From: the_dojang-owner@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com To: the_dojang-digest@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com Subject: The_Dojang-Digest V6 #433 Reply-To: the_dojang@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com Errors-To: the_dojang-owner@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com Precedence: The_Dojang-Digest Tues, 31 Aug 1999 Vol 06 : Num 433 In this issue: the_dojang: Re: The_Dojang-Digest V6 #432 the_dojang: RE: Physics the_dojang: Re: Injuries in MA/Stan Lim/Ray Terry the_dojang: Re: Injuries in MA/Stan Lim the_dojang: Re: The_Dojang-Digest V6 #432 the_dojang: Re: The_Dojang-Digest V6 #428 the_dojang: Re: Unsure of what to do Re: the_dojang: Re: Unsure of what to do the_dojang: Re: V6 #423: Tae Bee the_dojang: Re: V6 #424: Chil Sun Hyung the_dojang: Knife form, TSD? (fwd) the_dojang: . ========================================================================= The_Dojang, serving the Internet since June 1994. ~750 members strong! Copyright 1994-99: Ray Terry, California Taekwondo, Martial Arts Resource Replying to this message will NOT unsubscribe you. To unsubscribe, send "unsubscribe the_dojang-digest" (no quotes) in the body (top line, left justified) of a plain text e-mail addressed to majordomo@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com. To send e-mail to this list use the_dojang@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com See the Korean Martial Arts (KMA) FAQ and online search the last four years worth of digest issues at http://www.MartialArtsResource.com Pil Seung! Ray Terry, PO Box 110841, Campbell, CA 95011 KMA@MartialArtsResource.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Brett Erwin Date: Tue, 31 Aug 1999 09:52:53 -0500 Subject: the_dojang: Re: The_Dojang-Digest V6 #432 >> Surprises me. No disrespect, but in the ATA, and no student is 'allowed' to >> spar without the direct supervision of an instructor. >??? Students aren't allowed to workout on their own, with their friends? >Seems like it would be difficult to stop... ATA, and probably any instructor who cares about their students, discourage children and inexperienced adults from sparring outside of the dojang or tournaments unless their instructor is present. It's not a rule, just a common sense recommendation. - -- Regards... ************************************************************ J. Brett Erwin Raytheon Systems Co. Phone: (972) 952-3738 Antenna/Nonmetallics Dept. Pager: (972) 598-3616 2501 W. University M/S 8019 Email: jberwin@raytheon.com McKinney, TX 75070 Fax: (972) 952-3700 ************************************************************ ------------------------------ From: Ken Ashworth Date: Tue, 31 Aug 1999 09:57:59 -0500 Subject: the_dojang: RE: Physics AJ Wrote: > =09No intent to flame here, but Force =3D Mass x Acceleration, not Mass > x Velocity^2. Force _is_ proportional to M x V^2 in rotational motion, but > care must be taken to properly define the system. (Actually, force is the > time rate of change of momentum, but the mass of an isolated system during > the course of a technique does not change so the term with the derivative > (sp?) of mass with respect to time is zero and all that's left is a term > with mass times acceleration.) Acceleration is the rate of change of > velocity with respect to time. > > > =09=09=09=09=09-Keep kickin' > =09=09=09=09=09 -G > > > \ > I don't mystify MA. I can break a board because of physics (Force = > =3D > > Mass \ X Velocity(Sq)). \ > If my fist is conditioned to the force >Yes, in fact it is E(kinetic) = mv^2 rather than force. Me: You are right. Force = mass x accelleration. Accelleration is the rate of change of velocity. What I was getting at and what makes sense for MA is the kinetic energy of an object is increased more by the velocity than by the mass. If I increase the mass of my fist it is proportional to the increase in energy applied in the punch, If I increase the acceleration, the kinetic energy is proportional to the square of the velocity. This is what we have all learned in the dojang. Better to be lighter and fast than heavy and slow. Thanks for the discussion. Ken ------------------------------ From: "Lasich, Mark D." Date: Tue, 31 Aug 1999 11:38:28 -0400 Subject: the_dojang: Re: Injuries in MA/Stan Lim/Ray Terry >>>??? Students aren't allowed to workout on their own, with their friends? >>>Seems like it would be difficult to stop... Ray, you are correct. I guess I should have qualified that these are "in-school" restrictions. Actions outside the dojang are undertaken with the responsibility of the consequences of those actions! Suffice it to say that having an instructor present in the dojang doesn't solve *everything* either ;-) In the spirit of TKD......... Mark.Lasich@alcoa.com ------------------------------ From: "Alexander, Stephen (Nexfor)" Date: Tue, 31 Aug 1999 11:31:01 -0400 Subject: the_dojang: Re: Injuries in MA/Stan Lim Mark wrote: >> Surprises me. No disrespect, but in the ATA, and no student is 'allowed' to spar without the direct supervision of an instructor. << Then.... Ray wrote: >>??? Students aren't allowed to workout on their own, with their friends? Seems like it would be difficult to stop...<< Now I write.... Yes Ray, I agree, but I think what Mark was saying is that while in a club atmosphere, which is where Stan received at least two of his injuries, there seemed to be a lack of controls. As far as the tournament injury, as Hunter S Thompson would say, "you pay your money, you take the ride" ;> Steve Alexander Student of the Martial Arts. War never decides who is right, only who is left. ------------------------------ From: d g Date: Tue, 31 Aug 1999 09:06:42 -0700 Subject: the_dojang: Re: The_Dojang-Digest V6 #432 the_dojang-owner@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com wrote: > From: dbuehrer@denver.carl.org > Date: Tue, 31 Aug 1999 07:58:12 -0700 > Subject: the_dojang: Re: Unsure of what to do > Jim Wrote: \ Here's my situation. Currently, I am training with an instructor who \ believes that the emotional development of a person is just as or even more \ important than the physical development in the martial arts. I recently had \ a talk with him and he explained that he feels that I am too competitive and \ carry myself with too much ego. I do concede that ego and competitiveness \ are traits of mine and I am working to be more humble and to be more okay \ with losing. David wrote: >Here's some advice that might help. Don't focus on winning. Focus on >doing your best. If the other guy wins, but you did your best, then you >achieved your goal. Jim, I sure would like to meet up with your instructor because I agree with him and David. In competition I consider everyone a winner. As long as you have done your best there is no losers. That is the way I feel in my tournaments. I do not care. I am too old to care. I know I have done my best and that is what counts. Ego and overcompetiveness I really do not care for in a person. I have met too many who are and I do not like them. In the race to be the best, they hurt ppl who r with them. Donna - -- NO!! My cycle doesn't leak! It marks it's territory. ------------------------------ From: TKDSCRIBE@aol.com Date: Tue, 31 Aug 1999 12:47:51 EDT Subject: the_dojang: Re: The_Dojang-Digest V6 #428 In a message dated 8/29/99 7:46:17 PM Pacific Daylight Time, the_dojang-owner@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com writes: << << My advice: tell her to: 1. consider herself lucky (to have been hurt only once) and, 2. "get over it." Good luck. SESilz >> IYHO are broken bones the norm in training? Lorraine >> Dear Lorraine and friends of the MAs, It is hard to say broken bones are "the norm." That would mean that if you failed to sustain a fracture you were not normal, which is just not so. Nevertheless, it is not terribly uncommon for it to happen. In eleven years of running my own dojang in San Diego, I had many more of my students, particularly kids, turn-up quite badly injured from playing soccer, football, skateboarding and roller-blading, than taekwondo. ...But some boo boos occurred in the dojang as well. Basically, I think, if you play hard you run the risk of getting hurt. Swimming is supposed to be very safe yet my sister smacked her head on the edge of the pool requiring sutures. Go figure? In the final analysis, I'd like to suggest that one should accept the fact that there are risks in anything; even by sitting home on the couch all day one runs the increased risk of having a stroke or heart-attack. So don't worry about it and do as you wish. Remember what some smart dude said: "A coward dies a thousand times; a brave man tastes of death but once," or something like that. Sincerely, SESilz ------------------------------ From: "Jim Nakashima" Date: Tue, 31 Aug 1999 09:58:35 -0700 Subject: the_dojang: Re: Unsure of what to do Hi Everyone, To answer Paul Rogers question, it isn't an ATA school although we used to be a part of the ATA. We still do the Songahm patterns but the curriculum is quite different from the ATA as we learn Hapkido as well as other things along with the TKD. I understand what some of you are getting at, it's the journey not the destination. I guess I do look too much into the future. For a variety of reasons I find it very discouraging to see others who are not as physically ready for new material moving on while I don't. I know it's important to learn the basic material really well, I've been training for the last 3 years and with this school for the last year and I am currently a yellow belt at this school. It was hard to go back to white belt last year but I did because I did really want to learn the material correctly and work on the basics. I think I've persevered a lot through the basic material and although I know I am a far ways away from perfecting it, it does become quite boring. New material will help keep my training fresh and my interest level high as well as help me to improve my basic material. I know I can keep growing just going over the same material I just feel I can grow more with new material. What do you all think? Thanks for your time everyone, Jim ------------------------------ From: Ray Terry Date: Tue, 31 Aug 1999 10:19:59 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Re: the_dojang: Re: Unsure of what to do > To answer Paul Rogers question, it isn't an ATA school although we used to > be a part of the ATA. We still do the Songahm patterns .... Ahhh... I thought that was illegal.?. :) Ray Terry raymail@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com ------------------------------ From: samiller@Bix.Com Date: Tue, 31 Aug 1999 13:11:10 -0400 (EDT) Subject: the_dojang: Re: V6 #423: Tae Bee Danny Abramovitch wrote: >Point your browsers to: > > http://www.mercurycenter.com/columnists/barry/docs/db082299.htm > >and prepare for the new fitness craze, Tae-Bee. ROFL. Thanks. === Tang Soo! Scott ------------------------------ From: samiller@Bix.Com Date: Tue, 31 Aug 1999 13:11:14 -0400 (EDT) Subject: the_dojang: Re: V6 #424: Chil Sun Hyung Tom Marker inquired: >Does anyone practice these forms? The movements look very non-standard, >and as far as I can tell from the pictures, they appear to be slow t'ai chi >like moves... Am I correct in this assumption? We do the Chil Sun hyung at our school. I practice Chil Sun Il Ro Hyung and E Ro Hyung, am about to learn Sam Ro Hyung. As for your interpretation, we practice various techniques in these forms at different speeds. For example, the first, and second techniques in Chil Sun Il Ro Hyung are so-called power moves, and are expected to be done with isometric exertion and concentration. We are told that our entire bodies should be tensed to the point of shaking during these moves (but we are to relax after the techniques is complete and "held"). This requires that they be performed slowly. Other moves in the Chil Sun series, such as center punches and knife-hand defenses, reinforced blocks, kicks, etc., are done at "normal" speed. === Tang Soo! Scott ------------------------------ From: Ray Terry Date: Tue, 31 Aug 1999 10:24:39 -0700 (PDT) Subject: the_dojang: Knife form, TSD? (fwd) Forwarding David's reply. Ray Terry rterry@best.com - ------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Tue, 31 Aug 1999 11:04:37 -0400 From: "Hacker, David" Subject: Knife form, TSD? To: "'rterry@best.com'" Sorry, still haven't figured out how to reply in the normal group mode. Sounds like "Dahn Do Hyung Sho", as taught by International Tang Soo Do Association Grand Master Seo. He also is coming out with a series of (albeit expensive) Tang Soo Do Manuals. I picked up the first one as some of the form variations my instructor uses comes from Grand Master Seo. At any rate I hope this helps, replying from my work e-mail, replies to me can be sent to catmage@mindspring.com Dave Hacker Cho Dan Tang Soo Do - ------------------------------------------------- From: Ray Terry Date: Fri, 27 Aug 1999 00:18:28 -0700 (PDT) Subject: the_dojang: Knife form, TSD? The following is the first third or half of a knife form that was/is taught/practiced by an older Moo Duk Kwan grandmaster. Does it look familar to anyone? Know from whence it came? Ray Terry rterry@best.com 1. Start with feet shoulder width apart, hands at side. Knife is at left hip, in sheath, edge upwards. 2. Grasp knife with right hand, palm up. Step forward with right foot into back stance, slashing horizontally left-to-right, forearm parallel to the ground. (Essentially, this is an adaptation of and outside middle defense.) Hand finishes directly in front of body. 3. Step forward with left foot into a left front stance, slashing horizontally right-to-left, at neck height, palm down. Hand finishes directly in front of left shoulder. 4. Step forward with right foot into a right front stance, while circling hand down by right hip, and then over the top with a downward stabbing "ice-pick attack" motion. Hand finishes directly in front of body, forearm parallel to ground, elbow near solar plexus. etc... David A. Hacker David A. Hacker Bechtel 9801 Washingtonian Blvd. 5th Floor Gaithersburg, MD 20878-5356 (301)721-1007 (301)212-2567 Fax.. Hacker, David@nasd.com ------------------------------ From: Ray Terry Date: Tue, 31 Aug 1999 10:35:39 -0700 (PDT) Subject: the_dojang: . ------------------------------ End of The_Dojang-Digest V6 #433 ******************************** Support the USTU by joining today! US Taekwondo Union, 1 Olympic Plaza, Ste 405, Colorado Spgs, CO 80909 719-578-4632 FAX 719-578-4642 ustutkd1@aol.com http://www.ustu.com ===================================================================== To unsubscribe from this digest, the_dojang-digest, send the command: unsubscribe the_dojang-digest -or- unsubscribe the_dojang-digest your.old@address in the BODY of an email (top line, left justified) addressed to majordomo@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com. Old digest issues are available via ftp://ftp.martialartsresource.com in pub/the_dojang/digests. All digest files have the suffix '.txt' Copyright 1994-99: Ray Terry, Martial Arts Resource, California Taekwondo Standard disclaimers apply.