From: the_dojang-owner@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com To: the_dojang-digest@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com Subject: The_Dojang-Digest V7 #273 Reply-To: the_dojang@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com Errors-To: the_dojang-owner@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com Precedence: The_Dojang-Digest Sun, 23 April 2000 Vol 07 : Num 273 In this issue: the_dojang: Kuk Sool the_dojang: WTF/ITF Terms... the_dojang: Re: The_Dojang-Digest V7 #271 the_dojang: Re: Hapkido Founder (again) the_dojang: Teachers [none] ========================================================================= The_Dojang, serving the Internet since June 1994. 800 members strong! Copyright 1994-2000: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource Replying to this message will NOT unsubscribe you. To unsubscribe, send "unsubscribe the_dojang-digest" (no quotes) in the body (top line, left justified) of a plain text e-mail addressed to majordomo@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com. To send e-mail to this list use the_dojang@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com See the Korean Martial Arts (KMA) FAQ and online search the last five years worth of digest issues at http://www.MartialArtsResource.com Pil Seung! ---------------------------------------------------------------------- From: YMCATKD@aol.com Date: Sun, 23 Apr 2000 13:27:48 EDT Subject: the_dojang: Kuk Sool <<>> I can't state for a fact but I would think this...... I have been to Korea and I was amazed at how many people practice TKD....its on TV shows, its shown as sporting events and if I remember correctly their are 7,000 TKD dojangs throughout Korea(not including the school programs). I would imagine that competing for students in that environment is extremely tough. I imagine that since Hapkido is a known name they are trying to be more recognizable. We see this in this country too.....There are many Mu Duk Kwan (Tang Soo Do) instructors that state they are teaching TKD but are actually teaching the Tang Soo Do forms. They are obviously doing this for name recognition. Kuk Sool people do their own set of forms and much of the same Ho Shin Sool as Hapkido people. So maybe they are just trying to say.....we are Hapkido but do the Kuk Sool forms too. I think if they want to say Kuk Sool Hapkido thats great......its better than them stating....we are great and everyone else is stinks. Futher I was thinking.....who translated the interview with GM Seo? Was it properly translated? Did the translation reflect the manner in which the thoughts were really said and meant? The best person to answer many of our questions concerning this subject is a higher up member of GM Seo's organisation. The person I am thinking of is Steve Seo who has posted and here before and hopefully will step in and answer some of the groups questions. Sorry to put you on the spot Steve. Andy ------------------------------ From: J Thomas Howard Date: Sun, 23 Apr 2000 12:52:37 -0500 (CDT) Subject: the_dojang: WTF/ITF Terms... People wrote... < WTF & ITF korean terms >> > I don't know about a lot of these differences in terminology. I do > recall that in ITF we referred to forms as Hyung, and in WTF we call > forms Poomse. [and] =There appears to be many differences. I just pulled out Gen. Choi's =encyclopedia and noted a great many technique names that I am unfamilar =with (I'm WTF). I'll also note, along with the different spellings, types of terminology, and association differences, along in there somewhere many TKD people changed from one type of naming (based on Chinese characters, but don't quote me) to one more Korean-ized (but don't quote me----my knowledge of the reason came to me in an EXTREMELY fuzzy fashion). Example: Old style: Chung-gul seh (No, I don't want to hear it about the spelling :) New style: Ahp sohgi Both mean front stance. Those who use Ahp chagi for front kick will note that the new style is much easier to remember, as it is consistent throughout the terms. Even better, the terms my association uses are the old style for stances, and new style for everything else, far as I can tell. I'm thinking about making my students (and myself :) learn the new style terms in addition to the old style. Thomas - ------------------------------------ thomcat@binary.net http://www.binary.net/thomcat/ "If you aren't modeling what you are teaching then you are teaching something else." ------------------------------ From: ICyrus8528@aol.com Date: Sun, 23 Apr 2000 15:35:06 EDT Subject: the_dojang: Re: The_Dojang-Digest V7 #271 Jack: Thank you for your inquiry. The person I succeeded is Michael Atamian formerly of Rhode Island and Balckstone, MA. He succeeded Yew Mun (Lester) Sun and Sun succeeded Kim, Yi Soo. Stay in touch I am in the process of expanding our base and spreading the art(s). We had a few schools in Rhode Island but when I inherited ChoSon Kwon Bup 8 years ago, there was a great uproar over DoJu Atamian's choice (me). So, they left and affiliated themselves with Taekwondo and Hapkido organizations. On the subject of Kuk Sool versus Kuk Sool Hapkido, there is, in essence, no difference. All of the personalities involved can trace their lineage to DoJu Choi Yong Sul. I remember back in the 70's, when Kuk Sa Nim Suh, In Hyuk first arrived in the U.S. he called his art Kuk Sool Hapkido. I still have old magazines (called "Traditional Taekwondo") with advertisements to that effect. In some ways, the only thing that changes is the name we give to things. Ian A. Cyrus, Headmaster Int'l ChoSonDo Fed ------------------------------ From: SunBiNim@aol.com Date: Sun, 23 Apr 2000 15:41:07 EDT Subject: the_dojang: Re: Hapkido Founder (again) In a message dated 04/23/2000 12:26:07 PM Central Daylight Time, Master Jere Hilland writes: << I think now in my lifetime that makes about 1/2 dozen of those who claim they founded Dojunim Choi's hapkido >> Including Choi,Young Sool! Actually, no one else claims to have founded "Choi's" Hapkido , snce the Hapkido that most of us are familiar with includes many kicks that I've never heard anyone credit to GM Choi. Does anyone, from any of the sides, have any real documentation to support the "founder" claims? All I ever hear or read is "my instructor told me..." ------------------------------ From: HKDTodd@aol.com Date: Sun, 23 Apr 2000 16:56:04 EDT Subject: the_dojang: Teachers In a message dated 4/23/00 1:26:11 PM Eastern Daylight Time, the_dojang-owner@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com writes: << If you look at GM Han's kicking techniques, you will probably notice that they are incredibly similar to GM Ji's. There is a reason for this. GM Ji has told me that he was his teacher. Also, GM Han's 9th Dan was given to him by GM Ji. I understand the many Korean masters consider their teacher to be the one that contributed most to their learning. Not to be disrespectful to anyone, but the list of Hapkido masters and grand masters who learned from GM Ji, and later claim lineage to GM Choi is long and distinguish. >> Why is it that many of the high ranking Masters and Grandmasters will not claim Sin Moo Doju Ji as there teacher? (Kwang, Sik Myung, Bong, Soo Han exct.) It is my understanding that both of these asteemed teachers were not regular students of the Founder Choi, Yong Sool but seminar participants. I am just curious as to why? Todd ------------------------------ From: Ray Terry Date: Sun, 23 Apr 2000 14:34:46 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [none] ------------------------------ End of The_Dojang-Digest V7 #273 ******************************** It's a great day for Taekwondo! Support the USTU by joining today. US Taekwondo Union, 1 Olympic Plaza, Ste 405, Colorado Spgs, CO 80909 719-578-4632 FAX 719-578-4642 ustutkd1@aol.com http://www.ustu.com To unsubscribe from the_dojang-digest send the command: unsubscribe the_dojang-digest -or- unsubscribe the_dojang-digest your.old@address in the BODY of an email (top line, left justified) addressed to majordomo@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com. Old digest issues are available via ftp://ftp.martialartsresource.com. Copyright 1994-2000: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource Standard disclaimers apply.