From: the_dojang-owner@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com To: the_dojang-digest@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com Subject: The_Dojang-Digest V7 #195 Reply-To: the_dojang@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com Errors-To: the_dojang-owner@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com Precedence: The_Dojang-Digest Sat, 25 March 2000 Vol 07 : Num 195 In this issue: the_dojang: Hi the_dojang: Re: The_Dojang-Digest V7 #193 the_dojang: Re: Tink's questions the_dojang: Re: Tink...also the_dojang: Womens only classes: Re: the_dojang: Re: Tink's questions the_dojang: Re: The_Dojang-Digest V7 #193 the_dojang: Women Only Schools the_dojang: Re: Todd the_dojang: Gumdo Seminar ========================================================================= The_Dojang, serving the Internet since June 1994. 800+ members strong! Copyright 1994-2000: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource Replying to this message will NOT unsubscribe you. To unsubscribe, send "unsubscribe the_dojang-digest" (no quotes) in the body (top line, left justified) of a plain text e-mail addressed to majordomo@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com. To send e-mail to this list use the_dojang@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com See the Korean Martial Arts (KMA) FAQ and online search the last four years worth of digest issues at http://www.MartialArtsResource.com Pil Seung! ---------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "rich hodder" Date: Sat, 25 Mar 2000 09:26:58 PST Subject: the_dojang: Hi Hey There, I just wanted to introduce myself, I've been reading the list for about three weeks now and it seems like there is nice and relevant talk here (unlike some others). So just to say HI, my name is Rich Hodder and I have the privelge of knowing some of you and look forward to meeting the rest. Rich ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ From: Chuck Sears Date: Sat, 25 Mar 2000 11:44:03 -0600 Subject: the_dojang: Re: The_Dojang-Digest V7 #193 > ------------------------------ > > From: Oregfightingarts@aol.com > Date: Sat, 25 Mar 2000 00:43:53 EST > Subject: the_dojang: failing tests > > Hey all !!! > Last Wednesday, a fellow instructor invited me to his dojang to help with > testing. I train with him several times a month, and I get a chance to see > his students perform. ...snip... > I do not hold tests...I hold promotions. When I feel the person is > ready, they get promoted. I still make gup ranks perform all of their > requirements, but they will not fail (but they dont know that...my secret) :) > My question to the instructors of the list....Do you promote or test, and > if you test do you fail students? As I have mentioned in previous posts, I won't give permission to a student to test unless I think the student is ready for the next rank. That is the major obstacle they have to overcome. They still have to perform the required material to my satisfaction and to the satisfaction of the judges on the panel. ATA has a strict testing policy and although we are allowed a fair amount of leeway at a testing, we still have to observe their guidelines. Using board breaks as an example: At the higher ranks (Brown Belt on up), board breaks are a requirement for promotion, because they demonstrate power, focus and technique. We grade the students in forms, sparring and breaks. Suppose a student breaks some, but not all, of the stations in three attempts. If the form and sparring scores are high enough, I can still promote the student 1/2 rank. At Black Belt, though, the standards are higher. You gotta get all the breaks and as we all know, there are days when you can't even buy a board break. Hey, it happens (it's happened to me twice). You don't give up. You practice harder and test again next time and get them. Here's a good example: at last World Championships, we had a 7th Degree Senior Master testing for 8th Degree. He didn't get his breaks and he no-changed. He tested again at the Spring Nationals and got the breaks. Perserverance is what it's all about. ------------------------------ From: Knife1@aol.com Date: Sat, 25 Mar 2000 12:43:59 EST Subject: the_dojang: Re: Tink's questions Tink - No, I do not mind... I have been in the military since 1983. I have trained in the martial arts since 1979. I started with Taekwondo/Hapkido. Once I joined the Army, I was placed in what was called the "Cohort" program. Shortly speaking, you and 38 or 39 other soldiers are lumped together in a platoon in the reception company at basic training and you stay together all the way through your trainng and your first enlistment period. This started my matial arts journey. My "battle buddy" was a young filipino guy whose father was the head of their martial system. He had been training pretty much since his eyes opened. After he whippped up on the Drill Sergeant's in the hand to hand pit every one wanted to learn from him. As his Battle Buddy, I was always the one he used to show stuff on. I trained with him for the first 6 years I was in the Army. Once I was sent to Italy, I lost track of him for a few years. This was when I started training in Hapkido more. Then later, when I was with the Rangers in Georgia, I had the priviledge of meeting my Grandmaster in Aikijitsu. I was kind of cross ranked in a 2nd Degree because of my earlier training ( they must have felt sorry for me), and the rest was earned the regular way. The remainder of my filipino/indonesian training came in the form of private lessons with two different instructors. I made many road trips and often took leave to go train. I also went to many seminars and camps. These are some of the benefits of being in the military, you can move around alot and are exposed to many people. I kind of rampled with this, If I haven't answered your questions, please hit me with 'em again. Jim Mahan ------------------------------ From: Knife1@aol.com Date: Sat, 25 Mar 2000 12:46:05 EST Subject: the_dojang: Re: Tink...also I forgot to say that in the Aikijitsu, I have not taken a "master's test". The title was given once I tested for 5th dan. I don't know if this info will make a difference to folks or not. Bye! ------------------------------ From: "J. R. West" Date: Sat, 25 Mar 2000 13:06:10 -0600 Subject: the_dojang: Womens only classes: I have no personal opinion one way or another as far as this topic is concerned, but at my most recent seminar in Jackson, MS, one of the classes covered a "women's issues" session (for women only), and one of the topics discussed was the idea of a sexually segregated dojang. The number of women present at this discussion was close to 50, and with NO exceptions, the group stated that it would be a step backwards, and all of the higher ranked women, including a few school owners, felt that they had been through "blood, sweat and tears" in a previously male-dominated art in order to open the doors for the ladies of today. I know that at my school, when my wife began her journey into HapKiDo well over 20 rears ago, she was virtually the only woman in the class, and had to figure out for herself the best way to gain power throughout her techniques and how to train in an all male environment. As some of you have seen, Master Renee West is one of the toughest people I have ever seen when on the mat (male or female), and, because of her, we now have a large number of women in the class with over a dozen female black belts up to 5th degree. Would she have been as driven in a segregated class? Maybe. Would she have been as proficient? Probably not! Working with people of all backgrounds, sizes and body types certainly added to her training experience, not to mention her confidence. While living in CO, Renee was separated in a TKD school to the women's class, and after realizing her surroundings, she walked back to the men's class and advised the instructor that if she was going to wear a black belt at his school she was going to do everything that best student he had would have to do, and when she tested for her black belt, she WAS the best student he had. I know I have just violated my fathers favorite rule of discussion to NEVER discuss politics or religion, and I feel that a lot of folks consider this topic to be both. ...Sorry, but I'm just passing on that which was relayed to me, and that which I have seen....J. R. West www.hapkido.com ------------------------------ From: Ray Terry Date: Sat, 25 Mar 2000 12:18:34 PST Subject: Re: the_dojang: Re: Tink's questions > The remainder of my filipino/indonesian training came in the form of > private lessons with two different instructors. I made many road trips > and often took leave to go train. I also went to many seminars and camps. Is this where your 'Kali~Silat' comes from? I know Eskrima (AKA Arnis and Kali) and I know of Silat (Pentjak Silat, Kuntao Silat, etc), but not Kali~ Silat. Is that a family combo of FMA (Filipino MA) and IMA (Indonesian MA)? If you are into FMA you might also enjoy our eskrima-digest (see attached). Ray Terry raymail@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com ========================================================================= Do you practice Eskrima/Kali/Arnis or some other Filipino martial art? If so, why not join the Filipino martial arts e-mail distribution list? Eskrima-Digest is a ~1100 member e-mail distribution list for the respectful discussion of the Filipino martial arts, for those wheresoever dispersed around the globe. 6 years of continuous operation. The list is managed by "Majordomo". To subscribe to eskrima-digest send e-mail to the address; majordomo@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com with subscribe eskrima-digest in the BODY of the message, top line and left justified (not in the subject line). Also, make sure your e-mail is not in HTML format, use 'Plain Text' if using Outlook or Outlook Express. Brought to you by http://www.MartialArtsResource.com Mabuhay ang eskrima! ------------------------------ From: CKCtaekwon@cs.com Date: Sat, 25 Mar 2000 16:17:57 EST Subject: the_dojang: Re: The_Dojang-Digest V7 #193 In a message dated 3/25/00 10:31:34 AM Central Standard Time, the_dojang-owner@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com writes: << I do not hold tests...I hold promotions. When I feel the person is ready, they get promoted. I still make gup ranks perform all of their requirements, but they will not fail (but they dont know that...my secret) :) My question to the instructors of the list....Do you promote or test, and if you test do you fail students? >> I agree with you. Never test anyone who is not ready. Make the "test" really a promotion. Let them look good in front of their family. Gary Pieratt ------------------------------ From: Morgan Kochel Date: Sat, 25 Mar 2000 18:14:55 -0500 Subject: the_dojang: Women Only Schools Tink wrote: > HOWEVER...WHY women's ONLY schools...Women's only classes I can > understand...some things are meant to be just for women...just as some > things are meant to be just for men... I'm a woman, and I'm curious about what you're saying here. What would be considered only for women in an MA school? What would be considered only for men? > But Martial arts is for everybody...not just women...a school just for women > (IMHO)...in essence is making the statement that women are to be segregated > from men and are never to be part of training with men...nor are men to ever > share in the training with women...obviously women must be better than men > because they are allowed to have their own private schools for > training...there must be a martial art specifically for women only since men > are not allowed...can you tell me what the art style is and what its > genealogy and history is that makes it so special as to require a WOMEN'S > ONLY school for learning? Though that sounded a bit sarcastic, I happen to agree with you. I don't think women should be trained separately. I don't think they (we) should be coddled, taught different (i.e., "weaker") skills, or only rape-defense skills. I can see a school for women who *only* want to learn rape-defense. That *would* be female-specific. But a women's martial arts school? What's the point? > Just imagine...if a school opened for MEN ONLY...how long would it be before > suit was filed and the school either closed or became coed...just think > about the message a WOMEN ONLY school is sending... I agree. I don't like segregation. I know there are women on this list who probably think I'm a traitor, but if we're truly seeking to be treated as equals, we should *act* like the equals we are. Pilseung! Morgan ------------------------------ From: Knife1@aol.com Date: Sat, 25 Mar 2000 18:23:47 EST Subject: the_dojang: Re: Todd Todd- Yes, that is the same Ed Annibale. However, he is not under Klaus Shumacher. Klaus is also a member of the World Combat Arts Federation. He also heads the World Martial Arts League (Klaus, that is). Jim PS> I do not know about the Combat Hapkido thing though. ------------------------------ From: Ray Terry Date: Sat, 25 Mar 2000 15:58:15 -0800 (PST) Subject: the_dojang: Gumdo Seminar Received in the mail... Ray =========================================================== Gumdo Seminar Learn to teach - Make extra income for your school: Black belts and instructors only Korean Style Sword Fighting Saturday, June 3, 2000 2PM - 6PM Sunday, June 4, 2000 10AM - 3PM $60 for 2-day seminar Instructor from Korea Haedong Gumdo Place Kwon's Taekwondo Franklin Park Hosted by: Haedong Gumdo Korea Kwon's Taekwondo, Inc. 9956 West Grand Ave Franklin Park, Illinois 60131 847-451-1301 FAX = 847-451-1333 Wooden sword and uniform available for purchase at seminar. ------------------------------ End of The_Dojang-Digest V7 #195 ******************************** It's a great day for Taekwondo! Support the USTU by joining today. US Taekwondo Union, 1 Olympic Plaza, Ste 405, Colorado Spgs, CO 80909 719-578-4632 FAX 719-578-4642 ustutkd1@aol.com http://www.ustu.com To unsubscribe from the_dojang-digest send the command: unsubscribe the_dojang-digest -or- unsubscribe the_dojang-digest your.old@address in the BODY of an email (top line, left justified) addressed to majordomo@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com. Old digest issues are available via ftp://ftp.martialartsresource.com. Copyright 1994-2000: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource Standard disclaimers apply.