From: the_dojang-owner@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com To: the_dojang-digest@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com Subject: The_Dojang-Digest V8 #23 Reply-To: the_dojang@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com Errors-To: the_dojang-owner@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com Precedence: The_Dojang-Digest Thur, 11 Jan 2001 Vol 08 : Num 023 In this issue: the_dojang: Re: Coaches the_dojang: uniforms the_dojang: Training Today the_dojang: Re: Ken's Questions the_dojang: RE: Ground Techniques or grounded techniques the_dojang: Re: All these styles called Hapkido the_dojang: Han-KUK Mu-SOOL Hyop-HWE the_dojang: Re: Master Instructor's curriculums and other modern day thoughts the_dojang: weights for tkd the_dojang: Re: The_Dojang-Digest V8 #21 the_dojang: Re: The_Dojang-Digest V8 #21 the_dojang: Fwd: road rage the_dojang: . ========================================================================= The_Dojang, serving the Internet since June 1994. ~999 members strong! Copyright 1994-2001: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource Replying to this message will NOT unsubscribe you. To unsubscribe, send "unsubscribe the_dojang-digest" (no quotes) in the body (top line, left justified) of a "plain text" e-mail addressed to majordomo@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com. To send e-mail to this list use the_dojang@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com See the Korean Martial Arts (KMA) FAQ and the online search engine for back issues of The_Dojang at http://www.MartialArtsResource.com Pil Seung! ---------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Piotr Bernat Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2001 15:46:38 +0200 Subject: the_dojang: Re: Coaches > I want someone who is a thinker, a people person, a person of experience > in my corner when I am learning something. Not just someone who can fight > good. > > Know what I mean ? I am not good at words and probably put this > incorrectly so if you can say it better ... please someone do. > > Illona You put it right and I agree 100 %. My experiences are the same. I met people who didn`t have any competition career, but they spend hours with books and videotapes (and I don`t mean commercial videotapes here, but the ones recorded during major championships, with elite athletes etc.) analysing moves and thinking how to teach them most efficiently. One of them, a friend of mine, brought his VCR for reparation and they couldn`t believe the diamond head can be worn out like this from frequent use :) I remember a seminar in 1992 with some VERY skilled exponents of a Korean martial art which was at the time new to our country. The guys were just awesone. Great kicks, great locks, breakfalls etc. But the seminar as a whole was very poor, because they didn`t have an idea how to teach these things to this particular group of people who came for the seminar. Exeperience in fightin of competing is very good for the instructor, but in my opinion more important are the communication skills, analytic mind, ability to spot one`s mistakes and to correct it, knowledge of human psychology, sports theory and some other things. And of course a very good knowledge of the technical stuff in his art. For those who may be interested, a noted Polish fencing coach and author of several books about fencing and coaching in general, Z. Czajkowski, analysed history and actions of the biggest fencing teachers starting from the 16th century. He wrote they were all very different when it comes to their personalities. However, there were some points common for all of them: - - a true passion for their work and constant search for new methods and techniques, - - they all held fencing in high esteem when it comes to both physical and mental advantages for the trainee, - - very good knowledge of the fencing`s technical stuff, - - ability to present their thoughts and ideas in written form - this is important since it caused discussions with other teachers, new ideas were formed etc. - - communication skills, ability to pass their knowledge and their passion to their students, - - integrity and very hard work, - - self-confidence and confidence in their training methods. I think most (if not all) of the above can be applied to the martial arts instructors as well. Besides, this forum allows us to make use of another point of this list (writing, discussions etc.). So, thanks to Ray, we all have chance to be the greatest MA teachers ;) ..... Regards - -- Piotr Bernat dantaekwondo@lublin.home.pl http://www.taekwondo.prv.pl ------------------------------ From: Janet Moore Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2001 09:57:37 -0500 Subject: the_dojang: uniforms Anyone have any recommendations for a good training uniform that doesn't have excessive shrinkage. I bought the Century competition version which seem to fit fine. However, the more I sweat, the longer the pants get during the course of our workout probably due to the material. Anyone had any luck with any other brands? ------------------------------ From: LAHapkido@aol.com Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2001 10:30:58 EST Subject: the_dojang: Training Today Ken, in my honest opinion I feel that we have entirely to many Martial Arts studio's in the US that have forgotten what the Martial Arts were originally taught for, as a means of self preservation. Many Instructors do not teach the things that you advocated in your last post because they don't know how. Why? Because they were never taught these things. More and More studio's are leaning towards children and developing good character. Which I think is wonderful, but as an Instructor promoting Martial Arts and not just sport Karate you owe it to your students to prepare them by what ever means are available! All things that we now consider a Tradition began with an idea that has been accepted and passed on to yet another who shared it and thus we have Tradition. If you develop your students into responsible people giving them the tools that they MAY need to survive then you did the right thing. However if you teach some half hearted techniques that you insist they don't do full out because it could hurt their partner you may want to question that. Martial Arts without regard to any system are in a constant state of evolution. In 1965 when I began this journey you learned Front kick, side kick, round house kick, back kick, basic punches, basic blocks, falls and rolls. Which later was put together and then you learned a hand full of forms. The training was very basic at almost all studios however it was always intense and you did not move on to the next technique until you were proficient with what you were learning. Look at us now flying, falling, flipping go to an open tournament and you will wonder if you are in the right place. However you have to give the martial Artist of today credit. They will try anything that looks good, all in the name of Competition. Well, after all this I guess all I wanted to say was yes we as instructors should remain true to our teachings remembering that in order for things to improve we must make our contributions which may one day become Tradition. Develop a variety of curriculum and teach it according to age and need for those particular type students. Some students have no desire to be combat killers and they never will and that should be okay. It is their choice and it is up to you and the people that teach with you to help ALL of your students reach their full potential as they see fit. Take care! Train to Live and Live to Train! Dan ------------------------------ From: David Beck Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2001 09:18:15 -0600 (CST) Subject: the_dojang: Re: Ken's Questions Ken's questions: >a. What do they consider important teaching philosophies in their >respective >dojangs. non-resistance, circular motion, continuous flow, many possible paths to a destination, moderation, controlled levels of response (ie you use different techniques on your drunk brother than on a mugger) >b. Should old traditions be changed or modified. depends on the tradition - for instance, the bow can become a salute or placing of the hand over the heart, which retains the purpose of showing respect but loses the connotation some people have of superiority. Some should be thrown out - ie smacking a kid with a stick to impose proper form. >c. How do you publish advancement to promotion information to students. Give them a copy of the syllabus of what is covered. Tell them approximately what subset of that they'll be asked for at testing. >d. Do you consider the modern training principles of other martial arts >applicable to Hapkido, e.g., would a video tape on learning how to counter >punch and ring strategy be applicable to your Hapkido school. Depends. How to slip a punch, yes. How to deal with a constrained environment, yes. How to set up a knockout, no. From TKD, some of the newer footwork training, yes. How to do a 720, no. ... Korea romanticized into superior place to live? Of course not. To train? Depends on circumstances. Certainly there is comparable quality of instruction. You can train anywhere. David N. Beck Internet:dbeck@usa.alcatel.com WATT Lead Engineer Alcatel USA 1000 Coit Road Plano, Texas 75075 ** Opinions expressed are not those of Alcatel USA ** ------------------------------ From: Carsten Jorgensen Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2001 10:49:47 -0500 (EST) Subject: the_dojang: RE: Ground Techniques or grounded techniques >> You have me very curious about a response that you made (in Vol #10 ??) about training with GM Lee in California on a carpet. << Well, I didn't train there, I didn't become a black belt until 1989 :-) My comment was from watching old 8mm films of Hwarang Do demonstrations in Korea. And the part about the reason why they almost stopped teachning groundfighting in America is from Hose Montenegro, the first American to train Hwarang Do in America >> Were the techniques that you are referring to "grounded techniques" (def: techniques typically executed from standing position and adapted to be executed from a seated or kneeling position ie: grounded side-kick, grounded elbow strike) or ground techniques, meaning unique techniques originally intended exclusively for grappling on the floor? << They were using unique techniques exclusively intended for grappling on the floor. >> I also wonder if such true ground-fighting techniques would then comprise a major contribution to the Hapkido curriculum not unlike the inclusion of taek kyon material by GM Ji and Kim. How say you? << Sorry I don't know, how many Hapkido styles does groundfighting? I'm not going to comment on the Taekkyon part. Carsten Jorgensen hwarangdo@email.com Copenhagen, Denmark - ----------------------------------------------- FREE! The World's Best Email Address @email.com Reserve your name now at http://www.email.com ------------------------------ From: Carsten Jorgensen Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2001 10:52:25 -0500 (EST) Subject: the_dojang: Re: All these styles called Hapkido Dakin: >>Wow! What a lot to read! But it is GREAT to see everyone talking to each other in a gracious manner; that's what I think the martial arts should be all about. << Yes it's great, it's just like 'the old days' :-) >>Yu, Won, Wha Soft, Circular, Harmony that is Hapkido! << Yes, and Yu, Won, Hwa (Um) - Kang, Kak, Kan (Yang): Soft>> Tan Joon Ho Heup Bup, that is Hapkido! Straight Mind, Straight Body, Total Concentration that is Hapkido! << And Hwarang Do, but the exercises are different. >> The biggest problem that I have seen is when someone say's Kuk Sool Won, Hwa Rang Do, Han Mu Do, Kung Jung Moo Sool and a few other are all Hapkido. Naturally the Grandmasters and founder of these systems become upset. They are not now or were they ever be Hapkido. They or unique systems that after years of training became what they are today. << I agree, but some of them were actually known as Hapkido for about 7 or 8 years... The Kuk Sool Hwe (1962-66) was normally counted as one of the Hapkido organisations, so of course that means that GM Lee used the Hapkido name from ~1961 (his first school opened in 1960) until he dropped all ranks (including his 8th dan Hapkido) and all connections to the Hapkido people in 1968. Again, before everybody starts posting on the internet that Hwarang Do=Hapkido - Hapkido was a term used for all the different styles that was not Taekwondo... Try reading the articles with GM Lee again, but please read what he says, not what you think he says. They're also online at www.hwarangdo.com. >> I know when I first started training I was told I will give you ABC and you make the next technique. << Hwarang Do is a lot like that, but you have to learn the alphabet first. There are so many techniques and so many ways to do the techniques because the techniques have to fit the person, not the other way around. Carsten Jorgensen hwarangdo@email.com Copenhagen, Denmark - ----------------------------------------------- FREE! The World's Best Email Address @email.com Reserve your name now at http://www.email.com ------------------------------ From: Carsten Jorgensen Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2001 10:54:34 -0500 (EST) Subject: the_dojang: Han-KUK Mu-SOOL Hyop-HWE >>> Yes...did you read about the Kuk Sool Hwe? <<< Dakin: >> Where? Could you please clarify what exactly you're referring to? Any help would be greatly appreciated!! << You can try for instance http://www.hwarangdo.com/hrd2.htm or in the last two parts of the black belt magazine interview with GM Lee. If you didn't get them they are also online at http://www.hwarangdo.com/Magazines/blackbelt10-00.htm http://www.hwarangdo.com/Magazines/blackbelt11-00.htm Carsten Jorgensen Hwarangdo@email.com Copenhagen, Denmark - ----------------------------------------------- FREE! The World's Best Email Address @email.com Reserve your name now at http://www.email.com ------------------------------ From: Carsten Jorgensen Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2001 10:56:12 -0500 (EST) Subject: the_dojang: Re: Master Instructor's curriculums and other modern day thoughts Ken: >> Nice to follow the history tread. In sum, GM Choi to GM Ji, branches off to other students in Korea. Master Instructors migrate to US and other countries spreading art. Some Americans sponsor GM's. Various Hapkido organizations and branches subsequently ensue--as in any other permutation. Along this path Hapkido principles are modified. Internet arrives. Many communicate and continue to share divergent thoughts on origins of Hapkido. << Not at all, or yes if you're talking about GM Ji's lineage. >> Do you believe that Korea is a vastly superior place to live than what is offered in the U.S. ? << No, all countries have good sides and bad sides... well, of course - deep down I'm convinced that Denmark is a vastly superior place to live, hehe ;-) Carsten Jorgensen hwarangdo@email.com Copenhagen, Denmark - ----------------------------------------------- FREE! The World's Best Email Address @email.com Reserve your name now at http://www.email.com ------------------------------ From: Donnla Nic Gearailt Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2001 17:04:49 +0000 Subject: the_dojang: weights for tkd Hi there folks, yet another clueless newbie question from me! I have started doing weights in the last week. Following the advice of one of the members of my tkd club, who also does rowing and general fitness training, I plan on doing lots of reps of lighter weights rather than fewer of heavier ones. Here's the question - exactly how much should I be looking at building up to being able to lift/press/whatever before I start increasing the reps beyond the standard 3x20? Twice as much as what I was originally able to do, three times? BTW, I can bench press a whole 25 pounds! So am a bit of a weenie. I don't want to end up with huge muscles as a) This will result in me being in the heavyweight division in tournaments and b) I won't fit into my wedding dress in a few months time if I do :-). I know there are plenty of you on this list who have working with weights for a long time and I'd really appreciate any advice you'd have to give me. Especially as regards whether this is a good weights programme to follow for tkd. Donnla. - ----------------------------------------------------------------------- Donnla Nic Gearailt Computer Laboratory, New Museums Site, Graduate Student Pembroke St., Cambridge CB2 3QG, U.K. tel: +44-1223-334619 http://www.cl.cam.ac.uk/~dbn20/ "An eyelash! How could you be so careless!" - Jude Law, Gattaca ------------------------------ From: Donnla Nic Gearailt Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2001 17:22:19 +0000 Subject: the_dojang: Re: The_Dojang-Digest V8 #21 In message <200101110341.WAA26566@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com> you write: >From: "Anne Skjold" >Date: Wed, 10 Jan 2001 15:05:29 -0600 >Subject: the_dojang: Personal Safety tips for women > > I thought this would be a beneficial email for all my female friends, >family and fellow Martial Artists to read about. I hope no one ever has to >use this knowledge but you just never know. Better to be safe than sorry. > Firstly, many thanks for posting this - there are quite a few things in it that I wasn't aware of (especially the average time of day women are attacked, I would have thought it would have been at night, after bars shut). > > * If someone is coming toward you, hold out your hands in front of you >and yell Stop or Stay back! Most of the rapists this man talked to said >they'd leave a woman alone if she yelled or showed that she would not be > afraid to fight back. Again, they are looking for an EASY target. If you >carry pepper spray (this instructor was a huge advocate of it and carries >it with him wherever he goes,) yelling I HAVE PEPPER SPRAY and holding it > out will be a deterrent. > pity we can't carry this in the UK. I've been told hairspray is a reasonable substitute and legal to carry. > > Of course the things we always hear still apply. Always be aware of your >surroundings, take someone with you if you can and if you see any odd >behavior, don't dismiss it, and go with your instincts. You may feel a >little silly at the time, but you'd feel much worse if the guy really was >trouble. > This is something I was told on a self-defense course I went on before I started martial arts training of any kind. The analogy the instructor gave was, the wildebeast don't care about hurting the lion's feelings when they run away, they don't check that he's hungry before doing so, he said, if something doesn't feel right when someone talks to you or is close behind you, yell or shout *insert obscenity here* off and run fast. Who cares if their feelings are hurt. Donnla. - ----------------------------------------------------------------------- Donnla Nic Gearailt Computer Laboratory, New Museums Site, Graduate Student Pembroke St., Cambridge CB2 3QG, U.K. tel: +44-1223-334619 http://www.cl.cam.ac.uk/~dbn20/ "An eyelash! How could you be so careless!" - Jude Law, Gattaca ------------------------------ From: Donnla Nic Gearailt Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2001 17:24:45 +0000 Subject: the_dojang: Re: The_Dojang-Digest V8 #21 In message <200101110341.WAA26566@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com> you write: >From: MissIllona@aol.com >Date: Wed, 10 Jan 2001 18:18:31 EST >Subject: the_dojang: Re: Coaches > ><< Are the best athletic coaches also the best players? >> > >I have argued this one till the cows come home ... look at alot of the boxers > >managers and coaches ... they may have been fighters back when they were >younger ... but the ability to pass on that knowledge is given to few. >Understanding the body is important and alot of people don't even think about > >it. Those of us who went to uni know that the best professors in their field are often not particularly good teachers! The best teacher I ever had was a guy who taught math, physics and chem but only had a qualification in one of them. He was one heck of a good teacher basically. I think it's the same with sports coaches. Being good at what you're teaching is nice, but being a good teacher is preferable. However, I'm sure Linford Christie is a perfectly fine coach. Donnla. - ----------------------------------------------------------------------- Donnla Nic Gearailt Computer Laboratory, New Museums Site, Graduate Student Pembroke St., Cambridge CB2 3QG, U.K. tel: +44-1223-334619 http://www.cl.cam.ac.uk/~dbn20/ "An eyelash! How could you be so careless!" - Jude Law, Gattaca ------------------------------ From: TNTcombatives@aol.com Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2001 13:32:34 EST Subject: the_dojang: Fwd: road rage - --part1_b7.a74e840.278f5642_boundary Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit - --part1_b7.a74e840.278f5642_boundary Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Return-Path: <3411@policeone.com> Received: from rly-zb04.mx.aol.com (rly-zb04.mail.aol.com [172.31.41.4]) by air-zb02.mail.aol.com (v77.31) with ESMTP; Thu, 11 Jan 2001 13:31:50 -0500 Received: from c000.snv.cp.net (c000-h018.c000.snv.cp.net [209.228.32.82]) by rly-zb04.mx.aol.com (v77.27) with ESMTP; Thu, 11 Jan 2001 13:31:30 -0500 Received: (cpmta 11641 invoked from network); 11 Jan 2001 10:31:28 -0800 Date: 11 Jan 2001 10:31:28 -0800 Message-ID: <20010111183128.11640.cpmta@c000.snv.cp.net> X-Sent: 11 Jan 2001 18:31:28 GMT Received: from [205.188.198.36] by mail.policeone.com with HTTP; 11 Jan 2001 10:31:28 PST Content-Type: text/plain Content-Disposition: inline Mime-Version: 1.0 To: TNTcombatives@aol.com From: 3411@policeone.com X-Mailer: Web Mail 3.7.1.7 Subject: road rage Traffic incidents are one of my favorite scenarios. I like to use it as a suprise for the new, young drivers in the group, or the rookie cops who 'ran a red light' and caused an accident. Going through the motions of getting out your insurance/registration/license during a hostile incident is very good practice for actual events. We will all get into a few crashes, so it is nice to know that you are able to hold it together...even if someone starts to swing at you. From minor fender benders with uptight soccer-moms, to the full blown road rager...I always get a good laugh when watching the situation unfold. Mark Gajdostik - --part1_b7.a74e840.278f5642_boundary-- ------------------------------ From: Ray Terry Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2001 11:13:26 PST Subject: the_dojang: . ------------------------------ End of The_Dojang-Digest V8 #23 ******************************* It's a great day for Taekwondo! Support the USTU by joining today. US Taekwondo Union, 1 Olympic Plaza, Ste 104C, Colorado Spgs, CO 80909 719-578-4632 FAX 719-578-4642 ustutkd1@aol.com http://www.ustu.org To unsubscribe from the_dojang-digest send the command: unsubscribe the_dojang-digest -or- unsubscribe the_dojang-digest your.old@address in the BODY of an email (top line, left justified) addressed to majordomo@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com. Old digest issues are available via ftp://ftp.martialartsresource.com. Copyright 1994-2001: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource Standard disclaimers apply.