From: the_dojang-owner@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com To: the_dojang-digest@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com Subject: The_Dojang-Digest V7 #315 Reply-To: the_dojang@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com Errors-To: the_dojang-owner@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com Precedence: The_Dojang-Digest Fri, 5 May 2000 Vol 07 : Num 315 In this issue: the_dojang: KSW reqs the_dojang: KSW & SPM the_dojang: Chung Do Kwan Tae Kwon Do seminar in Cheyenne May 12-13 the_dojang: RE: Changing the rules the_dojang: Dr. Kimm's books the_dojang: Re: Saturday Night F? the_dojang: Re: Association vs Federation the_dojang: Children's Day and Re: Uniforms (baby of the class!) the_dojang: Yeonmaeng the_dojang: Re: tribal arts, worldwide the_dojang: Re: The Melinda Marketing Issue the_dojang: Robert Kim the_dojang: Robert Kim continued the_dojang: Re: tribal arts, worldwide the_dojang: Taekwondo Goons the_dojang: Re:Orlando FL. Schools the_dojang: Tribal Arts continued.. Re: the_dojang: Tribal Arts continued.. [none] ========================================================================= The_Dojang, serving the Internet since June 1994. 960 members strong! Copyright 1994-2000: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource Replying to this message will NOT unsubscribe you. To unsubscribe, send "unsubscribe the_dojang-digest" (no quotes) in the body (top line, left justified) of a plain text e-mail addressed to majordomo@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com. To send e-mail to this list use the_dojang@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com See the Korean Martial Arts (KMA) FAQ and online search the last five years worth of digest issues at http://www.MartialArtsResource.com Pil Seung! ---------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Ray Terry Date: Thu, 04 May 2000 21:27:14 PDT Subject: the_dojang: KSW reqs Since we're chatting about KSW, the following was provided as the requirements for 1st Dan. Ray Terry raymail@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com - ------------------------------------------------------------------------- 1st Degree Black Belt Requirements Ray inquired about the requirements for 1st degree black belt for Kuk Sool Won. Here it is, from memory -- so if I left something out, I apologize in advance! I should also point out that there is no single test for black belt in Kuk Sool. Black Belt tests are administered quarterly, and candidates must take the test many times (6 times in my case) -- it is the cumulative score over time that determines whether or not a candidate passes. YEA EUE - Etiquette KI CHO JAH KI and DAHN JUHN KI BUB - Breathing NAHK BUB - Falling: front, back, side, twisting falls; soft rolls; high flip; cartwheel (two-hand, one-hand, elbows, aerial); front handspring; back handspring SOO KI - Hand Technique (too many to list) JOHK SOOL - Kicking Technique (too many to list) HYUNG (empty hand) - Ki Cho Hyung (foundation); Cho Geup Hyung (elementary); Joong Geup Hyung (intermediate); Goh Geup Hyung (advanced intermediate); Dae Geup Hyung (advanced); Geum Moo Hyung (sword dance - black belt) KI BON BONG - Weapon Fundamentals (etiquette, control techniques, retrieval techniques) HYUNG (weapons) - Joong Bong Il Hyung (middle staff #1), Jung Geum Hyung (straight sword) KYUK PAH - breaking: examiner's choice SOO - Techniques Sohn Ppae Ki (5 basic defenses against same-side wrist grab) Ki Bohn Soo (15 fundamentals) Sohn Mohk Soo (11 defenses against same-side wrist grab) Eue Bohk Soo (13 defenses against clothing grab) Ahn Sohn Mohk Soo (6 defenses against cross-side wrist grab) Maek Chi Ki (15 hand strikes to pressure points) Maek Cha Ki (15 kicks to pressure points) Joo Muhk Maga Ki Bohn Soo (15 fundamentals against kick-punch attacks) Joong Geup Sohn Mohk Soo (7 defenses against same-side wrist grab) Ahp Eue Bohk Soo (20 defenses against front clothing grabs) Dee Eue Bohk Soo (23 defenses against rear grabs) Kwahn Juhl Ki (13 offensive wrist locks) Too Ki (13 conversion throws) Mohk Jeu Li Ki (5 choking techniques) Bahng Too Ki (10 defenses against throws) Yahng Sohn Mohk Soo (15 defenses against both wrists grabbed) Ssahng Soo (15 defenses against double-handed wrist grab) Dahn Doh Mahk Ki (15 defenses against knife attack) ------------------------------ From: Ray Terry Date: Thu, 4 May 2000 21:30:23 -0700 (PDT) Subject: the_dojang: KSW & SPM > I first heard about this Kung Fu connection several years ago, before I had > even seen Kuk Sool techniques performed. Then I saw the book on Korean > weapons that Suh, In Hyuk and Jane Hollander wrote. One of the weapons that > is demonstrated is a big pitch-fork. This is essentially a tiger fork which > is a (not too common) weapon in some Kung Fu styles. I thought to myself > "Well, that's something you don't see everyday." Other weapon similarities: > twin swords, spears, twin short swords, etc. From what I have read there is > an acknowledgement on the part of Kuk Sool people that Chinese arts had a > lot of influence on their art. It is thought that the Southern Praying Mantis connection is where the Royal Court Arts portion of KSW come from. Anyone have Dr. He-young Kimm's KSW book handy to see if that possible connection is mentioned? Ray Terry ------------------------------ From: Erik Kluzek Date: Thu, 4 May 2000 22:55:04 -0600 (MDT) Subject: the_dojang: Chung Do Kwan Tae Kwon Do seminar in Cheyenne May 12-13 Tae Kwon Do and Self Defense Seminars in Cheyenne WY, May 12th and 13th. Smart Sports Training Center and Medicine Bow Martial Arts will be hosting Tae Kwon Do and Self Defense classes on Friday May 12 and Saturday May 13,. The guest instructor will be 6th Degree black belt Master Don Richardson. Master Richardson from Flagstaff AZ,is certified both as a 6th Degree black-belt in Chung Do Kwon Tae Kwon Do as well as 6th Degree Black Belt in Judo. Martial artists of all disciplines and levels, or people interested in the martial arts are invited to attend these classes and demonstrations. Chung Do Kwan Tae Kwon is a style that emphases powerful kicking techniques, but also maintains strong hand and punching techniques. Classes will hone students kicking skills, as well as hand-striking techniques. The self-defense classes will also deal with holds, locks, chokes, and other grappling techniques, as well as how to defend against these attacks. Class fee is only $15.00 to train with a renowned martial art master. Classes will be at the Smart Sports Training Center at: Smart Sport Training Center, 5353 Yellowstone Rd, Cheyenne, WY. The tentative schedule: Friday May 12: class, 7pm to 9pm. Saturday May 13: Self-defense seminar, 8:30 am to 12:00 p.m. Class, 2:00 p.m. to 4:30pm Demonstration: 6 p.m. to 7:30 p.m. Contact Mike Londe at 307-637-8270 or via email at mlonde@earthlink.net for details ------------------------------ From: Emactkd@aol.com Date: Fri, 5 May 2000 01:37:59 EDT Subject: the_dojang: RE: Changing the rules Thanks to all of you who provided input. Your thought are welcome, especially if they don't agree with mine. The matter of loyalty to your instructor was incorrectly assumed that I meant to my instructor. I was speaking of the student's loyalty to his instructor. I very seldom accept a higher rank student from another local school, but not because I mean to stay in their good graces. They most happily take my former students, without regard to what I might think. I don't accept them because I strongly believe in loyalty to your instructor, and changing schools out of a policy disagreement by a higher rank rubs me the wrong way. If the students' goal is to get their belt soonest, coming to me would not be a solution, as I would not test them very soon anyway. I have said that I would speak to them if they wish, but immediate testing is out of the question. Soonest they can expect to test would be about the time their own school would award their belts anyway. And that is, of course, very conditional. Thanks y'all Rick Foley ------------------------------ From: JEREMYT@ATFI.COM (JeremyT) Date: Fri, 5 May 2000 08:30:51 -0500 Subject: the_dojang: Dr. Kimm's books "I have the book in front of me, and the "tribal period"..." Which one of his books has this information? Is it one that any of us can get a hold of? Jeremy ------------------------------ From: Piotr Bernat Date: Fri, 05 May 2000 08:12:15 +0200 Subject: the_dojang: Re: Saturday Night F? > From what I saw, the kids usually love > patches, but as they mature, their new doboks have fever and fever > additions. Probably I had fever myself, after getting back from Polish Junior Olympics at 3 a.m. (our bus broke down and we spent 5 hours waiting, until we finally managed to rent another one). The doboks are all in perfect shape, but my spelling isn`t ;) Regards - -- Piotr Bernat dantaekwondo@lublin.home.pl http://www.taekwondo.prv.pl ------------------------------ From: Piotr Bernat Date: Fri, 05 May 2000 08:20:09 +0200 Subject: the_dojang: Re: Association vs Federation Hello the_dojang-owner@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com Dnia 05-Maj-00, the_dojang-owner@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com napisa=B3: > This is kind of funny 'cause it's also true in Korea. It seems that > there is no distinction in Korean between the terms Union, Federation, > Organization, Association, etc., when pertaining to a sport. = Actually there is a distinction between "association" ("zwiazek" or "stowarzyszenie") and "federation" ("federacja") in Polish. But each national body in Poland choses the name they want to use internationally.= One group decided to use "Polish Taekwon-Do Association", which is a very= close and precise translation, while the other was named in English "Poli= sh Taekwondo Federation - WTF", although this translation is a bit loose. Anyway, the Kukkiwon doesn`t seem to care about it, since they keep on printing "President, Poland Taekwondo Association" in a place where our chairman should sign the KKW certificates... Regards - -- = Piotr Bernat dantaekwondo@lublin.home.pl http://www.taekwondo.prv.pl= ------------------------------ From: Kim Jones Date: Fri, 5 May 2000 00:04:14 -0700 (PDT) Subject: the_dojang: Children's Day and Re: Uniforms (baby of the class!) Piotr-- That is too cute...the "baby" of the class wearing the red and black uniform...and you would normally associate red and black with a warning...especially from a tiny tiny munchkin. Do you know what size the uniform is? Speaking of uniforms, I'd like to provide a shameless plug for those of you who are looking for the Pine Tree website. Been there, haven't got the t-shirt yet, but do plan on doing so. http://www.sangmoosa.co.kr/ Speaking of rugrats, today, May 5th is Children's Day in Korea. So, show your rugrats some love today!!!!!!! ===== ~~Kim Jones (*ladytimberland@yahoo.com*) http://kenochi_timberland.tripod.com/ ICQ: 52828008 AOL: Lady Timberland "The path of excess leads to the tower of wisdom." Enigma, "Gravity of Love" __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Send instant messages & get email alerts with Yahoo! Messenger. http://im.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ From: Kim Jones Date: Fri, 5 May 2000 00:31:25 -0700 (PDT) Subject: the_dojang: Yeonmaeng Mr. Silz-- That's an excellent point that you brought up. I looked up "yeonmaeng" and lo and behold! It translates to "league; federation; union." You weren't that far off the mark. =) However, there are synonyms to "yeonmaeng." "Yeonhap" (combination; incopration; alliance) and "hapdong" (can't find the word in my mini-dictionary - 6,000 words in Korean aren't enough to cover the entire language) mean nearly the same thing. I just asked my Korean mother for closely associated words, and she mentioned those. Just $.02 (or 22 won, using 1100 to the US$1) worth from the ROK. P.S. - Since my Korean vocabulary suffers greatly, there could be more words that I'm missing (due to lack of knowledge). However, I can read (just can't translate), and came up with that using my mini-dictionary (and primary source of a mother). ===== ~~Kim Jones (*ladytimberland@yahoo.com*) http://kenochi_timberland.tripod.com/ ICQ: 52828008 AOL: Lady Timberland "The path of excess leads to the tower of wisdom." Enigma, "Gravity of Love" __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Send instant messages & get email alerts with Yahoo! Messenger. http://im.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ From: Anders Torvill Bjorvand Date: Fri, 05 May 2000 11:15:58 +0200 Subject: the_dojang: Re: tribal arts, worldwide At 19:20 04/05/2000 -0700, you wrote: >Who was the dude in the Bible that wrestled God all night and only came >away with a bad hip?). It was Jacob - the grandson of Abraham. Sincerely, Anders T. B. ------------------------------ From: Ken McDonough Date: Fri, 5 May 2000 04:59:23 -0700 (PDT) Subject: the_dojang: Re: The Melinda Marketing Issue Another poster commented: Comment: I was gonna stay outta this one. However, a different perspective. Melinda is an honorable and trustworthy individual. She offers a few services that martial artists on this list may want to partake in. If I can obtain a few martial arts supplies at a better price from a list member, then I believe we should support that person. I also admire the business acumen Melinda has exhibited. So perhaps view it in a positive manner. Especially as you order Century products from the Century catalog at high prices. Figure it out. Ken McD... __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Send instant messages & get email alerts with Yahoo! Messenger. http://im.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ From: MichaelChoi@aol.com Date: Fri, 5 May 2000 08:17:19 EDT Subject: the_dojang: Robert Kim I guess some of you are not familiar with the Robert Kim incident. First of=20 all, Robert Chaegon Kim was not a martial artist. Rather, he was a computer=20 analyst at the Office of Naval Intelligence. He is being prosecuted by the U= S=20 government for giving the South Korean govenment "secret" or "top secret"=20 information. It included military, political, and intelligence documents on=20 the Asia-Pacific region. Kim gave the information to Baek Dong-il, a militar= y=20 attach=E9 to the South Korean embassy. The FBI, who has counter-espionage=20 responsibilities, suspected Baek Dong-il of being an intelligence operative=20 and monitored Kim after noticing activity between the two. I referred to=20 Koreagate and Robert Kim as examples of the Korean intelligence communities=20 attempting to infiltrate American government. (But who's surprised?) Sincerely, Michael Choi ------------------------------ From: MichaelChoi@aol.com Date: Fri, 5 May 2000 08:20:42 EDT Subject: the_dojang: Robert Kim continued When I was visiting my cousin in Korea, Robert Kim was a topic for discussion. The question was, "what's the big deal." Well, according to the media, the US did give the same information to the Koreans, except it was screened or filtered before given to them. The intelligence community was afraid that their intelligence methods would be compromised (a legitimate concern, in my opinion). Sincerely, Michael Choi ------------------------------ From: "Jim Griffin" Date: Fri, 05 May 2000 08:30:14 EDT Subject: the_dojang: Re: tribal arts, worldwide I believe that would be Jacob. - ---begin quoted text--- From: Ray Terry Date: Thu, 4 May 2000 18:55:12 -0700 (PDT) Who was the dude in the Bible that wrestled God all night and only came away with a bad hip?). Ray Terry - ---end quoted text--- Jim Griffin http://sitebuilder.liveuniverse.com/jgriffin/ ________________________________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ From: MichaelChoi@aol.com Date: Fri, 5 May 2000 08:29:48 EDT Subject: the_dojang: Taekwondo Goons Couple of things of Korean Taekwondo masters and their "goons." The protests happened in the early 70's, before I was born. So, I could never have been an eyewitness. Second, the "goons" were briefly mentioned in my Korean history course from an extremely reliable scholar. He does not have the reputation of distorting fact in order to satisfy his political views. Again, it was BRIEFLY mentioned in the context of the worldwide dissent against Park Chung-hee's heavy handed tactics in maintaining his regime. I could investigate this and give you more information, but I would rather "let by-gones be by-gones." To me, there are more interesting topics, such as the North-South Korea Summit coming up in June. Sincerely, Michael Choi ------------------------------ From: Dave Weller Date: Fri, 05 May 2000 07:56:10 -0500 Subject: the_dojang: Re:Orlando FL. Schools I have a good friend that trains with me. He is 3rd dan TKD (wtf) , also holds black belt in Kendo. He is a great guy, a hard worker, and loves to train. He is looking for a good school in the Orlando Florida area. Any recommendations would be appreciated. I did look on the web, but really found nothing in the Orlando area, I did note for him the 2 schools in Fl. affiliated with Master West, judging from what I have read on the DDJ a school under Master West's guidance would deliver the kind of training this guy is after. Thanks in advance for your help. Dave Weller student, WTF TKD “Practice a thousand hours and you learn self discipline. Practice ten thousand hours and you learn about yourself.” Myamoto Musashi ------------------------------ From: JEREMYT@ATFI.COM (JeremyT) Date: Fri, 5 May 2000 08:17:00 -0500 Subject: the_dojang: Tribal Arts continued.. "I agree with Ray. In ROK's capitalist economy, all martial arts need to compete for students. So they have an incentive to present a marketable "face" to their art. Personally, I don't want to be stuck in the past. I want the most effective techniques that work today on the street." We are talking about two different cultures here. In ROK, it is not as easy to shovel BS stories in your martial arts, because the government still has a little control over what you. As for being "stuck in the past", Koreans love their cultural history and traditions. Everything from dress to dance. Any martial art can be made "street" effective, but it is based on the individual practitioner. Plus, most people will tell you that Kuk Sul is very effective. Jeremy ------------------------------ From: Ray Terry Date: Fri, 05 May 2000 7:17:09 PDT Subject: Re: the_dojang: Tribal Arts continued.. > We are talking about two different cultures here. In ROK, it is not > as easy to shovel BS stories in your martial arts, .... Sorry... All evidence to the contrary. Ray Terry raymail@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com ------------------------------ From: Ray Terry Date: Fri, 5 May 2000 07:00:48 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [none] ------------------------------ End of The_Dojang-Digest V7 #315 ******************************** It's a great day for Taekwondo! Support the USTU by joining today. US Taekwondo Union, 1 Olympic Plaza, Ste 405, Colorado Spgs, CO 80909 719-578-4632 FAX 719-578-4642 ustutkd1@aol.com http://www.ustu.com To unsubscribe from the_dojang-digest send the command: unsubscribe the_dojang-digest -or- unsubscribe the_dojang-digest your.old@address in the BODY of an email (top line, left justified) addressed to majordomo@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com. 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