From: the_dojang-owner@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com To: the_dojang-digest@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com Subject: The_Dojang-Digest V7 #310 Reply-To: the_dojang@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com Errors-To: the_dojang-owner@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com Precedence: The_Dojang-Digest Thur, 4 May 2000 Vol 07 : Num 310 In this issue: the_dojang: netiquette the_dojang: re: Uniforms the_dojang: Re: Difference ITF/WTF the_dojang: Changing The Rules Mid-Game the_dojang: midnight blue the_dojang: Kuk Sool Won the_dojang: ITF vs. WTF, no more ========================================================================= The_Dojang, serving the Internet since June 1994. 960 members strong! Copyright 1994-2000: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource Replying to this message will NOT unsubscribe you. To unsubscribe, send "unsubscribe the_dojang-digest" (no quotes) in the body (top line, left justified) of a plain text e-mail addressed to majordomo@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com. To send e-mail to this list use the_dojang@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com See the Korean Martial Arts (KMA) FAQ and online search the last five years worth of digest issues at http://www.MartialArtsResource.com Pil Seung! ---------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Ray Terry Date: Wed, 3 May 2000 18:51:39 -0700 (PDT) Subject: the_dojang: netiquette Come on folks. Lets try to keep those sigs down to 6 lines or less. More isn't really proper netiquette. Thanks. Ray Terry ------------------------------ From: HwarangTSD@aol.com Date: Wed, 3 May 2000 22:04:54 EDT Subject: the_dojang: re: Uniforms Sir, I believe you are correct. Further, I spoke to one of my Instructors earlier and he indicated that the MDK has always used blue instead of black. He did indicate that many schools have begun to wear black in Korea due to a difficulty of finding midnight blue. I haven't had problems finding the blue personally, but the quality is not as it once was. Master Clay ------------------------------ From: Anders Torvill Bjorvand Date: Thu, 04 May 2000 04:14:07 +0200 Subject: the_dojang: Re: Difference ITF/WTF At 16:01 03/05/2000 -0700, you wrote: >From: TKDSCRIBE@aol.com >Date: Wed, 3 May 2000 17:54:52 EDT >Subject: the_dojang: Difference ITF/WTF > >Aside from how the ITF and WTF are governed there is but one difference in >the technical performance between the two: > The ITF system is virtually static. Things are done as they have been >done pretty much since the mid 1960s. A kick is done a certain way because >that is how it is "supposed to be done," according to the master-text. This >compares well with how Shoto Kan is practiced and performed i.e., very >classically. > One would expect an ITF expert from the year 2020 to perform quite >similarly to one from 1970. > On the contrary, the WTF system is very dynamic. Things evolve from > year >to year. I have trained in both systems (presently kukki-tkd), and I must say that you are very wrong. Since WTF/Kukkiwon does not have a unified way of performing techniques, change takes a long time to propagate - and some times a branch does not change at all. ITF on the other hand changes all the time - from my time in the late eighties/early nineties - several times a year. And our head instructor would show up for class and explain that there had been a change from the ITF technical committee and why the change had been made. Within a rather short period of time, all ITF schools all over the world had changed to the new way of performing the technique. By basically stating that there has not been and will not be siginificant change from 1970 and onwards, you are very wrong - literally hundreds (my guess) of changes have been made since then already - including additions of several new forms and the introduction of the sine wave movement. I am not stating here which approach is better than the other - I am simply stating that you are wrong and obviously have little or no knowledge of the ITF. Sorry - but that's the way it is :-/ > NOTE: The international Olympic Committee considered both systems during >the 1970s. In 1980 the IOC formally accepted the WTF system as the one they >preferred. Are you actually so naive that you believe that Antonio Samaranch evaluated ITF/WTF based on technical merits/quality? Sincerely Anders Torvill Bjorvand ------------------------------ From: Emactkd@aol.com Date: Wed, 3 May 2000 23:15:40 EDT Subject: the_dojang: Changing The Rules Mid-Game I have a problem that I am unhappy with, and maybe some clear ideas can come from the list. Maybe. I hope. Three gentlemen now own my instructor's school, my instrucor having retired and moved back to Korea. My instructor had asked me to buy his school, but I was unable to arrange the financing he was looking for and had to pass. I had my own school at the time, a full time job as well, no partner and limited funds and also was hesitant to try to fill his shoes in his dojang. I have stayed in good contact with the new owners, and have on occasion been on their test board. THe problem: 4 weeks prior to their next black belt test they announced that they would NOT be awarding black belts, but would put a stripe on the student's belt, and award the black belt in six months, and the certificate in another six months. These students have been under scrutiny for at least 8 months as candidates, and were expecting that if they passed the next test, they would receive their black belt. The students feel hoodwinked, and I have been approached indirectly to see if I would accept them for testing at my next test. (Of course not!) But I do feel they are justified in their feelings. Has this been tried anywhere else? The move is seen as an attempt to lock students in after black belt, which is admittedly a common stopping point for students, regardless of how you emphasis it as a beginning, not an end. The students think the change is only about money and are pretty upset. I am probably going to be approached by several to join my school, and ordinarily I would not accept them, but the circumstances are muddled. I am torn between the issues of loyalty to your instructor and fairness to the student. Any ideas? Rick Foley ------------------------------ From: "Mac" Date: Wed, 3 May 2000 22:15:02 -0500 Subject: the_dojang: midnight blue <> Well Master Clay, I'm going to have to agree with Master Vaillancourt here. I don't believe it was always midenight blue, but started out as black and changed later. I will also try to find out when it was and let yall know. Mac (sometimes black, sometimes blue) ------------------------------ From: "Mac" Date: Wed, 3 May 2000 22:24:55 -0500 Subject: the_dojang: Kuk Sool Won Master Clay, I personally have never trained in Kuk Sool Won, but have several friends who have. I have watched GM In Hyuk Suh in demonstration, and have met him and watched him at his dojang in Houston ( just a few miles from my home). Very interesting. Appeared to me kind of a blend of Korean and Chinese arts, little bit of everything, and nothing like I've ever seen in a regular TKD, TSD, or HKD dojang. Appeared to be a very complete MA. Mac ------------------------------ From: Ray Terry Date: Wed, 3 May 2000 22:10:00 -0700 (PDT) Subject: the_dojang: ITF vs. WTF, no more Ok folks, this ITF WTF thread is wearing thin. Take ALL future comments offline. Don't worry, it will come up again in another few weeks or months... Ray Terry ------------------------------ End of The_Dojang-Digest V7 #310 ******************************** It's a great day for Taekwondo! Support the USTU by joining today. US Taekwondo Union, 1 Olympic Plaza, Ste 405, Colorado Spgs, CO 80909 719-578-4632 FAX 719-578-4642 ustutkd1@aol.com http://www.ustu.com To unsubscribe from the_dojang-digest send the command: unsubscribe the_dojang-digest -or- unsubscribe the_dojang-digest your.old@address in the BODY of an email (top line, left justified) addressed to majordomo@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com. Old digest issues are available via ftp://ftp.martialartsresource.com. Copyright 1994-2000: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource Standard disclaimers apply.