From: the_dojang-owner@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com To: the_dojang-digest@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com Subject: The_Dojang-Digest V8 #116 Reply-To: the_dojang@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com Errors-To: the_dojang-owner@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com Precedence: The_Dojang-Digest Fri, 16 Feb 2001 Vol 08 : Num 116 In this issue: the_dojang: Special course announcement Re: the_dojang: Special course announcement the_dojang: Re: Passing a belt test the_dojang: not to slight Re: the_dojang: Time the_dojang: RE:15 years? Nice going! the_dojang: not to slight the_dojang: Time the_dojang: Re: Top Ten Travel Lessons the_dojang: Re: Speaking of roasted chickens ! the_dojang: Re: Speaking of collection plates ! the_dojang: Kukkiwon changes 8th & 9th dan certs. the_dojang: Re: Alice in Wonderland ? the_dojang: Paying Up the_dojang: RE: Ki for kids the_dojang: . ========================================================================= The_Dojang, serving the Internet since June 1994. ~1111 members strong! Copyright 1994-2001: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource The premier internet discussion forum devoted to the Korean Martial Arts. Replying to this message will NOT unsubscribe you. To unsubscribe, send "unsubscribe the_dojang-digest" (no quotes) in the body (top line, left justified) of a "plain text" e-mail addressed to majordomo@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com. To send e-mail to this list use the_dojang@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com See the Korean Martial Arts (KMA) FAQ and the online search engine for back issues of The_Dojang at http://www.MartialArtsResource.com Pil Seung! ---------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Andrew Pratt Date: Fri, 16 Feb 2001 10:52:57 +0900 Subject: the_dojang: Special course announcement Dear all, I want to announce a special seasonal course. The course is being arranged by me, Andrew Pratt, 10th Dan McDojang martial Services Inc. (applied last month, awaiting certificate, money in the post), 2nd dan I-con-ryu, and founder and Stupendous All-high Grandmaster of Giv-me-do. Location: On the frozen River Han, Seoul Time: Tomorrow morning if the temperature is -5, tomorrow afternoon if the temperature is -10 Duration: 3 hours Programme: The course will cover fighting philosophy, skills and techniques. Specifically the course will include: Philosophy: How to survive multiple attack snow fights Kicks: Practical kicks wearing snow shoes Self defence: 20 techniques wearing mittens Breakfalls: Previously secret Korean techniques to land on snow and why they are done naked. Weapons: Basic techniques with a ski stick including the eye-poke, thigh slap, and calf gouge Special instructors: Apart from myself there will be: The SBS (The British special underwater unit) will be teaching essential under-ice self defence techniques. Note: Due to security reasons the exact time of their appearance can not be revealed. Master West has kindly agreed to parachute in and give a course on Tibetan gopher throwing with frozen or hibernating gophers. Catering by the US Army: Burgers with a bang! Cost: $500 per hour if you bring your own gophers $1,000 per hour if you have no gophers. Note: Master West informs me that Korean gophers are too light for the techniques he has in mind. I have checked and there are no freely available authentic Tibetan gophers currently in Korea. However, I have managed to obtain a supply. I would also caution attendees to beware purchasing black-market stuffed gophers. These will seriously distort your technique and ruin your stances. Note: If the temperature rises above 0 degrees then the course will be cancelled due to inclement weather. Yours, with apologies to Master West, Andrew ------------------------------ From: Ray Terry Date: Thu, 15 Feb 2001 18:48:03 PST Subject: Re: the_dojang: Special course announcement > Note: If the temperature rises above 0 degrees then the course will be > cancelled due to inclement weather. Sounds like someone we know is suffering from winter fever... :) Ray Terry raymail@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com ------------------------------ From: Leah Makuch Date: Thu, 15 Feb 2001 23:06:53 -0500 Subject: the_dojang: Re: Passing a belt test [snip] Do most schools grade tests with percents and is 60% a pass? 60% in my experience (schools like high school and college, etc) is a D not a pass. 75% is a C. In my school, 80% is a passing level up to 4th gup, but all skills must be 80% and up, not below. The higher the rank the tougher the grade to pass. BB tests require a student to get 90% or better on all aspects, less and he fails. [/snip] For what it's worth, at my school, things are much more individualized. If you are asked to test, you have already earned your belt and the test is just formal to "show off," so to speak. My Master has only failed two students, to my knowledge, one for a black stripe and one for a black belt. (I do WTF TKD.) Both were because of forms. If you do not feel you earned your belt at a test, you are expected to refuse your belt, but no one will stop you and tell you that you should have refused your belt. Maybe this is very informal because it is a club, and our instructors do not get paid, but that is the way we do it. And it must work, because my Master trained a girl who won bronze in the Olympics this year in TKD...had to brag a little on his behalf. - -Leah Makuch lyet143@student.umass.edu www.umtkd.com ------------------------------ From: "John Bennett" Date: Fri, 16 Feb 2001 00:27:27 -0600 Subject: the_dojang: not to slight > From: Chereecharmello@aol.com > I meant not to slight the 18-month BB practitioners, it was just an > observation. I think you did. I think it was you who were being arrogant. That's why I was being sarcastic. I'll be nice now because you understood my point and responded without being ugly. I appreciate that and it shows dignity. ------------------------------ From: Ray Terry Date: Fri, 16 Feb 2001 7:46:26 PST Subject: Re: the_dojang: Time > John Bennett writes: > > > In my style it takes 15 years to get a black belt. > > > > That means that our black belts are much better than your black belts AND > > the 18 month black belts combined. > > > > I would hate to see one of our 15 year black belts in a contact fight with > > one of your pitiful 4 year black belts. > > John: > I see that your style is heavy on time and less stringent on humility and > manners. Me things he was just kidding. Ray Terry raymail@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com ------------------------------ From: Bruce.Sims@med.va.gov Date: Fri, 16 Feb 2001 09:09:34 -0600 Subject: the_dojang: RE:15 years? Nice going! Dear John: "...In my style it takes 15 years to get a black belt. That means that our black belts are much better than your black belts AND the 18 month black belts combined. I would hate to see one of our 15 year black belts in a contact fight with one of your pitiful 4 year black belts..." I was thinking as I read your comment that 15 years is truly an extraordinary length of time and that it says a lot about the dedication of individuals to their pursuit. Honestly, there are few activities of any sort that people stick to for that long a time unless they are really invested. In some ways, too, to have such a long time requiremtn also seems to approach not having any. Do you know what I mean? In my classes one must accrue certain periods of time ("mat hours") to support their promotion through each of the ranks. But it seems that once a person gets to the length of time that you specify, the use of time as a criteria becomes somewhat moot. On the other hand I think it's a tribute to your art and the quality of instruction that people will commit to practicing and supporting the classes for such an extended length of time. Best Wishes, Bruce ------------------------------ From: "John Bennett" Date: Fri, 16 Feb 2001 00:45:56 -0600 Subject: the_dojang: not to slight > From: Chereecharmello@aol.com > I meant not to slight the 18-month BB practitioners, it was just an > observation. I think you did. I think it was you who were being arrogant. That's why I was being sarcastic. I'll be nice now because you understood my point and responded without being ugly. I appreciate that and it shows dignity. - --------------------------------------- David Woods wrote: > Hey John Bennett my style is better than your style! How old are you anyway? That's impossible! My instructor told me that our style was the best! He said it was darn near undefeatable. He said it was 3000 years old. He said it was handed down directly to him from the REAL masters in the home-country. He said we were the only ones who were learning the real secrets and inside budo meaning behind the art. He said it was developed for use on the battlefield in real war. He said it was based on scientific priciples. He said the Navy Seals, Delta Force, Army Rangers, & CIA agents all used it. He said it was too secret and deadly to show on instructional videotapes or display winning fights on pay-per-view. Now who am I supposed to believe? My esteemed GrandMaster whose boots I lick and to whom I give my hard-earned money, or You, some buffoon out on the internet who wants to prove he is older than everyone else? ------------------------------ From: "Rudy Timmerman" Date: Fri, 16 Feb 2001 02:18:21 -0500 Subject: the_dojang: Time John Bennett writes: > In my style it takes 15 years to get a black belt. > > That means that our black belts are much better than your black belts AND > the 18 month black belts combined. > > I would hate to see one of our 15 year black belts in a contact fight with > one of your pitiful 4 year black belts. John: I see that your style is heavy on time and less stringent on humility and manners. Ken: I envy you my friend. Although I would be very uncomfortable not knowing how to repay such kindness, you are very lucky to have made such friends. Funny thing is, whenever I share with some other martial artist, I also do not wish to get paid. I just have not learned to accept similar kindness. All I know is that I wish I was there with you (and your beer). Sincerely, Rudy ------------------------------ From: Ken McDonough Date: Fri, 16 Feb 2001 04:06:30 -0800 (PST) Subject: the_dojang: Re: Top Ten Travel Lessons On a lighter note. When traveling in a foreign country: a. Remove ice cubes from your mineral water. b. Bring along Pepto-Bismol or Phazyme gas relief. c. Drink coke, beer, bottled water. d. If offered special food at the local market, decline nicely. e. Keep your money in a money belt not wallet. f. When local ladies (or men) approach you at the mall and ask "What hotel your staying at ?", note that they are not Nuns. g. Pay all of your bills but no problem negotiating for a discount. h. Drink much beer. i. Offer any martial arts instructor payment. If declined, insist and then make it a "gift". j. On martial arts payments in foreign countries, walk the fine line between U.S. inflation and local payment traditions. Next installment: My Dialogue with Diego. Cheers, McD... __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get personalized email addresses from Yahoo! Mail - only $35 a year! http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ From: Ken McDonough Date: Fri, 16 Feb 2001 04:21:13 -0800 (PST) Subject: the_dojang: Re: Speaking of roasted chickens ! This comment stirred up mixed emotions: Response: Roasted Chickens! I had just returned from the Base Line Gym in Cebu. We met with Master Max Tian, an Aikido Master. I had no breakfast. At almost every corner I noticed beat up machines with roasted chickens turning ever so slowly. The juices melting off of the chicken, falling onto the barbecue brickets. The same juices permeating the air, stirring my ravenous appetite. I asked Carli, "What's up with all the Lechon and Chicken stands ? Is the chicken edible ?" The response was "Of course it is good to eat, just wipe away some of the dust. Dust won't kill ya." Ah, thanks for bringing up "Roasted Chickens." McD... __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get personalized email addresses from Yahoo! Mail - only $35 a year! http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ From: Ken McDonough Date: Fri, 16 Feb 2001 04:32:04 -0800 (PST) Subject: the_dojang: Re: Speaking of collection plates ! - - This comment conjured up more flashbacks: Response: We just returned from the Mall where a Kung Fu demonstration in Cebu was conducted. There are many Chinese in Cebu and the majority of business owners are Chinese. Naturally, there was a Cebu Kung Fu Society. You can see the connection on some of the Wing Chun and Kung Fu exercises that are incorporated into the Filipino Martial Arts. Anyway, we have lunch and then head for the Church. Along the way I noticed that there are actual shops that just sell Catholic knick knacks like statues of the Pope, statues of the Virgin Mary, pictures of saints, rosary beads. Can you imagine--not a watch shop, not a liquor store, but a shop that just sells religious knick knacks. On any given day, the churches are full ! Well, I took communion (with the wine) and also put money in the collection plate. The guilt instantly left me. McD... __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get personalized email addresses from Yahoo! Mail - only $35 a year! http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ From: "Dana Vaillancourt" Date: Fri, 16 Feb 2001 12:34:31 Subject: the_dojang: Kukkiwon changes 8th & 9th dan certs. Hi. Just an interesting note that the Kukkiwon is changing the look of their 8th and 9th dan certificates "to level up the status of high dan holders." The new certificates will be horizontal versus vertical and appear to have more Chinese than the existing ones. Old style 8th and 9th dan holders can "apply" for the "re-issuance" of the new certificate to the Kukkiwon. I wonder if this is a result of 1) Just wanting to look different to set the high dans apart; 2) Get all out of touch 8ths and 9ths to touch base with the KKW or be viewed differently; or, 3) Potentially take care of fradulent dan certificates. Besides the colors, this will make three different types of Kukkiwon dan certificates: 1-4, 5-7, and 8-9. Oh well, just a morning muse! Dana _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com ------------------------------ From: Ken McDonough Date: Fri, 16 Feb 2001 04:46:01 -0800 (PST) Subject: the_dojang: Re: Alice in Wonderland ? - -Greg notes: Response: Through this wonderful dialogue, you take one piece of drivel I have written and formulate a conclusion that I never made. Oy vay ! Let me be clear. I understand that instructors must make a living and pay the bills. Do you understand that flexibility in working with students is equally important ? The central point is that the relationship must work to insure all sides of the equation. Nothing more than that. Now digressing. I am in this resort at Cebu and this lovely Filipina is swimming in the pool near me. She told me that I was truly her Prince. She loved me. For 500 pesos she could make me forever happy. I respectfully declined knowing that this Alice in Wonderland approach would not have a happy ending. But the thoughts, for a fleeting moment, do place me in a fantasy mode ! McD... __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get personalized email addresses from Yahoo! Mail - only $35 a year! http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ From: mtomlins@mail.volusia.k12.fl.us Date: Fri, 16 Feb 2001 08:15:29 -0500 Subject: the_dojang: Paying Up To set the record straght on this subject let me state where I get my small amount of monies from that I live on.. It seems that some people might be under the influence that I teach just for the money and that is why I am so vehement about the contract and payment issues. Well I am a proffesional educator and I teach at a public high school in Daytona Beach Florida,, this is one of the reasons I don't have to travel to see the world,, the world comes to me,, ever seen bike week? Black College Reunion,, Speed Week? Spring Break? etc. etc. etc. Right now there are over 500,000 people in town from all corners of the world. The high school I teach at is within a tenth of a mile from the Speedway,, dudes,, we see everything down here and I do mean EVERYTHING,, the high school students I teach are very street savvy,, they've grown up in this madness!! I also teach Hapkido on the side for very little money,, don't get me wrong I am not starving but I don't know of ANY educator in the public school system that does it for the money,, there has to be more to it,, like a feeling of contributing to the betterment of society,, teaching young adults to be RESPONSIBLE, HONORABLE, ACCOUNTABLE, and knowledgable about life,, that is what keeps me coming back to my classroom and Dojang. The love of learning, working out, and contributing, that is why I teach, I love it. So again let me state that if you can find a way out of your obligations and you can make up some excuse why it is o.k. then fine for you, but you are definately not living and practicing the Martial Way. Michael Tomlinson ------------------------------ From: "Dunn, Danny J RASA" Date: Fri, 16 Feb 2001 08:22:01 -0600 Subject: the_dojang: RE: Ki for kids Interesting question. I have found that kids really have a hard time grasping concepts like ki. Especially when they are only exposed to it as a part of class a couple time a week. I start them out with learning proper breathing, and increase the concentration on dan jun breathing and proper kiah but I don't really talk about ki development until mid teens. Danny Dunn <<<<<<<>>>>>>>>>>>>> ------------------------------ From: Ray Terry Date: Fri, 16 Feb 2001 7:53:03 PST Subject: the_dojang: . ------------------------------ End of The_Dojang-Digest V8 #116 ******************************** It's a great day for Taekwondo! Support the USTU by joining today. US Taekwondo Union, 1 Olympic Plaza, Ste 104C, Colorado Spgs, CO 80909 719-578-4632 FAX 719-578-4642 ustutkd1@aol.com http://www.ustu.org To unsubscribe from the_dojang-digest send the command: unsubscribe the_dojang-digest -or- unsubscribe the_dojang-digest your.old@address in the BODY of an email (top line, left justified) addressed to majordomo@hpwsrt.cup.hp.com. Old digest issues are available via ftp://ftp.martialartsresource.com. Copyright 1994-2001: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource Standard disclaimers apply.