From: the_dojang-owner@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com To: the_dojang-digest@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com Subject: The_Dojang-Digest V8 #53 Reply-To: the_dojang@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com Errors-To: the_dojang-owner@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com Precedence: The_Dojang-Digest Wed, 24 Jan 2001 Vol 08 : Num 053 In this issue: the_dojang: Re: BG checks the_dojang: Dojang love and Jackson in Febr the_dojang: Aikido/Hapkido the_dojang: DV conference the_dojang: Re: non-profits the_dojang: My apologies the_dojang: RE: Do Jang Relationships the_dojang: Re: HKD and competition the_dojang: Mime-Version: 1.0 the_dojang: Schools in Dallas the_dojang: Re: Students the_dojang: Re: History of Korean Martial Arts the_dojang: . ========================================================================= The_Dojang, serving the Internet since June 1994. ~1111 members strong! Copyright 1994-2001: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource The premier internet discussion forum devoted to the Korean Martial Arts. Replying to this message will NOT unsubscribe you. To unsubscribe, send "unsubscribe the_dojang-digest" (no quotes) in the body (top line, left justified) of a "plain text" e-mail addressed to majordomo@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com. To send e-mail to this list use the_dojang@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com See the Korean Martial Arts (KMA) FAQ and the online search engine for back issues of The_Dojang at http://www.MartialArtsResource.com Pil Seung! ---------------------------------------------------------------------- From: ChunjiDo@aol.com Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 18:17:27 EST Subject: the_dojang: Re: BG checks In a message dated 1/19/2001 11:52:18 AM Pacific Standard Time, the_dojang-owner@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com writes: << But then again I'm still going to run my background check if they want to be an instructor. I will never let any person who has ever been CONVICTED of Molesting a child teach. I will not do it ever. And before the crowd says they don't usually do marital arts and that the moral of the training weeds them out. I have had one student who later applied to be an instructor that was as I just said above. He was never allowed to teach. >> mike, i completely agree with you on all of this. recidivism for child molesters is so high it's scary. not a chance someone with that history would be teaching for me. thanks for the imput. melinda Chajonshim Martial Arts Supply http://www.chajonshim.com Proud Sponsor of the 10th Annual 2001 US Open Taekwondo Championships ------------------------------ From: "rich hodder" Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 23:27:45 Subject: the_dojang: Dojang love and Jackson in Febr I would like to thank all of the people who have reponded positivly to my query regarding marriage. I do, however think there might be some mis-understanding. This is not my first marriage unforunately (also regarding my feeling about comittment) I was married for ten years and with her for thirteen before the divorve. Thus, my extremely cold feet here in Steamboat Springs, thinking about marriage again and the possiblity of Divorce. Getting the legal system involved in your life in any way seems a bad thing over all. This being said, I am still willing to try at the normal martial artists intensity of 110%. Given her martial training (110% + 110% = one) I think we have a great chance of avoiding disaster. On a different note, after many phone calls (insisting that I attend GM West's Feb. seminar in Jackson) and a lot of help from priceline.com, I get to go. Hooray!! See all of you there. Rich _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com ------------------------------ From: "Patrick L" Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 16:03:51 -0800 Subject: the_dojang: Aikido/Hapkido Dear Mr. Lawson You wrote: >First, I agree that there are many points of similarity between the two arts. What I was trying to highlight was the particular emphasis given to achieving an "off balance" in the attacker. It is my observation that an off balance is critical in Aikido technical Strategy while it's "nice but not required" in Hapkido technical strategy. As an example, let me draw your attention to these two links (Kote Gaeshi in Aikido): http://www.vision.net.au/hapkido/mpeg/cnb2.mpg (from: http://www.vision.net.au/hapkido/gallery.html) and http://members.aol.com/aikibrkly/aikido/Images/narijunanahon/koteg.gif (from: http://www.sni.net/tomiki/nariyamatekubi.html) Note in the Aikido version, the attacker is drawn slightly forward with his balance beyond his hips where as in the Hapkido version, there is less of this "off balance."< The locations of the files seemed juxtaposition to the arts shown! :) Off-balance is a requirement in Hapkido for twists and throws, not just a nicety. In any event without being too critical; In the Hapkido example the opponents attacking power was allowed to die in front, and in the Aikido example the power was allowed to die after the 180 degree encouragement. In both cases, the "Tan jen" were allowed to set just before the "fall". Neither is a perfect example. The Aikido students provide a big example, the Hapkido ones a small example. A smaller example of the same principle does not indicate our abandonment of the principle. While Aikido typically uses Ki large, we typically use Ki small. The relationship to our opponent's power should be as important to a Hapkido student as to an Aikido student, perhaps just implemented differently. Thanx for the links. Getting in the Way, Patrick _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com ------------------------------ From: Ray Terry Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 18:42:45 PST Subject: the_dojang: DV conference FYI... Ray --------------------------------------------------------- National Domestic Violence and Sexual Assault Conference From: 23-Apr-2001 To: 25-Apr-2001 Register for class by: 16-Apr-2001 Price: $375.00 Max Students Allowed: 500 Host Hotel: Mission Valley Doubletree Hotel Hotel Phone: 619-297-5466 or 800-222-TREE Distance To Event: On site Location: San Diego, CA (Mission Valley Doubletree Hotel) Contact Name: Anne O'Dell Contact Email: Anne2215@aol.com Contact Phone: 858-679-2913 City: San Diego State: California URL: http://www.stopdv.com Description: This is a 3 day class with outstanding national presenters. Target audience is police, prosecutors, judicial, and probation. Go to http://www.stopdv.com for more information. ------------------------------ From: Daremo and Kitsune Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 20:51:25 -0600 Subject: the_dojang: Re: non-profits >From: Ray Terry >Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 8:48:39 PST >Subject: Re: the_dojang: Re: Non-profit, uniforms, Aikido net > >I can never keep them straight, but non-profit and not-for-profit are not >the same, right.?. One is a 503c (e.g. the USTU is 503c) and one is not. >We run our firearms training as the one that is not 503c. You can clear some >profit at the end of the year, but it is small. And the paperwork is much >less. > >Ray Terry >raymail@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com Ray might be thinking of the 501(c) (3) status. In fact, I think both programs could be 501 (c), but one is a 3 and the other has a different definition. I'm in the process of filing for non-profit status. I'll need to file with the state (MN) and start operating then, within 15 months, I have to file for the Federal status - 501(c)(3) - in order to develop further. What I'm looking at is developing a martial arts version of a YMCA. Since the YMCA is actually a non-profit, their format is well suited for martial arts schools. I plan on doing the monthly membership (basically a contract) for students but I also plan to do some grant-writing to get more funds in to develop more programs (after-school, anti-violence, etc.) and pay instructors. I'm sure there'll be some fundraising also. I plan to follow the advice of one of my black belts (a stock broker) who said to fill out the paperwork and ask an attorney to review it (that way he can write off his time) and then check with an accountant to keep the books because they can write off the work and/or get paid for it. For those interested, you'll need to have your state's non-profit status established before you can file the Federal. The Federal paperwork you'll need is the form 1024 which can be downloaded from the IRS site. Robert Frankovich Tiger Consulting Senior Trainer 4th Dan AAU Taekwondo 4th Dan Song Moo Kwan Taekwondo 2nd Dan Seidokan Aikido www.tigerconsulting.org "There's more to balance than not falling over." Michael Angier ------------------------------ From: "Anthony or Clare Boyd" Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 12:42:05 +0900 Subject: the_dojang: My apologies Ken McD. I am sorry that you cannot understand my point. I am sorry that I apparently managed to offend you. Oh, BTW, Korea has been teaching English in schools for much, much longer than 3 years. Three years ago many schools began to offer it at earlier grades. I offered a contrary point about Korea because one of the functions of this list is to relate information about Korean culture. I have been living here since 1997. Sorry to have ruffled your feathers but navigating in Korea is not as hard as you made it sound. I was in no way arguing the merits of one Asian culture over another. I do think that we North Americans could stand to lose a little arrogance when it comes to things like foreign visitors. (I even included a smiley to demonstrate my intent.) Once again, my apologies. I was not making a personal attack and regret being responsible for sparking you to make one. Enjoy your trip. ------------------------------ From: "Dunn, Danny J RASA" Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 09:03:00 -0600 Subject: the_dojang: RE: Do Jang Relationships Several people have been talking about relationships in the dojang lately. Thought I'd put in $0.02. As a young black belt of 17 I met a beautiful redhead in my dojang. I was an assistant instructor, as were all the cho dans in my instructors school. My instructor had no rules about in school relationships. We started dating a few months after this young lady began taking lessons. To make a long story short, we have been together for 26 years and married for over 21. My wife went on to get her black belt under me and we ran a school together for several years. She still helps out sometimes, but no longer works out in regular class. She does not like teaching. During the time that she was a student before she got her cho dan, I tried to treat her like any other student. I also tried to maintain a very professional attitude in class. From her prespective, she told me later that she felt I was harder on her than the other students. She said this bothered her sometimes, especially for some points I deducted on her written test for black belt, on some of her discussion questions. I really saw no problems with jealousy from other students, because she could obviously back up her rank with ability. From my current prespective, I think I probably did expect more from her, because she was and is a very talented martial artist. Then and now I tend to push very capable students a little harder to help them reach their full potential. However, there can be problems in being the teacher to someone you have an intimate relationship with. In my experience, not everyone is capable of accepting a teacher-student relationship and seperating it from their partner relationship. Even though we didn't have any big problems, if I had had the choice I would have had her take lessons from another person, at least in formal class. However, I was the only instructor in my dojang at the time. I have also seen the same types of problems from time to time in teaching my own children. It was very difficult for them, especially when they were younger to seperate my relationship as a father, from my dojang relationship as an instructor. I think that they have felt pressure at times from just their natural desire to please me as a father. I also catch myself sometimes being a little less understanding with them than with other students. As for dating between instructors and students, I discourage casual dating. Just to much at stake. Usually if two people date for a while, then one decides to move on, one or the other will leave the dojang. But having been there, I do not strictly forbid it. That would be hypocritical. Dating between teenagers in the dojang usually has the same problems with loosing one student in the end. In larger schools it might be possible to avoid this by switching classes or schedules, but in my dojang it is not possible. As for hanging out, black belts are welcome at any time, so long as they are working out or busy with something related to the dojang or their school work. Gup students must either be working on an assigned task, in a class or watching a class. We have had some problems in dating teens trying to get together during our organization's regional summer camps. It has kept the assigned senior black belts busy. Sorry for the length. Danny Dunn ------------------------------ From: Piotr Bernat Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 21:58:45 +0200 Subject: the_dojang: Re: HKD and competition >> I have seen quite a few HKD stylists at open tournaments over the years >> in the southeast. Don't know of any HKD specific tournaments though. > > There is at least one in Korea each year. I think it is run by the World > Hapkido Games Federation, or something like that. International Hapkido Federation (the one led by the late GM MYUNG, Jae Nam) also organised HKD competitions in Europe. The 1st European Championships were held in 1994 in breaking, nak beop and self-defence. I`m not sure if they still do it though. The Austrian Hapkido Federation also organises regular championships in sparring, breaking, forms and demos, including national championships. I believe there are some such events in Germany as well. Regards - -- Piotr Bernat dantaekwondo@lublin.home.pl http://www.taekwondo.prv.pl ------------------------------ From: "Geoff J. Booth" Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 21:37:14 +1100 Subject: the_dojang: Mime-Version: 1.0 Master Geoff J. Booth (Hapkido 7th Degree) of Sydney Australia will be visiting the USA in Late February/early March of this year, During the trip he will have some free time on his hands and he is looking at sticking out the thumb for any schools interested in hosting a Hapkido seminar with a Aussie flavour. You know how good Aussies can do things, just take a look at the Olympics. :) For more information please contact Master Booth at the e-mail address below. For referee's please feel free to contact: Master JR West - hapkido@netdoor.com Master Jere Hilland - jere-hilland@msn.com Regards & G'Day from the land downunda. Geoff Booth International Hapkido Alliance Australia Hapkido Group http://hapkido.netro.com.au "The art is in the person, all we have to do is bring it out" ------------------------------ From: "Paul" Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 08:26:24 -0600 Subject: the_dojang: Schools in Dallas I currently train in Kuk Sool Won and will soon be moving to Dallas. Is there anyone that is famialur with the Dallas schools and could give me ideas on where to train? ------------------------------ From: Piotr Bernat Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 15:12:23 +0200 Subject: the_dojang: Re: Students > 1) My Kyo Sa Nim puts these "loafing" students to work; sweeping the > floor, calling students that have not attended class in a while, typing > renewal letters..., etc., After all, the Do Jang is not a day care. Good idea, they also come handy when e.g. there are too few persons to hold the targets ;) Regards - -- Piotr Bernat dantaekwondo@lublin.home.pl http://www.taekwondo.prv.pl ------------------------------ From: JSaportajr@aol.com Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 09:52:57 EST Subject: the_dojang: Re: History of Korean Martial Arts This is related to a previous discussion that I participated in about the history of and its connection to Hapkido. Someone from another list recommended the following web site: http://www.sni.net/hwarang/Hwa_Personal.html The discussion on this website is very good, scholarly and intellectually honest. It answers many of my questions and confirms many of my doubts about previous Hapkido Masters who have moved on to invent their own styles and invent a history to go with it. I am training with a Korean Grand Master now (in addition to my training with Master Hal Whalen) who has developed his own system or martial art. He is an 8th Dan in Taekwondo, an eight Dan in Hapkido and a former professional Tae kick boxer with an undefeated record. His system integrates his experience in these three arts. The nice thing though is that he is not inventing a history to go with it, it is clear that this is a system that he has developed over the last ten or so years, and that the history of this art begins with his beginning to teach it now, though he acknowledges its roots in his prior martial arts experience. He has no need to invent a mythologic history for this art. I wonder why so many grand masters who develop a new martial system have to create a whole mythologic history to back up their art. Perhaps in certain cultures, a claim to a certain kind of historical lineage confers some sort of power, which may be different in American culture. The other nice thing about the experience I am having with this is the lack of egos. Master Whalen is aware of my training with this Korean master and is fine with it, and when I occasionally show him things that he and the other master do differently, he is interested and nondefensive. Similarly, the Korean master is fine with my training elsewhere as well. The Taekwondo Master from which I received my second Dan, Master Steven Carrasco, is also training with me and others from our Dojang in this new art that is being taught by GrandMaster Kwon in Teuksburry Mass. It is refreshing to see the sense of nondefensive interest and collaboration. Jose' ------------------------------ From: Ray Terry Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 8:16:08 PST Subject: the_dojang: . ------------------------------ End of The_Dojang-Digest V8 #53 ******************************* It's a great day for Taekwondo! Support the USTU by joining today. US Taekwondo Union, 1 Olympic Plaza, Ste 104C, Colorado Spgs, CO 80909 719-578-4632 FAX 719-578-4642 ustutkd1@aol.com http://www.ustu.org To unsubscribe from the_dojang-digest send the command: unsubscribe the_dojang-digest -or- unsubscribe the_dojang-digest your.old@address in the BODY of an email (top line, left justified) addressed to majordomo@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com. Old digest issues are available via ftp://ftp.martialartsresource.com. Copyright 1994-2001: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource Standard disclaimers apply.