From: the_dojang-owner@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com To: the_dojang-digest@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com Subject: The_Dojang-Digest V6 #251 Reply-To: the_dojang@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com Errors-To: the_dojang-owner@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com Precedence: The_Dojang-Digest Sun, 9 May 1999 Vol 06 : Num 251 In this issue: the_dojang: Re: Calling someone Master the_dojang: Re: Golf the_dojang: Re: Master Titles, Familiarity the_dojang: Ahzah! the_dojang: re: Female Ranks the_dojang: Re: Guest speakers for ChatRooms the_dojang: chopsticks the_dojang: Shamrock seminar the_dojang: Baby Do Boks. the_dojang: Master at the Bait Shop the_dojang: Re: Bag Holding! the_dojang: Re: golf & chopsticks the_dojang: Re: Bag-holding the_dojang: . ......................................................................... The_Dojang, serving the Internet since June 1994. ~730 members strong! Copyright 1994-99: Ray Terry, California Taekwondo, Martial Arts Resource Replying to this message will NOT unsubscribe you. To unsubscribe, send "unsubscribe the_dojang-digest" (no quotes) in the body of an e-mail (top line, left justified) addressed to majordomo@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com To send e-mail to this list use the_dojang@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com See the Korean Martial Arts (KMA) FAQ and online search the last two years worth of digest issues at http://www.MartialArtsResource.com Pil Seung! Ray Terry, PO Box 110841, Campbell, CA 95011 KMA@MartialArtsResource.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Date: Sun, 9 May 1999 10:50:52 EDT Subject: the_dojang: Re: Calling someone Master << My instructor now detests being called Master or even Mr. "Lastname Here". He likes a respectful, friendly environment in school and asks students to call him by his first name. All adults that is. Junior students still refer to him as Mr. "Lastname Here". He figures it is a good thing for children...but that as adults, we are all equal and titles with friends are not needed. What do you folks think? >> In our ATA school we refer to everyone as Maam or Sir.. even the youngest of students. If we need to use names, generally with the adults we use Mr/Mrs/Ms followed by their last name. With the kids we normally use their first names, except for the junior black belts. Nothing wrong with adults and kids showing proper respect, regardless of age. I sometimes refer to a 6 year old as Sir... but that's me.. I'm used to it :O) Happy Mother's Day to all you Mom'out there!! Joe ------------------------------ From: "Jamaica Power" Date: Sun, 09 May 1999 07:57:12 PDT Subject: the_dojang: Re: Golf >>>Jamaica, I'm thinking it could prove useful. Around here they have the Korean Golf Assoc. Since most dojangs I know are closed on Sun. that leaves the day fortee time and then tea time. [Sorry, its late and I get silly] Do you know how to play? Dawne>>>>>>>>> That's okay, I'll be silly back at you. Well rumour has it (smile) that the criteria for picking tournament sites is the type of "Golf Courses," that are availalable not the tournament site itself. Oops...hahah..there I did it again. 50 letters from GM's across the world calling me on that one! Well next time you say why did they pick "that city" to have a tournament, check out the golf courses. And do I play.. sure. Just don't ask me how good I am?!! Yes I was out on the golf courses after some tournaments. Notice I didn't say during the tournaments. Hmmm and I have shined a few golf clubs in my day, been a caddie on a few golf courses (my motivation for learning how to play golf). jamaica _______________________________________________________________ Get Free Email and Do More On The Web. Visit http://www.msn.com ------------------------------ From: "Jamaica Power" Date: Sun, 09 May 1999 08:04:00 PDT Subject: the_dojang: Re: Master Titles, Familiarity >>>>I used to have a Master instructor that was quite caught up in being >>>>called "Master"...whether one was in school or out. This went a little >>>>beyond this...but we'll just stick withe the Master stuff...>> ============================================== I knew a couple master instructors that brought their lay person credentials with them and insisted being called, "Doctor so and so instead of Master or Mister, say if they had a Ph.D. etc. They professed it to be an endearing title but it really was an ego thing. jamaica _______________________________________________________________ Get Free Email and Do More On The Web. Visit http://www.msn.com ------------------------------ From: "Jamaica Power" Date: Sun, 09 May 1999 08:04:51 PDT Subject: the_dojang: Ahzah! Anybody own the Ahzah Karate Master Board Game? Like it? jamaica _______________________________________________________________ Get Free Email and Do More On The Web. Visit http://www.msn.com ------------------------------ From: "Laura Kamienski" Date: Sun, 9 May 1999 11:24:55 -0400 Subject: the_dojang: re: Female Ranks There are two 3rd degree women in my dojang. There is at least one woman holding a fifth degree black belt (she may be 6th by now) and several 4th degrees in my system. (Chin Mu Kwan TKD) Laura lkamiens@ptd.net lkamnski@bucknell.edu http://www.students.bucknell.edu/lkamnski http://home.switchboard.com/LKamienski ____________________________________________________ "The destination is not the purpose of a journey; death is not the purpose of life." -Thich Nhat Hanh ____________________________________________________ ------------------------------ From: "Jamaica Power" Date: Sun, 09 May 1999 08:24:34 PDT Subject: the_dojang: Re: Guest speakers for ChatRooms This is a followup to my request about your feelings on M.A. chatrooms. Ray Terry mentioned that getting a guest speaker works quite well. Within your style/organization who do you think would a good guest speaker or someone you'd like to chat with and why? Thanks jamaica_power@hotmail.com _______________________________________________________________ Get Free Email and Do More On The Web. Visit http://www.msn.com ------------------------------ From: Date: Sun, 9 May 1999 11:54:06 EDT Subject: the_dojang: chopsticks In a message dated 99-05-09 10:06:39 EDT, you write: << BTW, I have never seen any metal ones as mentioned in a previous post. Pil Seung, Stan Wojcoski >> Hey Stan, You are correct, the wooden ones are easier, but with a little practice you can use the others as well. The metal ones are Korean, and you will not find them in Japan and other countries. The ones you bought sound Japanese. When I lived in Japan, I asked them about metal chopsticks and they said no, and were surprised when I told them there were metal chopsticks in Korea. I was pretty good with chopsticks before I went to Korea the first time in 88, but that's when I first tried the metal one. That was a change, they are harder to use. But then I got where I could use them and the wooden ones are even easier. I have metal ones here at the house that I bought in Korea, but I have not seen them anywhere else. They do use the wooden ones in Korea too, but many places have the metal ones. Alain ------------------------------ From: Date: Sun, 9 May 1999 12:23:07 -0700 (PDT) Subject: the_dojang: Shamrock seminar FYI... Rated by many as the #1 NHB fighter under 200 lbs. Ray - ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Frank Shamrock Seminar Take advantage of this rare opportunity to train with the world's most complete fighter and the best mixed martial artist of all time. Frank Shamrock is offering one of his world famous seminars at his new school in San Jose. The seminar will be held at 1830 Hillsdale Avenue (across from 24 Hour Fitness). Date: Saturday, May 22 12:00 p.m. - 5:00 p.m. Location: 1830 Hillsdale Ave San Jose, Ca Cost: $79.00 Pre-Registration $99.00 At the door Learn the techniques that have made Frank an unstoppable world champion and allowed him to defeat an Olympic gold medallist in 14 seconds! Learn the most effective techniques of submission wrestling. Study takedowns and throws. Practice arm locks and leg locks. And learn effective conditioning drills. Space is limited, so don't delay. Reserve your place today by calling 408-245-6310. Or, send your check for $79.00 payable to Mr. Frank Shamrock to: Frank Shamrock USA 1669-2 Hollenbeck Ave. Suite 205 Sunnyvale, CA 94087 ------------------------------ From: John Hancock <4karate@bellsouth.net> Date: Sun, 09 May 1999 14:19:50 -0500 Subject: the_dojang: Baby Do Boks. Baby Do Boks. Folks...these thinks have been around for years. Almost every major wholesaler at one time or another has offered them. Century sold them for a while. It is a gimmick thing...so it comes and goes. Seems to show up around "Mothers Day" every so many years. The reason these things aren't well know is...because those few that are bought are not all that comfortable for the baby (ya got to remember....cotton canvas isn't exactly soft outa the box). Personally.......I don't get it. I guess it may seem 'cute' to lots of folks. I'm sort of ambivalent. I guess I have just seen it too many times now....and the novelty has worn off so it isn't as cute as it used to be. Anyway...contact Tiger Claw or Century Martial Arts.....I'm sure they could probably fit your toddler with a do bok. (I recommend you wash it several times first though...like I said...lots of babies don't find them all that comfortable).....and remember...when you buy one of these things.....keep in mind you need DIAPER room in the pants. ------------------------------ From: John Hancock <4karate@bellsouth.net> Date: Sun, 09 May 1999 15:07:49 -0500 Subject: the_dojang: Master at the Bait Shop Well...here we go again with the Master thread. I think everybody who finally gets the rank goes through a period of using the title. Today...sometimes I use it....sometimes I don't....mostly.....I just don't care one way or the other. I'm sort of fond of the title my Sword Master uses : Son Saeng Nim. Translation: simply means 'teacher'. As for my current feelings on usage of titles? Well....all jabs aside (MAC & RAY) I' know I've sort of made a name for myself for using some outlandish titles attached to my postings in the past. Mostly this has been tongue in cheek and with sarcasm. SO...I guess you'd have to say...mostly I don't see the title as being all that important. However, I do have a deep respect for MILITARY leadership development...and respect of titles is one aspect of that. I insist that students in the school refer to me by title or as MR. Never are they to speak to me in the familiar (i.e. first name) when in the school. I do tell them on the street they do not have to call me MASTER outside the Dojang (as a matter of fact...I'm not too KEEN on it inside the Dojang either....I prefer Son Saeng Nim or Sabomnim). I do expect them to refer to me as MR. Hancock though....unless we have developed some familiarity. BUt here is where it gets tricky. I am not against students being my friends....but I do know the danger of being friends with my students. As a leader...I am responsible to and for them to a degree. As such...much like a military commander....I must have the faith they will carry out my directives...even if sometimes they don't like that directive. Too much familiarity can make for trouble in that area. It is a delicate juggling act between care and responsibility. This is even more of a problem if you are romantically involved with someone you are teaching....which is a whole other Pandora's box. I do insist all children and youths refer to me as Mr. Hancock....in or out of the dojang. They have more respect for my teaching where there is a limit to the familiarity allowed. This is very important to the role and their learning process. I don't mind doing things with my students outside the Dojang...but even so....I limit the degree to which I am willing to become familiar. My friends are truely few and far between. I mean MY REAL FRIENDS. I have many, many acquaintances...and many people I will call friend because of a certain level of familiarity has developed between us over time. BUT my deepest friends...those who I let all the way in...are very, very few....and for good reason. It is too bad their isn't a word in our language for those in between being acquaintances and deep friends. I think this would sole some of the delimna in determining where certain people fall. I do ask that all my students refer to me as Mr. Hancock in or out of the school...even adults. I will refer to my students in a similar manner. This helps to insure there is a degree of definition to our relationships. In the military...they talk about Fraternization. Officers are not to fraternize with the enlisted...and NCO are not to fraternize with the privates. There is a purpose to this. This allows for the emotions to be seperated out of the orders that must be given and must be followed. This is not a bad thing. It can be a lonely thing.....but....it is negotiable. I have had many senior NCO's and some Officers I have had a high regard for who I also had a measure of familiarity with. But....we weren't "friends" as I consider it. I did know I could go to them with a problem and I could trust them and their advice. They knew that if they needed my support they could call on me for action or input. I guess the one thing that doesn't exist in these relationships (and it rightly should not) is intimacy. This is hard to describe...but you have a level of intimacy with a close friend that is never allowed in these military type relationships. I think that is a good thing...and worth emulating in our schools. Be a teacher first....a friend second. The priority of your relationship is to TEACH the individual. That is why they came to you. So remember that always. The problem is when a friend or lover decides they want to learn martial arts from you. These are folks who you had a relationship with before they came to you be a student. OK...whole new ball game here. Your role as teacher can kill the friendship...IF....and remember, this is IF.....if THEY cannot adapt to your new role. The best thing to do is have a sit down talk with them about this prior to beginning. Lay out the relationship between you as it stands now...before you get started...and the responsibility you have in this newer role as their teacher. Decide if it is worth the risk of damaging the friendship before you start. If you decide to do it, that is teach a friend or lover, then take the time to go over the rules of etiquette and the importance they have to development. Help the friend or lover to see that by helping you in being able to put your friendship or love on a shelf during training....it helps the other students as well (cause it doesn't confuse them why so-n-so gets away with talking to the teacher like that but we can't). Be patient with them as they adjust to the new usages of language....and lead by example......ALWAYS refer to them as MR. or MS. and LAST NAME ONLY during any class or Dojang related event. If you can do this...pretty soon...it will become second nature...a natural seperation of your relationships and roles will develp which will help protect each from being damaged incidentally by the other......and the other students will come to accept each of you as being in dual roles with one another and won't question the relationship, its affect on the school and on them as co-students. I don't know if I have done a very good job here of explaining myself. I have a back ache...I'm hungry, I need a shower, its hot in here and it has been so long since my last date animal husbandtry is starting to look good (lol), but hopefully something has come out of my ramblings that makes some sense. John Hancock, (insert title here) the_dojang-owner@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com wrote: > The_Dojang-Digest Sun, 9 May 1999 Vol 06 : Num 250 > > In this issue: [300 lines deleted. I can think of a good title for you about now... :) ] ------------------------------ From: Paul Rogers Date: Sun, 09 May 1999 15:33:23 -0500 Subject: the_dojang: Re: Bag Holding! >>> Jamaica wrote: I would like to know how different schools have their students hold the bags for kicks and punches. Meaning when you have students hold bags/paddles do you have them lock their stance so the bagholder does not move backward if someone is doing a back spinning kick with a cannon ball effect or a side kick. <<< In our classes, it can be both: for accuracy, handheld pads are placed on the back of folks' hands (so there's no hyper-extension on a good kick). Other times, a larger bag is placed on the hip or side, and folks whale away. Another variation is to hold (or not) a hanging bag for various kicks. We don't use paddles in our school. Paul Rogers, Round Rock, TX (ATA) ------------------------------ From: "Darlene" Date: Sun, 9 May 1999 13:52:24 -0700 Subject: the_dojang: Re: golf & chopsticks My TKD Master plays golf and occasionally uses golf analogies. It's been helpful for me to have been on the links a few times myself (although not with him) to understand him comparisons. When I was in college -- a long time ago ;-) -- I had a Japanese roommate and two of our good friends were from Malaysia. We would get together over a frypan full of food, and if you couldn't use chopsticks, you didn't eat! Fortunately for me, I learned when I was still a young pre-teen. (even a longer time ago) I think that having an awareness of how to do different tasks and making the effort to learn something new makes you a better person. It encourages new synapses in the brain and makes you a more interesting person to be around. ...Another reason why I started TKD! Darlene 2nd kup Port Hadlock, WA ------------------------------ From: "Darlene" Date: Sun, 9 May 1999 14:04:01 -0700 Subject: the_dojang: Re: Bag-holding In our school, we have a variety of ways in which we practice techniques with bags and focus pads. For bags, we do line drills where we all practice a similar kicking or punching skill, with higher belts practicing extended versions of the same skill (lower belts practice roundhouse; higher belts practice jumping roundhouse/spinning roundhouse, etc.) We also occasionally have round-robin "centers" where students in pairs practice a particular skill at each center, and everyone rotates every five minutes, so that each pair gets time on the bag. For focus pads, we get together in pairs, facing each other, and take turns holding the pads for our partner. Students are paired with similar age-belt-size partners and practice techniques appropriate for their level. The TKD Master shows everyone the skill and how to hold the pad, then helps students during the drill time. After so many kicks or so many minutes, He'll stop us and give us a new kick or other technique to practice. Sometimes the drills are static (standing in one place), sometimes they are "chasing" drills--where we "chase" our partner across the floor kicking while we move forward &/or backward. I have found these very helpful for honing certain aspects of my technique, because the Master visits each of us during these drills and offers suggestions for improvement. It's a very personalized way of getting help, also because we also observe and help each other. Darlene 2nd kup Port Hadlock, WA ------------------------------ From: Date: Sun, 9 May 1999 14:30:40 -0700 (PDT) Subject: the_dojang: . ------------------------------ End of The_Dojang-Digest V6 #251 ******************************** Support the USTU by joining today! US Taekwondo Union, 1 Olympic Plaza, Ste 405, Colorado Spgs, CO 80909 719-578-4632 FAX 719-578-4642 ustutkd1@aol.com http://www.ustu.com --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe from this digest, the_dojang-digest, send the command: unsubscribe the_dojang-digest -or- unsubscribe the_dojang-digest your.old@address in the BODY of email (top line, left justified) addressed to majordomo@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com. Old digest issues are available via ftp://ftp.martialartsresource.com, in pub/the_dojang/digests. All digest files have the suffix '.txt' Copyright 1994-99: Ray Terry, Martial Arts Resource, California Taekwondo Standard disclaimers apply.