From: the_dojang-owner@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com To: the_dojang-digest@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com Subject: The_Dojang-Digest V6 #578 Reply-To: the_dojang@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com Errors-To: the_dojang-owner@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com Precedence: The_Dojang-Digest Wed, 1 Dec 1999 Vol 06 : Num 578 In this issue: the_dojang: Welcome back the_dojang: Upcoming seminars in the Chicagoland area the_dojang: Re: The_Dojang-Digest V6 #577 the_dojang: Clearing Away Clouds the_dojang: Taekkyon the_dojang: budo, mudo, musul, jujitsu, woshu, and muye the_dojang: 1965 Hapkido article the_dojang: Re: The_Dojang-Digest V6 #577 the_dojang: Re: The_Dojang-Digest V6 #577 the_dojang: . ========================================================================= The_Dojang, serving the Internet since June 1994. ~710 members strong! Copyright 1994-99: Ray Terry, California Taekwondo, Martial Arts Resource Replying to this message will NOT unsubscribe you. To unsubscribe, send "unsubscribe the_dojang-digest" (no quotes) in the body (top line, left justified) of a plain text e-mail addressed to majordomo@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com. To send e-mail to this list use the_dojang@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com See the Korean Martial Arts (KMA) FAQ and online search the last four years worth of digest issues at http://www.MartialArtsResource.com Pil Seung! Ray Terry, PO Box 110841, Campbell, CA 95011 KMA@MartialArtsResource.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------- From: JEREMYT@ATFI.COM (JeremyT) Date: Wed, 1 Dec 1999 16:49:30 -0600 Subject: the_dojang: Welcome back Hope you had a good holiday. I wanted to let people know of my new (extremely rough draft) website. http://on.to/martialarts (there is no .com). Take care and glad to see the site up and running again. Jeremy MACS ------------------------------ From: JEREMYT@ATFI.COM (JeremyT) Date: Wed, 1 Dec 1999 16:51:07 -0600 Subject: the_dojang: Upcoming seminars in the Chicagoland area I wanted to remind those who are in the Chicagoland area or nearby about the two seminars this weekend. Saturday Dec. 4th, Felix Vasquez of Circle Of One - Nin-Jutsu will be conducting a 4 hour seminar on Koga-ryu ninjitsu from 9am-3pm CST at the Amercian Martial Arts school in Westmont, Illinois. Investment is $55.00 for the day. Below are some of his accomplishments: - Enforcement Protective Services Inc. (E.P.S.) - CEO - Private Investigator, Fugitive Recoveries Agent - Celebrity Martial Artist & Senior Intrl. Weapons Champion - International Hall of Fame Inductee (Nin-Jutsu) - World-wide Defensive Tactics Instructor - ABC Wide World Of Sports & International Martial Arts Choreographer Contact me at JeremyT@atfi.com if you need more information. Sunday Dec. 5th, Martial Arts Collective Society will be holding its Local Gathering from 12:00pm-4:00pm CST. Investment is $15.00 for non-MACS members and free for members. We will have instructors teaching in the arts of Hapkido, Kajukenbo, Kosho Shorei Ryu Kempo, Jidokwan Taekwondo, Arnis and much more. Those interested, please contact me at forementioned email. Jeremy MACS ------------------------------ From: TKDSCRIBE@aol.com Date: Wed, 1 Dec 1999 18:28:15 EST Subject: the_dojang: Re: The_Dojang-Digest V6 #577 Just a brief note to thank those who supported my run at the USTU vice presidency. And another thank you to those who even gave me their consideration. I am very pleased to have my good friend and long time USTU supporter Grandmaster Jerome Reitenbach in this office, and I will do my best, as always, to assist him should he ask. Thanks again, Y'all, SESilz ------------------------------ From: Ray Terry Date: Wed, 1 Dec 1999 16:21:05 -0800 (PST) Subject: the_dojang: Clearing Away Clouds On the plane flight back from Ohio today I finally read Stephen Fabian's book Clearing Away Clouds: Nine Lessons for Life from the Martial Arts. It had been recommended to me a few months back, I picked it up but then it sat in my 'to read' stack until the trip to Ohio. Imagine my surprise, Fabian was a student under the same TKD instructor that I was -and- at the same time! He was at our branch dojang in Champaign, Illinois, while I was at the 'home' dojang in Bloomington, IL. The various branches only got together once a year, if that, for sparring competition, so unfortunately I don't remember the author. Fabian talks a lot about the lessons we both learned at the same time (late '70s & early '80s) from Master NK Hyong. Master Hyong was my first TKD and Hapkido instructor, although I had previously studied TSD and Judo. It was surprising that Fabian, like me, also had previous martial arts training before studying under Master Hyong at the University of Illinois. I was leaving the U of I at about the time he arrived there, but I only moved 50 miles down the road to work at Illinois State University in Bloomington, where I first met Master Hyong. Fabian's lessons relate to far more than just martial arts. The lessons are: Embrace a Way, Accept Responsibility for Your Actions, Control the Breath, Focus, Develop Self-Discipline, Train Hard - Seeking Aesthetic Refinement, Be Patient and Flow, Persevere, Cultivate the Mind of No-Mind. Portions of a couple of the lessons... 'By "letting it happen", as Master Hyong so frequently advised us, we are not so much in a rush to get to our objective that we make things harder for ourselves getting there. ... Rushing headlong toward mastery will keep you far from it, like grasping for something in water, only to send it further away... Paradoxically, attempts at self-mastery of the Way actually requires a diminishing of ego. As we strive to develop our self, we in fact must diminish self-importance. ...' Important lessons in life. Ray Terry rterry@best.com ------------------------------ From: Andrew Pratt Date: Thu, 02 Dec 1999 10:51:09 +0900 Subject: the_dojang: Taekkyon Dear Michael, _________ << Small point, but the action here is not just presumed to be Taekkyon. It is specifically identified as such in the caption on the painting. The spelling is "Takkyon," where the /a/ sounds like /o/ in "rock." This was a common pronunciation in mid/late Choson. This pronunciation also had Chinese characters associated with it, though the characters have only been found in one history book. Michael P. >> I did not realize that the painting was attributed that way. I thought it was just titled 'farmer's games' or similar. I am also a little surprised to hear that Chinese characters have been discovered for Taekkyon. This must be fairly recent because all the books and articles I have read have all said that there are no Chinese characters. The earliest text I read about was a 1798, reference by Yi SOng-ji in his book, 'Chaemulbo.' In this book, Taekkyon is spelt in Hangul. The reference links Taekkyon to Subak (quite probably spuriously, but that is a different argument). Subak is in Chinese characters, as is most of the rest of the sentence. It is possible that Yi did not know the Chinese characters for Taekkyon (presuming they exist), but the simpler and possibly more logical explanation is that there are no Chinese characters for Taekkyon. Can you name the source for my future reference thanks. Yours, Andrew ------------------------------ From: Andrew Pratt Date: Thu, 02 Dec 1999 10:52:03 +0900 Subject: the_dojang: budo, mudo, musul, jujitsu, woshu, and muye Dear Anthony, Thanks for the comments. You wrote, in part: >> a conversation with an english speaker during the required feast afterwards. He was able to explain to me that the Koreans prefer to focus on muye rather than mudo. He phrased it as the Chinese following musool or "warrior techniques", the Japanese following mudo (budo) or "warrior ways" and the Koreans as following muye or "warrior manners."Does this help or hinder? << This may be sort of right. But, as far as I can remember, the 'mu' relates more to 'military fighting' rather than 'warriors' per se. It is certainly true that 'musul' in Chinese is 'wushu' and is used to describe martial arts. Though I can not prove this at the moment, I have the suspicion that this is a recent term and may have the same source (i.e. Japan) as mudo. The 'sul' of 'musul' is pronounced Jitsu (or Jutsu depending on Romanisation) and was commonly used during the pre-modern period to describe martial arts (bu-jitsu may have also been in use, but I am not sure about this). However, it is the 'muye' that I really wanted to talk about. The 'ye' in 'muye' actually refers to art, as in the sense of high art (paintings, writing, etc). The 'ye' referred to by Anthony's informant is another Chinese character. (Will it be controversial if I say that Korean education of Chinese characters is not what it used to be and that this type of mistake is common when one reads ancient texts written in Chinese translated into Korean with no Chinese ideographs for such obscure (or even common) words??? ;-). I expect to find this term in Chinese period works, but I have yet to translate any yet (I am still working on Korean texts at the moment). The term may come from the earliest interpretations of Confucianism and what makes a sage man. The qualities necessary included archery and horse riding. Both of these were seen as an expression of military prowess. I don't think other weapons counted, being considered too brutish(?). From the earliest mural paintings, we know that archery was important in Korean society from the earliest times and it should come as no surprise to find that even during the Choson period archery was considered a useful pursuit of the yangban 'literary' class. Thus the 'military' archery became 'artistic.' Perhaps Kyodo in Japan is similar in this respect with it's emphasis on the form of the draw over the military aspects (which would be rapid firing and hitting the target!). Hope that made things a little clearer. Yours, Andrew p.s. I have written this without access to my Chinese dictionaries and histories so any errors are all mine. ------------------------------ From: Andrew Pratt Date: Thu, 02 Dec 1999 10:53:17 +0900 Subject: the_dojang: 1965 Hapkido article Dear Ray, >> Interesting old/short article on Hapkido, http://www.blackbeltmag.com/searchdb/bbm/1965/August/6.html << Good find, interesting article. If find it intriguing that Sea Oh Choi seems to prefer to call Choi Yong Sool 'Tatujutu Yoshida' even though it is 1965 America. I hope you had a good holiday. Yours, Andrew ------------------------------ From: d g Date: Wed, 01 Dec 1999 20:37:51 -0800 Subject: the_dojang: Re: The_Dojang-Digest V6 #577 > From: Ray Terry > Date: Wed, 1 Dec 1999 13:54:00 -0800 (PST) > Subject: the_dojang: lists back up! > > The lists are back up. > > Yep, I'm back from Ohio. Had a good time being away from California, seeing > family, doing some college recruiting for Hewlett-Packard, and teaching > a couple of small Hapkido seminars. Oh Sure. Give a seminar down there and not come up here for one. :) We missed u Ray. Welcome back. Alain's video is out. I already received it. I like the video. It was well made. Close ups of the manuvers, repeated a few times, even done in slow-mo. There is a couple of scenes where he does this in street clothes. I suggested that he do this more in his next video. It makes it more interesting. My friend and also instructor Jesus has the video now. My main instructor sees it tomorrow when I attend my first Black Belt workout. This is for all upper ranks. Not just Black Belts. I am due to test for brown the second week in Jan. Then I am going to have to workout extra time for the next five months. My instructor wants me to test for red in May. We'll see. I am not sure if I can be ready. I will see how bad I want this. Donna ------------------------------ From: Chuck Sears Date: Wed, 01 Dec 1999 20:25:35 -0600 Subject: the_dojang: Re: The_Dojang-Digest V6 #577 the_dojang-owner@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com wrote: > The_Dojang-Digest Wed, 1 Dec 1999 Vol 06 : Num 577 > > In this issue: > > the_dojang: lists back up! > ========================================================================= Hey, Ray - Hope you had a great Thanksgiving!! ------------------------------ From: Ray Terry Date: Wed, 1 Dec 1999 18:50:05 -0800 (PST) Subject: the_dojang: . ------------------------------ End of The_Dojang-Digest V6 #578 ******************************** Support the USTU by joining today! US Taekwondo Union, 1 Olympic Plaza, Ste 405, Colorado Spgs, CO 80909 719-578-4632 FAX 719-578-4642 ustutkd1@aol.com http://www.ustu.com ===================================================================== To unsubscribe from this digest, the_dojang-digest, send the command: unsubscribe the_dojang-digest -or- unsubscribe the_dojang-digest your.old@address in the BODY of an email (top line, left justified) addressed to majordomo@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com. Old digest issues are available via ftp://ftp.martialartsresource.com in pub/the_dojang/digests. All digest files have the suffix '.txt' Copyright 1994-99: Ray Terry, Martial Arts Resource, California Taekwondo Standard disclaimers apply.