usually have group games at first, team-building challenges (similar to ground-level ROPES course activities). One we did this time was: line everyone up on a balance beam, then have them switch order moving one person at a time and not touching the floor. We also played paperball basketball (it was a wild game this time!). Once they're tired out from that, we had a variety of board games, card games, and pizza. We counted down the New Year and lights out hit at 12:30 am (lights out is at 10:30pm--I think--for the summer sleep-over), although there are always a couple of kids who fall asleep early-despite the noise. Good luck and have fun! Darlene 2nd kup Port Hadlock ------------------------------ From: Daremo and Kitsune Date: Sun, 25 Apr 1999 21:56:42 -0500 Subject: the_dojang: (Off topic) For Piotr... Sorry list but my address for Piotr wouldn't work so I resorted to this since I know he's here. Again, sorry and thanks. Piotr, >it would be probably possible to you to take part at such a course. Being >a Bachelor, you would need to submit a copy of your students` record >(with all examination results), as well as information about the total >number of hours (of each subject) in your studies and any other info >about you which could be helpful in your opinion. I can send him the Bachelor's information and transcripts but I don't know what examination results you mean. Would that be the Taekwondo work? I can send copies of my rank certificates and written material that I've done (6 published articles and works in progress). > He asked to send this materials directly to him and he will try to help >you. The examinations on subjects which are the same on both >universities (in the U.S. and in Poland) will be accepted, and from what I >understand, you`ll receive an individual studies and examinations >schedule, so that you don`t have to come over to Poland every other >weekend (it would be nice from my point of wiev, but I think a bit too >expensive on your side ;)...). From the first section, let me know what subject matters he wants. As for traveling to Poland...maybe not every other weekend but I would greatly enjoy the chance to train and study with you. >I can`t tell you how long would the course take for you, because it >basically depends on the schedule of your previous studies. I don`t know >about the costs either, but they will be surely higher than for Polish >students. Can he give me an estimate? >Anyway, if you will send the above materials to Mr Brzozowski, he >assured me he will forward you all information about the course, so you >will be able to decide it for yourself if it`s something that suits you. I'm sure that its something that would fit. Could you ask him about the material a bit more so I know exactly what to send? Thank you very much for your assistance! "Young Eun" ------------------------------ From: "Darlene" Date: Sun, 25 Apr 1999 22:15:24 -0700 Subject: the_dojang: Re: Women M.A.'s Jamaica, I am training in TKD 1) for exercise to keep my weight at the low end of my weight range; 2) to increase my response time; and 3) to gain flexibility and strength in my muscles. Most of your questions apply to assault situations. I live in a fairly safe community, and practice self-preservation techniques: I don't walk around in the dark alone, I don't go anywhere without telling someone generally where I'll be and when I'll be home, and I lock my car doors when I'm in town. >>Do you feel your training is really preparing you for an unexpected >>assault or confrontation that might occur outside the dojang. I'm not training for unexpected assaults outside the dojang, but I feel that I am getting some preparation for confrontations in which I could adequately defend myself (mostly through Hapkido and running). My GM (6th dan) made a good point when he said that if someone came up to him with a knife and demanded his wallet, he'd give the attacker the wallet. "Nothing in my wallet is worth my life or even a cut on my body," he told us. >>Have your awareness capabilities increased? I find that I sometimes use a high block when someone unexpectedly taps me on the shoulder! >>Do you think you have within you the ability to attack back (if the >>situation deemed necessary) by your assailant? I hope I am never in such a situation, but I doubt (at 2nd kup) that my skills would be adequate in defending myself against seasoned street fighters. >>Would you be able to physically assault them if it was you or them, >>ie grabbing out the eyes, ears, and other sensitive areas to render >>harm. If I were in a life-threatening or rape situation, you bet! >>Have you been taught alternate ways of escape? I have learned some Hapkido skills and grab-releases in TKD, and a long time ago learned a few "women's self-defense/self-preservation" techniques. A couple of those techniques were reinforced and strengthen through self-defense lessons in TKD. >>Have you been taught safety on the internet? Not in TKD, but I teach this in school. >>Would you be able to attack your opponent if they were another woman, >>teenager (female or male). Yes, but the above situation applies (street fighting skills). I would not counter-attack unless I were in a situation that threatened my life. >>In today's society I still see the majority of women putting >>themselves at great risk to help another woman, woman with a child or >>teenager even though it could be a setup to greater problems. Women are trained through socialization to help others, especially other women and children. If training women to be stronger physically gives them a tool to help others, all the better. Why should we wait for a man to help others, when we can help them ourselves? Why should we turn the other way when someone is in trouble? I would probably be more inclined to put myself at risk if a child were in danger. I would probably also have a more level-headed approach then the person within the situation and use conflict-resolution language as much as possible to avoid a violent situation. >>More thoughts on your training or past experiences? Teaching at all grade levels, and especially at middle school, I have found myself in situations were two young men are fighting and I was the teacher in charge/passing by. I have separated them (even though we're not supposed to get in between fighting students), and talked them out of continuing, even toward a resolution before the assistant principal showed up. This was before I started TKD. With more years of experience (read "age"), more years of teaching, I can now resolve fights with more voice and less yanking, even though I'm stronger and could probably force them to the ground now. >>How do you feel when you spar or throw a large male martial artist? >>Are you confident or deep down inside does it make you feel very >>uncomfortable? I've only had a few trainings in throwing others, but we don't throw hard. I did work after class one night, because while I felt I learned the technique, I wasn't using enough strength to throw someone who didn't want to be thrown. It helped learning about getting low and lifting with the throw. In sparring, I know that the men are stronger (and higher ranked), so I use my blocks and try to use checking to fake them out so that I can get a good kick in. Our larger black belt is also over 50 and fairly slow. It's the slim 18-year old I have to watch out for! >>Do you train with weapons? I've had one lesson in num-chuks and look forward to learning more about them and other weapons. >>Do you feel your instructors address your situations as a female? Unusually, we have a large number of women in our dojang, so he hasn't much choice! Darlene 2nd kup Port Hadlock, WA ------------------------------ From: "Darlene" Date: Sun, 25 Apr 1999 22:30:41 -0700 Subject: the_dojang: Re: Awards It was my impression that the multitude of awards (especially trophies) were a Korean anomaly. At our local tournaments, the Koreans give out five-feet tall trophies to all their (mostly Korean) friends who helped support their tournament! Whatever was left for the black belt tournament winners was small enough to be set on the front table. Color belts get medallions on ribbons for 1st, 2nd, & 3rd place (two bronze for children's classes). "Student of the Month" is more of an American tradition--mostly taken from the public schools. Our (Korean) GM gives these awards, plus "most improved," "best form," etc. at each of the kup/black belt tests held at his dojang. My TKD (American) Master has chosen not to do these awards, and he has a great turn out at classes and good attitude among his students. (He also has a great sense of humor!) Darlene 2nd kup Port Hadlock, WA ------------------------------ From: "Kim Jones" Date: Sun, 25 Apr 1999 23:16:14 PDT Subject: the_dojang: Re: Kumdo paperwork and more. >Greetings all, > >This is my first message to the list. I haven't had much to contribute since I began >lurking a month or so ago as I haven't studied TKD and I no longer study Hapkido. >I've been in Korea for the past year and a half studying Hai Dong Gumdo. (It's a >comprehensive sword style that is definitely not Kendo. ;} ) >My question for the group concerns returning home. I'm Canadian by the way. >For those of you who received training in Korea, how difficult was it to get recognition >of your achievements at home? I will not be going home for a few years yet but as I will >be testing for 1st Dan in 2 weeks the question has begun to cross my mind. Now I realize >that TKD, TSD and HKD are much more widespread than the art I study but I'm sure there >are parallels in experience. There is a world organization for Hai Dong Gumdo and it has >even managed to penetrate Canada to some extent. >What can I expect from local practitioners when I return home? >Any suggestions and opinions would be greatly appreciated. I'd hate to get home only to >find I'm missing a vital document or red stamp... ;} > > >Anthony BT Boyd >Swordsman and Teacher Well, Anthony, I guess it really depends on who does documentation and how it's done wherever you're going back to. As for myself, I'm just returning to Korea and am about to look into the TKD programs on Yongsan. It really matters on how they run things in your particular art and organization affiliation outside the Peninsula. >Subject: the_dojang: sure is slow... > >Sure is slow around here... Is everyone on spring break? "I'm ba-ack..." Seriously, I'm back online and checking e-mail on a pretty regular basis. In short, the flight from Atlanta to Chicago to Korea was ho-hum with its moments upon landing. Which brings me to this question: Do people experience different reactions when an airplane lands on the ground? When the plane landing for more passengers and a gas-up at Chicago, I experienced the most excruciating pain even though I cleared my ears as fast as I could. The pain spread from my ears to across my brows. The same thing happened again landing in Seoul at Kimpo International, except this time my mom said I looked like I was getting hives. (This didn't happen when I left Korea to go to Georgia.) And... I've laid off solo training because I'll have moments at which I'll experience a feeling of vertigo (doesn't happen any more, but it's still weird). Any explanations? Kim Jones "All warfare is based on deception." --Sun Tzu, "The Art of War" _______________________________________________________________ Get Free Email and Do More On The Web. Visit http://www.msn.com ------------------------------ From: Klaus Steinberger Date: Mon, 26 Apr 1999 09:15:55 +0200 Subject: the_dojang: Re: Class length > "where's the rest? I'm not done! I haven't even broken a sweat! I liked > the class and the excercises, but I just don't think 3 40 minute classes a > week is going to do me much good, or at least isn't worth my 50-$75 a month. > Any thoughts on this? What are oyur class lengths? I think also that 40 minute classes are much too short. (Oh better than nothing, but ...). Our classes are between 60 minutes (children) to 90 minutes. We have shorter classes (60 minutes) for children, because 90 minutes is a little bit too long for them to have their full attention. Sincerely, Klaus - -- Klaus Steinberger Beschleunigerlabor der TU und LMU Muenchen Phone: (+49 89)289 14287 Hochschulgelaende, D-85748 Garching, Germany FAX: (+49 89)289 14280 EMail: Klaus.Steinberger@Physik.Uni-Muenchen.DE URL: http://www.bl.physik.tu-muenchen.de/~k2/ In a world without fences and walls, who needs Windows and Gates? ------------------------------ From: Bernard Eddey Date: Mon, 26 Apr 1999 17:17:18 +0800 Subject: the_dojang: Shi Da Xian kung fu The following is a rough translation from the chinese of the 'tenets' of this particular style. It is also known as (again a rough translation) as Heart-will Six Harmony kung fu. I think they can be applied just about anywhere! Have the wisdom to use your skills only for self defence and the protection of others. Have the courage to take full responsibility for your actions and the confidence to do what you know to be right. Have the compassion to give assistance and kindness wherever needed. Have the diligence to work hard to develop ypour mind and body. Have the integrity to be ruthful and honest at all times. Have the self discipline to aim for goals and the persistence to achieve them. Have the confidence to follow your dreams. Have the patience to enjoy life. Have the self belief to keep a positive focus in all situations. Have the understanding to respect your fellow humans and the environment in which we live. I think I'll call them the 10 commandments!! regards Bernard Eddey 1st Dan TKD Shanghai ------------------------------ From: burdickd Date: Mon, 26 Apr 1999 07:27:55 -0500 (EST) Subject: the_dojang: Forms Someone wrote: (essentially a black belt) I learned Pal-gue forms and did standerd black belt forms as well (Koryo, etc) At the school I attended that offered 40 minute classes they utilized Tae-guk forms, which I am not familiar with except that they are very similar to lower level Okinawan forms (simple) .... are there three major forms systems and what organization utilizes each? Where did the Song-ahm forms coem from? My response: Yes, there are several forms systems. The P'algwae (aka Pal-gue, Pal-gay etc.) set is the older set from the W.T.F., and are based upon the Pyong-an set (korean for pinan, from Okinawan karate). Schools that teach the P'algwae forms often teach the WTF black belt forms (Koryo, Kumgang, etc.). The Tangsudo guys teach the pyong-an and chulgi sets (more often based on the Shotokan heian and tekki sets than on the Okinawan pinan and neihanchi sets). Gen. Choi's ITF teaches the Chang Hun set (Hwarang, etc.). The Modern WTF (Olympic schools) teach the t'aeguk set. The American Taekwondo assocation under Haeng Ung Lee teaches the Songnam set, which were designed in the 1980s and are based on a square. The Sangmukwan teaches the chung bong set. Choi Kwan do has a set of forms based on free sparring. Oh, and there are older versions of Koryo floating around, usually designated as Koryo A and Koryo B. My personal recommendations: The Chang Hun set is fairly challenging, the Songnam set has lots of high kicks and the design of the forms is excellent, the T'aeguk set is just too high for me (I can't stand walking stance), the Pyong-ans are the best for close combat if taught Okinawan style. The modern Koryo is probably my favorite Korean form -- it seems to me to be the easiest to find self-defense applications in. Your mileage may vary, Dakin Burdick burdickd@indiana.edu ------------------------------ From: Date: Mon, 26 Apr 1999 09:21:59 -500 Subject: the_dojang: Martial Arts - not "practical" enough? I've watched for years the debate on whether the trend in teaching martial arts should be more or less street-oriented - on the theory that being able to recite a code of ethics does lttle good in a true self-defense situation. A recent posting to this forum relit that issue in my mind. I agree that it is certainly quicker and more effective to teach "down and dirty" techniques. In some classes, such as a women's self-defense class, or a class to military, law enforcement, or other similarly "high-threat" groups, that's fine. These same folks also have, by the time they take our classes, developed their personal ethic and behavior. Some may want more philosophy, some less, and the market will provide schools to teach that. Kids are a different matter. First of all, when a kid starts "martial" training at age 5, 6, or so, there's a lot more time before we should be truly expecting them to have to defend themselves, so focusing on a broader definition of martial art is not necessarily a hindrance. Secondly, children are, by nature, savages. Civilized behavior is learned. As many of the NAPMA, EFC, and other similar group's publications attest, a martial arts instructor may spend more time with a child over the time of instruction than any other adult, including (in some cases) the parents. Do we truly want our children to learn that brute force with no ethics is an acceptable response? If we teach the ethics first and then build in the techniques, we'll probably get a better society as well as young adults who can protect themselves. Recent events continue to show us the risk to our society of failing to teach our children about the responsibility that comes with the power to hurt. MA schools need to be part of the solution. Just because the barbarians may have won the battles doesn't mean their system was best. Jaimie Orr Pak's Tang Soo Do of VA beach Dragon Connections ------------------------------ From: Date: Mon, 26 Apr 1999 09:02:47 -0700 (PDT) Subject: the_dojang: . ------------------------------ End of The_Dojang-Digest V6 #220 ******************************** Support the USTU by joining today! 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